The Official Rapido APT-E Thread

[47137]

I wouldn't worry about nobody else having the same issues as you, Myself had a dodgy diode on the PCB, few posts ago, and nobody's mentioned anything similar, same as Colin, his universal joints on the drive shaft weren't connected properly, no-one else has said the same, Looks like every E-Train is unique.

For Correctness, it did transpire one of the UJs on my model was incorrectly seated.

 

I discovered this because I took my model to pieces and posted pics here for another reason; the model seemed to run well enough so there may be others out there, belonging to people who don't take brand-new models apart :-). My claim to uniqueness at the moment I have assembled the three-car set.

 

- Richard.

[UP 4000]

Hi Richard,

 

Sorry got confused, yes I remember now, you were looking for something and posted the photos, Was it John that picked up on it?? I checked the pair of mine straight away,

 

Hi Simon,

 

No problem, I think I'm starting to understand now, the standard head/tail lights can't operate properly over it's length, so just for example PC-1's headlights are wired normal, but on PC-2 they use aux 1 & 2, and with the ESU 21pin decoder using the MTC board you get aux 3 & 4, cablighting in the 2 power cars.

 

So you map aux 1 & 2 to F0, lighting.

 

I can't do CV'S, so have the Lokprogrammer, I'm no expert with it and still learning, but wouldn't be without one now, mainly purchased it for the Trix/Marklin Big Boy locomotive's to reblow the sounds on some of them and now use it for everything. 

 

Just checked on Ian's decoder and it's set:

 

Forward F0              Front Light [1], AUX2 [1]

Reverse F0              Rear Light [1], AUX1, [1]

 

This is what we need, starting to get thing's sorted out now,

Edited June 18, 2016 by UP 4000

[UP 4000]

I can now understand Scott's frustration, But maybe we should have been informed on the decoder situation a bit more,

 

Rapido do say in the manual your chosen decoder, and on the apt-e help sheet they haven't tested all decoders, but you do need in essence a 6 function decoder, hence the Loksound or Lokpilot V.4

 

I can see why they couldn't sell them themselves, but recommend an authorised dealer, Charlie DC Kits or their authorised service engineer so you could buy direct off them already set up, If you can't do CV's and don't have a Lokprogrammer, your pretty much up the creek.

 

There are probably a lot of people out there who aren't on RMWeb, who has done exactly the same thing,

[Removed a/c]

Thanks for your responses gentlemen much appreciated. 

 

I will compile a list with what each button on my controller gives me in forward & reverse. 

[Jitmen]

Great day today at NYMR diesel gala,pulled by a deltic,26er,40,37,and a 25er

[srihaggis]

Went up to "The Model Centre" to have my APT-E weathered, as per photographs found via various google searches. This was the first one they had worked on. Took them just under 3 weeks from me dropping it off and collecting. Didn't want this going in the post!

 

Thought it would be appropiate to do this mini photo-shoot at Colton Jc, just south of York.

 

 

 

[UP 4000]

Went up to "The Model Centre" to have my APT-E weathered, as per photographs found via various google searches. This was the first one they had worked on. Took them just under 3 weeks from me dropping it off and collecting. Didn't want this going in the post!

 

Thought it would be appropiate to do this mini photo-shoot at Colton Jc, just south of York.

 

 

 

 

Stunning, is all I can say! Definitely in her working clothes, beautiful model, Hats off to you,,,

[mikeharvey22]

Seeing the exhaust deposits on the roof of the weathered version (which looks very convincing) prompted me to think about exhaust deposits on that small windscreen. From what I remember the first production HSTs suffered badly from oily exhaust deposits on the trailing car windscreen which then became the leading car windscreen for the return trip. The solution was the deflector installed above the cabs which improved things enough. Was the shape of APT-E such that the exhaust was not drawn down onto the vertical screen? Maybe Mr. Tilt knows the answer.

Edited June 18, 2016 by mikeharvey22

[Removed a/c]

My findings so far

 

 

 

Clockwise travel with PC2 going forward

 

 

 

 

RL-Rearlight

HL-Headlight

Edited June 19, 2016 by thebritfarmer

[UP 4000]

Done a bit more testing on this lighting situation, For this I used a Loksound V.4 (don't have a Lokpilot at hand or any other spare 21pinner) and had to set the aux outputs as they weren't available on this decoder.

