OO gauge J94 Austerity Tank locomotive

[pmorgan_cym]

 

 

Radio control? Radio has its uses, no doubt, but after going super high tech and launching satellites to transmit information, we have gone back to cabling. Just as rails provide guidance to the wheels, they provide a handy means of cabling and they come in pairs. Why not use them? Many years ago, the subject of radio control came up. The discussion ended with the word “tunnels”.

 

 

My R/C garden steamers have no trouble with tunnels,  and don't think many indoor layouts will use breeze blocks, rocks and paving slabs to build theirs!

[richardupton]

Oh yes it is!

 

I asked Hornby ' The HM2000 controller is described as using 'compensation' to keep a steady speed despite varying load. Can you tell me if this is the same as 'back EMF feedback' and would it be suitable to use with coreless motors? I am asking as I currently use feedback controllers to keep speed steady but a new DJ Models coreless loco is jerky on them and Dave Jones of DJM advises against using them.'

 

The answer :-

 

Yes, it is the same. We do not use coreless motors at present, so are unaware of the performance of the HM2000 with them.

 

Hope this helps.

 

Best regards,

 

Laura

Customer Care Advisor

I wonder if anyone can help me on the subject of the HM 2000 controller. I have one of these and 3 of the new spec J94's. Individually they seem to run ok, but if I run two one on each of the loops fed by the HM 2000 controller the one running on the outer loop suddenly goes slower..

 

So my questions are these:

 

If I continue to run them on the HM 2000 will I risk damage to the motors

What controller type is non feedback and will run older locos (all post 2000) and newer coreless motored loco's ?

 

Cheers.

[rodger5591]

 

Of course, you may well be right. I’m not opposed to progress just so long as it is progress. Take digital watches, for example. The very early ones wouldn’t tell the time until prodded with a finger, which needed something that finger was engaged upon to be put down. Likewise, digital cameras took some time to come of age.

 

Why use battery power in locomotives? At present, I only have to put a loco on the track and apply power. Suppose someone arrives unexpectedly and wants to see my new Fell. Who wouldn’t? (Rhetorical question.) The battery is flat and will need an hour to charge up.

 

Radio control? Radio has its uses, no doubt, but after going super high tech and launching satellites to transmit information, we have gone back to cabling. Just as rails provide guidance to the wheels, they provide a handy means of cabling and they come in pairs. Why not use them? Many years ago, the subject of radio control came up. The discussion ended with the word “tunnels”.

 

 

The future may already be here, and its got a name: deadrail (http://www.deadrailsociety.com/ ). Plenty of info can be found on test layouts from a Google search

Rodger

[bertiedog]

Why dead rail or power on board? No connections to the tracks, no wired points, full reverse loops, dog bone layouts work, triangles or any track formations you care to outline, no power pickups, and full motor control.......I have used it with 0n3, great system. I do not connect through to DCC control etc.

Stephen

[JSpencer]

Why dead rail or power on board? No connections to the tracks, no wired points, full reverse loops, dog bone layouts work, triangles or any track formations you care to outline, no power pickups, and full motor control.......I have used it with 0n3, great system. I do not connect through to DCC control etc.

Stephen

 

And plenty of batteries to charge up or change. This concept is great for a few big locos and long lines, but becomes problematic when you have a normal room sized (or smaller) railway layout, lots of locos of various ages and sizes. While the US tends to use few big locos, the UK tends more towards the many small locos.

When not in use, the batteries should be removed, simply because eventually they rot.

I have one loco with a battery powered sound system and found it to be a real pain that in the end I kept to DCC sound via the rails.

[Roy Langridge]

And plenty of batteries to charge up or change. This concept is great for a few big locos and long lines, but becomes problematic when you have a normal room sized (or smaller) railway layout, lots of locos of various ages and sizes. While the US tends to use few big locos, the UK tends more towards the many small locos.

When not in use, the batteries should be removed, simply because eventually they rot.

I have one loco with a battery powered sound system and found it to be a real pain that in the end I kept to DCC sound via the rails.

 

Fully agree and it is for these reasons that I don't see the idea taking off in the UK for many many years. Let us say the technology becomes available at a reasonable cost in x years time:

• Do we throw away our existing stock - and remember with lighting / sound coming in coaching stock also now we are not just talking locos? No.
• There are people, quite rightly, expressing dismay at the cost of stock, are they going to change their possibly extensive stock in a short time? No.
• Will a system that allows both new radio controlled battery and old powered stock to be used together? Possibly.
• Will such a system be attractive enough to make people want to change their manner of operation? Doubtful

What is the real advantage of battery power? As I see it we don't need to clean tracks - little more.

