Wright writes.....

[Tony Wright]

5 hours ago, Jeepy said:

Good afternoon Tony,

 

I am currently reading a book about William Stroudley's 'Terriers', the first part being about the man himself and I was amazed to find that from the year 1857 to 1858 he was seconded to supervise the working of the Edenham & Little Bytham Railway! Owned by Lord Willoughby de Eresbury of course, but I'm guessing you already knew that! 

 

Regards,

 

Jim.

Good evening Jim,

 

I did. I also know that another friend of the Lord was Daniel Gooch.

 

Apparently, the two great engineers would spend weekends at Grimsthorpe Castle, Lord Willoughby's ancestral home (which is where the Edenham Railway hoped to reach, but a bit was uphill from there!), tinkering with the line's two locos. 

 

As I look through our bedroom window every morning, the remains of the line across the valley can still be made out, even though it was abandoned in the 19th Century.

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

[Compound2632]

17 hours ago, Jeepy said:

I am currently reading a book about William Stroudley's 'Terriers', the first part being about the man himself 

 

I'm intrigued. I could pass on the Terriers - though Stroudley's work as a whole on the Brighton was revolutionary - but the biography sounds interesting. What's the book?

[Jeepy]

2 hours ago, Compound2632 said:

 

I'm intrigued. I could pass on the Terriers - though Stroudley's work as a whole on the Brighton was revolutionary - but the biography sounds interesting. What's the book?

Hello,

 

It's titled 'Stroudley and his 'Terriers' by Tom Middlemass,  published 20th October 1995, there's two ISBN numbers: ISBN-10 1899816003 and: ISBN-13 978-1899816002.

I bought it as part of my research on the Terriers as I managed to acquire an 'O' gauge one, although I generally model in 'OO' or 'EM' ! 

There were so many modifications to them throughout their lives so I'm trying to decide which prototype to model! No two Terriers were the same it seems! 

 

Regards,

 

Jim.

 

I hasten to add it's not a biography in the true sense of the word really, but there's a few pages dedicated to his career path etc.

Edited March 23 by Jeepy
To add something.

[Steamport Southport]

Has as much about Stroudley as the William Dean book has about William Dean. Very little.

 

Certainly nothing like the Oakwood biographies of the CMEs/Locomotive Superintendents.

 

Now if you want the history of Dean Goods then this is the book. Has a little about his other locos, but is virtually An Illustrated History Of The Dean Goods and would have probably been better called such. If you want The Life And Times Of William Dean then I would look elsewhere.

 

 

https://www.amazon.co.uk/William-Dean-Greatest-Them-All/dp/1906419922

 

 

Jason

[Compound2632]

26 minutes ago, Steamport Southport said:

Has as much about Stroudley as the William Dean book has about William Dean. Very little.

 

Indeed, I have the Clements book - you may be surprised to know I was wanting detailed info on the goods engines - and as far as it discusses Dean's life, it's more hagiography than biography. 

[Tony Wright]

Yesterday, Howard Smith brought over some new TMC models to run on Little Bytham (Howard, ex-BRM, now works for TMC).

 

 

First was this exclusive Brush Type 4, D1960. 

 

This was analogue, and ran superbly (as expected from a Heljan model). The weathering was superbly-applied. 

 

Another one was tested, this time with DCC onboard. Though not displaying every function, the DCC-fitted Brush 4 also ran beautifully on analogue, with sound.

 

Attention then turned to the DCC-fitted G5s he brought.

 

 

 

 

At least three little beauties.

 

Now, in the past, DCC control has been coupled-up to Little Bytham and everything ran perfectly. Not this time! In that past, it's been Bachmann's Dynamis DCC, but Howard brought over a brand new NCE Powercab. On initial test in the fiddleyard, everything was fine. However, once out on the scenic section, the locos just refused to comply with any 'command'. 

 

Though all the DC stuff was completely turned off, the signals and the points seemed to interfere with the DCC signal. The fiddle yard has no signals, and the points are switched by solenoids. The scenic section's signals are worked by Viessman motors and the points by Fulgurex motors. How could they affect the DCC signal? 

 

Has anyone else encountered this phenomenon? 

 

The little locos still worked happily on DC, as will be evident on a video Howard shot. 