 

For this I will use how ESU class the outputs, 

 

Front Headlights,

Rear Lights,

AUX 1,

AUX 2,

AUX 3,

AUX 4,

 

A 6 function decoder, Because I'm using a Loksound the function buttons are taken up by sound, so were set to 14,15,16,17, But will class them as 1,2,3,4.

 

PC-1 in forward/leading,

Using F0, headlights on, no rear lights,

In reverse, headlights on PC-2, no rear lights,

 

Only headlights work at change of direction,

 

AUX 1, F1

Rear lights on PC-1, direction makes no change,

 

AUX 2, F2

Rear lights on PC-2, direction makes no change,

 

AUX 3, F3

Cab light in PC-1,

 

AUX 4, F4

Cab light in PC-2  

 

On yours Scott, were they any other functions operating, you only mention F0 & F1?

 

As it's sounding, the decoder is fine, just needs setting up, E-Trains fine also, You just need to find somebody with a Lokprogrammer, Or if you have any sound equipped loco's or intending to go down that route, it may be worth investing in one.

 

This is what it should look like,

[Mr_Tilt]

Seeing the exhaust deposits on the roof of the weathered version (which looks very convincing) prompted me to think about exhaust deposits on that small windscreen. From what I remember the first production HSTs suffered badly from oily exhaust deposits on the trailing car windscreen which then became the leading car windscreen for the return trip. The solution was the deflector installed above the cabs which improved things enough. Was the shape of APT-E such that the exhaust was not drawn down onto the vertical screen? Maybe Mr. Tilt knows the answer.

 

Pretty much yes, but E-Train was a lot lower than the HSTs and thus the exhaust bulges could be taller without infringing the C1 gauge limits. The bulges helped lift the exhaust flow clear of the E-Train's roof and so it didn't get as dirty as the HST's were.

 

Being a gas turbine exhaust it had different characteristics to a diesel exhaust, perhaps it was hotter so less heavy and dirty combustion products remained?

 

The situation is graphically shown in one of the Swindon August '75 pics below, the 252 set's roof is black whereas E-Train's is only slightly smoky.

 

Edited June 19, 2016 by Mr_Tilt

[UP 4000]

Another one of my stupid video's, hopefully should help with the lighting situation,

 

http://youtu.be/35Lurc2hg2o

[shreds]

Pretty much yes, but E-Train was a lot lower than the HSTs and thus the exhaust bulges could be taller without infringing the C1 gauge limits. The bulges helped lift the exhaust flow clear of the E-Train's roof and so it didn't get as dirty as the HST's were.

 

Being a gas turbine exhaust it had different characteristics to a diesel exhaust, perhaps it was hotter so less heavy and dirty combustion products remained?

 

The situation is graphically shown in one of the Swindon August '75 pics below, the 252 set's roof is black whereas E-Train's is only slightly smoky.

 

 

Diesel particulates always carry more soot, whereas look at an aircraft, yes there will be staining, but it will not be anything like as extreme. 

 

Plus remember the E Train was cosseted, did relatively short runs and was well looked after, it was not really a working network train.

 

I am sure Mr Tilt could even name the cleaners that looked after it!

[Mr_Tilt]

Diesel particulates always carry more soot, whereas look at an aircraft, yes there will be staining, but it will not be anything like as extreme. 

 

Plus remember the E Train was cosseted, did relatively short runs and was well looked after, it was not really a working network train.

 

I am sure Mr Tilt could even name the cleaners that looked after it!

 

E-Train ran on normal rail diesel, not aviation jet fuel, but it burned the stuff differently.

 

I'm not sure that 'cosseted' quite describes the situation, it's true that Ron Puntis' E-Train Support Section fell upon it with vigor whenever we returned to the RTC and cleaned it as well as possible, but that depended what mods we had to make to the train before the next test schedule of test runs. Sometimes we parked the vehicles in the APD Lab right away and got at it, so there wasn't much chance to clean it.

 

Karl was one of the cleaners, yes. 

 

He was a very morose Polish guy who figured the entire world was on his shoulders, if you could understand what he was saying mind you. But could he ever wield a broom, mop or cleaning cloth! 

Edited June 19, 2016 by Mr_Tilt

[Dagworth]

I guess I should open mine soon, it arrived Tuesday and it's still sealed in its transport box as I've been more concerned about a poorly cat

 

Andi

[Ian J.]

...but it burned the stiff differently...

