rovex Posted April 13, 2018 Share Posted April 13, 2018 Well very impressed with Rails, I rang this morning to let them know what the problem was and that I would be returning the model to them. They've emailed me a returns label and whilst they are no more black ones in stock have agreed to exchange it for a green one, which I have asked that they check over thoroughly before they send it to me. Very efficient service. With regards to the original model my box was completely unmarked with no signs of damage, the plastic packaging was undamaged and I can only assume that any damage took place when the model was rammed into it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Ian Hargrave Posted April 13, 2018 RMweb Gold Share Posted April 13, 2018 I see a tear in the cardboard sleeve.....and that is all. The clear plastic bubble cradle appears intact and that is the one that matters.I have many times received parcels which display that same tear which is easily caused by the removal of the tight fitting cardboard sleeve either on packing or repackaging . I would not conclude from what I personally see that there is the remotest evidence of transit damage. Remember Rob has more of these consignments than most of us and surely his views can be trusted on the basis of experiences going back many years.His voice stood clear in support of Heljan's Beyer Garratt.So no,I do not believe he or anyone else for that matter is scapegoating Heljan for delivery damage. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ndg910 Posted April 13, 2018 Share Posted April 13, 2018 (edited) Am sorry to disappoint everyone and I really do sympathise with everyone who has a duff one of these. You shouldn't have to be returning a brand new loco with some of the faults and Quality control and manufacturing issues identified. I bought 4704 in shirtbutton livery. Arrived undamaged, no loose handrails, stanchions and all wheels correctly fitted. There are no parts that have come off in the box and I cant see anything actually missing or broken. The front of the frames are straight to my untrained eye and a quick test run over a complex track layout has shown no derailing issues and no issues with running. I need to run in mine but overall not bad. I can see the faults everyone has spoken of on here in terms of detail and I am unconvinced by the number plates but can live with them for now. Next time I have an order for plates for a kit I might add it to the order to save the postage. I hope that helps people realise that there are good ones out there and seems I am lucky and this is not meant as gloating, just an attempt to redress the balance. Edited April 13, 2018 by ndg910 6 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BRIAN T Posted April 13, 2018 Share Posted April 13, 2018 If this model were a motor car surely it would have been recalled by the manufacturers by now? I am not in favour of manufacturer bashing, and indeed - as with others - have some excellent Heljan diesels in my 'fleet'. But I think that (?) UK retailers ought to act together on this. Some combination of design fault, sloppy manufacturing and lack of quality control appears to have resulted in a product that is just not fit for purpose.Totally agree,also with Barry Ten,wiping a bit of oil off ,not happy with a bit of pipework......not even worth mentioning.But......the rest of the faults in a desperate attempt to keep a very expensive model,......snapped footplate,broken front bogie,not running on a straight piece of track ,even the retailers have given the thumbs down,..........glueing filing,soldering,”just needs reclipping” of the axle or I’ll use part of another kit or model......really isn’t on...or we’ve just got money to burn....such a shame as I don’t like manufacturer bashing either. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold 81C Posted April 13, 2018 RMweb Gold Share Posted April 13, 2018 Totally agree,also with Barry Ten,wiping a bit of oil off ,not happy with a bit of pipework......not even worth mentioning. But......the rest of the faults in a desperate attempt to keep a very expensive model,......snapped footplate,broken front bogie,not running on a straight piece of track ,even the retailers have given the thumbs down,..........glueing filing,soldering,”just needs reclipping” of the axle or I’ll use part of another kit or model......really isn’t on...or we’ve just got money to burn....such a shame as I don’t like manufacturer bashing either. Me neither but I think this time there is an excepton to that rule. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Dunsignalling Posted April 13, 2018 RMweb Gold Share Posted April 13, 2018 (edited) To be fair to Heljan, they aren't all faulty - I've seen none "in the flesh" that are, though one owner reported having to clip the pony wheels in. On the other four I've observed, nothing has been detached, damaged or wonky. All seem to run well and have plenty of "grunt". The way certain details are presented is a matter of something "crossing the line" of what is acceptable (or fixable) for any individual prospective purchaser, but the production issues are clearly not universal. Rob's loco is a rather extreme example, but another contributor has mentioned that Rails don't have any black ones left if he did want a replacement. His photo suggests that front footplate is a separate part that has become detached (or never been properly attached) rather than snapped. I have no idea of the extent of Rob's