Wright writes.....

[Tony Wright]

I wholly agree, and plead guilty to failing to change RTR bogie and pony wheels in many cases. In mitigation I can only state that I'm too mean to keep buying new carrying wheels and I'm short of time anyway. Where the new wheels would have to be painted green to and lined to a standard that matches the rest of loco, the time and stress penalty associated with making the change is also significant....

Thanks Graeme,

 

I agree with what you say as well. I suppose, on a (large?) layout, changing the (usually-awful) RTR bogie/pony wheels might not be necessary (this has been discussed before), but, from a photographic point of view, since the gross RTR bogie/pony wheels are the first thing (wheel-wise) which the camera records, leaving the originals on (at least to me) is not an option; unless, the replacements have to be painted lined apple green. Since my wheels are black, that's easy.

 

 

Certainly, attempting to match the paint-finish on any replacement bogie wheels for this Hornby A1 at Grantham would be very difficult, though the wheel treads are a bit gross in this tight-perspective shot. That said, with Grantham's Code 100 track, there'll be less likely to give trouble, anyway. 

 

 

As supplied in black, they just look poor in my view. Why is it, as well, that in post-1953 condition, both sets of guard irons are retained by Hornby's LNER Pacifics (both attached to the bogie, as well, which is weird). 

 

 

This is what 60093 became on LB, and it's the last of my Hornby A3s (retained because it has an A4 boiler). I modified it and Tom Foster weathered it for me. 

 

 

Could one get a 'cruder' three-quarter front view than that presented by these two RTR locos (on a very good exhibition layout)? The bogie/pony wheels presented are awful and if ever a case can be made for the abandonment of tension-lock couplings, surely, this is it! Just change those wheels and junk the couplings and think how much more realistic this scene would look. 

 

 

Alan Gibson does an 'exact' bogie wheel for a 4mm Patriot.

 

 

Bachmann's LNER bogie wheels aren't right, either (and just look at that coupling).

 

 

Though the steps and cylinder drain cocks do hide the replacement wheels on this A2 a little, the difference is still substantial. The bogie wheels here are also AGW. I did the mods and Tom Foster produced the brilliant weathering.

 

My apologies to those who think I'm on a bit of a crusade here, but the simple mods I'm suggesting (though there is a cost) can surely be undertaken by anyone who calls themselves a railway modeller. Changing those gross bogie/pony wheels (and, especially, chucking away those TL couplings), makes such a difference. Am I on a mission, I wonder? 

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

Edited April 4, 2018 by Tony Wright

[2ManySpams]

I think each of us is guilty of our our private crusades. To some it's lamps, bogie wheels and the finer details of LNER pacifics.

 

Me? I have an equal interest in buildings and one thing that jars is when corners aren't finished properly. Brick or stone courses not matching and highly visible joints/gaps are particular gripes. I personally feel it's a shame that these issues aren't always addressed as they don't take a huge amount of time, effort and skill to rectify.

 

As Tony correctly says small things like bogie wheels tyre treads and the wrong number if spokes are easily picked up by a camera, even on a layout loco. Likewise I often spot the things that bug me on photos and unfortunately these days photography also means that even background buildings come under scrutiny.

 

 

I think the key point here is that whilst we all have our crusades we also all have our blind spots.

[Tony Wright]

I think each of us is guilty of our our private crusades. To some it's lamps, bogie wheels and the finer details of LNER pacifics.

 

Me? I have an equal interest in buildings and one thing that jars is when corners aren't finished properly. Brick or stone courses not matching and highly visible joints/gaps are particular gripes. I personally feel it's a shame that these issues aren't always addressed as they don't take a huge amount of time, effort and skill to rectify.

 

As Tony correctly says small things like bogie wheels tyre treads and the wrong number if spokes are easily picked up by a camera, even on a layout loco. Likewise I often spot the things that bug me on photos and unfortunately these days photography also means that even background buildings come under scrutiny.

 

rps20180404_122937.jpg

 

I think the key point here is that whilst we all have our crusades we also all have our blind spots.

Quite right, Chris,

 

Though it is a rather cruel enlargement. It's at least three times larger than real life. 

 

Though I did mitre the corners, there is that unsightly seam. 

 

I think I've probably got more blind spots than most, though I still contend it's easier changing four bogie wheels than it is to accurately match the courses on model buildings' corners. 

 

May we see how it's done properly, please? I know you have your own threads, but it would be nice to see your work here as well. 

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

[2ManySpams]

Deleted as cut and paste didn't not work. See link in post below.

