Wright writes.....

[Barry Ten]

A couple of years ago I was looking at a society stand being manned by one modeller when I noticed a nice etched brass coach kit of a type that's been hard to find for a while, with a sticker on it for a reasonable price (not a steal, by any means, but fair). I was just taking out my money to pay when a second modeller dashed over to the table and said in a panicked tone - to the first guy as much to me - "none of that's for sale! It''s just to show what's been available through the years!" It turned out the first guy was only minding the stand and hadn't been briefed that the stickered items which appeared to be for sale ... weren't actually for sale.

 

Probably an idea not to put prices on things, if you don't want people attempting to buy them, I'd suggest.

 

Al

Edited January 6, 2019 by Barry Ten

[31A]

Good afternoon, Clive,

 

I don't have the slightest idea how to access ebay, nor ever want to.

 

My point was more with regard to swapmeets. Without exception, it seems to me, that these don't really cater for 'modellers'. They're aimed at 'collectors', who never seem to alter/improve/renumber/rename/weather any model railway items. All they seem to be interested in is mint, boxed stuff, or general tat at knock-down prices. 

 

For instance, about 18 months ago, friend, Geoff West, and I took a stand at one Spaldling swapmeet. Geoff was disposing of his diesel stuff, mainly much-improved RTR. Unaltered, but boxed, stuff was grabbed long before the event opened (by traders). Once open to the public, we were astonished by comments such as 'I'd have bought that, but you've taken off the original couplings.' Needless to say, the replacements were scale shackles! Or, 'That's not the number/name which is on the box, and it's been weathered'. Anything improved was rejected by most, though it did eventually sell - but for less, in general, than the unaltered stuff. 

 

I'm still convinced that kits can be bought at swapmeets for really knocked-down prices. What price a pair of un-made white metal Gresley bogies, complete with Jackson wheels? '50p, mate, is that all right?' The rest of the stand was just second-hand tat as far as I was concerned. On another occasion, a chap was selling four etched-brass, un-made kits for locos for £30.00 the lot. I'd have grabbed them immediately, had they not been Jidenco ones. He had no idea what they were. Even if they'd have been really good etched-brass kits, they'd have still been the same price. Instead, I bought six sets of Gibson loco bogie wheels for £3.00! His stall was mainly second-hand RTR.

 

Anyway, as the generation (mine), which is principally-interested in steam-outline loco kits, inevitable dies out, prices will tumble over the next few years in my view. I'm under no illusions as to what mine might be worth to any future recipients. 

 

Regards,

 

Tony.  

 

 

On the subject of swap meets, in general I wholeheartedly agree.  We have one occasionally at York Racecourse and if it wasn't within an easy stroll of where I live, I wouldn't bother, as it is mainly the same old recycled RTR dross (by which I don't mean that all RTR is dross, but a lot of what gets recycled at swap meets seems to be).

 

But there is at least one trader who seems to specialise in selling what I take to be people's cast off (or deceased people's collections) of kits and bits, and I always make a bee line for that stall.  It's entirely pot luck what you find there and sometimes nothing of interest at all, but recently I've got unopened packets of ABS and Kenline wagon parts, MSE and Alan Gibson signal components, Modelmaster transfers, 3H and Parkside wagon kits.  At the most recent in December, there seemed to be a collection of loco kits for sale.  I didn't inspect them as I'm afraid I don't tend to build locos any longer, but there were Nu Cast, Sutherland, DJH etc.

[Northmoor]

I think the days of cheap secondhand stuff is slowly going as even things like the old Tri-ang Brush Type 2 are selling at £40 plus as good as there were in 1963 they are not worth that in 2019.

Clive - if those are the prices achieved (as opposed to the starting price - listing ends with no bids) I would be surprised; although places like Rails sell items for top money, they seem very honest in their descriptions and take the time to test things properly.  I've been a satisfied customer of theirs before.

 

There seems to be a chronology to how 2nd hand prices move:

1. New model is announced at £90.

2. "New" models appear on eBay, "never opened or run" for £120.