modelling abilities but, if it's a good runner, and I were where he is geographically, I'd be inclined to fix it myself or find someone who can. John Edited April 13, 2018 by Dunsignalling Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Stationmaster Posted April 13, 2018 RMweb Gold Share Posted April 13, 2018 To be fair to Heljan, they aren't all faulty - I've seen none "in the flesh" that are, though one owner reported having to clip the pony wheels in. On the other four I've observed, nothing has been detached, damaged or wonky. All seem to run well and have plenty of "grunt". The way certain details are presented is a matter of something "crossing the line" of what is acceptable (or fixable) for any individual prospective purchaser, but the production issues are clearly not universal. Rob's loco is a rather extreme example, but another contributor has mentioned that Rails don't have any black ones left if he did want a replacement. His photo suggests that front footplate is a separate part that has become detached (or never been properly attached) rather than snapped. I have no idea of the extent of Rob's modelling abilities but, if it's a good runner, and I were where he is geographically, I'd be inclined to fix it myself or find someone who can. John I think with modern Chinese production it is probably inevitable that there will be some modes with assembly shotrtcomings. BUT, yes, a big BUT, the 'manufacturer' - Heljan in this case - must surely set a minimum acceptable standard and level for assembly errors even if it is only based on the 12 models on top of the order for 500 (which seems to be standard fare for Chinese manufacture). Equally there are considerable differences between small parts poorly fitted/loose in box and the sort of thing Rob has experienced and purchasers are in my view quite right ti expect a correlation between price and the standard of model delivered. Inevitably we will be more likely to hear of bad examples than good, that's the way of the internet world, but equally - and more importantly - nobody should be expecting a model with major assembly shortcomings in this day and age and Heljan seem to have something of a reputation for such things (maybe incorrectly?). Do they now have Friday afternoons in China? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rovex Posted April 13, 2018 Share Posted April 13, 2018 His photo suggests that front footplate is a separate part that has become detached (or never been properly attached) rather than snapped. I have no idea of the extent of Rob's modelling abilities but, if it's a good runner, and I were where he is geographically, I'd be inclined to fix it myself or find someone who can. John If its not a separate item it certainly seems to be a point of weakness Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSpencer Posted April 13, 2018 Share Posted April 13, 2018 His photo suggests that front footplate is a separate part that has become detached (or never been properly attached) rather than snapped. I have no idea of the extent of Rob's modelling abilities but, if it's a good runner, and I were where he is geographically, I'd be inclined to fix it myself or find someone who can. It looks a mix of both. The upper front foot plate seems to be a seperate part. but there are bar like shaped parts that seem to run along just below the full running plate along the sides and these look snapped off where the front part of the running plate joins the long middle section. I,m not into manufactuerer bashing but it is hard to imagine what caused this damage after leaving the factory. The model is heavy so it might be possible for it to take a low level whack, move forwards from its held position, break off the part and spring back without there being any indication of postal damage. But that sounds unlikely. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
locoholic Posted April 13, 2018 Share Posted April 13, 2018 First there was the Heljan Lynton & Barnstaple loco that derailed and whose valve gear disintegrated. Now we have the 47xx debacle. Heljan don't seem to be able to design and manufacture reliable UK outline steam locos. It's as if they've adopted the North British approach to diesel loco manufacture. I hope Heljan doesn't go the same way as NB did... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Castle Posted April 13, 2018 Share Posted April 13, 2018 (edited) To be fair to Heljan, they aren't all faulty - I've seen none "in the flesh" that are, though one owner reported having to clip the pony wheels in. On the other four I've observed, nothing has been detached, damaged or wonky. All seem to run well and have plenty of "grunt". The way certain details are presented is a matter of something "crossing the line" of what is acceptable (or fixable) for any individual prospective purchaser, but the production issues are clearly not universal. Rob's loco is a rather extreme example, but another contributor has mentioned that Rails don't have any black ones left if he did want a replacement. His photo suggests that front footplate is a separate part that has become detached (or never been properly attached) rather than snapped. I have no idea of the extent of Rob's modelling abilities but, if it's a good runner, and I were where he is geographically, I'd be inclined to fix it myself or find someone who can. John Hi John, The front running plate is not a separate part - it is part of the main body moulding. You could clearly see on mine