Arboretum Valley - Invasion of the Daleks

[Jock67B]

Lovely shots Jaz, and very interesting for us that were unable to visit in person. Thank you,

Kind regards,

Jock.

Edited August 4, 2014 by Jock67B

[Jaz]

Having done the cat....I had to do the dog. 1:1 graffiti / mural.

 

Test subject waiting to pounce on her sister

 

head shot..

 

I could add more fine detail bit on the wall doesn't justify it

 

I should perhaps have 'placed' her a little to the left avoiding the sockets.. but am tempted to add an owner....

this is her....I know theres a biscuit in this look.......

 

and this perhaps needs a balloon.to reflect her thoughts............its not as good looking as me...and if it moves...it's toast!!!!!!!..

....Kara on guard??????

go on.....move....I dare you......

[Jaz]

rmweb2723wrecrail2030

 

rmweb274wrecrail2031

 

rmweb2725wrecrail2032

 

these are Hornby railroad ....possibly 21T mineral no idea if rived (although I see some) or welded, no idea if 4 or 8 shoes. And I would like to try some salt weathering.

They were EWS Kal has grey primed them.....as he knows I'm a devil to going straight to finish. 

so

1. need to do a rusted effect

2 need hairspray and salt

3. need the finish paint

4. water to wash off the salt and some paint 

I watched a video for ideas.....

and I may try a little of that latex dabbed on again to try for folded back paint.

 

Well the rust effect won't be hard....but what to go on top is the question.

[Jaz]

Am at present perusing this 

http://www.google.com/url?sa=i&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=images&cd=&cad=rja&uact=8&docid=9usZpivYG0ne3M&tbnid=z_HfEAyBMo0v7M:&ved=0CAEQjxw&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.modelrailwaywagons.co.uk%2FWagon%2520History.html&ei=l4XfU6ewDOel0QWc9oCYDQ&psig=AFQjCNGswON2sfWn5OzVRaB4WwOV3GRBIw&ust=1407243178646260

to see if i can find anything suitable

I think the 1960s 8 shoe looks vaguely similar....

[Anotheran]

I think the 1960s 8 shoe looks vaguely similar....

 

On the page that you link the text against the 1960s 8 shoe says "The main difference over the early designs were the small flap doors above the main side doors". Yours doesn't have those small flap doors that are on the picture, and the top of the end panel is significantly different. So I'd suggest that yours is probably an earlier design. But I'm not knowlegable enough to be sufficiently helpful to point you to a better option!

[Jaz]

Kal has already established that this specific design is apparantly one of Hornby's 'guesses' and is not real...and might explain it being in their Railroad range.

There seems no match to anything similar having existed in EWS either. So I am looking for something that is an ALMOST match where they can be used in the background as additional scenic items. Another reason why I have decided to go for the rusty decayed look rather the the nice and clean one...as finding appropriate decals is not likely, so a dirty look will hopefully make them harder to read and therefore less obvious that that are not 'right'

 

Apparently 21T minerals were not really used after 1972....and as such highly unlikely to have ever been badged by EWS!!!! We have been unable to find anything closer in looks, although would love to be proved wrong. 

 

According to this the site I linked It seems some were produced 1950/52 approximately 2500, 1000 being riveted and the rest welded

Plus some others were produced in the 1960s. The distinctive pattern on the end appears to match the later ones. A bit of evergreen etc might be used to help the sides look a little less 'wrong'. 

 

But if I am going to the trouble I want something close to what might have existed....although I am sure a few people would say if you can't find 'em....get rid of them. But there is a plus side to test painting ideas out on these cheap ones.....they bring no angst if they don't turn out too well....

[Jaz]

Kal looked at these wagons earlier

 

http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/72163-arboretum-valley-pictures-from-wrecrail-2014/page-121&do=findComment&comment=1333877

 

 

[Jason T]

21 ton minerals survived into the 70's and you may have had an occasional one or two that survived into the early 80's but by then, the would have been precious few locations with the facilities to unload them. Any that exist today will only be on preserved lines and there is absolutely no chance that they were still in revenue (or engineering) service when EWS came into existence.

