Bachmann Midland Pullman

[ChrisMRL]

what was the music?

 

Hi, the music is mozart-symphony no.29 4th movement

 

cheers

Chris

[PaulCheffus]

I bought a second hand Falcon and ran it on my layout which has Relco track cleaners and when I opened Falcon up it had a decoder fitted. I have not removed the decoder and it runs on DC with Relco track cleaner with no problems.

 

Hi

 

Are you definitely sure it is a decoder and not just a blanking plug.

 

I thought that running on DC with HF track cleaner could cause the loco to behave erratically due to the decoder seeing the HF as a corrupted DCC signal.

 

Cheers

 

Paul

[mow]

Hi, the music is mozart-symphony no.29 4th movement

 

cheers

Chris

 

Thanks for that, I have been racking my brains trying to remember which of the 41 Symphonies it was from.

[Welly]

Just been watching this film of the Blue Pullman - if it was linked earlier, my apologies. Top hats in evidence at the end.

I watched the whole thing on my BTF DVD collection and I was amused by the passengers drinking brandy after breakfast - there was one guy who appeared a bit pie-eyed before 11am! Also I wasn't impressed with the stark looking interior and the rough riding of the BP coaches.

[Michael Delamar]

the metro cammell film of them being built is a good one, comes with the other film mentioned above and also lets go to Birmingham film,.

[ianwales]

Hi all

 

Just a quick query, does anyone know if any of the various sound DCC manfacterers have plans to do a sound chip for the Pullman?

 

Ian

[phil gollin]

.

 

Was there a reason they weren't used on railtours to other regions very much (especially Southern !) ????

 

.

[Stevelewis]

Hi all

 

Just a quick query, does anyone know if any of the various sound DCC manfacterers have plans to do a sound chip for the Pullman?

 

Ian

 

I would imagine it would be difficult to produce an accurate sound decoder as no actual Midland Pullmans exist , however it is more than likely that a generic sound decoder will be produced, it has to be remembered also that 2 sound decoders will be required!

 

Strange as it may seem I can still remember the sound of the Midland Pullmans, we used to watch them returning to the Reddish TMD most evenings.

 

I for one would certainly be interested in installing sound.

[johnd]

.

 

Was there a reason they weren't used on railtours to other regions very much (especially Southern !) ????

 

.

There is a picture in a Scenes from the past No 33 of a Western 8 car set sat in Bury Bolton street station on 28.1.67 on a Football special. No Yellow panel in view,

[Rugd1022]

Only a handful of crews were trained on them, plus releasing the units from normal service (and bearing in mind the maintenance schedules) to use on a charter / railtour wasn't always an easy thing to arrange. The WR sets did manage to get off region now and then, but not often.

[45568]

.

 

Was there a reason they weren't used on railtours to other regions very much (especially Southern !) ????

 

.

 

Those regions had Relcos hardwired into the track and the units were DCC fitted?

Cheers, Peter C.

[chopper20059]

Hi

 

Are you definitely sure it is a decoder and not just a blanking plug.

 

I thought that running on DC with HF track cleaner could cause the loco to behave erratically due to the decoder seeing the HF as a corrupted DCC signal.

 

Cheers

 

Paul

 

Falcon definitely has a decoder fitted.

[Karhedron]

I would imagine it would be difficult to produce an accurate sound decoder as no actual Midland Pullmans exists

I wonder if any othe stock fitted with the MAN 1000 hp engines have been preserved? Would they sound substantially the same as a BP or would other factors like transmission significantly affect the sound?

[PaulCheffus]

 

 

Falcon definitely has a decoder fitted.

 

Hi

 

That goes against everything I have ever read on the subject. I assume you don't see any issues with this.

 

Cheers

 

Paul

[SRman]

Most problems I have experienced with DCC fitted items running on DC have been directly attributable to the analogue (DC) controller not putting out pure DC but rather, putting out a waveform emulating the required DC voltage; it is that waveform that 'confuses' the decoder.