before I sent it back, the fracture lines where it had snapped through on the hanging bar. Sorry that you have joined the ‘club’ New Zealand Rob - it is interesting that this from section seems to be a weak point and that these BR black ones are the worst affected. There was obviously a 300 pound gorilla working in the Heljan factory’s packing department that day... All the best, Castle Edited April 13, 2018 by Castle Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bike2steam Posted April 13, 2018 Share Posted April 13, 2018 (edited) The front running plate is not a separate part - it is part of the main body moulding. Mmm, what an interesting project, I wonder how cheap I can get one for, and rework it to get it right ?? But I suppose Heljan will just throw the reject bodies back in the melting pot to remould. Edited April 13, 2018 by bike2steam Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Horsetan Posted April 13, 2018 Share Posted April 13, 2018 (edited) .....nobody should be expecting a model with major assembly shortcomings in this day and age and Heljan seem to have something of a reputation for such things .... It seems to be becoming their "trademark". ...... I wonder how cheap I can get one for, a rework it to get it right ?? ..... Just wait for eBay to turn up with some broken ones. Edited April 13, 2018 by Horsetan Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rovex Posted April 13, 2018 Share Posted April 13, 2018 Mmm, what an interesting project, I wonder how cheap I can get one for, a rework it to get it right ?? But I suppose Heljan will just throw the reject bodies back in the melting pot to remould. you could always give Hattons/Kernow/Rails a ring, seems like they'll all have quite a few rejected ones hanging around the shop. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
micklner Posted April 13, 2018 Share Posted April 13, 2018 It seems to be becoming their "trademark". Just wait for eBay to turn up with some broken ones. Olivias sell returns on eBay, that is how I got a cheap O2. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AGR Model Store Posted April 13, 2018 Share Posted April 13, 2018 (edited) How many traders have had problems ? Two arrived in same condition today .... Edited April 13, 2018 by AGR Model Store Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BRIAN T Posted April 13, 2018 Share Posted April 13, 2018 How many traders have had problems ? Two arrived in same condition today .... 30743043_10155895297579702_686574896205004800_n.jpg 30743043_10155895297579702_686574896205004800_n.jpg How many traders have had problems ? Two arrived in same condition today .... Th 30743043_10155895297579702_686574896205004800_n.jpg 30743043_10155895297579702_686574896205004800_n.jpg That’s disgusting and an insult to the trade and the customer Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rovex Posted April 13, 2018 Share Posted April 13, 2018 How many traders have had problems ? Two arrived in same condition today .... 30743043_10155895297579702_686574896205004800_n.jpg 30743043_10155895297579702_686574896205004800_n.jpg Can we have a "shocked" emoticon Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimC Posted April 13, 2018 Share Posted April 13, 2018 I'm starting to wonder if the entire shipment experienced some sort of high energy accident. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Dunsignalling Posted April 13, 2018 RMweb Gold Share Posted April 13, 2018 (edited) Are all the affected locos examples of the BR black versions, or are GWR ones arriving with similar damage? John Edited April 13, 2018 by Dunsignalling Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rail-Online Posted April 13, 2018 Share Posted April 13, 2018 My Mate got one from his local model shop and was expecting problems - very forst one they unpacked and inspected was fine. He has seen this thread and knows what to look for........ Tony Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Metr0Land Posted April 13, 2018 RMweb Gold Share Posted April 13, 2018 I'm starting to wonder if the entire shipment experienced some sort of high energy accident. Either that or they were rushed out immediately pre/post Chinese New Year? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Dunsignalling Posted April 13, 2018 RMweb Gold Share Posted April 13, 2018 (edited) When it arrives, my late-BR green one will be purchased from my local dealer so I can inspect it first. Hopefully, whatever disasters have befallen the early batches will have been identified and any repetition prevented by then, but my peace of mind will be well worth the extra few quid I'll pay compared to getting one over the web. John Edited April 13, 2018 by Dunsignalling Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tonytrainset Posted April 13, 2018 Share Posted April 13, 2018 Just opened the box of 4706 and first impressions are good. Packaging really nice, very heavy model and the finish looks great!! First Heljan Steamer........screws to remove the tender top on the top of the tender........radical!! Ill chip it and run it and get back to you but been looking forward to this day and so far not disapointed.....hope its a good one! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
neal Posted April 13, 2018 Share Posted April 13, 2018 Welcome back bro! Good luck, look forward to seeing it on your channel. N Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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