[Clive Mortimore]

I think each of us is guilty of our our private crusades. To some it's lamps, bogie wheels and the finer details of LNER pacifics.

 

Me? I have an equal interest in buildings and one thing that jars is when corners aren't finished properly. Brick or stone courses not matching and highly visible joints/gaps are particular gripes. I personally feel it's a shame that these issues aren't always addressed as they don't take a huge amount of time, effort and skill to rectify.

 

As Tony correctly says small things like bogie wheels tyre treads and the wrong number if spokes are easily picked up by a camera, even on a layout loco. Likewise I often spot the things that bug me on photos and unfortunately these days photography also means that even background buildings come under scrutiny.

 

rps20180404_122937.jpg

 

I think the key point here is that whilst we all have our crusades we also all have our blind spots.

I agree we all have our turn offs.

 

Mine is model figures, the Airfix/Dapol bodies on every other layout irrespective of the period being modelled. Many a "modern image" layout is ruined by figures wearing 50s clothes.

As for seated figures with their feet waving around in mid air. Most of you will be reading this sat down, look where your feet are? It always reminds me of an old style geriatric ward where the patients are sat in very high chairs and their feet did not touch the ground.  They couldn't get up and walk about and then fall over......or run to the ladies ward and drop their trousers. Seriously when I see a layout with dangley feet I walk away no matter how good the bogie wheels are or the corners on the building line up. 

Edited April 4, 2018 by Clive Mortimore

[2ManySpams]

Sorry Tony, the last cut and paste didn't work. Here's a link to the post with step by step photos in my thread:

 

http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/69736-pencarrow-pg255-wagons-walls-bufferstops-and-concrete-dont-mention-frogs/?p=3038614

 

Very easy to do IMO with the same basic tools as loco building.

 

Edit: and the photos in the thread are all very cruel close-ups

[2ManySpams]

And an alternative to using Wills sheets is scribing your own out of plasticard...

 

http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/69736-pencarrow-pg255-wagons-walls-bufferstops-and-concrete-dont-mention-frogs/?p=1978712

 

Takes much longer to do obviously but gets away from seeing the same stone patterns over and over. I have subsequently amending the mortar courses to make the thicknesses a bit more random.

[Tom F]

I had an enjoyable day at York on Monday stewarding. Great to catch up with Tony and Mo again and discuss all things modelling!

York was the first show I had been to in 12 months, with my personal life being up in the air, largely with my Dad's passing, my interests in  model railways had dropped to an all time low. My current layout of Cwm Prysor has sat dormant for some months as I couldn't face it. Thanks to the likes of Tony and others, I've been able to slowly return to the hobby, and gradually turn that around as I focus on a new layout to get me modelling again.

 

I've bought my first kit in ages, a J21 which with Tony's help I intend to crack on with shortly. I'm constantly held back by lack of confidence, and I really want to get kit building under my belt....so many wonderful prototypes out there, especially of a North Eastern variety.

 

 

I've a Hornby B1 on the way, and after having a route through my modelling draws, I found I've a lovely Dave Bradwell chimney casting..... that will soon replace the Hornby one.

 

Oh and thanks to Tony's suggestion (and mentioned earlier in the thread) my B1 (and K1) both have replacement Gibson bogie/pony waiting patiently to be fitted!

 

Looking forward to Scale Four North in a week and a half!

Edited April 4, 2018 by 9793

[Compound2632]

Could one get a 'cruder' three-quarter front view than that presented by these two RTR locos (on a very good exhibition layout)? The bogie/pony wheels presented are awful and if ever a case can be made for the abandonment of tension-lock couplings, surely, this is it! Just change those wheels and junk the couplings and think how much more realistic this scene would look. 

 

It's the lack of front steps on those LMS engines that jars with me - they are much more of a prominent feature than on your pacifics, to my eye. Of course that's a knock on (or off) effect of the front tension-lock coupling. It's not as if they're not in the bag, at least for the Crab. (And where's it's cab steps too?) Not sure any came with the old Hornby Patriot - a fine body but let down by a truly awful tender. And it's towing one of the hideous old Hornby Stanier coaches... real 1980s retro stuff there.

 

Sorry, 'nuff red stuff. I'll let you get back to the green machines.

[chrisf]

. I'm constantly held back by lack of confidence

 

Tom, you are not alone.  Trust me ...

 

Chris

[Andrew P]

I think each of us is guilty of our our private crusades. To some it's lamps, bogie wheels and the finer details of LNER pacifics.

