RMweb Gold BlueLightning Posted December 10, 2016 RMweb Gold Share Posted December 10, 2016 Make sure you take lots of pics. I would be very interested in how to do this, it sounds like it would be a good upgrade to the Gladstone which currently has an X04 for power. Gary 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ruffnut Thorston Posted December 13, 2016 Share Posted December 13, 2016 (edited) Other upgrade options for the M7 chassis... The later X.03 motor with black plastic single start worm, and silver-grey gear wheel. This was said by Hornby to give more controlability... There are a few 5 pole motors that fit straight into the Tri-ang chassis... One was made for Airfix MRRC of Bournemouth which is just about identical, but 5 poles. This is the Cat. No. 1001 5 Pole Loco Motor 12 Volts D.C.Amother was made for/by MW Developments of Henley on Thames (1960s). MW 005 Five Pole Motor. Possibly the same motor? Photos...I don't have the Airfix motor...just an empty box! But I do have some spare brushes! MW Developments Motor, Box, and Packing... Note that the brush holder is under the top plate. X.04 type Tri-ang motors have the brush holder on top of the top plate... Edited December 13, 2016 by Sarahagain 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold RedgateModels Posted December 13, 2016 RMweb Gold Share Posted December 13, 2016 Watch this space - I'm working on a modern can motor replacement for the X04, drop in replacement, flywheel etc. JUst at the design concept stage at the moment but should have a test etch next year 9 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rowanj Posted December 13, 2016 Share Posted December 13, 2016 (edited) Great to hear from you again, Sarah, and the possibility of a cam replacement fot Hornby/Triang chassis is really interesting. I have begun the dismantling stage and now have a kit of parts. The X04 type is too big to fit in the boiler - I find with all these GBL conversions, other than Mallard, a serious amount of plastic has to be cut away from boiler/firebox. The Mashima/Comet combo I had lying around seems to fit ok, but the chassis needs some major grinding to allow it to slip in. I know many folk get X04 or replacement 5 poles to work well, but I prefer a modern motor/gearbox combo all things being equal. (not that this combination is all that modern these days...) Somewhere I have the extended axles and outside cranks, and the Romford wheels. I came across some coupling rods in the spares box and the rear pair seem the right size. Hornby A4 bogie will be used with the GBL overlay, but I don't have any suitable bogie wheels. Not sure yet what to do with the tender. Next post, hopefully, will show the motor in situ showing the required cuts to the chassis block, John Edited December 13, 2016 by rowanj 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ruffnut Thorston Posted December 13, 2016 Share Posted December 13, 2016 (edited) Looks interesting there John... I have been thinking along the lines of the Tri-ang SR L1 4-4-0 chassis for something like this... But the original X.04 motor is a bit far back, and is in the cab of the L1! The chassis was last used under the 1970s Hornby LMS 2P (itself a conversion of the L1 body, with a Midland type cab substituted for the SECR version!) Edited December 13, 2016 by Sarahagain 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rowanj Posted December 14, 2016 Share Posted December 14, 2016 I spent a productive hour or so on the M7 chassis. The photos show, I hope, what was needed to get the chassis to fit. Without a Dremel or equivalent, the fitting of a gearbox will be a very tedious task, and, frankly, it night be easier to scratch-build a 4 - coupled chassis. Even now. the chassis is squeezing in the gearbox so I cannot fit the final worm on the axle.A bit more work tomorrow will sort that, I trust. Other than that, the cuts are straightforward, and the boiler needed almost no work to fit over the motor. Once I get the chassis/ loco bodu running, I'll tackle the leading bogie. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest spet0114 Posted December 14, 2016 Share Posted December 14, 2016 Just a thought, but as we draw close to the new year and the traditional time for a flurry of partworks to be launched, might we see the GBL series reissued, or even better, a second series? 