'CHARD Posted March 26, 2016 Share Posted March 26, 2016 I daren't count my Black Fives (or my Brits), and would happily rake in a couple more, if the tender chassis/ solebar fiction didn't grate so much. Surely that's fixable at source, when home-brewed correction is long-winded and at best, touch and go. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
robmcg Posted March 30, 2016 Share Posted March 30, 2016 With the lowered midland lamp bracket I have 44781/44871 (plain black) and 45156 /45190 (lined black). Checking my dome (as it were), there is a slight angle.. It's not as pronounced as the sample pic, nor is it as bad as the Hattons images, and mine is flush to the boiler, but there is an angle.. Not enough to warrant me removing it from service, but if opt arrives I may take off the body and see if there's a lug that I can pop to re-sit it. If the right price came along I may stretch to a 2nd one, and just keep the tender as a spare ( I have a couple of spare tenders already, but they are lined / welded). I see Hornby has a few black 5s on stream this year, I saw 5156 at Ally Pally with stanier coaches (£200), very nice model and variant on the LMS liveries to date, can't quite justify it (I have a set of lms stanier and I try not to duplicate numbers and my preference is BR), but it's a good model, but also 45116 (complete with its odd sized/spaced numbers) and 45274.. (Plus 45025 in railroad), but of them all this one is to me the most unique variant just due to the tender. Going back to 45116, it seems it carried both undersized and oversized numbers during its lifetime.. A quick Google finds smaller numbers in Wellingborough in 1959 http://www.rail-online.co.uk/p129376112/h380C476E#h380c476e And oversized Scottish numbers in 1951 http://www.rail-online.co.uk/p129376112/h5CFCE8F8 Hornby have done long term Carlilse based 45455 in lined black (with snow ploughs), regular on the WCML / S&C and made it till summer 1967. Thanks for that, I tossed up over 44694 and 45455, always having fondness for Carlisle-based engines, since so many ended up there in the sad last days of heavy steam, I took a deep breath and bought a model of the latter, unlined, snow plough and so on but pristine, from Trains4u this morning. It looks new in the ad, but described as used, it being a 2003-4 model. I hope the pic is of the actual model and some 'stock' photo. In driving to town in the sunshine today, having a couple of hours to consider the errors of my ways I found myself thinking, yes! Can't wait for that one to arrive! (Always a good test when buying; do you feel good, after you've hit 'buy'). This is not to say I won't buy another lined pristine version. Pics to come if allowed. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold farren Posted March 30, 2016 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 30, 2016 I have to agree with you. You can't have to many I've got seven with the different boilers plus long/short wheel base excellent model of a super locomotive. I keep looking at the Comet model of the caprotti! I mean eight wouldn't be seen as being greedy now would it? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
34theletterbetweenB&D Posted March 30, 2016 Share Posted March 30, 2016 ... would happily rake in a couple more, if the tender chassis/ solebar fiction didn't grate so much. Surely that's fixable at source, when home-brewed correction is long-winded and at best, touch and go. I find that kicking the Hornby tender into the weeds works for me. A s/h Mainline or Bachmann Stanier 4,000 gallon job, relatively cheap and easy to find from a long ago clapped out split chassis model of a Scot, Pate or Jube is substituted, and all is well. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
No Decorum Posted March 30, 2016 Share Posted March 30, 2016 “If it's not available in CRIMSON! It's not a proper engine.” I assume that one of your “Black” 5s is the Hornby one which appeared in self-coloured crimson plastic many years ago? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold farren Posted March 30, 2016 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 30, 2016 Under every Black LMS goods locomotive there's a beautiful Crimson loco just waiting to be released. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Hilux5972 Posted March 30, 2016 RMweb Premium Share Posted March 30, 2016 “If it's not available in CRIMSON! It's not a proper engine.” And that also applies to my lovely Hogwarts Castle loco too Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
robmcg Posted March 30, 2016 Share Posted March 30, 2016 I have to agree with you. You can't have to many I've got seven with the different boilers plus long/short wheel base excellent model of a super locomotive. I keep looking at the Comet model of the caprotti! I mean eight wouldn't be seen as being greedy now would it? I think an even dozen is the correct number , whether it be Black 5s, Merchant Navys, or Britannias. Certainly a measly 8 Black 5s barely covers the variations! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sawyermodels Posted March 30, 2016 Share Posted March 30, 2016 Got ours today, lovely model. male/female plug from loco to tender, nem pocket on tender, sprung buffers etc. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
