Humbrol matt enamels

[Mallard60022]

What 2 years and no more gripes ? Has everyone stopped using Humbrol ?

I think the current formula enamel is rubbish. Oh, yes like many others I've been using enamel tinlets since the Airfix days.

I now have a problem salvaging a Parkside Dundas Southern BY van due to rubbish enamel paint. On opening a new tin

of Matt 82 it was like sludge, given a good long stir and it's still like sludge. Try to apply to a small panel by brush and it sits

there, no flow, unable to brush into a generally covering coat.

I've noticed this over the last 2 years, while old paints may have pigment settle to the bottom it stirred up into a nice flowing

paint. The new sludge may work thinned and airbrushed, but I gave up using an airbrush 20 years ago.

An example of the sludge sold by Humbrol I show you an example of a matt varnish brush painted over a raw Slaters brick

plasticard - I thought I could use the orange plastic to advantage by just matting & then overwashing with some thin colours.

I was not expecting to see a heavy frost !! I stopped almost at once I could see it wasn't working.

IMG_0397.jpg

 

If my local shop did Revell paints I would use them now, but in desperation I'm going to try some acrylic, either that or give up

modelling & rely on RTR stock !!

 

Dad-1

That is horrible. However, strangely, it could look OK as pointing if the stuff was rubbed off the brick surfaces?

P

[Mallard60022]

Today, sadly, I discovered the Humbrol matt that isn't and won't dry situation. This is not the first matt of my collection that has presented like this but I still thought this tin would be OK......Pah!

Phil.

[d600]

HI I have found matt red,black,and white don't seem to dry properly I did buy the same three colours again thinking it may of been a dodgy batch but there the same the black seems to come off the model easily has well.   

[crompton 33]

Today, sadly, I discovered the Humbrol matt that isn't and won't dry situation. This is not the first matt of my collection that has presented like this but I still thought this tin would be OK......Pah!

Phil.

 

The same thing. Yesterday i used Humbrol matt black on a model.  24 hours later it's not dry . Time to bin the tin . Going to keep to Railmatch from now on. Sadly it's a 40 mile round trip as my local model shop only stocks Humbrol. 

[Alcanman]

I've just painted track on my new layout today with humbrol enamels.  Nice matt finish. I've been using humbrol for over 30 years and never had a problem.

 

The old tip of storing the tinlets upside down and mixing the paint well has worked for me, and quite surprising how long some of the paint  lasts

[Mallard60022]

Maybe one more try for me then after super stirring, but not on something' important' first go.

P

[70021 Morning Star]

.

ULTRASONIC MIXING ?

 

Has anyone tried putting the paint tin in an Ultrasonic Cleaner to thoroughly mix the paint?

 

I'm thinking that the ultrasonic vibrations would shake the paint constituents off the sides of the tin, better than any stick type mixer, and that this would really shake things up. You could start with the tin the right way up, then upside down, to give the best possibility of a thorough mix.

 

Ultrasonic Cleaners are cheap enough these days, so if it works it'd be a worthwhile investment.

 

 

Rick

Edited September 25, 2015 by 70021 Morning Star

[smokebox]

Strap the tin to the blade of an electric jigsaw? Make sure the lid's tight though.

[Lyddrail]

I have found all purchases this year after my return to modelling have been as previously discribed a "thick sludge". Also from different suppliers.

Yet tins dating back 20 years are still useable as was the case in the past. Only as they run out do I have a problem. I have purchased some Phoenix paints to see if they will fill the void.

I have used a couple of Humbrol acrylics which have been very good, especially their matt white.

 

Cheers.

 

[orford]

I'm astonished by this thread. I have been using Humbrol matt enamels for well over 45 years and cannot say that I have ever had a problem with them, including a batch of 10 colours (including matt black) bought fairly recently.  I did notice that they seemed to be rather thicker than in the past but I actually saw that as being an advantage as they thinned down easily enough for both brushing and airbrushing (and thereby I reason, will last longer, per given size of tin). Certainly I have had no problems whatsoever with them drying. Used some of the matt black only yesterday in fact on my new Hornby D16/3 - airbrushed on, it was quite dry enough to pick the model up with the fingers 20 minutes later.