 

Personally I think battery power, whilst improving, has a long way to go to make this viable in, for example, 4mm scale. A battery will have to power the loco, sound, lighting, receiver... That is an awful lot to power from a small loading gauge. And we still want to get weight in a loco, will the battery provide this, doubtful as one of the improvements needed in battery technology is to make them lighter.

 

I guess where I am going with this, is there a market for radio control in smaller gauges - certainly. Will it be sufficiently large to justify the cost of manufactures taking the leap? I really do not think so. But time will tell.

 

Roy

[No Decorum]

Something of a half-way house is the RailPro system. Radio control but powered from the track. Semi-compatible with DCC in that locos equipped for the different systems will run together, each controlled by its own controller and ignoring instructions from the other controller.

 

Of course, the question is, why?

 

One problem is that the radio receiver is quite bulky and would be difficult to find space for.

 

On the other hand, the controller is a very nice piece of work, which has nothing to do with radio control. I have been crying out for something like Hornby’s Rail Master but in a format similar to an NCE Power Cab. The RailPro controller could be improved but it is a move in the right direction.

 

Meanwhile, Samsung has announced its entry into the UK model railway market using battery power. The first models will be Bulleid unrebuilt Pacifics which are expected to burst into flames at unpredictable moments, true to prototype.

 

Boeing found its plans to do the same gazumped. Instead, Boeing now plans a range of early diesels with Spanner boilers which can likewise be expected to catch fire unexpectedly. Star of the range will (at last) be a Fell.

[JSpencer]

Something of a half-

 

 

Meanwhile, Samsung has announced its entry into the UK model railway market using battery power. The first models will be Bulleid unrebuilt Pacifics which are expected to burst into flames at unpredictable moments, true to prototype.

 

Boeing found its plans to do the same gazumped. Instead, Boeing now plans a range of early diesels with Spanner boilers which can likewise be expected to catch fire unexpectedly. Star of the range will (at last) be a Fell.

Altaya already beat them to it with their HO orient express locos, and did not even need to batteries and spanner boilers. The problems on these models make the Heljan's Garrett and class 17 look exceptionally reliable in comparison. I don,t think there was one working anywhere in the entire world after 1 day of use. Worse still, the only way to stripe them apart was with a hammer.

 

They currently offer an N gauge layout with stock in 300 weekly parts. My wife said, it's cheap you should buy. No dear I will the money to better use like a J94 or something and in any case they are too small for my rails.

[adb968008]

Fully agree and it is for these reasons that I don't see the idea taking off in the UK for many many years. Let us say the technology becomes available at a reasonable cost in x years time:

• Do we throw away our existing stock - and remember with lighting / sound coming in coaching stock also now we are not just talking locos? No.
• There are people, quite rightly, expressing dismay at the cost of stock, are they going to change their possibly extensive stock in a short time? No.
• Will a system that allows both new radio controlled battery and old powered stock to be used together? Possibly.
• Will such a system be attractive enough to make people want to change their manner of operation? Doubtful

What is the real advantage of battery power? As I see it we don't need to clean tracks - little more.

 

Personally I think battery power, whilst improving, has a long way to go to make this viable in, for example, 4mm scale. A battery will have to power the loco, sound, lighting, receiver... That is an awful lot to power from a small loading gauge. And we still want to get weight in a loco, will the battery provide this, doubtful as one of the improvements needed in battery technology is to make them lighter.

 

I guess where I am going with this, is there a market for radio control in smaller gauges - certainly. Will it be sufficiently large to justify the cost of manufactures taking the leap? I really do not think so. But time will tell.

 

Roy

 

 

I was actually looking at BlueRail, this looks like a nice quick and easy way to do it.

http://bluerailtrains.com/board-sign-up/

in old money (2009) was £80, 3 months ago was just over £100, but this evening, after bank charges will cost me £150 / $167.. per loco for battery, switch and board...

 

nice though, but unless 2009 comes back, or until we get Helicopter money from the government  I doubt this solution will take off in the UK, but relative to European locomotive costs it could see some take up there.

[No Decorum]

I was actually looking at BlueRail, this looks like a nice quick and easy way to do it.

http://bluerailtrains.com/board-sign-up/

in old money (2009) was £80, 3 months ago was just over £100, but this evening, after bank charges will cost me £150 / $167.. per loco for battery, switch and board...