robmcg Posted March 30, 2016 Share Posted March 30, 2016 Having expressed misgivings about the dome on some advertiser's pictures showing a dome issue and chimney issue, most noticeable in the Rails ad, I have decided that I NEED a pristine late BR Black 5, and will take the plunge, seeing another pic where the dome and chimney appear to be correctly fitted, ... thus So as is common with many new Hornby models, there is an element of risk adventure call it what you will edit; I would note also that the Kernows model appears perfect too maybe Rails just got one with slightly wonky dome/chimney assembly? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold farren Posted March 30, 2016 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 30, 2016 Think it 3 out of the seven I have where I'd had to turn the dome round. Yes it only takes a minute or two but for the cost of the model it should be right in the first place. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
robmcg Posted March 31, 2016 Share Posted March 31, 2016 Think it 3 out of the seven I have where I'd had to turn the dome round. Yes it only takes a minute or two but for the cost of the model it should be right in the first place. Thanks for the reassurance that even if a dome looks a bit wonky it is quite easy to fix. I bought 45455 unlined Carlisle-based Black 5, and then being so pleased that Hornby are still producing models, I bought 44694 as well, to go with the 'few' others I have, mostly weathered, one very heavily weathered. Here are the two recent purchases and an older pic of 44668... these really are lovely engines, quite the perfect counterpoint to a Princess Coronation... (all others being pretenders. for today at least ) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Hilux5972 Posted March 31, 2016 RMweb Premium Share Posted March 31, 2016 The only black 5 I have ever owned is the older one that was painted bright green with a number 3 on the tender ;-) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
robmcg Posted March 31, 2016 Share Posted March 31, 2016 The only black 5 I have ever owned is the older one that was painted bright green with a number 3 on the tender ;-) Well I have indulged in bursts of enthusiasm for Black 5s and they are utterly addictive, with such a wide range of time for building, 1935-1951, and many subtle changes, mostly done faithfully by Hornby with their suite of tools, even down to crosshead vacuum pump brackets (but not the actual pumps which were usually removed by 1938). As mentioned before I HAD to buy 44694 because is was built in the month I was born! Mind you, I have similar affection for Std 4-6-0 5MTs... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold adb968008 Posted April 1, 2016 RMweb Gold Share Posted April 1, 2016 I have to agree with you. You can't have to many I've got seven with the different boilers plus long/short wheel base excellent model of a super locomotive. I keep looking at the Comet model of the caprotti! I mean eight wouldn't be seen as being greedy now would it? Heres my list.. 44668 44694 44781 44871 44908 44932 45156 45253 45377 Plus 5055 (which may or may not become a donor for a project). I also have 2 spare lined/welded tenders (both late crest) to put behind 45253/44668 when I feel a bit "late 60s", prior to 44694 my only other riveted tender was 44908 (e/c). My hearts telling me to get 45190 and 45455 but my wallets telling me to behave... the want may fade if I had a 2nd l/c riveted lined tender to put behind 44908 occasionally. Perhaps in 2018 Hornby may do an August 1968 Black 5s set.. 45212, 45318, 45110, 45305 to fill in the gaps with other August 1968 models already made. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold farren Posted April 1, 2016 RMweb Gold Share Posted April 1, 2016 That's a nice list there adb968008.most of Mine are yet to have their identity given to them. 2-3 will be Leicester engines. Though I may like a few more Hornby black5. with total of 20 stanier 4-6-0 builds and rebuilds. If i was to buy another black 5 its likely to just be caprotti. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold farren Posted April 2, 2016 RMweb Gold Share Posted April 2, 2016 Deleted post. And apologise to the reader who's post this was aimed at. Never meant for you to feel that your should have delete your own post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Black 5 Bear Posted April 2, 2016 Author Share Posted April 2, 2016 W Heres my list.. 44668 44694 44781 44871 44908 44932 45156 45253 45377 Plus 5055 (which may or may not become a donor for a project). I also have 2 spare lined/welded tenders (both late crest) to put behind 45253/44668 when I feel a bit "late 60s", prior to 44694 my only other riveted tender was 44908 (e/c). My hearts telling me to get 45190 and 45455 but my wallets telling me to behave... the want may fade if I had a 2nd l/c riveted lined tender to put behind 44908 occasionally. Perhaps in 2018 Hornby may do an August 1968 Black 5s set.. 45212, 45318, 45110, 45305 to fill in the gaps with other August 1968 models already made. What a splendid idea, a boxed set of all main variants (not some of the more obscure). A newly tooled Caprotti would also be most welcome.... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Ian Hargrave Posted April 2, 2016 RMweb Gold Share Posted April 2, 2016 WWhat a splendid idea, a boxed set of all variants and just possibly a newly tooled Caprotti.... To be marketed as 'Black (5) Magic' perhaps ? Your idea of a Caprotti version is long overdue.The question being which Caprotti version There were a few variations on a theme.Hornby already have a fair representation of the valve gear with their Duke of Gloucester. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Ian Hargrave Posted April 2, 2016 RMweb Gold Share Posted April 2, 2016 Just been looking at the 'Going Home' set with LMS 5156 on the Rails website. The constituent parts of the set are front rank Hornby stock ,coaches of this particular era being a far better livery representation than the BR versions and the black 5 quite ,I think,visually striking in plain black LMS presentation . I am not normally drawn to Hornby's train packs but this one tempts me A word however of caution.Our war weary troops....my late father being one......would not have been greeted off their troopships by such a sparkling,gleaming troop train at the dockside on their way to dispersal and demob. Wartime and postwar trains were sadly grimy,grubby affairs....especially troop trains.Thus for authenticity,a job for our Toboldlygo might be in order. Still,I like what I see even though it's pure fantasy.What the hell....I am a war baby after all ! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold adb968008 Posted April 3, 2016 RMweb Gold Share Posted April 3, 2016 . Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
