RMweb Gold Ian Hargrave Posted September 29, 2017 RMweb Gold Share Posted September 29, 2017 Thanks for that Neil.Seems strange,if your conclusion is correct,that it should have been released as a GA loco,complete with headboard and arrows .OK for your shunting plank but not for my roundy.Award your good lady a tin of pilchards if you do decide on the Kernow option 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSpencer Posted September 29, 2017 Share Posted September 29, 2017 (edited) OK< I have been out to the garage and fitted a decoder to it! It runs very well, fantastic slow speed control in fact but with a restricted top speed as far as I can tell -- I have an end-to-end layout. I'd say it's not the lack of power, but the gearing that is the issue - maybe these motors have a lower rev ceiling so the gearing has been calculated wrongly. My US diesels don't go much faster though - different market, different tastes? Of course if it did 120 we'd all moan about that too . It's fine for my purposes, but I can see your point if you have a roundy-roundy that allows Tony Wright ECML speeds! Not my thing, but if it is yours then point accepted. I actually wanted a 1366 but was unimpressed with the number of non or poor runners complained about, so thought a 1361 may suffice - but which? Still not sure.....but I'm leaning Cornish-wards. The Mrs is from Looe..... Personally I think the motor is undersized and therefore under powered but compensated by a very fine gear box giving great low speeds. In DC mode, no other modern diesel or electric will match it for slow speed (in DCC mode, the others catch up). If the gearing was the same as Hornby's , I still think it would lack grunt because Hornby's motor is at least twice the size. Smaller motors can normally rev higher, but lack torque, so speed advantage is instantly lost if it cannot shift the load. The small motor, fine gearbox should still allow heavy loads (even if it's down on out right top speed), but Hornby is far heavier, filling up much the inside with weight. But DJM is better for sound fitting. Overall DJM sacrifices weight for easy DCC and sound fitting with excellent slow running characteristics, the trade is lack of power and top end speed. Not a problem on small shunters, but was found wanting (only) on big express trains at express speeds. Edited September 29, 2017 by JSpencer Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Corbs Posted September 30, 2017 RMweb Gold Share Posted September 30, 2017 This is interesting, looking back at the CAD, 1364 doesn't have splashers (the only one which doesn't, by the looks of it) 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
woodenhead Posted September 30, 2017 Share Posted September 30, 2017 Or you can't see them in the resolution of the image because on the actual model the splashers are almost hidden from that side Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium New Haven Neil Posted September 30, 2017 RMweb Premium Share Posted September 30, 2017 Thanks for that Neil.Seems strange,if your conclusion is correct,that it should have been released as a GA loco,complete with headboard and arrows .OK for your shunting plank but not for my roundy.Award your good lady a tin of pilchards if you do decide on the Kernow option Um, it's not a shunting plank, it's nearly 40 feet long.... The model I have is the original crowd funded version, not a Golden Arrer. Of course the gearing won't have been altered between them. I don't think the motor lacks power, aren't coreless supposed to be more powerful size for size than Iron core? I seem to recall the hoo-hah when Portescaps came out saying that. Oh god I'm that old.... As naturalised Manxies we run on Kippers by the way. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium jjb1970 Posted October 5, 2017 RMweb Premium Share Posted October 5, 2017 I think there is far too much emphasis placed on certain motor marketing hooks, such as coreless, five pole, skew wound etc. The important aspects of a motor include the power and torque characteristics, rotational speed and efficiency. Size and weight are obviously crucial for some applications but probably not that problematic for OO/HO model trains. If the motor has the correct power and torque characteristic for the application and the speed is appropriate (along with gear ratios) then it'll perform well, if not then it won't perform well. However marketing people have realised that certain things look good in marketing. The quality and durability of a motor, its power, torque etc are determined by design, bearings and manufacturing, not weather or not it is coreless. I also think there is too much emphasis placed on motors and not enough on transmission as if a locomotive is noisy or jerky it is probably not the motor at fault. You do get what you pay for, and I'm guessing model train manufacturers will have to select the most appropriate motor from OEM motor suppliers. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
No Decorum Posted October 5, 2017 Share Posted October 5, 2017 I think there is far too much emphasis placed on certain motor marketing hooks, such as coreless, five pole, skew wound etc. The important aspects of a motor include the power and torque characteristics, rotational speed and efficiency. Size and weight are obviously crucial for some applications but probably not that problematic for OO/HO model trains. If the motor has the correct power and torque characteristic for the application and the speed is appropriate (along with gear ratios) then it'll perform well, if not then it won't perform well. However marketing people have realised that certain things look good in marketing. The quality and durability of a motor, its power, torque etc are determined by design, bearings and manufacturing, not weather or not it is coreless. I also think there is too much emphasis placed on motors and not enough on transmission as if a locomotive is noisy or jerky it is probably not the motor at fault. You do get what you pay for, and I'm guessing model train manufacturers will have to select the most appropriate motor from OEM motor suppliers. In addition, whatever the motor is, it can be well or badly manufactured. Much the same goes for transmissions. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSpencer Posted October 6, 2017 Share Posted October 6, 2017 In addition, whatever the motor is, it can be well or badly manufactured. Much the same goes for transmissions. I have Altaya's Orient express set (2 locos, 10 coaches, covering say 1910 and 1930). These were advertised with the spec we are normally used to seeing these days. My god, they have the smooth running qualities of an electric razor. Try to imagine the noise of a friction drive in a model loco. Some people who complain about DJM being hard to take apart, have never met these things! Hardly a screw on them. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium jjb1970 Posted October 6, 2017 RMweb Premium Share Posted October 6, 2017 Out of interest, to what extent are model train drive systems designed? Obviously they're designed to an extent as otherwise factories wouldn't know what to build, but is it just a case of the designer using their experience and the bits in the parts box or do they do the analytical work to analyse stress, torque, transmission behaviour etc? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
