Humbrol matt enamels

[cobach47]

Personally i prefer to use satin paints mainly revell and humbrol as the matt paints tend to leave a rough finish and have to be varnished before you can

apply transfers. The trick is to put the paint in a pallette add a drop or two of white spirit and the paint flows better and you get less brushmarks.

if you still need a matt finish try using "purity seal" from games workshop £9.50 for a large can lasts for ages. for example if you were using it on a coach

side just one spray from end to end is usually enough and it drys quickly too.

 

 

                                                                                            hope this helps

                                                                                         

[Ruston]

Something has definitely changed in the paint itself. The last 3 tins of Humbrol matt varnish that I've bought have needed a LOT of stirring and shaking, in fact stirring is very difficult because the thick stuff forms into a ball around the stirrer and takes ages to mix in. When you do get it mixed it doesn't always end up with a matt finish and if you leave the tin for a few days the thick stuff settles and you have to begin the whole stirring process again.

 

I noticed that some years ago the stamped number on the lids changed to a smaller size and at a show last year I bought an unopened tin of the same matt varnish, but with the old large numbers, from a second hand stall. This tin took very little stirring and I can leave it for weeks without any stirring - I can open it up and use it straight away and it always gives a matt finish. I've also had the same thing happen with an old tin of 113 and one of matt black when compared with the current stuff.

[David C]

My twopennyworth:

 

Like Capt Kernow, I've never had any problems with Humbrol enamels. I always stir by dropping a small screw or similar into the tin and shake it for 2 minutes. If its good enough for spray cans, then its good enough for tiny Humbrol tins! Revell is rather thicker and "gloopier", Precision and Railmatch are as good as Humbrol, but those Railmatch screw tops are a pain as unless you clean 'em and the thread on the top of the bottle every time, you soon find you can't get the darn things off! 

 

Acrylics: I don't like 'em at all. I find they don't cover as well as enamels nor as smoothly.

 

David C

[James]

 

but those Railmatch screw tops are a pain as unless you clean 'em and the thread on the top of the bottle every time, you soon find you can't get the darn things off!

The old child proof tops turned out to be quite James proof too most of the time!

[Guest oldlugger]

As an update to the non drying Humbrol matt conundrum, I've found that the rogue paints did eventually dry after about three days in very warm temperatures!

 

Simon

[Alan Higgi]

 

 

The old child proof tops turned out to be quite James proof too most of the time!

The best method of removing child proof tops is my 3 year old Grandson!

[corneliuslundie]

I have just had a problem with matt black drying gloss, It was an unopened tin but I had had it a couple of years. I did shake and stir very thoroughly.

[David C]

With older tins of Humbrol, I have occasionally suffered what Ruston experienced - very thick sludge at the bottom of the tin. This can be cured by breaking it up and manually stirring until it mixes with the rest of the paint. I then give it the "small screw and shake for 2 minutes" treatment. That has cured the problem.

 

I haven't got any suggestions about how to deal with your gloss finish once its on your model, alas! Either strip it off or add a coat of matt varnish?

 

David C

[SM42]

Many years ago I had the matt black drys gloss problem.

 

I happened to bump into the Humbrol rep in my local model shop who asked if I had stirred it.

 

"Yes" I replied.

 

"Oh you've stirred it too much then"

 

 

I don't use matt black much now  except for weathring purposes. Underframes I paint with Coal Black to give an ex works semi gloss finish and knock it back with weathering  (like wot happens to the the real thing) Matt varnish kills off any remaining unwanted gloss.

 

What is noticeable about all makes of paint both model and domestic is that they are now horribly thin and coverage is terrible. (legislation strikes  again?) One coat great (and rare now) , two a chore , three coats  purgatory.  (I'm impatient,  me)

 

For the older RMWebbers who may remember them, I still have some servicable Airfix paint. It was a joy to use.

 

Andy

[delticman]

 

 

For the older RMWebbers who may remember them, I still have some servicable Airfix paint. It was a joy to use.

 

Andy

 

Blimey you`ve taken me right back now, I can smell the Airfix gold paint for my Airfix Beefeater kit (two shillings from Woolworths)!

Those jars were a bit impractical though as they were tall and caused you to get paint all up your brush, and the tops were hard to unscrew. Back on topic I find that no matter how much I stir a new tin of Humbrol Matt Black it still dries semi-gloss, but the next time I use it it`s nice and flat!???

 

Geoff.