 

What the problem meant was that I as unable to try out the smoke-fitted/sound-fitted Hornby P2 seen before (it won't work at all on DC). Luckily, I know one or two mates with DCC layouts.................

[Nick Holliday]

5 hours ago, Compound2632 said:

 

I'm intrigued. I could pass on the Terriers - though Stroudley's work as a whole on the Brighton was revolutionary - but the biography sounds interesting. What's the book?

If you want a book that goes into Stroudley's life and achievements in a rather more detailed way, I can recommend this one. Although the writer doesn't claim it is a biography there is an excellent introduction to his life, fascinating details of some of the minutiae of loco fittings, and even a summary of his inventiveness in the maritime sphere.

 

Edited March 23 by Nick Holliday

[Tony Wright]

Further to the topic of William Stroudley and his association with Lord Willoughby's private railway from Little Bytham to Edenham, I recommend the acquisition of Lord Willoughby's Railway The Edenham Branch by R. E. Pearson and J. G. Ruddock, published by the Willoughby Memorial Trust in 1986. Chapter and verse are contained therein.

 

I first visited Little Bytham in the early-'70s (hunting Deltics), and became aware of a railway bridge on the road from the village to Witham on the Hill. I knew nothing about it, but later found out that it carried the Witham Road over the Edenham branch.

 

 

50 years later, that bridge still stands (despite no train having passed underneath it since 1873). Thankfully, it was repaired just prior to Covid and should stand into a further century. Lord Willoughby consulted Walter Marr Brydone, Engineer of the GNR at the time of his line's building in the 1850s, and the GN man's input is apparent in this beautiful structure.

 

The line of trees in the far distance mark the remains of the M&GNR, which cut through the remains of the Edenham branch at the end of the 19th Century. 

 

My dear friend, Ian Wilson, built a layout which supposed that the GN took over the Edenham branch shortly before its closure and kept it running. In turn, the LNER then eventually BR kept it running, evening expanding its operation to tap into local minerals. Presumably, then, it was closed at the same time as the M&GNR.

 

I think Ian built a lovely model..............

 

 

The little hut to the right is the only structure which survives to this day, though Ian's station building is a larger representation than the actual one built. As for the loco shed, there was one at Little Bytham, so provision here invokes even more 'modeller's licence'.

 

 

After Lord Willoughby's railway was abandoned, the GNR took over the line's loco shed and converted it into a stable. It survived into the 'sixties. Ian scratch-built this model.

 

My contribution to Ian's Edenham..............

 

 

Has been to build most of the locos and rolling stock.

 

 

Even to the extent of photographing it! 

 

 

Edited March 23 by Tony Wright
typo error

[Jeepy]

6 hours ago, Nick Holliday said:

If you want a book that goes into Stroudley's life and achievements in a rather more detailed way, I can recommend this one. Although the writer doesn't claim it is a biography there is an excellent introduction to his life, fascinating details of some of the minutiae of loco fittings, and even a summary of his inventiveness in the maritime sphere.

 

Thank you Nick, a copy found and ordered! 

 

Regards,

 

Jim.

 

 

Edited March 23 by Jeepy

[Jeepy]

1 hour ago, Tony Wright said:

Further to the topic of William Stroudley and his association with Lord Willoughby's private railway from Little Bytham to Edenham, I recommend the acquisition of Lord Willoughby's Railway The Edenham Branch by R. E. Pearson and J. G. Ruddock, published by the Willoughby Memorial Trust in 1986. Chapter and verse are contained therein.

Thank you Tony!

I have found and ordered a copy,

 

Regards,

 

Jim.

[PMP]

22 hours ago, Tony Wright said:

 

Has anyone else encountered this phenomenon? 

 

As someone who runs DC/DCC on the same layout, (NCE powercab) I’ve never experienced any similar issues. My track power and points aren’t integrated though in that point motors are powered from an entirely separate source.

Good to see Howard has stayed in the industry.

[Tony Wright]

2 hours ago, PMP said:

As someone who runs DC/DCC on the same layout, (NCE powercab) I’ve never experienced any similar issues. My track power and points aren’t integrated though in that point motors are powered from an entirely separate source.

Good to see Howard has stayed in the industry.