 

Running my DCC fitted locos with an old H & M Duette controller causes no problems whatsoever. However, a much newer electronic Hornby H & M 2000 causes a few anomalies in the running qualities, like slowing down even after the control knob has been turned to a higher setting.

[Roy P]

SRman,

I have similar experiences with these controllers (The "old" H&M duette and the newer Hornby HM2000) but when running a basic experiment with both these and a Gaugemaster Q, it appears to me that it might not be so much the modernity of the electronics at play so much as the quality of the components. One can measure the "smoothness" of rectified DC output. The worst I have seen is from the mains adapter supplied with the Hornby train sets (the black and red item). Some of my sons stock was bought dcc fitted and hasn't shown any issues when running with the G'master Q (other than a perceived difference in speed). I don't personally have any fitted stuff at present (Blueper will be the first - just it time for a new dcc project) though I haven't opened up my Falcons yet (?).

RP

[ianwales]

Hi all

 

Is there a photo of the BP with full yellow ends as Bachmann are going to model it, all I can find in Nanking Blue with yellow ends shows a band of blue at bufferbeam level and the cab dome still in blue?

 

Ian

[00ERmissus]

Hi all

 

Is there a photo of the BP with full yellow ends as Bachmann are going to model it, all I can find in Nanking Blue with yellow ends shows a band of blue at bufferbeam level and the cab dome still in blue?

 

Ian

 

Hi, see post numbers 239 and 245 on this thread....................

[Dicky W]

I would imagine it would be difficult to produce an accurate sound decoder as no actual Midland Pullmans exist , however it is more than likely that a generic sound decoder will be produced, it has to be remembered also that 2 sound decoders will be required!

 

Strange as it may seem I can still remember the sound of the Midland Pullmans, we used to watch them returning to the Reddish TMD most evenings.

 

I for one would certainly be interested in installing sound.

 

Our editor, John Emerson, has an O gauge Midland Pullman running on his Gifford Street layout - this was produced using existing recordings of locos with a similar MAN engine plus some background diesel noises for the kitchen cars' auxiliary under-slung Rolls Royce engines.

[Ed-farms]

Hi all

 

Just a quick query, does anyone know if any of the various sound DCC manfacterers have plans to do a sound chip for the Pullman?

 

Ian

 

I do not know of any plans to release a sound chip but the Blue Pullamn's were fitted with a "NBL V12 Supercharged" engine - apart from the supercharged bit the same engine is inside a Class 22 which Howes do a sound chip for - albeit based on various sound files available to them, maybe they can tweak these to make a Blue Pullman sound decoder.

[Prometheus]

Just been watching this film of the Blue Pullman - if it was linked earlier, my apologies. Top hats in evidence at the end.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=djBDuPFI0X4

 

'Blue Pullman at Hinton Parva' - magnificent : the music was absolutely perfect and you'd swear that Edgar Anstey was behind some of the scenes......

 

Thanks

 

Tony

[Rugd1022]

Well, knock me down with a feather duster.... thanks to my lovely other half Sue, I now have a copy of Kevin Roberton's BP 'Supplement' book, an early and very unexpected birthday present which arrived today, so.... diving in with both feet and checking the photos and captions in both books very carefully, I think we're now a lot closer to unravelling the mystery of the 'custard dipped' livery as applied to the Bachmann model, and just as importantly, what kind of treatment the power car at the other end was given.

 

On pages 62 and 63 of the Supplement there are five black and white photos of the 'custard dipped' ex-Midland six-car set stabled just outside the Pullman Shed at Old Oak, taken by Electrical Fitter Derek Everson on Wednesday 8th November 1966 ; the power car at the Paddington end is M60092, which is wearing the srange 'apron' shaped yellow panel seen here (and earlier on in the thread) on another ex-Midland power car M60090 at Swindon Works in July...