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rowanj Posted December 16, 2016 Share Posted December 16, 2016 (edited) The chassis has now had sufficient metal removed to lower the footplate to the correct height and to fit the motor. The photos show how much has been removed. To be honest, it became a question of "I've started so I'll finish" and I advise anyone who feels they have the ability to fabricate brass frames, given how much is hidden away behind the frames. Having said that, the loco looks ok, I think, and should run well enough, Certainly the gearbox is lovely and smooth. The front bogie is from a Triang A3, and the GBL frames are just blutacked for effect. I intend to fit a metal stretcher across the bogie in a "U" shape and Aroldite the GBL sides to that. I removed the swing-link, preferring the more modern bracket method to allow the bogie to pivot. I'm not sure what to do with the tender. I want to fit pick-ups to give more electrical security through my dead frog pointwork. The conversion I saw involved grinding the wheels away from the tender casting and then cutting grooves for the axles. I may just build a plasticard sub- chassis, and fill it with lead for ballast. Edited December 16, 2016 by rowanj 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium uax6 Posted December 16, 2016 RMweb Premium Share Posted December 16, 2016 (edited) I use a Branchlines slim gearbox (8.5mm wide, although it sits the motor over to one side). Not really much hassle to make the opening, I'm using it on 0-6-0 chassis, so I drill a new hole over the rear axle in a pillar drill, and then ten minutes if a coarse file produces the hole. Only the top of the worm is visible at floor level, which is easy to hide! Andy G Edited December 16, 2016 by uax6 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ruffnut Thorston Posted December 16, 2016 Share Posted December 16, 2016 (edited) The chassis has now had sufficient metal removed to lower the footplate to the correct height and to fit the motor. The photos show how much has been removed. To be honest, it became a question of "I've started so I'll finish" and I advise anyone who feels they have the ability to fabricate brass frames, given how much is hidden away behind the frames. Having said that, the loco looks ok, I think, and should run well enough, Certainly the gearbox is lovely and smooth. The front bogie is from a Triang A3, and the GBL frames are just blutacked for effect. I intend to fit a metal stretcher across the bogie in a "U" shape and Aroldite the GBL sides to that. I removed the swing-link, preferring the more modern bracket method to allow the bogie to pivot. I'm not sure what to do with the tender. I want to fit pick-ups to give more electrical security through my dead frog pointwork. The conversion I saw involved grinding the wheels away from the tender casting and then cutting grooves for the axles. I may just build a plasticard sub- chassis, and fill it with lead for ballast. Have you considered using a Hornby Lord of The Isles bogie? The current ones pick up power too! (Pun intended! ) (Tri-ang ones are also available, but do not have pick-ups... ) Edited December 16, 2016 by Sarahagain 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rowanj Posted December 17, 2016 Share Posted December 17, 2016 Have you considered using a Hornby Lord of The Isles bogie? The current ones pick up power too! (Pun intended! ) (Tri-ang ones are also available, but do not have pick-ups... ) That's a good idea, Sarah, so I resisted the reluctance to spend "new" money ( things I already had/bought don't count, do they? ) and invested £6.60 in a Dean bogie. I also decided that using the metal sub-chassis in the tender looks too much like hard work so I'll build a replacement from plastic, after a last rummage around the spares boxes to check if there is anything else I can use. One possibility is to drill out the axle boxes and fit bearings, then use EM axles with the wheels set to OO. Cheers John Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ruffnut Thorston Posted December 17, 2016 Share Posted December 17, 2016 (edited) I think the GBL (A-la Bachmann...) Tender Chassis is better detailed than the Hornby (A-la Tri-ang!) LOTI Tender chassis..... So, a new "sub-frame" would probably best there! Edited December 17, 2016 by Sarahagain Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rowanj Posted December 18, 2016 Share Posted December 18, 2016 (edited) I think the GBL (A-la Bachmann...) Tender Chassis is better detailed than the Hornby (A-la Tri-ang!) LOTI Tender chassis..... So, a new "sub-frame" would probably best there! After cutting and drilling a pair of plasticard side-sheets for the sub-frame, and discovering the axle holes, bearings and all, were out of line, I hit on a more simple way of adding wheels. There are dimples in the tender frame behind the axle guards, so I opened them out, and found standard pinpoint axles fitted perfectly. I've used wheels which I think came from Hornby A4 detailing sets, used to replace the flangeless set on the trailing bogie. I find Hornby plastic centred wheels very easily distort when removed from their original axles.As they all seem to "drop-in" these days, that isn't