Thanks Paul,

 

In DC mode the tracks on Little Bytham are powered from four Helmsman O Gauge controllers (one for each of the main circuits). These were all switched off when DCC was attached.

The points on the scenic side have their own supply. This was all switched off.

The signals have their own supply. This was all switched off.

The points in the fiddle yard have their own supply. This was all switched off.

 

Every power source is independent. 

 

Why the scenic-side power sources (the points and the signals) should affect the NCE unit, I have no idea, especially when everything was switched off. 

 

Thankfully, for my own use, it's not a problem since LB will never be DCC-operated while I'm still alive, but for testing DCC-onboard locos using an NCE unit it's clearly going to be an issue. So, those who want to use DCC, please bring along your Dynamis system...............

 

Yes, I'm delighted Howard is still in the industry, too.

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

[MikeParkin65]

Evening Tony

 

Was Howard using the PowerCab on its own without a booster? It’s only a starter set on its own with I think a max 2 amp output and I think 13.8volt max output.  I can imagine even a single circuit of Little Bytham needs a tad more than that.  Surprised a Dynamis works to be honest.  

[Tony Wright]

12 hours ago, MikeParkin65 said:

Evening Tony

 

Was Howard using the PowerCab on its own without a booster? It’s only a starter set on its own with I think a max 2 amp output and I think 13.8volt max output.  I can imagine even a single circuit of Little Bytham needs a tad more than that.  Surprised a Dynamis works to be honest.  

Good morning Mike,

 

I have no idea which NCE controller Howard used; once he was shown how the gadget was attached, my involvement ceased, knowing nothing of such 'mysterious' control systems.

 

You could well be right about the need for extra power on a layout as 'big' as LB (that's why the heavy-amperage Helmsman O Gauge analogue controllers were chosen).

 

As for Dynamis working - on LB that was with Bachmann's own staff, operating Bachmann's own stock using Bachmann's own system - running the Midland Pullman (it's on Youtube somewhere). 

 

As an aside, I find it disappointing to find that all the most-recent DCC-fitted Hornby locos I've tested of late won't work on DC at source. It would seem that the decoder has been programmed not to work on DC. Granted, not all functions would be available, but the wonderful  DCC-fitted Heljan Class 47 Howard brought over on Friday (exclusive to TMC) worked fine on just DC, even to the extent of having sound! It'll be out on Youtube soon.

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

[Izzy]

37 minutes ago, Tony Wright said:

 

 

As an aside, I find it disappointing to find that all the most-recent DCC-fitted Hornby locos I've tested of late won't work on DC at source. It would seem that the decoder has been programmed not to work on DC. Granted, not all functions would be available, but the wonderful  DCC-fitted Heljan Class 47 Howard brought over on Friday (exclusive to TMC) worked fine on just DC, even to the extent of having sound! It'll be out on Youtube soon.

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

 

There is a newish thread here concerning DCC sound fitted locos on DC, with several remarks that their performance is generally quite poor. Very slow speeds and low sound levels. I wonder if this is not the case with LB simply because you use heavy duty O gauge DC controllers that can give these locos the current levels they need on DC which other OO specific DC systems with lower amperage rates cannot. This might explain why Hornby have gone down this route. To prevent users expressing dissatisfaction at the poor performance on DC when they are quite satisfactory on DCC.

 

Bob
 

[DenysW]

1 hour ago, Tony Wright said:

the most-recent DCC-fitted Hornby locos I've tested of late won't work on DC at source.

I was naif/feckless enough to buy a Trix/Marklin DCC locomotive that said it would work on DC. It did - for a while. It turns out that the maximum DC voltage it could accept was appreciably lower than the 20V maximum put out by my Gaugemaster controller, and I burned it out quite quickly. I'd say that specification incompatibility like this will be quite common, and Hornby may just be guarding against it.

[34theletterbetweenB&D]

4 hours ago, Tony Wright said:

...I have no idea which NCE controller Howard used...

And it has probably been through a few variations in output since  going on sale in the UK, and was notoriously 'flabby' in output when I first looked at one about twenty two years ago. That example couldn't get a Lenz decoder equipped WD 2-8-0 to reach scale for 30mph. On 12V DC the same model would run at scale for 60mph.