 

nice though, but unless 2009 comes back, or until we get Helicopter money from the government  I doubt this solution will take off in the UK, but relative to European locomotive costs it could see some take up there.

That looks most interesting and ingenious. It gives the option of track or battery power, whichever you like. Now, where’s my Samsung ... Oh.

[streak7]

hello everyone, I am new to the forum so please go easy on me.

Can I just ask if anyone else has had a mechanical problem with their J94.

mine has expired with a burning smell following 10 hours of gentle running in.

[Edge]

Contact DJMDave on here or the seller that you purchased the loco from. Dave is very friendly and I'm sure can point you in the right direction to get your model sorted - it is his after all .

[Les1952]

hello everyone, I am new to the forum so please go easy on me.

Can I just ask if anyone else has had a mechanical problem with their J94.

mine has expired with a burning smell following 10 hours of gentle running in.

 

That could be the blanking plug- a club member had one go that way but it runs fine on DCC and the plug smoked when tried in a different J94.  If you have a spare blanking plug try swapping it over.

 

Dave asked for and got the duff plug back, my mate didn't want a replacement and the loco has now run happily for 20-odd hours chipped with no problem.

 

Les

[No Decorum]

hello everyone, I am new to the forum so please go easy on me.

Can I just ask if anyone else has had a mechanical problem with their J94.

mine has expired with a burning smell following 10 hours of gentle running in.

Welcome to the forum. I can sympathise, having lurked for ages before taking the plunge. I needn’t have worried. Stay clear of arguments and extreme opinions and personal attacks and you should be fine. Some people in here go to immense trouble to be helpful and some have more knowledge in their little fingers than I have in my brain.

[DJM Dave]

hello everyone, I am new to the forum so please go easy on me.

Can I just ask if anyone else has had a mechanical problem with their J94.

mine has expired with a burning smell following 10 hours of gentle running in.

 

Hi mate,

 

Rather than take this to PM, we can chat here in case others have had this problem.

 

I have had 2 returned for the same 'fault'. I say fault as they ran perfectly on test. This doesn't mean that they will fail, and i'd like it if you continued to use the model and see if it settles down.

 

May i also ask what controller yo are using, and if you use any electronic track cleaner, as it might help us to collectively identify a problem and subsequently help you and of course other modellers..

By the way, welcome to the RMW family. 

 

cheers

Dave

[streak7]

Guys thanks for the prompt and friendly replies. I have spoken to the retailer and they have said that they are happy to replace it if I want to send it back. I have no other DJm models so suspect that I don't have a spare blanking plug that would fit?

For Dave (of DJ models?) the loco is one of the BR batch. My layout is DC control only with 4 different non feedback Gaugemaster controllers.

I ran it in using a Gaugemaster handheld controller model W which is about 5 years old.

This controller is not linked to any electronic track cleaners. I probably ran it for about 40 feet on one of the other controllers which is linked to a gaugemaster electronic track cleaner when I first opened the box. I then read the instructions and changed controllers!

I ran it in with a tiny drop of model railway oil (cant remember the brand but it is specifically for model railways) on axle bearings and coupling rod bearings as per the instructions.

The loco smoothed out steadily with use and started to run much better so I then added some wagons for it to haul.

The load was gradually increased to about 15 and the loco happily hauled these round in both forwards and reverse during last week.

It probably completed 10 hours of light engine running and 2 to 3 hours of hauling steadily increased loads up to the 15 wagons.

Due to my finger trouble while operating another train on a separate circuit I switched the wrong point and cut off the power to the J94 when it was running at a fair speed (perhaps half power on the controller) with the goods train.

it came to an abrupt stop and would not restart when I realized my error and reset the point.

It appears to now have a short circuit or drivetrain issue as it will move about 5 mm on full power in either direction but no more.

I have unscrewed the chassis from the body so that the motor is not meshed with the gears and it runs freely if the wheels are given power but it will not run when reassembled.

 

Mark

[No Decorum]

Dave,

 

If I may ask, is fitting a decoder for use on DC a solution for people who have had running problems but don’t wish to change their controllers?

[DJM Dave]

Guys thanks for the prompt and friendly replies. I have spoken to the retailer and they have said that they are happy to replace it if I want to send it back. I have no other DJm models so suspect that I don't have a spare blanking plug that would fit?

For Dave (of DJ models?) the loco is one of the BR batch. My layout is DC control only with 4 different non feedback Gaugemaster controllers.

