2012 / 13/14.....Dukedog?

[buffalo]

...Also, apart from livery and numbering what are the other differences between the model and a pre-war version? What is this about chimneys?

Rich, can I suggest reading this topic from the first page? You can probably skip most of the stuff about the size of bogie wheels on 3265, but most of the detail variations are mentioned on the first two pages.

 

Nick

[Richard Mawer]

Ok. Thanks. Yes I did get lost on the bogie wheels.

[Miss Prism]

Another topic of conversation with Bachmann today - they have the tapered chimney dimension but are having difficulty finding suitable loco pictures but it seems they would like to do a pre-war version (or at least their design chap does!).

 

Here's one, and surprise, surprise, it's 3203:

 

3203 - 1937, tapered chimney, shirtbutton, standard cab windows, parallel loco buffers, fishbelly rods

 

That's about it though - most ran with parallel chimneys:

 

3205 - 1938, fat parallel chimney, standard cab windows, sandboxes 'on top', parallel loco buffers, fluted rods

 

3212 'Earl of Eldon', straight from the shops, fat parallel chimney, standard cab windows, tapered loco buffers, fluted rods

 

3218 - 1938, fat parallel chimney, small top feed, standard cab windows, insignia not visible but certainly shirtbutton, parallel loco buffers, fluted rods

 

9001 - 1953, thin parallel chimney, standard cab windows, parallel loco buffers, fluted rods, BR black

 

9004, late, fat parallel chimney, large top feed, standard cab windows, tapered loco buffers, fishbelly rods

 

9004 - undated, fat parallel chimney, large top feed, standard cab windows, tapered loco buffers, fishbelly rods

 

9008 - 1951, fat parallel chimney, sandboxes 'on top', tapered loco buffers, fluted rods, BR black

 

9015 - 1955, fat parallel chimney, 'eyebrow' cab windows, parallel loco buffers, BR black

 

9015 - undated, but late, fat parallel chimney, 'eyebrow' cab windows, parallel loco buffers, fluted rods

 

9028 - 1953, fat parallel chimney, standard cab windows, tapered loco buffers, fluted rods

 

 

Sandbox style was inherited I think from whatever style the donating Bulldog loco frame had.

 

I believe 9026 ran with a small 2500 or 3000g tender in BR days. 9019 ran with a 2500g for a while as noted previously in the thread.

 

Locos Illustrated No 50 (The GWR double-framed 4-4-0s) also has quite a few pics, so you might find something in there.

 

Btw, before Bachmann jump at the shirt-buttoned tapered-chimney 3203, check out the rivets on the bogie frame...

 

Swindon standardisation, huh? Yer just can't beat it!

Edited March 24, 2013 by Miss Prism

[buffalo]

...Btw, before Bachmann jump at the shirt-buttoned tapered-chimney 3203, check out the rivets on the bogie frame...

 

Swindon standardisation, huh? Yer just can't beat it!

Yes, as noted in #45, though deep in the discussion of the bogie wheels on 3265. There were at least three different patterns on Dukes, Bulldogs, etc., maybe more, though I'm not sure how many of these were seen on Earls/Dukedogs.

 

Nick

[The Stationmaster]

Hmm LI No.50 - well I really ought to have thought about looking there!!!

[phil gollin]

.

 

Thank-you "Miss Prism".

 

The Dukedogs were pure "character".

 

I hope that Bachmann produce many versions over many years.

 

.

[Miss Prism]

I've done some notes on the Dukedog, hopefully to wrap up variations and thoughts encapsulated in this thread.

 

Btw, if anyone has got a decent pic of 9017 (preferably in black) to donate that I could use as a header pic, I'd be grateful.

[M.I.B]

I've done some notes on the Dukedog, hopefully to wrap up variations and thoughts encapsulated in this thread.

 

Btw, if anyone has got a decent pic of 9017 (preferably in black) to donate that I could use as a header pic, I'd be grateful.

Many thanks for sharing your hard work.

[Torn-on-the-platform]

Miss Prism, I have a few photos from 9017's visit to the South Devon Railway in 2011 here - http://chrisrailwayphotos.weebly.com/2011.html. I don't have the originals on my laptop here, but if there are any that you would like to use and can wait until Sunday, I would be able to send them to you.

[Miss Prism]

Oooo, there's some nice ones there, Chris. The atmospheric 6649785_orig.jpg would be perfect.

[Torn-on-the-platform]

Certainly. The file name you give has been assigned by the website and doesn't correlate with my own so I can't work out which photo you are talking about, but I see it has 'orig' in the file name so you could try to download it and it may well be the original full resolution file!

 

If this doesn't seem to be the case, would you mind describing the photo to me please?

 

Many thanks

[Miss Prism]

Ah, ok, I'm not quite sure how I did it, but I've managed to download the 'orig' file. It's now uploaded to the Dukedog notes page, and I've credited the pic as 'Chrisrailwayphotos', but PM me with your real name if you prefer.

Edited April 8, 2013 by Miss Prism

[john dew]

Just heard from Liverpool........latest arrival time is now September/October 2013

[Mikkel]

I've done some notes on the Dukedog, hopefully to wrap up variations and thoughts encapsulated in this thread.Btw, if anyone has got a decent pic of 9017 (preferably in black) to donate that I could use as a header pic, I'd be grateful.

Thanks for compiling these notes Miss R, and what a great photo by Chris! It seems to me the GWR has finally moved one from the stigma that was once attached to it in modelling circles, and "different" locos like this help too.