 

Me? I have an equal interest in buildings and one thing that jars is when corners aren't finished properly. Brick or stone courses not matching and highly visible joints/gaps are particular gripes. I personally feel it's a shame that these issues aren't always addressed as they don't take a huge amount of time, effort and skill to rectify.

 

As Tony correctly says small things like bogie wheels tyre treads and the wrong number if spokes are easily picked up by a camera, even on a layout loco. Likewise I often spot the things that bug me on photos and unfortunately these days photography also means that even background buildings come under scrutiny.

 

rps20180404_122937.jpg

 

I think the key point here is that whilst we all have our crusades we also all have our blind spots.

I agree Chris, and even Pete Watermans wonderful O Gauge empire has a TO ME a major fault, most Locos have no Crew in the Videos, such a shame.

 

BTW Corner brickwork looks spot on.

Edited April 4, 2018 by Andrew P

[wagonbasher]

I think each of us is guilty of our our private crusades. To some it's lamps, bogie wheels and the finer details of LNER pacifics.

 

Me? I have an equal interest in buildings and one thing that jars is when corners aren't finished properly. Brick or stone courses not matching and highly visible joints/gaps are particular gripes. I personally feel it's a shame that these issues aren't always addressed as they don't take a huge amount of time, effort and skill to rectify.

 

As Tony correctly says small things like bogie wheels tyre treads and the wrong number if spokes are easily picked up by a camera, even on a layout loco. Likewise I often spot the things that bug me on photos and unfortunately these days photography also means that even background buildings come under scrutiny.

 

rps20180404_122937.jpg

 

I think the key point here is that whilst we all have our crusades we also all have our blind spots.

If I do have a blind spot, I haven't seen it.

 

Andy

[2ManySpams]

If I do have a blind spot, I haven't seen it.Andy

Blindness of blind spots?

[cctransuk]

... Pete Watermans wonderful O Gauge empire has a TO ME a major fault, most Locos have no Crew in the Videos, such a shame.

 

 

 

But a static crew is as anachronistic as no crew - especially when the loco is on-shed.

 

It's purely a personal preference - I prefer no crew.

 

Regards,

John Isherwood.

Edited April 4, 2018 by cctransuk

[Northmoor]

But a static crew is as anachronistic as no crew - especially when the loco is on-shed.

 

It's purely a personal preference - I prefer no crew.

Static people and static traffic (when both are clearly meant to be moving).

 

FWIW, Mostyn does this believably; the traffic just looks like a stop-start queue on the A55!

[Buhar]

It's the lack of front steps on those LMS engines that jars with me - they are much more of a prominent feature than on your pacifics, to my eye. Of course that's a knock on (or off) effect of the front tension-lock coupling. It's not as if they're not in the bag, at least for the Crab. (And where's it's cab steps too?) Not sure any came with the old Hornby Patriot - a fine body but let down by a truly awful tender. And it's towing one of the hideous old Hornby Stanier coaches... real 1980s retro stuff there.

 

Sorry, 'nuff red stuff. I'll let you get back to the green machines.

 

I think that's a Railroad Patriot, which isn't a great starting point for what where quite attractive engines.  The curves on the layout where they are displayed look gentle enough for the Mogul's front steps, perhaps it runs elsewhere where they would foul the pony.  No excuse for the rear ones though.

[Compound2632]

I think that's a Railroad Patriot, which isn't a great starting point for what where quite attractive engines.  The curves on the layout where they are displayed look gentle enough for the Mogul's front steps, perhaps it runs elsewhere where they would foul the pony.  No excuse for the rear ones though.

 

I had a Hornby Patriot as a teenager in the early 80s. It was the start of my road to dissatisfaction with RTR which I kept up for twenty years. Quite a lot of RTR has since made up the ground between it and me but not that Patriot - though as I said, the body's not bad.

[grahame]

 

bogie wheels 01.jpg

 

Could one get a 'cruder' three-quarter front view than that presented by these two RTR locos (on a very good exhibition layout)? The bogie/pony wheels presented are awful and if ever a case can be made for the abandonment of tension-lock couplings, surely, this is it! Just change those wheels and junk the couplings and think how much more realistic this scene would look. 

 

 

 

Knowing very little about such locomotives I can't comment about the bogie wheels, but yes, those couplers look dreadful - as bad as the N gauge Rapido coupler which most people take off the front of steamers. However, aren't there also steps missing and I can see holes in the buffer beams so presumably something is also missing there.