robmcg Posted April 3, 2016 Share Posted April 3, 2016 Much appreciated adb968008 that you have taken the time to show how to fix this issue with good photos and sage advice, Thank you. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
robmcg Posted April 7, 2016 Share Posted April 7, 2016 So I wish I could tell you I spent hours toiling away on this, but truth be known, it was 10 minutes all in. I decided to address the "dome" today, first off was to unplug the tender, and unscrew the loco's side tender screw. Then undid the screw under the front bogie. The chassis sits additionally in 2 lugs under the footplate, slide the chassis out. image.jpeg I put the body in a soft cradle, and put a screw against the lug, holding in the dome. Things to watch for... The sanders, the steps and the drivers windshields all protrude (the windshields are the easiest to catch as naturally the chunky bit to hold is the cab). I actually put the body upside down in a vice, with a piece of cork either side of the frame, by the smokebox end, and put another piece of cork under the boiler, incase the body slipped downwards onto the vice..causing a scratch)..it also catches the dome as it drops. image.jpeg Quick tap against the lug and out it pops. image.jpeg Turn it around, put it back in. . image.jpeg Put a tiny drop of glue onto a tip ( I have an old broken screwdriver for this stuff) and put it on the inside of the body over the lug. Put it all back together again, and job done image.jpeg Hi,I have received my 44696 and lovely it is, except for the dome. I have removed the body carefully, no problem, but the dome will not budge, not even with a 'quick tap', not with quite extreme pressure, and I am a bit scared about hitting very hard with a punch. I didn't make a cork cradle in a vice, I don't have a vice, I held it in the cradle of my hands whiole my partner delivered severe blows to the inside of the dome. Any ideas? I don't know about the suitability of the packaging cradle, but it is no longer the 'simple fix' I thought it might be. I wouldn't want to break any detail... 'A quick tap on the lug and it pops out', um, alas not even a quite brutal blows with a centre-punch worked. I have given up and put it back together without damage. Nice model all the same. Don't look at the dome! They say you have to understand failure in order to succeed... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold MikeParkin65 Posted April 8, 2016 RMweb Gold Share Posted April 8, 2016 A set of Alan Gibson wheels for the bogie will do far more for the looks of this loco than turning the dome around will Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold adb968008 Posted April 8, 2016 RMweb Gold Share Posted April 8, 2016 Hi,I have received my 44696 and lovely it is, except for the dome. I have removed the body carefully, no problem, but the dome will not budge, not even with a 'quick tap', not with quite extreme pressure, and I am a bit scared about hitting very hard with a punch. I didn't make a cork cradle in a vice, I don't have a vice, I held it in the cradle of my hands whiole my partner delivered severe blows to the inside of the dome. Any ideas? I don't know about the suitability of the packaging cradle, but it is no longer the 'simple fix' I thought it might be. I wouldn't want to break any detail... 'A quick tap on the lug and it pops out', um, alas not even a quite brutal blows with a centre-punch worked. I have given up and put it back together without damage. Nice model all the same. Img_0327a_r1200.jpg Img_0328a_r1200.jpg Don't look at the dome! Img_4141ab_r1200.jpg They say you have to understand failure in order to succeed... The dome is hollow inside, but has a solid Sprue end from the under-centre of the dome that fits into the hole. Try working away at that 'lump" a little on the inside with a small scalpel (or just twist/squeezing off with pliers a bit) Looking at yours it looks like that Sprue is a bit longer penetrating into the body than mine (may be who ever cut it off when assembling left a longer shank) .. Trimming that a little will probably unseat it a bit.. Giving it good tap should be ok.. That Sprue is solid... Put the screwdriver on it first and then hit (not whack) it with hammer. (Don't hit the hammer on the screwdriver first.. You might miss the Sprue !).. I used a 2mm jewellers screwdriver as that was the approx size of the hole.. Just incase it followed the Sprue through the hole but it didn't. I wouldn't resort to drilling the Sprue, you need the Sprue to put it back in. Good luck holding it in your hands, holding a precious body, close to my precious wotsits whilst my partner whacks it with a hammer isn't something I think I would trust my misses not to abuse the power of the moment ! It will come out though...all that's holding it is that Sprue. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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