 

And yes - I would certainly endorse the 'store the tin upside down' comment. It totally stops the tin drying out in my experience (but do make sure the lid id on properly first).

 

Clearly everyone else seems to know something I don't. I'll keep an aye on it in the future.

[Boris]

I got fed up with some of the Humbrol issues, although the ones that were trouble always came from certain shops so I always wondered if it was down to the way they were stored (hot/cold/damp etc?).  I use Vallejo paints now, much better and they dry in minutes which is perfect for settling down to an afternoon painting session.

[bgman]

I got fed up with some of the Humbrol issues, although the ones that were trouble always came from certain shops so I always wondered if it was down to the way they were stored (hot/cold/damp etc?).  I use Vallejo paints now, much better and they dry in minutes which is perfect for settling down to an afternoon painting session.

Do you tend to use mostly brown matey ! LOL

[wainwright1]

Hi All.

 

I have been using Humbrol enamels for around fifty years and would say that they are my favourite paints although the old formulae ones seemed to work better than the new ones. However, you could always get a dodgy tin in the old range where the matt paint would not dry matt however well you stirred it.

 

I use a lot of paints but have not experienced the stodgy or rubbing off problems, although I have had a problem, particularly with the matt black, which does not dry overall matt, but with shiny streaks.

 

I agree that you should stir the paint thoroughly, I use a wooden tea stirrer which seems to work well, but I also apply a test patch to a piece of plastic card or similar to ensure that it dries properly and continue to stir and test  it until it does.

 

There was a blog on RMweb earlier this year related to Humbrol problems and I raised one related to matt varnish. I tested about eight different types of matt varnish some years ago and found the the ordinary matt varnish in the Humbrol enamel range seemed to give the best matt finish, even better than their Matt Cote. I use a lot of,this varnish including adding paint to some to use as a weathering finish. I have had at least four tins where the varnish would not dry clear, but with a cloudy bloom however well you stirred it. I registered a complaint for this on the Hornby web site and they requested that I return the tin to them. They supplied a replacement, but did not answer the details of the complaint. I also returned the other tines to my local supplier so he could send them back with a complaint to Hornby. It would seem that some batches are badly formulated but most are o.k.

 

If you have this problem or the ones already raised in this blog, I would raise a complaint on the Hornby website detailing precisely what the problem is and make a note of the batch number from the label on the bottom of the tin(s). (The label normally has the paint number, a bar code and the batch number). You can then look for tins of the same paint number from a different batch which may dry o.k.

 

Hopefully if enough people raise these queries with Hornby they may take notice and do something to rectify these quality control problems.

 

All the best

 

RB

[James Harrison]

My recent experiences of Humbrol can be said to run thus:

 

1) Humbrol satin Clearcote.  Applied this as a varnish to a newly finished model (which had taken a few months to build and weeks to paint and finish).  Within 5 minutes it dried to a white, chalky, flakey finish which defied all attempts to remove.  I ended up stripping the model down and doing it over again.

 

2) Humbrol enamel paint.  Older tins of this (as in, tins I've had for a few years) are fine.  Tins I've bought over the last year have been atrocious.  You open the tin to be presented with a thick sludge that defies stirring or thinning.  When you do, with baited breath, apply it to the model, you find it goes on very streaky, doesn't flow to a nice even finish, if you manipulate it into something approaching an even finish it is so thin as to be translucent, and takes days to dry.  I used a tinlet of #64 on a goods van on Saturday night.  Here we are on Monday, 48 hours later, and it is still tacky.  For a matt paint it is surprisingly shiny.  In places it has dried to a nice mid-grey colour; in others it barely covers the resin the kit is made of.  Likewise I used a tinlet of gloss white last night.  What I painted with it is not only still sopping wet, but the undercoat shows through to the extent that the white may as well not be there. 