 

http://www.flickr.co...ool-bluepullman

 

... while the one at the country end is M60093, which has had the all over yellow end applied as per the previously doubted Bachmann realease. Now then, tying this in with the 'test run at Newbury' photo posted further up the thread is the fact that the yellow on M60093 is quite workstained (noticable in the side profile shot on page 63) which suggests Derek's photographs were taken after a test run, which logically in turn means this particular unit went out on the mainline with two different versions of yellow end treatment. Whether or not anyone else captured it on film in this condition during this short test run phase we may never know, but from the above, it seems that the livery as applied by Bachmann is basically 'half right'. Bearing in mind that the 'Midland Pullman' logo was left intact during the test runs, it would be quite easy to replicate this set just by painting out part of the yellow area on one of the power cars to match the flickr shot above.

 

It's clear from previous posts that this strange livery variation is not everyone's cup of tea to start with, but having looked at Kevin's books again, I'm tempted to go with the 8/11/66 photos when I acquire a set. Not having a layout to run it on at present means it doesn't necessarily have to 'fit in' with anything else, and besides it would make for an interesting model. Whether it ran like this for one day or one week makes no difference to me.... any thoughts gents?

[Colin_McLeod]

any thoughts gents?

 

http://www.flickr.co...ol-bluepullman/

 

if the Bachmann livery is so rare that it requires such intensive research to prove it actually ran at all, and even then it is only "half right" in that the power car at the other end did not match, then my thoughts are as follows:

 

Bachmann can either sell the custard dip version for a small production run and let it become a collectible item, and then produce the more normal yellow version later

 

OR

 

Admit that the model is not very typical and, if it is not too late, replace the custard dip livery with a more typical one.

[Peter Kazmierczak]

Just been watching that brilliant "Blue Pullman" film again.

 

I don't know if anyone has mentioned this before, and it's the first time I've noticed it, but watch carefully in the final shots after arrival at St Pancras. The leading power car has BLUE seats whilst the adjoining kitchen car has RED seats. This leads me to believe that the colour of the seating alternated between adjoining cars, rather than a half set having seats all one colour.

 

Need to do a little more delving I think.

 

Any comments on this?

[orcadian]

I don't know how many (or how few?) others on here also read MREmag regularly, but on 4th July, it contained a detailed reply from Bachmann's Dennis Lovett on the subject of the yellow-ended Blue Pullman.

He stated, as seems to be generally confirmed now, that when the six-car units arrived at Swindon, livery experiments were undertaken for evaluation purposes, before these units entered W R service.

Dennis Lovett further stated that an experimental yellow-ended livery is the ONLY (my emphasis) alternative livery that Bachmann can correctly apply to the six car units, because before they entered passenger service on the W R, they were fitted with the MU jumper cables and the lower front end was modified to permanently expose the coupling gear.

 

Dennis Lovett also states that Bachmann would need to modify the tooling to produce the 6-car model as it ran in W R passenger service, something which they could possibly consider in due course (BUT NOT YET - again, my emphasis).

 

So the only way Bachmann can offer the six-car Blue Pullman in more than one livery is by using this experimental, not used in public service, livery. And Bachmann clearly do want to get it out in two liveries!

 

In the same reply, Dennis Lovett re-states exactly why Bachmann are not intending to produce the 8-car Western Pullman. This is because it only has two Type 6 Parlour Cars in common with the Midland Pullman. A Western Pullman would need three newly-tooled coaches:- Type 2 power cars, Type 3 parlour cars and type 5 kitchen cars. In other words, producing an accurate Western Pullman would effectively mean starting from scratch with a second set of new tools for three types of coach.

 

Sorry this is long, but it seems to be Bachmann's 'final word' on it for now. They do want to do 2 liveries of the 6-car, they don't want to modify the power car tooling to do the MU jumpers and drawgear cut-away, and they most certainly don't want to do three more new vehicles!

 

Richard.