3. Starting prices for previous model discontinued ten years earlier, in good condition, increases on eBay from £30 to £40.

4. All similar models, regardless of condition, start at £40; even damaged/non-runners are advertised at this price.

5. Swapmeets are full of the above models at £60, with traders moaning to each other that no-one is buying anything.

 

I agree with Tony that you can get some real bargain kits at swapmeets (but you have to search, I have a few in the project boxes, all less than £20).  Where I may disagree is the availability of "general tat at knock-down prices".  I am glad that there is very little I am still actively looking for, as the prices asked for real tat - damaged and made-by-the-thousand Triang or 70s Hornby - has reached hilarious levels.

[Headstock]

You've made a lovely job of those, Andrew. My favourite diagram! I assume they are for use on Leicester South Goods? Here's a photo of a pair of them at Quorn with a Leicester-Sheffield service in 1952. I have several to build myself when I can get to them. I've been mass producing Parkside and Cambrian coal wagons over Christmas in order to get coal trains of the correct loadings for the Nottingham-Derby line that I'm modelling. Very quick and easy but it'll be nice to get on to something else.

 

Returning to the D210s and picking your brain (if I may).... You said the ones you've built were based at New Basford. Do you have records of specific allocations? I've only ever managed to get general class allocations for carriages, i.e. 'the D210s were for the Nottinghamshire and Lincolnshire services'. Many that worked over the GN lines in Nottingham were based at Basford North carriage sidings which were just up the GC line from New Basford on the spur to the GN Derby line. I recall seeing the allocations ('Basford N') on one or two photos on the ends of the carriages. The New Basford carriage sidings and depot were on the East side of the GC main line just north of New Basford station and I presume had a separate allocation in spite of being situated only about a mile away from Basford North.

 

Afternoon Clem,

 

a good question. Unfortunately and annoyingly, working through the ECS movements in and out of Nottingham Victoria is rather a pain, as there is no distinction made between Basford North and New Basford, just Basford! Isinglass would have it that there were five twins allocated to the Nottingham suburban services, this may however have only have been an initial allocation as I think more would have been required. That said, I haven't tried to untangle all the workings of these sets, (fascinating though they are) to be honest, this is a project taken over from someone else and most of the workings information is not directly relevant to what I'm modeling.

 

Only one set featuring the diag 210 twins worked south of Leicester, forming the 12.03 pm service to Rugby and return (weekday). It finished its days work up at Sheffield and formed the 6.05 am working to Nottingham the next day. From Nottingham it worked ECS to Basford with another set of twins for carriage cleaning. It departed Basford as a service train at 4.17 pm the same day for Nottingham Victoria with a Thompson/ Gresley non gangway three set attached. The latter was detached at the Vic and the train worked on to Mansfield. From here it would resume its day one timetable that would bring it back to the 12.03 pm departure from Leicester to Rugby. The ECS movements seem to be taking about seven minutes or so between Basford and the Vic, is this enough time to get up to Basford North? I'm quite happy to except that all the twins were shedded up there, there is a certain amount of logic in this.

 

P.S. The twins originally had an ex GC matchboard, non gangway, ten compartment third marshalled between them in the post war period, discontinued in the early fifties.

Edited January 6, 2019 by Headstock

[Headstock]

You've made a lovely job of those, Andrew. My favourite diagram! I assume they are for use on Leicester South Goods? Here's a photo of a pair of them at Quorn with a Leicester-Sheffield service in 1952. I have several to build myself when I can get to them. I've been mass producing Parkside and Cambrian coal wagons over Christmas in order to get coal trains of the correct loadings for the Nottingham-Derby line that I'm modelling. Very quick and easy but it'll be nice to get on to something else.