[Rich.B]

I have also experienced problems with Humbrol paints over recent years as expressed by many on this thread,....the matt black seems to cause the most problems lately, from personal experience,...the glossy finish...even after stirring the paint really well for nearly ten minutes....which is something I've always done ever since using any paint product.

 

The other Humbrol enamel `problem paint' I had was with the M34 white,....How many of you have managed to use even 1/4 of a tinlet before it's `had it'??,..or at best gone very thick or chalky.  I even bought a bottle of the recommended Humbrol `enamel thinners' to thin it down to a usable viscosity but found it difficult in application(drying extremely quickly)= thick heavy overbrush marking from section to section on a surface area.

Also, the paint still seemed to suffer from the same problem of `separation', also,the thinners would sometimes have `evaporated' leaving a dried out `cracked' solid in the tin, or a thick solid mass at the bottom and clear liquid/thinners floating on top.

 

I will say however, that I have not had problems of the `semi gloss' issues with the white.  Also, found M121 pale stone to be `prone' to a similar problem to the white, but not quite as bad.  

 

It has been commented about the quality of the `earlier' Humbrol paints(c1970's etc) still being `very good' after long storage/or use, and I can wholeheartedly agree with this point.  I too, have some of the `older' or very `early' tinlets of Humbrol that are still OK after many,many years.

 

Acrylics, I would move to completely using without hesitation!....advantages!....better drying times, not having strong smelling solvents in them, come in much easier and practical containers.  Plus also, they can be easily thinned with water/water brush cleaning.

 

I have tried some of the very first Humbrol acrylics that came out in the late 80's early 90's but didn't care much the application and finish,...plus the old problem of the semi gloss problems that seem to be `blighting' many of late `black' Humbrol enamels.  I  also, tried the,...I think...`Railmatch' acrylics that came out several years ago now??...(apparently, the range was dropped not long after it's launch)  I still have 3 or 4 of the `frame dirt' and `dark rust' colours and found them `not too bad' but still not as good as the Precision or Humbrol ranges.

 

I'm now considering trying the `Vallejo' acrylic range as one or two have mentioned earlier in this thread and see how I get on with them.

 

Also, from my training at college in the early 90's in painting and decorating, we were taught the new COSHH,(control of substances hazardous to heath) regulations.  Under these regs, all paints/coatings that came into domestic(and certain industrial) use were to be eventually manufactured  as acrylic based products, unless for special purpose applications,....and that the idea was to replace all conventional `oil/solvent' based products in general use.

So, could this be what is starting to happen here??...lower the quality of `well tried & tested' products = more lose faith in it = less buy it + more start looking to alternative products = demand falls = eventually `justifying' it being dropped from the market??  I'm not saying this is `fact',....but take a look at the amount of `acrylic' based products now available in most D.I.Y chain stores etc, or`alternative' products being offered nowadays!!

 

Just a thought,                         

 

Cheers,  Rich.b

[SM42]

I'm currently having the gloss effect with light grey (No 64) The bit I get off the stirry stick is fine, the rest is gloss.  Good for transfers but not for the blood pressure.

 

The other (older tin) I have is fine. How I long for the old days when you only had to shake and not stir.

 

The variable quality is a shame as I am rapidly losing faith with the range.

 

Now I'll have to go and find alternatives that I am happy with in terms of colour range, versatility and workability.

 

Andy

[Jon Fitness]

In response to almost everyone...send the stuff back to Hornby/Humbrol and ask for a replacement. I got 3 replacement tins of Matt black and an apology almost by return of post. Id tried every trick I could think of and was getting a mix of matt/satin/gloss from the same mixed tin on the one job at the time!

 If we don't complain they'll never sort it...

JF

[Paul Cram]

How?Post office don't accept paint and local model shop just has the same batch.

[crompton 33]

my local model shop only stocks humbrol now. so it's a round trip of 40 miles to get railmatch. now that the post office will not except paint there is no choice. the problem i have is when i need cherry paint for my model buses .

[Jon Fitness]

How?Post office don't accept paint and local model shop just has the same batch.

As I did; wrap it well and don't tell. 

JF

[Jon Fitness]

How old's this one then? Found it in my collection today. Opened it, used it, perfect matt black!

 

 

Jon F.

[5050]

How old's this one then? Found it in my collection today. Opened it, used it, perfect matt black!

 

P1050691 (800x533).jpg

 

Jon F.