 

If it is the Hornby one that has been around for ever then the chances are that it will be unfitted, e.g. Manual brakes only so your only real option if you want to use it and keep a modicum of realism is to paint it in BR unfitted grey, add the decals to match and pop it in a siding in Goathland.

[Jaz]

21 ton minerals survived into the 70's and you may have had an occasional one or two that survived into the early 80's but by then, the would have been precious few locations with the facilities to unload them. Any that exist today will only be on preserved lines and there is absolutely no chance that they were still in revenue (or engineering) service when EWS came into existence.

 

If it is the Hornby one that has been around for ever then the chances are that it will be unfitted, e.g. Manual brakes only so your only real option if you want to use it and keep a modicum of realism is to paint it in BR unfitted grey, add the decals to match and pop it in a siding in Goathland.

Thanks Jason   I did see Goathland had painted ONE the wrong colour. 

 

Any ideas for the other FIVE!!!!

[Jason T]

Here are two of mine, built from the Parkside kit, painted in BR Freight Grey (1948-64) and with Modelmasters sheet 4608 (BR 21T & 24.5T Mineral Wagons)

 

 

Edit: Looking at the photos you posted again, the underframe (as well as being horrendous with gigantic mouldings) does have clasp brakes so BR Bauxite would be a more suitable livery. I have a feeling that they are from Hornby's imagination (designed for train sets with names like 'EWS Heavy Freight Hauler' that also include a 1920's tank wagon, a cattle wagon in Railfreight yellow and a GWR Toad brake van in DRS livery) but as you say, ok for practicing on.

[Jaz]

Kal got a new pre order this morning a limited edition of 300, and some 42 were still available this morning

so for any one humming and har-ing some pictures

rmweb2772wrecrail2033

 

rmweb2727wrecrail2034

 

a little closer

rmweb2778wrecrail2035

[Jaz]

Here are two of mine, built from the Parkside kit, painted in BR Freight Grey (1948-64) and with Modelmasters sheet 4608 (BR 21T & 24.5T Mineral Wagons)

 

steel and riveted? and a good age for us....thanks very much 

[Kal]

Here are two of mine, built from the Parkside kit, painted in BR Freight Grey (1948-64) and with Modelmasters sheet 4608 (BR 21T & 24.5T Mineral Wagons)

 

 

Edit: Looking at the photos you posted again, the underframe (as well as being horrendous with gigantic mouldings) does have clasp brakes so BR Bauxite would be a more suitable livery. I have a feeling that they are from Hornby's imagination (designed for train sets with names like 'EWS Heavy Freight Hauler' that also include a 1920's tank wagon, a cattle wagon in Railfreight yellow and a GWR Toad brake van in DRS livery) but as you say, ok for practicing on.

I think you got it spot on, we bought them when we had no idea about anything to do with railways, and rather than flog them for nothing thought they provide good learning medium. I practiced, cut and shut nem pockets, adding new wheels, adding resistor sets to wheels and priming with a spray can. So they have all ready paid the tenner i paid for the five of them.

 

Not sure i know much more these days, but tend to look at what the real ones do, before i buy these days

 

Thanks for the info, at least if we replace them with something more authentic we will have learnt a bit on the way on something disposable.

Edited August 4, 2014 by Kal

[Jaz]

Here are two of mine, built from the Parkside kit, painted in BR Freight Grey (1948-64) and with Modelmasters sheet 4608 (BR 21T & 24.5T Mineral Wagons)

 

 

Edit: Looking at the photos you posted again, the underframe (as well as being horrendous with gigantic mouldings) does have clasp brakes so BR Bauxite would be a more suitable livery. I have a feeling that they are from Hornby's imagination (designed for train sets with names like 'EWS Heavy Freight Hauler' that also include a 1920's tank wagon, a cattle wagon in Railfreight yellow and a GWR Toad brake van in DRS livery) but as you say, ok for practicing on.

Using your info as reference I googled, and found a number or matches including some 16T ......wow they are bashed a bout .....and the marks seem to have straight lines in them....I'm assuming they are shovel marks????? Can anyone confirm or refute this????