 

Returning to the D210s and picking your brain (if I may).... You said the ones you've built were based at New Basford. Do you have records of specific allocations? I've only ever managed to get general class allocations for carriages, i.e. 'the D210s were for the Nottinghamshire and Lincolnshire services'. Many that worked over the GN lines in Nottingham were based at Basford North carriage sidings which were just up the GC line from New Basford on the spur to the GN Derby line. I recall seeing the allocations ('Basford N') on one or two photos on the ends of the carriages. The New Basford carriage sidings and depot were on the East side of the GC main line just north of New Basford station and I presume had a separate allocation in spite of being situated only about a mile away from Basford North.

 

Afternoon again Clem,

 

I've just realized, (though I don't have time to check the relevant paperwork at the mo) there is a high probability that the photo (if at Quorn) shows the train I am modeling. Is it northbound?

Edited January 6, 2019 by Headstock

[Tony Wright]

Tony,

 

I've tried Markits bogie wheels on some of my RTR pacifics, but, as previously discussed on here I find the difference quite subtle and not really worth the cost, plus I have had some issues with the Markits wheels derailing over some of my less good quality pointwork (I use some older Peco points in the fiddle yard with the 'universal' frog). It does have the curly '6' and '9' (from the Ian Wilson smokebox door sheet).

 

The boiler on 60119 has the dreaded DCC decoder, so not much room for weight - entirely my own fault you're no doubt thinking!

 

I got 60119 from a trader at the Uckfield show in 2017. It was £100 reduced to £80 when I pointed out that it didn't work. As it was generally quite tidy, I thought that was a fair to good price, but I have had to buy a motor/ gearbox and two drivers (to replace the flangeless centre drivers) for it.

 

The cylinder drain cocks are plastic RTR ones to avoid a short, while I haven't much idea about eccentric rods I'm afraid. I may bring it to Stevenage next weekend for you to point out what I need to do if that's OK?

 

Regards

 

Andy

Andy,

 

I can't believe that some folk cannot see the difference between RTR bogie/pony wheels and proper ones - those made by Markits or Alan Gibson. 

 

I can see how a finer wheel might be less-than-happy over 'dodgy' track, but I'm afraid that, in my opinion, by using crude wheels you're solving any running problems in the same way that 'curing' any knocking sound from a car's engine is cured by turning up its radio to full blast! 

 

If you recall, when you were last over, a K2 would not run through one of the Peco 'Setrack' curved points in the M&GNR fiddle yard. The pony didn't derail (it's Markits), but the chassis did not have enough sideplay. It does now, and it runs through just fine. On close inspection, I was surprised how much 'finer' the flangways were in that new Setrack point. Much finer than the old 'Universal' type. Might I suggest abandoning any old universal points?

 

£80.00 seems a very good price for a DJH A1 kit, even if you had to buy-in more parts. I wonder what it would have been had it been un-made, especially with wheels. I'd have been tempted by that, but not made-up. Anyway, as you intimate, if you will fill up valuable ballast space in your locos with electronic gubbins, then what can I say?

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

[Clem]

Afternoon Clem,

 

a good question. Unfortunately and annoyingly, working through the ECS movements in and out of Nottingham Victoria is rather a pain, as there is no distinction made between Basford North and New Basford, just Basford! Isinglass would have it that there were five twins allocated to the Nottingham suburban services, this may however have only have been an initial allocation as I think more would have been required. That said, I haven't tried to untangle all the workings of these sets, (fascinating though they are) to be honest, this is a project taken over from someone else and most of the workings information is not directly relevant to what I'm modeling.

 

Only one set featuring the diag 210 twins worked south of Leicester, forming the 12.03 pm service to Rugby and return (weekday). It finished its days work up at Sheffield and formed the 6.05 am working to Nottingham the next day. From Nottingham it worked ECS to Basford with another set of twins for carriage cleaning. It departed Basford as a service train at 4.17 pm the same day for Nottingham Victoria with a Thompson/ Gresley non gangway three set attached. The latter was detached at the Vic and the train worked on to Mansfield. From here it would resume its day one timetable that would bring it back to the 12.03 pm departure from Leicester to Rugby. The ECS movements seem to be taking about seven minutes or so between Basford and the Vic, is this enough time to get up to Basford North? I'm quite happy to except that all the twins were shedded up there, there is a certain amount of logic in this.