 

You might request that any visiting DCC systems have an adjustable voltage output. (The Lenz system I use is a good one, user adjustable voltage output to protect against N gauge burn out, and for O gauge traction to receive sufficient power, doubtless there are others.)

[john new]

A bit back the thread carried posts about kit built locos never being run. Just read of a recent auction in Scarborough with circa 300 examples. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-york-north-yorkshire-68645753 

[polybear]

3 minutes ago, john new said:

A bit back the thread carried posts about kit built locos never being run. Just read of a recent auction in Scarborough with circa 300 examples. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-york-north-yorkshire-68645753 

 

That works out at £27 per loco....

[john new]

1 minute ago, polybear said:

 

That works out at £27 per loco....

I also thought they were either low priced (bad for the sellers) or a typo in how much they made. Mind you I haven’t seen much on how well or otherwise they were put together. Didn’t know about it in advance.

[Barry Ten]

1 hour ago, 34theletterbetweenB&D said:

And it has probably been through a few variations in output since  going on sale in the UK, and was notoriously 'flabby' in output when I first looked at one about twenty two years ago. That example couldn't get a Lenz decoder equipped WD 2-8-0 to reach scale for 30mph. On 12V DC the same model would run at scale for 60mph.

 

You might request that any visiting DCC systems have an adjustable voltage output. (The Lenz system I use is a good one, user adjustable voltage output to protect against N gauge burn out, and for O gauge traction to receive sufficient power, doubtless there are others.)

 

 

My Powercab was bought in the UK circa 2010 and didn't really work reliably until I swapped the power supply.

 

[EHertsGER]

On 18/03/2024 at 16:10, Barclay said:

MJT etched parts are very good. Available from Dart Castings. They also do a variety of cast axleboxes and springs to go with them.

I suggest you take a look at Rumney Models' website Morton-Independent-Lifting Link Brake Underframes | Rumney Models. You will, of course, need axle boxes and so on, which he also supplies. Your van bodywork has been finished very well, so a decent chassis should go under it. The kits are not as hard to build as you might think form the pictures. I managed it...!

[Tony Wright]

2 hours ago, polybear said:

 

That works out at £27 per loco....

I was still doing the maths, Brian.

 

Not much, I have to say. However, if they've never run.....................

 

Regards,

 

Tony

[Tony Wright]

7 hours ago, Izzy said:

 

There is a newish thread here concerning DCC sound fitted locos on DC, with several remarks that their performance is generally quite poor. Very slow speeds and low sound levels. I wonder if this is not the case with LB simply because you use heavy duty O gauge DC controllers that can give these locos the current levels they need on DC which other OO specific DC systems with lower amperage rates cannot. This might explain why Hornby have gone down this route. To prevent users expressing dissatisfaction at the poor performance on DC when they are quite satisfactory on DCC.

 

Bob
 

Thanks Bob,

 

That all makes sense. 

 

Certainly, the DCC-fitted Heljan 47 certainly displayed no lack of power, and with the wick turned up, one could certainly hear it! 

 

Testing it on just DC was in response to a request by a potential customer asking if there would be a 'drop-off' in performance without DCC control. There was no drop-off (the loco easily exceeded the prototype's top speed in scale and any more engine noise would have been annoying). Of course, we had no idea which DC supply the customer has, and Helmsman O Gauge controllers are certainly at the top end for power delivery. 

 

Regards,

 

Tony.  

[Tony Wright]

2 hours ago, john new said:

I also thought they were either low priced (bad for the sellers) or a typo in how much they made. Mind you I haven’t seen much on how well or otherwise they were put together. Didn’t know about it in advance.

Good evening John,

 

The pictures of the models in your post didn't seem to show the 'highest quality', though the real value was probably obtained by the late builder in just making/painting them. 

 

Though my 'experience' in selling models on behalf of distressed/bereaved families is nowhere near that of an auction house, I'm sure I'd achieve a fair bit more that £27.00 each. That said, recent experiences tend to reveal that the bottom might be falling out of the second-hand kit-built loco market (unless the builder/painter is well-known and provides a provenance); a classic case of supply rapidly exceeding demand as the generation which made such things dies off!

 

Regards,

 

Tony.