usually an issue. I actually found putting them on longer pin-point axles gave me more control , though 2 out of 8 did develop a wobble. I had intended to fit pin-point bearings, but they run very freely in the plastic, and seemed ok when pushed through pointwork in the fiddle yard. I also fitted the Markits outside cranks, not realising each packet only contained 1 pair. They are very neat , though I need to investigate whether the boss onto which the coupling rods fit should face outward or towards the frames. Edited December 18, 2016 by rowanj 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ruffnut Thorston Posted December 18, 2016 Share Posted December 18, 2016 (edited) Nice job on the tender! As it was based on the Bachmann type, I suppose we shouldn't be too surprised if the Bachmann bearing holes did transfer to the GBL tooling! I did a similar thing with the tender for the Caledonian Single, 123....http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/76497-sarahs-projects/?p=1725643 I am interested in the Extended axles and cranks....seeing as I want to do something similar, but with the Dapol Kit. Edited December 18, 2016 by Sarahagain Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Hilux5972 Posted December 19, 2016 RMweb Premium Share Posted December 19, 2016 After cutting and drilling a pair of plasticard side-sheets for the sub-frame, and discovering the axle holes, bearings and all, were out of line, I hit on a more simple way of adding wheels. There are dimples in the tender frame behind the axle guards, so I opened them out, and found standard pinpoint axles fitted perfectly. I've used wheels which I think came from Hornby A4 detailing sets, used to replace the flangeless set on the trailing bogie. I find Hornby plastic centred wheels very easily distort when removed from their original axles.As they all seem to "drop-in" these days, that isn't usually an issue. I actually found putting them on longer pin-point axles gave me more control , though 2 out of 8 did develop a wobble. I had intended to fit pin-point bearings, but they run very freely in the plastic, and seemed ok when pushed through pointwork in the fiddle yard. I also fitted the Markits outside cranks, not realising each packet only contained 1 pair. They are very neat , though I need to investigate whether the boss onto which the coupling rods fit should face outward or towards the frames. The boss should face outwards. The coupling rods extended out from the footplate. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rowanj Posted December 19, 2016 Share Posted December 19, 2016 Nice job on the tender! As it was based on the Bachmann type, I suppose we shouldn't be too surprised if the Bachmann bearing holes did transfer to the GBL tooling! I did a similar thing with the tender for the Caledonian Single, 123....http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/76497-sarahs-projects/?p=1725643 I am interested in the Extended axles and cranks....seeing as I want to do something similar, but with the Dapol Kit. Thanks Sarah This is the first time I've built outside cranks. Hilux' confirmation of the way they should face is very much appreciated. I'm waiting for the second set, but perusing the Net has thrown up a few issues about fixing the cranks securely, yet allowing subsequent removal, and then quartering, which needs to be done by eye/trial and error. I trust a 4 coupled loco will be easier. The way the model is designed, the frames just drop over the extended cranks. In real life, the frames were solid with a rectangle through which the axles run. I'm trying to think of an easy way to replicate this once the loco/chassis is virtually complete which will still allow easy removal, Advice gratefully received from anyone who has done this. I assume the Dapol/ Branchlines combo makes some arrangement? John Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ruffnut Thorston Posted December 19, 2016 Share Posted December 19, 2016 I thought the bosses would go to the outside....but wasn't 100% sure. When Tri-ang Hornby made a visual model of the City Class (Not actually made in the end. ) I believe they, like Bachmann, left the axle keeps off to allow body removal... I think one way of fixing the axle keeps would involve having the Cab/ Boiler removeable so as to allow access to the motor and top of the transmission... Failing that...maybe PVA glue so that the keeps can be prised off for servicing? It would need very small screws otherwise I think?? Another interesting problem! 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