 

P.S. The twins originally had an ex GC matchboard, non gangway, ten compartment third marshalled between them in the post war period, discontinued in the early fifties.

 

Thanks Andrew. That is fascinating information. I don't know whether I can add much, if anything. I certainly haven't got any information of the operational diagrams of these carriages. Passenger trains took 5 minutes to New Basford and 8 minutes to Basford North station ('Basford and Bulwell' before 1950) which was just beyond the Basford North carriage sidings. The New Basford carriage sidings were on the up side whilst the Basford North sidings were on the spur down from Bagthorpe Junction. So that's a little inconclusive. I'm sure your instinct is correct that there must have been more than 5 twins allocated to Basford. So many pictures show them working in pairs with the van section to the outside and often with an additional carriage. Here's a picture of what seemed to be a fairly typical formation in the centre road at the Vic The leading carriage in the photo is, I believe, a Diagram 244. On the Pinxton service sometimes single twin was used along with a Brake third. By the way, do you know Isinglass's original source. Possibly York Museum Library? 

[APOLLO]

Just have to say what a superb photo of Nottingham Victoria - has this station ever been modelled ?

 

Brit15

[Captain Kernow]

I can't believe that some folk cannot see the difference between RTR bogie/pony wheels and proper ones - those made by Markits or Alan Gibson.  

I also think it's an obvious and easy improvement to RTR models. I recall Tim Shackleton likening it (in MRJ a few years ago) to cutting just the edges of a lawn, to give an appearance of tended grass,

 

I am, however, guilty of extremely long-term procrastination when it comes to my two Ivatt 2-6-2 tank locos. Both are Bachmann and date from the mid-1990s, when this model first appeared. I fitted motion brackets (left over etches from another chassis kit) to both locos, which I felt improved them a lot, but never quite got around to dealing with the bogie and pony wheels.

 

The current Bachmann offering now has a motion bracket fitted.

 

When these locos were first mooted, by the way, my first exhibition layout 'Engine Wood' had only just been completed and there was a serious motive power shortage.

 

Much of my modelling time over the previous 15 years or so had been spent building loco kits for a model shop. The renumeration was lousy but it gave me masses of experience, so all in all, I didn't do so badly out of it.

 

This meant, though, that when I came to first exhibit 'Engine Wood' in December 1994 (the Bath exhibition in The Pavilion - anyone remember those?), I had so little appropriate motive power and rolling stock, that I had to borrow extensively from my friend Simon Castens (now proprietor of The Titfield Thunderbolt bookshop and also Wild Swan publications).

 

Starting in January 1995, a fairly intensive loco building programme started. Nowhere as quick or productive as you, Tony, but sufficient to allow me to become independent of 'outside help' within a few years.

 

Those locos which were improved RTR offerings, generally ended up with a replacement, etched chassis (but not the two Ivatt tanks!). The S&DJR in the late 1950s/early 1960s also saw a few BR Standard types, most of which were not available RTR at the time that I needed them, so 82041, 80043 and 73051 were built from kits.

Edited January 6, 2019 by Captain Kernow

[Clem]

Just have to say what a superb photo of Nottingham Victoria - has this station ever been modelled ?

 

Brit15

 

I think many have thought about it  and I think there is a model in progress of one end of the station, but I can can't remember by whom. Of course the big problem is the large area under the overall roof. How the hell would you get to it for operational purposes? Still, I suppose the Lime Street boys manage somehow... BTW I think the photos taken about 1956 as the J6 has a weatherboard at the front of the tender made out of a part of a withdrawn J52.

[Clem]

Afternoon again Clem,

 

I've just realized, (though I don't have time to check the relevant paperwork at the mo) there is a high probability that the photo (if at Quorn) shows the train I am modeling. Is it northbound?

 

Yes. Northbound.

[robertcwp]

I thought I'd post the results of my Christmas modelling efforts which involved finishing off my Mailcoach/ 247/ MJT BTO/TO pair ex West Riding as below.