That should be in the 'Collectables' thread.  We could have a field day sorting out old tins and jars.  I've got all sorts - including a jar of Airfix Gold!

[SM42]

I think the Gloy Caledonian Blue I used about 28 yrs ago is still drying!

[45059]

I've also had the gloss paint from a matt tin problem. Always from a new tin, and as has been mentioned in earlier posts, upon using the same paint for the second time the finish was matt.

 

I learned by accident that if you open a new tin and leave it for a while before use this can seem to fix the problem.(By allowing air to get at it?) I'm not claiming this to be definitive

 

'cure', but it seemed to work for me. Having said that I have always found Humbrols whites to be a nightmare, and so avoid them!

 

As for Revells range of paints, I used these for my aircraft when I was in Germany as they were the most commonly stocked, but I find that they become too thick especially if the

 

weather is too hot or too cold. Although I managed to paint a King Tiger with them no problem in the middle of a Bosnian summer...

 

Again, this is just what I've found, so don't shoot the messenger! I guess it's just personal choice and what ever works best for the individual.

Edited June 15, 2013 by 45059

[Dad-1]

What 2 years and no more gripes ? Has everyone stopped using Humbrol ?

I think the current formula enamel is rubbish. Oh, yes like many others I've been using enamel tinlets since the Airfix days.

I now have a problem salvaging a Parkside Dundas Southern BY van due to rubbish enamel paint. On opening a new tin

of Matt 82 it was like sludge, given a good long stir and it's still like sludge. Try to apply to a small panel by brush and it sits

there, no flow, unable to brush into a generally covering coat.

I've noticed this over the last 2 years, while old paints may have pigment settle to the bottom it stirred up into a nice flowing

paint. The new sludge may work thinned and airbrushed, but I gave up using an airbrush 20 years ago.

An example of the sludge sold by Humbrol I show you an example of a matt varnish brush painted over a raw Slaters brick

plasticard - I thought I could use the orange plastic to advantage by just matting & then overwashing with some thin colours.

I was not expecting to see a heavy frost !! I stopped almost at once I could see it wasn't working.

 

If my local shop did Revell paints I would use them now, but in desperation I'm going to try some acrylic, either that or give up

modelling & rely on RTR stock !!

 

Dad-1

Edited September 18, 2015 by Dad-1

[philsandy]

Yes, I 've found the same thing. Sludge is a very good description.

Most model shops seem to sell only Humbrol paints. it is a poor quality product.

I had some red gloss that I threw away, not because it was like sludge,  it literally would not dry.

[Removed a/c]

Can't say I have had any issues with the Humbrol paints I am using. I don't have an airbrush either. There is sludge in the bottom and it does take a few minutes to get it all stirred up but after that they seem ok.  

Edited September 18, 2015 by thebritfarmer

[Bristol_Rich]

If you are thinking of boycotting Humbrol try Valejo acrylics...the range is comprehensive including metallic mediums and varnishes.

 

The paint be brush or air brush applied but as with all acrylic not as durable as enamel...but Valejo isn't far off.

Edited September 20, 2015 by rich_eason

[70021 Morning Star]

The problem facing ALL paint manufacturers is EC health and safety regulations.

 

They're no longer permitted to use the traditional volatile solvents. As a result, it can be extremely difficult to get paint to dry. This is further exacerbated when they're packaging in very small quantities. Any 'settling out' of the complex compounds they're mixing is far more noticeable in our tiny model paint tins. That's why people keep telling us to thoroughly mix our paints. Then mix them some more.

 

Personally, I've almost given up on Enamel modelling paints. I'm actually a trained professional artist. These days I mostly use Acrylic paints. But, even Acrylics aren't without their problems. Many of the model makers' Acrylics have a habit of turning 'chalky', caking rather than flowing, or are rubbery. Interestingly though, some of the 'craft' acrylics (sold to hobbyist painters) seem to work better.

 

A couple of years back I had a conversation with Hammerite. Their technical people told be they were having nightmares getting anything to dry!

 

Another paint to consider is water-soluble artists' oil paint. Yes, I know that's a contradiction in terms. But, if you can have a quick-drying, high-quality artists' grade pigment, that can be made to flow like the old-style Enamels, isn't it worth trying? The trick is to thoroughly mix with water until you get an appropriate 'flow', as versus slapping it on like an oil painter.

 

Hope this helps,

Richard

Edited September 21, 2015 by 70021 Morning Star