 

(retires to await cheap shot from some shady LSWR type)

[M.I.B]

Just heard from Liverpool........latest arrival time is now September/October 2013

 

Thanks for the update.

[Coach bogie]

I'm naming and re-numbering mine to a 1940s  3265 TP&P so if that photo accurately shows what's due to arrive, then I am happy.

 

Whenever it arrives.

 I am considering the 1930's version with a smaller tender. Challenge is the Bachmann cab has the correct flared out cab sides for the 3200 series that 3265 did not get until much later. I doubt if I can straighten it out. might need replacement side sheets (and then 3265 will appear with Truro's tender as a special edition!)

 

It is not going to stop me cancelling mine but I am not happy with the tender brake blocks. All the investment in a new tender with correct pattern frames and the tender blocks are set for broad gauge - totally out of line with the wheels. I have spoken to Bachmann about it but it is a 'too late now' answer. Bachmann's 'design clever' moment perhaps.

 

Mike Wiltshire

[gwrrob]

I don't know if its old news but Bachmann have changed the running no. on the GWR version to 9003 according to Kernow Models newsletter.

 

http://www.kernowmodelrailcentre.com/product/33947/31087DC_Bachmann_3200_Earl_Class_440_Steam_Locomotive_9003

[bigherb]

All the investment in a new tender with correct pattern frames and the tender blocks are set for broad gauge - totally out of line with the wheels. I have spoken to Bachmann about it but it is a 'too late now' answer. Bachmann's 'design clever' moment perhaps.

 

 

Mike Wiltshire

Seems to be the norm for Bachman now the C class and 3F are the same.

[Ozexpatriate]

I don't know if its old news but Bachmann have changed the running no. on the GWR version to 9003 according to Kernow Models newsletter.

 

http://www.kernowmodelrailcentre.com/product/33947/31087DC_Bachmann_3200_Earl_Class_440_Steam_Locomotive_9003

Shows as 9003 at the Bachmann website.

 

Sep/Oct ... 31-087DC ... 3200 (Earl) Class 9003 GWR Green (DCC On Board)

Edited April 12, 2013 by Ozexpatriate

[Richard Mawer]

I wrote to Bachmann about the short, if existant, period that 3205 would / could have had a GWR livery. They did some more research and decided to alter the number to the later series. I got a nice reply, which I have to say impressed me. I am glad it has now been made public. It still doesn't help me as I model mid 1930's, but I am glad the anomoly has been removed and this lovely model will have a wider appeal and be accurate.

[Miss Prism]

I wrote to Bachmann about the short, if existant, period that 3205 would / could have had a GWR livery. They did some more research and decided to alter the number to the later series.

 

It would be interesting to know whether Bachmann's new research concluded that 9003 appeared in green or has assumed the whole class was repainted in green in late 1946.

[Richard Mawer]

I have no idea. I pointed out that at best 3205 could have had about a year in that combination or may not ever have been like that, and that to me it would make more sense to stick to early number series and shirtbutton, or later numbers and later livery. I directed them to the work you put up here about the variations. They say they have done more research. I understand they normally copy a photo so they know they have it right, but I don't know any more. I am impressed they listened in the first place.

[Coach bogie]

It would be interesting to know whether Bachmann's new research concluded that 9003 appeared in green or has assumed the whole class was repainted in green in late 1946.

I have seen the research that Bachmann consulted, based on Richard's email, and it is clear that some of the class were too new/low priority to have received wartime black and continued as built through the war years.

 

Mike Wiltshire

[Trains&armour]

I wrote to Bachmann about the short, if existant, period that 3205 would / could have had a GWR livery. They did some more research and decided to alter the number to the later series.

And now I should be thankful? GWrrrrrrrrr....  

My layout is supposed to be set in 1944, and the original number+GWR would have suited me fine! It could have happened and because of wartime censure it is unlikely that someone could have proven me wrong with a dated photo!.

But seriously, I can see the wider appeal of the new numbering    I just will have to renumber and replace GWR with the shirtbutton logo, as that seems to have been the most likely situation in 1944:

 

 

Edit: The editor does not allow me add anything below the second quotation! strange...

I have seen the research that Bachmann consulted, based on Richard's email, and it is clear that some of the class were too new/low priority to have received wartime black and continued as built through the war years.

 

Mike Wiltshire

Edited April 13, 2013 by Trains&armour

[Coach bogie]

And now I should be thankful? GWrrrrrrrrr....  

My layout is supposed to be set in 1944, and the original number+GWR would have suited me fine! It could have happened and because of wartime censure it is unlikely that someone could have proven me wrong with a dated photo!.

But seriously, I can see the wider appeal of the new numbering    I just will have to renumber and replace GWR with the shirtbutton logo, as that seems to have been the most likely situation in 1944:

 

 

When it was explained to me it all makes perfect sense. By the September 1939, two Earls had only just been put in traffic and one (3028) was still being 'built'. After 1940, the northern engines rarely went to Swindon, relying on Oswestry and Stafford Road for major work. By comparison to Swindon, paint facilities were more limited. None of the second batch would have required painting by 1945 as they were only 6 years old - unless there was platework damage they were just too young to justify a repaint. Unnecessary painting would be an expense too far, combined with wartime shortages, stock was only painted if a definite need. Earls clearly were not a priority class, as many others such as 28xx panniers etc (there was a pannier still with a roundel when withdrawn in the 1960's). Hence green Earls were around throught the war.

 

Mike Wiltshire