 

DSC_1635.JPG

 

More details of the build are on my workbench thread at http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/135510-coulsdon-works/?p=3357918. This pair completes my early '50s West Riding set. It is formed (almost) as per the 1951 carriage workings (thanks Robert C):

BTO/TO (as above)

FO (Southern Pride Thompson standing in for an artic FO pair as happened from time to time)

RT/TO (D&S kit? ex John Houlden bought via Tony)

CK (Bachmann Thompson)

TK (Bachmann Thompson)

BTK (Bachmann Thompson)

BCK (Mousa/ MJT end Vestibule Gresley)

CK (Kirk end vestibule Gresley bought on eBay)

TK (Bachmann Thompson)

TK (Bachmann Thompson)

BTK (Bachmann Thompson)

 

 

The Twin BTO-TO looks good. It was not in the formation on the day of the Huntingdon fire and one of the ex-Coronation twins was standing in and was destroyed, along with the West Riding twin first. A bit later on all three surviving twin-firsts were on former GC services (until the Talisman began) so a Thompson FO became standard in the West Riding, later replaced by a BR Standard one. 

 

One small clarification is that the term was 'end-door' not 'end-vestibule', in spite of what several 'knowledgeable' authors have written over the years. This point has been the subject of some recent discussion in a society of which I am a member. In LNER terms, what BR called a gangway was a vestibule.

[Headstock]

Thanks Andrew. That is fascinating information. I don't know whether I can add much, if anything. I certainly haven't got any information of the operational diagrams of these carriages. Passenger trains took 5 minutes to New Basford and 8 minutes to Basford North station ('Basford and Bulwell' before 1950) which was just beyond the Basford North carriage sidings. The New Basford carriage sidings were on the up side whilst the Basford North sidings were on the spur down from Bagthorpe Junction. So that's a little inconclusive. I'm sure your instinct is correct that there must have been more than 5 twins allocated to Basford. So many pictures show them working in pairs with the van section to the outside and often with an additional carriage. Here's a picture of what seemed to be a fairly typical formation in the centre road at the Vic The leading carriage in the photo is, I believe, a Diagram 244. On the Pinxton service sometimes single twin was used along with a Brake third. By the way, do you know Isinglass's original source. Possibly York Museum Library? 

 

Was there ever a more photogenic location than Nottingham Victoria?

 

I notice the ex NE BZ, the Vic was Van central for BZ traffic both North South and East West as well as many other permutations. Not sure if that is a Pinxton train, though 1956 is getting a bit close to the great desolation for comfort, so I'm not so up on such times.

 

An image from the just a little earlier, (no harsh looking MK1 interlopers in this shot) and a favorite of mine. One of Annesleys N7 tank locomotives adds a bit of GE sparkle, surrounded by carriages from the GN, NE and GC. You couldn't make it up but you would have a great time building it.

[Headstock]

Yes. Northbound.

 

Thanks Clem,

 

I think there was only one set of workings between Leicester and Nottingham that employed the diag 210 twins, that would be the same as encompassed the 12.03pm Leicester Rugby.

[Tony Wright]

I also think it's an obvious and easy improvement to RTR models. I recall Tim Shackleton likening it (in MRJ a few years ago) to cutting just the edges of a lawn, to give an appearance of tended grass,

 

I am, however, guilty of extremely long-term procrastination when it comes to my two Ivatt 2-6-2 tank locos. Both are Bachmann and date from the mid-1990s, when this model first appeared. I fitted motion brackets (left over etches from another chassis kit) to both locos, which I felt improved them a lot, but never quite got around to dealing with the bogie and pony wheels.

 

The current Bachmann offering now has a motion bracket fitted.

 

When these locos were first mooted, by the way, my first exhibition layout 'Engine Wood' had only just been completed and there was a serious motive power shortage.

 

Much of my modelling time over the previous 15 years or so had been spent building loco kits for a model shop. The renumeration was lousy but it gave me masses of experience, so all in all, I didn't do so badly out of it.