I ran it in using a Gaugemaster handheld controller model W which is about 5 years old.

This controller is not linked to any electronic track cleaners. I probably ran it for about 40 feet on one of the other controllers which is linked to a gaugemaster electronic track cleaner when I first opened the box. I then read the instructions and changed controllers!

I ran it in with a tiny drop of model railway oil (cant remember the brand but it is specifically for model railways) on axle bearings and coupling rod bearings as per the instructions.

The loco smoothed out steadily with use and started to run much better so I then added some wagons for it to haul.

The load was gradually increased to about 15 and the loco happily hauled these round in both forwards and reverse during last week.

It probably completed 10 hours of light engine running and 2 to 3 hours of hauling steadily increased loads up to the 15 wagons.

Due to my finger trouble while operating another train on a separate circuit I switched the wrong point and cut off the power to the J94 when it was running at a fair speed (perhaps half power on the controller) with the goods train.

it came to an abrupt stop and would not restart when I realized my error and reset the point.

It appears to now have a short circuit or drivetrain issue as it will move about 5 mm on full power in either direction but no more.

I have unscrewed the chassis from the body so that the motor is not meshed with the gears and it runs freely if the wheels are given power but it will not run when reassembled.

 

Mark

Hi Mark,

 

Thanks for the in depth answer.

Question, will, if 'barred over' the wheels rotate?

I'm thinking possibly a shock loading on a gear or 2 giving something akin to a split gear here?

Cheers

Dave

[streak7]

Dave, the chassis revolves freely when the motor is not engaged (ie the body and chassis are separated) and the motor runs freely under power but when reassembled it does not want to turn.

The motor looks to have a worm wheel to engage with the geartrain so presumably the wheels cant be turned if the motor is engaged? 

Is removing the screws underneath the boiler the way to access the motor so that I can attempt to turn it while it is in mesh with the geartrain?

So far I have just unscrewed the screws on the underkeep which allow the body and chassis to be moved apart (while still being linked by wires).

I checked that the blanking plug was correctly located last night and it was but it made no difference. This feels like a mechanical problem to me.

 

Mark

[Jake R]

To reply about the "burning smell" and smoke situation, I had the same problem when I bought mine. The loco would stop and seconds after smoke would come out (and I saw an orange light after with the smokebox off- perhaps fire?) as well as the scent. All I did was open the smokebox, remove the DCC blanking plate and push it back on hard (can't see the pins between the blanking plug and the plate) to stop it. I've also had the same problem with a Bachmann A1 that was fixed by doing that.

[DJM Dave]

Dave, the chassis revolves freely when the motor is not engaged (ie the body and chassis are separated) and the motor runs freely under power but when reassembled it does not want to turn.

The motor looks to have a worm wheel to engage with the geartrain so presumably the wheels cant be turned if the motor is engaged? 

Is removing the screws underneath the boiler the way to access the motor so that I can attempt to turn it while it is in mesh with the geartrain?

So far I have just unscrewed the screws on the underkeep which allow the body and chassis to be moved apart (while still being linked by wires).

I checked that the blanking plug was correctly located last night and it was but it made no difference. This feels like a mechanical problem to me.

 

Mark

 

Hi Mark,

 

Thanks for the posting, i've put some disassembly instructions on my web site (under maintenance) for you to take a look at and for the help of anyone that needs to get into the model.

 

Let me know how you get on, but it might need returning to the place of purchase.

cheers

Dave 

[DJM Dave]

Hi everyone,

 

just off out the door because of the ongoing family emergency but have taken phone pics of the remaining DJM J94's that have arrived as final deco samples.

 

They aren't great pictures but pleas bear with me and i'll try and get more up over the later part of the weekend.

 

Cheers

Dave

[streak7]

Dave, thanks I will have a look at that tonight and try it out. I will probably send it back but I would like to know what went wrong.

 

Mark

[No Decorum]

 

... i've put some disassembly instructions on my web site (under maintenance) for you to take a look at and for the help of anyone that needs to get into the model.

Thanks, Dave, very useful. 

[railroadbill]

Hi everyone,

 

just off out the door because of the ongoing family emergency but have taken phone pics of the remaining DJM J94's that have arrived as final deco samples.

 

They aren't great pictures but pleas bear with me and i'll try and get more up over the later part of the weekend.

 

Cheers

Dave

They look good, Dave, glad I've hung on for one of the LNER ones. Is there an approximate estimate for when they'll be available?  ie before Christmas etc.

 

Hope your family emergency gets sorted ok.