 

ukrail1770tilltoday.me.uk

[Jason T]

You would have to be pretty clumsy and heavy handed to dent and score them like that with a shovel. More likely is that the battering comes from the coal being loaded into them from above, from them being lifted up to the top of coaling towers, from them being used in tipplers, from being heavy loaded with all kinds of minerals, etc. They did not have an easy life; if you were filled with coal and dragged back and forth over the Pennines by a WD or 8F day after day for years, chances are at you'd look a bit lumpy and scratched too

 

That one is in pretty good condition; good enough to be saved rather than scrapped like the tens of thousands of other ones.

[Jaz]

while researching these wagons I was reading info about colouring the models, and a gentleman who clearing does a LOT of livery work etc....under advice used red oxide on some of the wagons rather than grey (both Halfords) and subsequently when he puttee top coat on....the whole pant job lifted off.... someone commented on this saying that red oxide primer is meant to go on METAL and this probably explains the problem, I don't know what other peoples experience has been regards this.....BUT as a safe guard to avoiding any extra work...I will not be using red oxide primer for a quick fix for the rusty undercoat!!!!!!!

If anyone has had a nasty experiences....or indeed any good ones regards Halford red oxide on plastic I would appreciate the feedback....as red oxide wss until i read that a big contender.

[The Stationmaster]

Using your info as reference I googled, and found a number or matches including some 16T ......wow they are bashed a bout .....and the marks seem to have straight lines in them....I'm assuming they are shovel marks????? Can anyone confirm or refute this????

 

ukrail1770tilltoday.me.uk

Looks to me as if it has been unloaded a few times by a mechanical shovel of some sort and the bucket has bashed the sides from the inside.  Quite common sort of 'more modern' damage on 16 tonners after they got into departmental use - not something I can remember seeing in the past before that sort of use started. 

[hybridangel77]

wow the painting of the dog on the wall looked amazing jaz...nice one.

[Kal]

Groan, don't encourage her Terry, .... I have to keep moving all day or else i end up covered in graffiti !

[Jaz]

What! There are only SIX murals inc the dog on then side walls, one outside (we agreed that's up for grabs.........) I don't include the legitimate ones in the loft for the layout.

I asked if he wanted the dog first....not sneaking it in you understand....  The dog is better than the cat because I got her to 'pose' nearby.....plus the dog will certainly last a lot longer....weather not being an issue.

 

The first one...........

..could do with some more work as I have improved my wall painting technique, having bought a number of weathering paints since then Ithin I can make a much better job of it. It is like 4fthigh by 8ft long and in the hall as you enter the front of the house.

Edited August 4, 2014 by Jaz

[86902]

Hi Jaz.

The yellow ploughs are Brittania pacific not Pete Harvey's.

Regards

Bob

I did however take a picture of this, which are a mixture of mig pigments and citadel weathering colours. Not railway perhaps, but a good idea of his weathering skills

rmweb2713wrecrail2020

 

rmweb2714wrecrail2021

 

rmweb2715wrecrail2022

the yellow is Pete Harvey's snow plow ends

 

rmweb2716wrecrail2023

 

rmweb2717wrecrail2024....

at the exhibition he was colouring a wagon.

[Jaz]

Hi Jaz.

The yellow ploughs are Brittania pacific not Pete Harvey's.

Regards

Bob

Oh .....My bad. I made the jump. I'll show the correction above.

[Jaz]

Looks to me as if it has been unloaded a few times by a mechanical shovel of some sort and the bucket has bashed the sides from the inside.  Quite common sort of 'more modern' damage on 16 tonners after they got into departmental use - not something I can remember seeing in the past before that sort of use started. 

That makes sense and would account for the lines....thank you for the clarification.

[newbryford]

Groan, don't encourage her Terry, .... I have to keep moving all day or else i end up covered in graffiti !

 

Could be worse, in my household anything that doesn't move is painted yellow............

 

Cheers,

Mick

[Jaz]

Could be worse, in my household anything that doesn't move is painted yellow............

 

Cheers,

Mick

If my little Peurgot ever needs a repaint...I'll know where to leave it...