 

This meant, though, that when I came to first exhibit 'Engine Wood' in December 1994 (the Bath exhibition in The Pavilion - anyone remember those?), I had so little appropriate motive power and rolling stock, that I had to borrow extensively from my friend Simon Castens (now proprietor of The Titfield Thunderbolt bookshop and also Wild Swan publications).

 

Starting in January 1995, a fairly intensive loco building programme started. Nowhere as quick or productive as you, Tony, but sufficient to allow me to become independent of 'outside help' within a few years.

 

Those locos which were improved RTR offerings, generally ended up with a replacement, etched chassis (but not the two Ivatt tanks!). The S&DJR in the late 1950s/early 1960s also saw a few BR Standard types, most of which were not available RTR at the time that I needed them, so 82041, 80043 and 73051 were built from kits.

It's interesting that you mention 'appropriate' motive power, Captain,

 

I the mid-'90s, I was commissioned by a model railway magazine to photograph a certain S&D layout, on the recommendation of the building club's 'publicity officer'. 'You're going to photograph the finest model railway you've ever seen' he told me over the phone. Thus, the visit was arranged (with overnight accommodation provided by a friend) and I duly set off down south. This was in the days before digital photography, so my car (a Ford Sierra) was packed with lights, rigs, tripods, cameras and sky background sheets. 

 

However, on seeing this 'masterpiece', without doubt bulging with potential and displaying (already) some outstanding trackwork and architectural modelling, I was rather surprised to see that all the available motive power/rolling stock was RTR, in most cases untouched. There were, indeed, at least two of those little Ivatt 'Mickey Mouse' tanks you mention from Bachmann. There were also a couple of Palitoy BR Standard 4 4-6-0s, what looked like tender-drive 4Fs and 2Ps, and that was about it, loco-wise. Coaching stock consisted of various Hornby or Bachmann ex-GWR/ex-SR items, plus some Airfix ex-LMS carriages. There were also a few RTR vans. 

 

When I enquired as to where were the S&D 2-8-0s, the 'proper 4Fs and 2Ps, the 9Fs, the Standard 5s, the original Bulleid Pacifics and what have you, I was told that 'They're being built'. 'Yet', I said,'You told me that I was to photograph the finest model railway I've ever seen!' - I wonder how many he thought I'd seen. 'And, it's only OO!' 

 

Apart from taking one or two general shots, I made my excuses and left, phoning the editor (from a call box) and telling him it was a waste of my time and his money. The club paid all my expenses, and, as far as I know, the images never appeared apart from one shot of a magnificent station roof. . 

 

What does the above prove? For one thing, be very suspicious in my view of anyone who calls him/herself a club's 'publicity officer'; and another, why is that some seem to take the greatest care in building a layout, with lots of scratch-built structures, bespoke trackwork, accurate signals and wonderful scenery, yet are quite happy to run RTR locos and stock? Granted (and this has merit, I do concede) if those RTR items have been altered/improved/detailed/weathered by the builder(s), then so much the better, but to me, at times, it's rather like running excellent hand-/kit-built locos and stock through Superquickville, Metcalfe Town, Skale Dale  or Scenecraft City. 

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

[Blandford1969]

Just have to say what a superb photo of Nottingham Victoria - has this station ever been modelled ?

 

Brit15

With all the research the Nottingham Victoria 3d model group have done on Facebook unearthing plans and rebuilding views it a lot more information is available. https://www.facebook.com/NottsVic3D/ 

[great central]

Thanks Andrew. That is fascinating information. I don't know whether I can add much, if anything. I certainly haven't got any information of the operational diagrams of these carriages. Passenger trains took 5 minutes to New Basford and 8 minutes to Basford North station ('Basford and Bulwell' before 1950) which was just beyond the Basford North carriage sidings. The New Basford carriage sidings were on the up side whilst the Basford North sidings were on the spur down from Bagthorpe Junction. So that's a little inconclusive. I'm sure your instinct is correct that there must have been more than 5 twins allocated to Basford. So many pictures show them working in pairs with the van section to the outside and often with an additional carriage. Here's a picture of what seemed to be a fairly typical formation in the centre road at the Vic The leading carriage in the photo is, I believe, a Diagram 244. On the Pinxton service sometimes single twin was used along with a Brake third. By the way, do you know Isinglass's original source. Possibly York Museum Library?