railroadbill Posted December 23, 2016 Share Posted December 23, 2016 Happy Christmas to all! Hope to get going on some more GBL projects from the box next year.... 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold BlueLightning Posted December 23, 2016 RMweb Gold Share Posted December 23, 2016 Happy Christmas to you too. (And to everyone else as well) 5 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ruffnut Thorston Posted December 24, 2016 Share Posted December 24, 2016 Christmas Greetings and Best Wishes for the New Year to all GBL Bashers everywhere! A look back at some models I made earlier! GBL Mallard on Tri-ang Hornby Chassis.... GBL B12 modified Body on Tri-ang Hornby Chassis. GBL B12 Tender Body on Tri-ang Hornby Chassis (Right) TH Tender Body on GBL Chassis (Left) GBL Caledonian Single 123 on Tri-ang Hornby Chassis...GBL GWR Shunter's Truck (From the 8750 Pannier Tank Model....) GBL Ivatt 2-6-2 Tank Loco on Bachmann Chassis.... 5 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rowanj Posted December 24, 2016 Share Posted December 24, 2016 Hi and Merry Christmas to all. Seeing Sarah's photos was a great reminder of how useful this series was. It's a shame the remaining planned issues were cancelled. Still - we can live in hope. I'm still pushing on with the City of Truro. The chassis now runs with the cranks and coupling rods attached, Quartering was done by hand and eye and I superglued the cranks to the axles. The coupling rods were cut from spares I had. They attach to the cranks with 10ba screws - the cranks are already tapped - but protrude and press against the loco frames, so need to be cut back. Once I fit the bogie and know all is well, I'll tidy up the wiring and attach nuts to the cranks, add a touch of solder and shorten them as needed. The bogie is from Hornby, and has pickups fitted. As supplied, it comes with the older method of attaching to the chassis, but my cutting meant I had nowhere to fix it, so I replaced it with the more modern front Bogie assembly, from a Schools, I think. I still don't have a ready fixing point, so I'll probably Epoxy it in the short-term, then drill and fit a self-tapping screw when I know it will navigate the layout properly. Once again, all the best to everyone for Christmas and 2017' John 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
cypherman Posted December 25, 2016 Share Posted December 25, 2016 Hi all, Happy Christmas to all. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RosiesBoss Posted December 25, 2016 Share Posted December 25, 2016 A belated happy Christmas and happy new year to all, with a few happy snaps of my GBL kitbashing efforts: Britannia class, using modified Tri-ang chassis: GWR City class, using Tri-ang M7 chassis: Caledonian single, with Tri-ang chassis: GWR pannier tank, using Tri-ang chassis: GWR shunters' truck: Stephenson's Rocket, using tram chassis in coach: Current project: Motorised chassis of GWR County - using GBL chassis block (more to come later): Regards, Rob 10 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
cypherman Posted December 26, 2016 Share Posted December 26, 2016 (edited) Hi Rosiesboss, I have a couple of questions. On the City of Truro how did you manage to get the crank pins and conrods to show and work at the same time. Also you say you use an M7 chassis. Do you still have the M7 body and is it in good condition. If it is I would be willing to buy it from you if the price is acceptable to both of us. One last thing,The Brittannia did you use the older powered chassis or the tender powered chassis. Yours, C Edited December 26, 2016 by cypherman Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ruffnut Thorston Posted December 26, 2016 Share Posted December 26, 2016 RE: Britannia Chassis.... There are a few versions of Tri-ang Chassis... The first was for 1960 only, and was the "Plate Frame" type, with solid wheels. 1961 saw the Cast Chassis Block with the fitting for the Seuthe Type Smoke Unit. This has an "S" on the underside, small S at first, later a bigger S.... This has See Through Wheels, and magnahesion as well... 1964 saw a small modification to the Chassis Block to take the large Synchrosmoke Unit, This chassis has "SU" on the underside. The same chassis block was used for the early Tender Drive Britannia locos, with a weight block added. These had the tender coupled to the rear pony truck by a rivet, and wires taking the electricity from the loco wheels to an all wheel (traction tyre fitted) drive ringfield motor tender. (Early Version) Later TD locos had the tender removeable, with a pin taking one side of the pick-up from the loco frame to the tender motor (New Type), the other pick up bing via two whels on the tender, which was now only 4 wheel drive, but with traction tyres only on two wheels (the non-pick up side...) I am betting on the model in question has the SU Chassis, with an X.04 motor? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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