cctransuk Posted October 6, 2017 Share Posted October 6, 2017 Out of interest, to what extent are model train drive systems designed? Obviously they're designed to an extent as otherwise factories wouldn't know what to build, but is it just a case of the designer using their experience and the bits in the parts box or do they do the analytical work to analyse stress, torque, transmission behaviour etc? I think that you know the answer to that one, don't you? Regards, John Isherwood. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium jjb1970 Posted October 6, 2017 RMweb Premium Share Posted October 6, 2017 I think that you know the answer to that one, don't you? Regards, John Isherwood. Yes, but I thought I'd ask as it is something I've often wondered when looking at models. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Stationmaster Posted October 12, 2017 RMweb Gold Share Posted October 12, 2017 I am led to believe that these are now very close to a certain retail establishment in Cornwall (in fact I had to decline collecting mine at the Farnham show on Saturday as I am collecting a number of other items there in any case so the transactions need to be a bit more spread out ). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
micklner Posted October 12, 2017 Share Posted October 12, 2017 This is interesting, looking back at the CAD, 1364 doesn't have splashers (the only one which doesn't, by the looks of it) Review in Hornby Magazine today. You can see the splashers in the photo of 1364 on the same side as above CAD. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Ian Hargrave Posted October 12, 2017 RMweb Gold Share Posted October 12, 2017 Err..well I've just "splashed out" on a GWR version........Oh the shame of it 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
GWR8700 Posted October 12, 2017 Share Posted October 12, 2017 I pre-ordered one of these a while back on my old card. Just wanting to check that that won't mess things up when the payment is taken? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
cctransuk Posted October 12, 2017 Share Posted October 12, 2017 I pre-ordered one of these a while back on my old card. Just wanting to check that that won't mess things up when the payment is taken? The best thing to do is to contact Kernow, I'd think. Regards, John Isherwood. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Stationmaster Posted October 15, 2017 RMweb Gold Share Posted October 15, 2017 1362 arrived with me yesterday via the Farnham show but not fully checked as yet and I'm waiting for the camera batteries to re-charge before fully unveiling it. 8 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jwd Posted October 16, 2017 Share Posted October 16, 2017 Any reason why Kernow are not doing plain green or Great <> Western livery of this? Especially when they are doing the works/photo grey livery? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
knitpick Posted October 16, 2017 Share Posted October 16, 2017 I pre-ordered one of these a while back on my old card. Just wanting to check that that won't mess things up when the payment is taken? As cctransuk says - contact Kernow. Otherwise your order will be delayed as the card company will reject the payment. And Kernow will need to contact you for your new card details. For what it's worth, whenever my card has expired, I have contacted Kernow with the new card details. This has meant that when preorders have arrived at Kernow, payment can be taken and they can be despatched to me. Slightly off topic but those Warships have been a long time coming and I'm now on my second re-issue of that card. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
GWR8700 Posted October 16, 2017 Share Posted October 16, 2017 The best thing to do is to contact Kernow, I'd think. Regards, John Isherwood. As cctransuk says - contact Kernow. Otherwise your order will be delayed as the card company will reject the payment. And Kernow will need to contact you for your new card details. For what it's worth, whenever my card has expired, I have contacted Kernow with the new card details. This has meant that when preorders have arrived at Kernow, payment can be taken and they can be despatched to me. Slightly off topic but those Warships have been a long time coming and I'm now on my second re-issue of that card. Thanks, I'll give them a ring after work. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garethp8873 Posted October 16, 2017 Share Posted October 16, 2017 1362 arrived with me yesterday via the Farnham show but not fully checked as yet and I'm waiting for the camera batteries to re-charge before fully unveiling it. Oh damn... more money will soon be coming out of my account then it seems... I am however looking forward to comparing my order of GWR 1363 to Heljan's GWR 1364. Of the examples Heljan has done, I was most impressed by 1364 bar the lettering. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium it's-er Posted October 16, 2017 RMweb Premium Share Posted October 16, 2017 I'm sure I can't be the only one who is hoping Mike The Stationmaster's camera batteries are charged by now (post 470)? John Storey Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
GWR8700 Posted October 17, 2017 Share Posted October 17, 2017 Any reason why Kernow are not doing plain green or Great <> Western livery of this? Especially when they are doing the works/photo grey livery? I too would have been interested in one in that livery, quite surprised that neither Heljan or Kernow attempted this. Fingers crossed for a future release Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ozexpatriate Posted October 17, 2017 Share Posted October 17, 2017 I too would have been interested in one in that livery, quite surprised that neither Heljan or Kernow attempted this. Fingers crossed for a future release I would be very surprised if it didn't come down to having the right photographic evidence available when liveries were chosen. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TerrySVR Posted October 18, 2017 Share Posted October 18, 2017 Has anyone managed a review of these? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now