.

 

Regarding New Basford or Basford North, the access to New Basford required a reversal into the up line platform of the station then the stock was hauled into the sidings. Always accomplished fairly smartly but depending how detailed working time tables were at the time, the reversal may well have been shown.

Our current diagrams for the Newark reversal include such details even issuing a separate headcode for the reversal move.

With that in mind and, I think but stand to be corrected, a straight entry into the sidings at Basford North the slightly longer time points to that as the destination. Also you mentioned a train starting at Basford North for Nottingham Victoria? Did that take the back line via Daybrook which I believe still had a limited passenger service until closure? I'd be almost certain that would use stock from Basford North, anything from New Basford would require a double reversal. I can remember both the Derby Friargate and Pinxton trains from Victoria, we used them as a way of getting onto the station as it was almost impossible for a group of scruffy kids to get past the ticket collector on the bridge even with platform tickets!

I can just remember the last of the Sheffield stoppers using Directors and towards the end Brush type 2s, latterly class 31s after the original engines were replaced with EE units.

[APOLLO]

Just found this impressive Nottingham Victoria layout. As mentioned not the easiest of subjects to model.

 

http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/blog/1535/entry-15819-nottingham-victoria-by-tony-phillips/

 

A link to the 3d website

 

http://nottinghamvictoriastation.com/

 

And a painting off the web

 

 

Brit15

Edited January 6, 2019 by APOLLO

[trustytrev]

Hello,

     Found this by chance today. A real gem from the past.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FeojYgl5GFE

Possibly a better location for this?

trustytrev..

[Clive Mortimore]

Just found this impressive Nottingham Victoria layout. As mentioned not the easiest of subjects to model.

 

http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/blog/1535/entry-15819-nottingham-victoria-by-tony-phillips/

 

A link to the 3d website

 

http://nottinghamvictoriastation.com/

 

And a painting off the web

 

 

Brit15

I have always thought a model of just one end of the station would be manageable , the whole station, wow. As I say one end with its respective tunnel and the overall roof acting as the scenic breaks. A potential downside is like many locations where there are excellent scenic breaks it is in a cutting which limits the view to the roofs of the trains.

 

I have in my collection of goodies a hand drawn signal diagram by a now deceased member of the Witham club. Before moving south he had been a signalman at various GCR boxes in the Nottingham area.

[Clem]

.

 

Regarding New Basford or Basford North, the access to New Basford required a reversal into the up line platform of the station then the stock was hauled into the sidings. Always accomplished fairly smartly but depending how detailed working time tables were at the time, the reversal may well have been shown.

Our current diagrams for the Newark reversal include such details even issuing a separate headcode for the reversal move.

With that in mind and, I think but stand to be corrected, a straight entry into the sidings at Basford North the slightly longer time points to that as the destination. Also you mentioned a train starting at Basford North for Nottingham Victoria? Did that take the back line via Daybrook which I believe still had a limited passenger service until closure? I'd be almost certain that would use stock from Basford North, anything from New Basford would require a double reversal. I can remember both the Derby Friargate and Pinxton trains from Victoria, we used them as a way of getting onto the station as it was almost impossible for a group of scruffy kids to get past the ticket collector on the bridge even with platform tickets!

I can just remember the last of the Sheffield stoppers using Directors and towards the end Brush type 2s, latterly class 31s after the original engines were replaced with EE units.