 

Was the diesel fuel from a graveyard? ;)

[Removed a/c]

Done a bit more testing on this lighting situation, For this I used a Loksound V.4 (don't have a Lokpilot at hand or any other spare 21pinner) and had to set the aux outputs as they weren't available on this decoder.

 

For this I will use how ESU class the outputs, 

 

Front Headlights,

Rear Lights,

AUX 1,

AUX 2,

AUX 3,

AUX 4,

 

A 6 function decoder, Because I'm using a Loksound the function buttons are taken up by sound, so were set to 14,15,16,17, But will class them as 1,2,3,4.

 

PC-1 in forward/leading,

Using F0, headlights on, no rear lights,

In reverse, headlights on PC-2, no rear lights,

 

Only headlights work at change of direction,

 

AUX 1, F1

Rear lights on PC-1, direction makes no change,

 

AUX 2, F2

Rear lights on PC-2, direction makes no change,

 

AUX 3, F3

Cab light in PC-1,

 

AUX 4, F4

Cab light in PC-2  

 

On yours Scott, were they any other functions operating, you only mention F0 & F1?

 

As it's sounding, the decoder is fine, just needs setting up, E-Trains fine also, You just need to find somebody with a Lokprogrammer, Or if you have any sound equipped loco's or intending to go down that route, it may be worth investing in one.

 

This is what it should look like,

Hi Craig,

 

Thanks F5 & F6 work the cab lights. But that is all, the other F keys do not function. Off out for Fathers day so will look further at the info you provided later. Cheers !

[Mr_Tilt]

Was the diesel fuel from a graveyard? ;)

 

Hehehe, my keyboard lacks a few letters so it's touch and go if I hit the correct ones. 

[Colin_McLeod]

Hehehe, my keyboard lacks a few letters so it's touch and go if I hit the correct ones. 

Try a modern computer and not that old one in TC2

[UP 4000]

Hi Craig,

 

Thanks F5 & F6 work the cab lights. But that is all, the other F keys do not function. Off out for Fathers day so will look further at the info you provided later. Cheers !

 

Hi Scott,

 

Already mapped this on the lokprogrammer, and tested it on the old, knackered, smoke generating decoder, sort of worked on the decoder tester, but wasn't willing to put it in E-Train.

 

I'm going to my local model shop in the morning for a loksound 21pinner to upgrade the Hornby 08, I'll test the functions first on the E-Train before I reblow it to the 08 sound file on the esu's website, way better than Hornby's.

 

Give me a day or two, I'll check it on a lokpilot, if all's o.k, I'll let you know and if you want, if you can beg, borrow or worst case buy a lokprogrammer, PM me with your email and I'll send it to you.

[Mr_Tilt]

Try a modern computer and not that old one in TC2

 

I'm not sure the Redcor would be classified as a 'laptop', the DY430  teletype that programmes it must weigh more than my fridge and is about the same size! 

[newbryford]

I'm not sure the Redcor would be classified as a 'laptop', the DY430  teletype that programmes it must weigh more than my fridge and is about the same size! 

 

If it's so large, maybe it would be a laptop if you sat on its' lap.....

 

Cheers,

Mick

[Mr_Tilt]

If it's so large, maybe it would be a laptop if you sat on its' lap.....

 

Cheers,

Mick

 

If I did that you really WOULD get some random text output!

 

I'll try it.........

 

.r#typ=2 r23uez2`1g\`'#[za #tobeornotobethatisthequestion34cpreocueiw cw teww[re'[

 

See what I mean?  

[No Decorum]

 

If I did that you really WOULD get some random text output!

 

I'll try it.........

 

.r#typ=2 r23uez2`1g\`'#[za #tobeornotobethatisthequestion34cpreocueiw cw teww[re'[

 

See what I mean?  

 

“Infinite Monkey Theorem”. Clever.

[UP 4000]

Cracked it,

 

Successfully mapped the lights onto a loksound, working perfect, also tried a shunting mode setup where headlights and cablights stay on in both directions and only rearlights go off on the forward car (depending on direction).

 

I've even added it to service use, looks quite effective.

 

Thanks Simon for the information and pushing me in the right direction, learnt a bit more about the lokprogrammer and what you can do, will also be adding some of these features to my other loco's

 

I'll still check on a lokpilot but can't see why not. The loksound was purely for testing functions, there is no sound on it (well a 7F at the moment, soon 08), Only Ian has sound for E-Train, only available from Charlie.