 

3) Humbrol acrylic paint.  I have only used a few of this range (brunswick green, apple green, crimson lake and matt black).  The latter two appear to be okay.  The brunswick green dries to a very dull uninspiring finish, so when I use it I have to put some gloss enamel brunswick green down first to 'pep' it up a bit.  The apple green has next to no coverage, and again has to be laid down on top of a similar undercoat to get a decent finish. 

 

Overall; not very impressed.  I've been using Humbrol products for the last twenty years or so (since I started with Airfix at the age of 8 ) and have noticed in particular over the last year the quality has plummetted.  I'm actively looking for an alternative paint range. 

Edited November 16, 2015 by James Harrison

[d600]

Hi I use an old mini drill with a metal stirrer in which mixes the paint spot on but it still wont dry and its the same three colours all the time matt red,white and black I think it is humbrol paint has I found in the shed a rusty tin of revell matt black I tried it today and spot on its bone dry

[57xx]

Strap the tin to the blade of an electric jigsaw? Make sure the lid's tight though.

 

Or go one step further and make a holder that fits in your reciprocating saw.

 

 

I have a velcro strap that holds the tin firmly. 1 minute of shaking in this mixes even the most stubborn tin.

[tractor_37260]

Hi All.

 

I have been using Humbrol enamels for around fifty years and would say that they are my favourite paints although the old formulae ones seemed to work better than the new ones. However, you could always get a dodgy tin in the old range where the matt paint would not dry matt however well you stirred it.

 

I use a lot of paints but have not experienced the stodgy or rubbing off problems, although I have had a problem, particularly with the matt black, which does not dry overall matt, but with shiny streaks.

 

I agree that you should stir the paint thoroughly, I use a wooden tea stirrer which seems to work well, but I also apply a test patch to a piece of plastic card or similar to ensure that it dries properly and continue to stir and test  it until it does.

 

There was a blog on RMweb earlier this year related to Humbrol problems and I raised one related to matt varnish. I tested about eight different types of matt varnish some years ago and found the the ordinary matt varnish in the Humbrol enamel range seemed to give the best matt finish, even better than their Matt Cote. I use a lot of,this varnish including adding paint to some to use as a weathering finish. I have had at least four tins where the varnish would not dry clear, but with a cloudy bloom however well you stirred it. I registered a complaint for this on the Hornby web site and they requested that I return the tin to them. They supplied a replacement, but did not answer the details of the complaint. I also returned the other tines to my local supplier so he could send them back with a complaint to Hornby. It would seem that some batches are badly formulated but most are o.k.

 

If you have this problem or the ones already raised in this blog, I would raise a complaint on the Hornby website detailing precisely what the problem is and make a note of the batch number from the label on the bottom of the tin(s). (The label normally has the paint number, a bar code and the batch number). You can then look for tins of the same paint number from a different batch which may dry o.k.

 

Hopefully if enough people raise these queries with Hornby they may take notice and do something to rectify these quality control problems.

 

All the best

 

RB

I've also used Humrol emamels for many years with good results. In fact I still have some of the original Humbrol Authentic tins from years back, most of these are still useable, once the pigment that's settled at the bottom has been well mixed in.

One colour I have found can be "batch" related is 82 Matt Orange - some of these are "a tin of sludge"  no amount of stirring etc makes any difference - it just remains sludge !

I've never had a problem with non-drying, perhaps the more modern production batches have insufficient "Dryers" added to the mix.

Edited November 21, 2015 by tractor_37260

[Roger Sunderland]

Recently bought some Satin cote and gloss cote to protect transfers. Pants!!!!!

From the description on the bottle I thought they would do the same job as The old Johnson clear. All it leaves is a nasty white chalky deposit ( even the gloss). Complete waste of money. As both Vallejo and Lifecolour paints are readily available online I don't know why anyone would use this inferior range.

[tractor_37260]

Recently bought some Satin cote and gloss cote to protect transfers. Pants!!!!!

From the description on the bottle I thought they would do the same job as The old Johnson clear. All it leaves is a nasty white chalky deposit ( even the gloss). Complete waste of money. As both Vallejo and Lifecolour paints are readily available online I don't know why anyone would use this inferior range.