 

I did once try to upgrade an old Farish Crab loco (N gauge) from the 1990s (so a product from long before the modern quality/detail improvements now commonly available like see-through spoked wheels, etc.,), by adding wire handrails and so on. It never got completed but here's my efforts. They're not good and it was never completed, but at least it has steps and a brake hose on the front, unlike the OO RTR ones in your pic.

 

 

G

[46256]

The Hornby unrebuilt patriot...the valve gear...was it this or the compound..or both ...had the extra long fowler tenders? I know they do not stand comparison today but in the days when kit building was either too expensive or beyond my limited skills they were most welcome. The Lima crab another model required by a Midland region modeller. I remember an article in the modeller describing widening the running plate...duly done. The Hornby black five...now thankfully upgraded as I never got my ks kit to work..nostalgia not what it used to be..

[micklner]

Knowing very little about such locomotives I can't comment about the bogie wheels, but yes, those couplers look dreadful - as bad as the N gauge Rapido coupler which most people take off the front of steamers. However, aren't there also steps missing and I can see holes in the buffer beams so presumably something is also missing there.

 

I did once try to upgrade an old Farish Crab loco (N gauge) from the 1990s (so a product from long before the modern quality/detail improvements now commonly available like see-through spoked wheels, etc.,), by adding wire handrails and so on. It never got completed but here's my efforts. They're not good and it was never completed, but at least it has steps and a brake hose on the front, unlike the OO RTR ones in your pic.

 

DSC_5378.JPG

 

G

 

The couplings in that photo are at least Locos of 10 + years vintage. The current NEM couplings are as the photo of the Bachmann A2 shown by Tony, far from perfect but no uglier than the monster Kadee couplings IMHO. The problem is if you have tight(ishj) curves not a lot else will work.

 

Bogie wheels, have been discussed many times before. Personally the last thing I look at on a Loco are the bogie wheels , much more detail is (or should be) visible before looking at  them on most Locos especially ones with Cylinders nearby .

 

Loco crews , nothing looks more ridiculous than a Loco going past being driven and fired by ghosts. Ok ,not every Loco, had anyone on the footplate when stationary, but plenty did due to their high maintenance needs.

Edited April 4, 2018 by micklner

[Red Devil]

If you're on about 'personal crusades' then setts are mine, I can't be doing with Wills sheets, they're too big and nearly always look jointed.

 

So it's out with the scribe for me, still plenty more to do and about 55 weeks to debut at York 2019 (erm... planned!)

 

 

 

 

 

[Jesse Sim]

 

B16 1 painted 01.jpg

 

B16 1 painted 02.jpg

 

This is the one I built, painted by Ian Rathbone in LNER guise. It sees regular service on Grantham and will be running during the LNER weekend on Little Bytham in August.

 

 

That will look good along side my A4 Commonwealth of Australia, due to make it's second appearance on LB. As well as my O2 I'm bringing along and the C2 I'll be picking up, please let me know what I will owe you before I leave so I dont leave my self short! 

 

Excellent stuff, I think a B16 will be on my list of locos to build. 

[manna]

G'Day Folks

 

Yes it would be nice to have the correct wheels on my loco's, the hardest problem I have along with others living down under is the lack of web presents, Mainly Trains, was brilliant, one click and you were on there site, order what you wanted, paid, and waited for it to arrive, today even firms like Gibsons, Markits, useless.

 

manna (aka Terry)

[DougN]

Manna (Terry) I have had great response from Alan Gibson over here. There are other ways to pay with credit cards than to log on, online! infact the way the phone calls are going it could be cheaper to phone than to email! Colin is the owner and he is great if you can give him the part numbers on an email then phone with a CC number 

 

It reminds me I have to do a big order of wheels for a number of things I have been mucking around with. 

[Compound2632]

The Hornby unrebuilt patriot...the valve gear...was it this or the compound..or both ...had the extra long fowler tenders? I know they do not stand comparison today but in the days when kit building was either too expensive or beyond my limited skills they were most welcome. The Lima crab another model required by a Midland region modeller. I remember an article in the modeller describing widening the running plate...duly done. The Hornby black five...now thankfully upgraded as I never got my ks kit to work..nostalgia not what it used to be..

 

The Patriot tender was short, but that was the least of its sins. I tried giving mine the tender off an Airfix 4F which at least had the right wheelbase but since this was cloaking the Hornby tender drive mechanism, it looked rather odd. The 4F then got a plasticard attempt at a Midland flared tender as part of a conversion to a RH drive engine. Ah the innocence of youth!