 

Good memories! I also remember the ticket collectors at Nottingham Victoria. You couldn't get on the platforms with a platform ticket for love nor money. Usually a ticket to London Road High Level would do it. I remember the Directors on the Sheffield trains too. I didn't think I mentioned the service from Basford North to Nottingham Victoria via Daybrook and Gedling but that you mention it, it would have left from the bay at Basford North. My brother went to Henry Mellish School and a lot of his school chums caught it. He'd go up to the station most days with them although he didn't catch it. No, the timing I was talking about was the direct journey from Nottingham Vic to Basford as taken by all but one of the Derby trains (and the Pinxtons, too).

[Tony Wright]

What a fantastic project Nottingham Victoria would be.

 

 

Plenty of V2s would be needed. This one, however, will be a New England-allocated one, so unlikely to have been seen on the ex-GC.

 

When WMRC built Charwelton (which is now in diesel-mode - now run by others), we must have had about a dozen V2s to call on. I'd built about eight or nine, Tony Geary had at least two, and there were a couple belonging to other members, not to mention guest ones (two of which I'd built for customers). Two of Tony's ended up on Peterborough North, but I had to modify them to run round the tighter radii. They also ran on Stoke Summit.

 

All were built from kits, of course; no Bachmann ones were used, largely because of indifferent (split-chassis) performance and poor body. Now the Bachmann one, at last, has a decent chassis and a new body is promised. But when will it arrive? Not that I'm over-bothered, but I'm sure it'll mean masses of older Bachmann V2s coming up for sale second-hand.

 

Just the valve gear to erect on this one tomorrow, and book reviews to write...................... How did I ever find the time to go to work? 

[thegreenhowards]

Andy,

 

Might I suggest abandoning any old universal points?

 

 

I agree that new code 100 points, even settrack, are much better than old ones. I certainly won’t be laying any more, but ripping them all up at this stage would be a lot of work. I’m close to eliminating them on one circuit, so at that stage, I might try again with some bogie wheels, and route restrict such locos to the ‘up’.

 

But, the price of two sets of bogie wheels = one DCC chip...and I know which I’d prefer!!!

[Mallard60022]

An aside. On moving to Retford in January 2003 I became more interested in the railways of Nottinghamshire (and area) and began to look at Nottingham and the GC in particular. I spent several days on 'field trips' looking at the few remaining areas of earthworks and infrastructure including trying to orientate myself at Colwick. What a huge web of lines there were and how few are left now. I suspect people may have been suspicious of me peering over fences and into old cuttings but what a sad sort of entertainment it was for me. However, I have several lovely books in my collection and what a Town it must have been for railway enthusiasts until the late 60s/early 70s.

I never saw the actual Victoria but fortunately Midland retains much of its' historic buildings and just a little atmosphere.

Phil

[thegreenhowards]

The Twin BTO-TO looks good. It was not in the formation on the day of the Huntingdon fire and one of the ex-Coronation twins was standing in and was destroyed, along with the West Riding twin first. A bit later on all three surviving twin-firsts were on former GC services (until the Talisman began) so a Thompson FO became standard in the West Riding, later replaced by a BR Standard one. 

 

One small clarification is that the term was 'end-door' not 'end-vestibule', in spite of what several 'knowledgeable' authors have written over the years. This point has been the subject of some recent discussion in a society of which I am a member. In LNER terms, what BR called a gangway was a vestibule.

Thanks Robert,

 

I realise that the ex-WR twin was not in the fire, so I’ve modelled that one. I believe that after the fire a different twin FO was used for a bit, and it wasn’t regularly A Thompson FO until after the train became Mark 1 at the back (although you’re missing the critical years in your carriage working database so I can’t be sure). In any event, I’ve seen photos of Thompson FOs standing in earlier than that, so I feel I can get away with it. Running with apple green 60117 as in the video is pre-fire anyway as she was painted blue and named in July 1950. I also run the train with blue 60118 and green 60156, but in the latter case I substitute out the teak liveried BSK at the end (and will substitute the teak Gresleys when I can build some).

 

I have built a twin FO, but that’s in Maroon and runs in my 1958 Talisman. I can’t face another Mailcoach kit just yet!

 

I stand corrected on end door. Vestibule will be wiped from my vocabulary!

 

And