 

I never had much luck using Humbrol Satin/Gloss cote either. However I've used a lot Humbrol enamel varnishes with great success, using white spirit as a thinner. It goes on well and dries fairly quickly leaving a nice smooth coating, Depending on the amount of finished sheen required, they can be mixed together to give the required result.

Never spray varnish in cold humid or damp conditions, the results can vary from "blooming" to a frosted white look to the finish, which is near impossible to remove without stripping and starting over again !

Edited November 21, 2015 by tractor_37260

[60159]

I came across this old thread when trying to find out why, despite the usual upside down storing and thorough stirring of the "gloop", my recently purchased Humbrol matt Navy Blue still goes on in very streaky fashion and dries to a healthy gloss. I have many other older tins of Humbrol and matt has always been matt. This latest tin is just hopeless and exceedingly frustrating. The item I have been attempting to paint has already been stripped back to bare metal once because of the gloss finish and will need to be stripped back once again - bah! Is it too much to ask to get paint that works?

[PaulCheffus]

I came across this old thread when trying to find out why, despite the usual upside down storing and thorough stirring of the "gloop", my recently purchased Humbrol matt Navy Blue still goes on in very streaky fashion and dries to a healthy gloss. I have many other older tins of Humbrol and matt has always been matt. This latest tin is just hopeless and exceedingly frustrating. The item I have been attempting to paint has already been stripped back to bare metal once because of the gloss finish and will need to be stripped back once again - bah! Is it too much to ask to get paint that works?

Hi

 

Sadly it seems that Humbrol has lost the plot when it comes to their enamel paints. The recent tins of Matt varnish I bought just contain a grey sludge and no amount of mixing produces a suitable finish. I had to strip the two wagons I had put transfers on as the varnish just turned milky.

 

I have also tried the matt black (33) and matt lemon yellow (99) which did dry with the correct finish but tend to go gloopy quite quickly once opened. I have some tins of Humbrol that are around twenty years old that are still as good as the day they were bought.

 

Cheers

 

Paul

[John Tomlinson]

The annoying thing here is the work caused when paint or varnish misbehaves.

 

Like Paul in the last post, I recently sprayed with an old tin of "Light Aircraft Gray 166", getting on for 20 and absolutely smooth as silk with good cover. My last can of Black 33 was unusable, thin and stringy despite endless stirring, fortunately I was only brushing  some detail so it didn't take much to repair.

 

I have tried Revell enamels, spraying a Centurion tank with green 65 some months ago. I used what was left for something else at the weekend and the paint still sprayed perfectly. So I intend to make use of this range in future.

 

John.

Edited April 17, 2017 by John Tomlinson

[Barry Ten]

My only local supply of modelling paints is Revell, and I've found their matt black to be very frustrating, remaining glossy and sticky despite a great deal of stirring, and then being hard to over-paint without it all turning into a nasty sludgy mess.

 

Matt black used to be the one modelling colour you could rely on dry quickly and dead flat, but no longer it seems.

[Colin]

I've had the odd issue with Humbrol matt black in the past, and like others on this thread, have found Revell's product to be a better, and slightly cheaper, alternative. My big beef has been with the matt yellow in the Humbrol range - a while back I tried to add a warning panel to a plain green diesel and was still getting a horrid lime green tinge after stirring the stuff for ages and applying 4 coats, which were starting to obscure some of the finer detail on the loco. I stripped the paint off and started again with a pale grey panel as an undercoat, but the yellow still didn't cover properly, drying a nasty off cream shade instead. Strangely enough, I have had a similar problem with Railmatch yellow - is is something peculiar to the colour itself?

[5050]

Yellow is a very difficult colour to get a good coverage with.  Many years ago one of my major clients wanted a corporate yellow shade on some sheet metalwork and the sprayshop just couldn't get it to cover properly no matter what undercoat, primer etc. they tried.  We persuaded the client to use one of their other corporate colours and they went for  their grey instead.  No further problems!