Ronchatt Posted April 3, 2016 Share Posted April 3, 2016 Andrew Having second thoughts re the curve in the wall, there was no curve in the track from the foot bridge to the Cunliffe Rd bridge the OS maps make it look that way. But google maps definitely show a curve it must be bringing the wall in from the full width of platform 4 down to the end of the bridge. The bridge started right on the corner of Brook St and Railway Rd. Sorry about That Ron. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kingmoorkid Posted April 3, 2016 Share Posted April 3, 2016 Hi again chaps I'm looking at my plan here and could do with something checking, if anyone is going to be in Ilkley at any stage soonish. What I am wondering (and I don't have a good photo of this to check) is if the wall on the north side of the station (above Railway Road) is dead straight or whether it is curved very slightly in plan. The drawings I do have indicate that the wall began to curve southwards at about the point where the subway went down through platform 4 and exited through the bottom of the wall and out onto the street. Now - given that this section is within the overall roof, it seems a bit unlikely that the designers would have put a curve in the wall, as it would have made the roof a bit narrower at the western end and obviously a bit more difficult to construct. If anyone has a good photo of the Railway Road frontage or maybe inside the supermarket or on the old Platform 4, this might clear up this query for me. I've had a good search through my archives and I've nothing that is unequivocal in this area. Cheers Andrew I'm live in Ilkley Kiwirail - think the wall is dead straight but I'll go scouting with my camera tomorrow and post results. Might get some odd looks taking some snaps in Marks and Sparks though! Anything else you want photoing? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LMS29 Posted April 4, 2016 Share Posted April 4, 2016 (edited) Hi Folks, Thanks for the photos of the Foot Bridge, they were really helpful and I will try and detail my model to carry some of this extra information. As I remember it the from the late 50's early 60's both ends were at right angles to line of the foot bridge as shown in the photographs from the 80's. As I remember it the northern wall of the station is straight from the M&S corner all the way along past where the subway emerged along to the start of the coal drops. The wall does then curve away beyond the coal drops as shown in the drawing until it ends near the 'steps' up to the signal box that I photographed a few weeks ago. Ron, I also saw the T.P. and started to get excited, until I realised there was another one on the south side of the cropped drawing, still looking for the exact spot! Talking of photographs, if any one wants to model the roads to the south of the station, I do have photos of most of the buildings including the Station and Midland Hotels if that would help anyone. Tom Edited April 4, 2016 by LMS29 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kiwirail Posted April 4, 2016 Share Posted April 4, 2016 Tom et al You're right, it does look as though there is a bit of a curve there on Google. Need some eyes on the ground. It'll be interesting what Kingmoorkid comes up with! I'd be interested in any photos of the buildings around the top end of Brook St. My model will go up as far as the Grove, but not on the south side. I'm lacking information on the buildings on both sides of Brook St between the old railway bridge and the Grove. When I am next back in the UK I shall go on a fact finding mission, but until then, any shots of these buildings will help build a mental picture! Happy to fwd my email address if anyone wants to avoid cluttering this forum. Cheers Andrew Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kingmoorkid Posted April 4, 2016 Share Posted April 4, 2016 Tom et al You're right, it does look as though there is a bit of a curve there on Google. Need some eyes on the ground. It'll be interesting what Kingmoorkid comes up with! I'd be interested in any photos of the buildings around the top end of Brook St. My model will go up as far as the Grove, but not on the south side. I'm lacking information on the buildings on both sides of Brook St between the old railway bridge and the Grove. When I am next back in the UK I shall go on a fact finding mission, but until then, any shots of these buildings will help build a mental picture! Happy to fwd my email address if anyone wants to avoid cluttering this forum. Cheers Andrew Kiwirail, I went out this AM with camera - once I work out how to resize in Win 10 Photo editor I'll post. LMS29 is spot on with his description, the wall at the station is dead straight to the coal drops, which are set back from Railway Road, then it carries on on same line to a point just after the footbridge then it curves gently from a point opposite Golden Butts Rd towards the site of the old signal box but then kicks out slightly following curve of road. The buildings on Brook Street are pretty much as they were with a couple of additions where new premises have been built where the original bridge abutments used to stand, its still possible to see old adverts painted on one of the building ends. Think I'll have to revert to Win8 for resizing, I'm either daft or Microsoft seem to have eliminated the most useful feature in photo Editor with their latest 'upgrade'! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kingmoorkid Posted April 4, 2016 Share Posted April 4, 2016 Kiwirail, I went out this AM with camera - once I work out how to resize in Win 10 Photo editor I'll post. LMS29 is spot on with his description, the wall at the station is dead straight to the coal drops, which are set back from Railway Road, then it carries on on same line to a point just after the footbridge then it curves gently from a point opposite Golden Butts Rd towards the site of the old signal box but then kicks out slightly following curve of road. The buildings on Brook Street are pretty much as they were with a couple of additions where new premises have been built where the original bridge abutments used to stand, its still possible to see old adverts painted on one of the building ends. Think I'll have to revert to Win8 for resizing, I'm either daft or Microsoft seem to have eliminated the most useful feature in photo Editor with their latest 'upgrade'! Old computer comes to the rescue.... This is the view along Railway Road from point east of Coal Drops/footbridge showing curve in wall that follows the curve in the road. At the end it kicks slightly out. This is a view from effectively the end of platform 4 over the Coal drops. Lovely patna - a weathering challenge for you. This is the point where main wall ends at the coal drops. I'll sort some more pictures out of 'town' end showing buildings and more detail. Regards KK Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kingmoorkid Posted April 4, 2016 Share Posted April 4, 2016 Old computer comes to the rescue.... This is the view along Railway Road from point east of Coal Drops/footbridge showing curve in wall that follows the curve in the road. At the end it kicks slightly out. 001.JPG This is a view from effectively the end of platform 4 over the Coal drops. 003.JPG Lovely patna - a weathering challenge for you. 002.JPG This is the point where main wall ends at the coal drops. 006.JPG I'll sort some more pictures out of 'town' end showing buildings and more detail. Regards KK Dead straight I reckon.... Pointing West. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jamesas Posted April 4, 2016 Share Posted April 4, 2016 There are some very good arial shots of the station on the Britain from Above website http://www.britainfromabove.org.uk/image/epw024365 The wall is straight the full length of the platform and begins to curve just before the end of the canopies as the wall comes in towards Brook Street bridge. This is still evident today with the curve beginning just after the subway entrance in the direction of Brook Street Other pictures of the station on the site show the footbridge straight on springs lane and at right angles to railway road. regards James Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ronchatt Posted April 5, 2016 Share Posted April 5, 2016 Hi All I like every body else would have sworn the wall on railway Rd was dead straight . BUT one ting I have learnt from this topic, that memory can be wrong, which is why I checked on google maps. Every street view photo from Brook st to thee houses past Trafalgar Rd clearly show a slight curve in the wall from the old subway and the last 6 arches towards Brook St. The aerial photos also Clearly show it Back to the foot bridge, the plan shows the first bridge pier on the south side set back from the road and no wall, as I remember it from the 40s the wall is right up next to the pier and the steps at right angles to the bridge. could be the wall was built in the 20s or 30s to widen Springs Lane, just a thought. Ron Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LMS29 Posted April 5, 2016 Share Posted April 5, 2016 (edited) Tom et al You're right, it does look as though there is a bit of a curve there on Google. Need some eyes on the ground. It'll be interesting what Kingmoorkid comes up with! I'd be interested in any photos of the buildings around the top end of Brook St. My model will go up as far as the Grove, but not on the south side. I'm lacking information on the buildings on both sides of Brook St between the old railway bridge and the Grove. When I am next back in the UK I shall go on a fact finding mission, but until then, any shots of these buildings will help build a mental picture! Happy to fwd my email address if anyone wants to avoid cluttering this forum. Cheers Andrew Andrew, I have photographed the buildings that existed up the last couple of years, which as others have said is most of them, from Cow Pasture Road to the old railway bridge on Brook Street because I decided to model looking south over the station and could give you some information on some of the buildings that are missing. Easier to do off line as it means that I will not have to resize the photos. Let me know what you think. Tom Edited April 5, 2016 by LMS29 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LMS29 Posted April 5, 2016 Share Posted April 5, 2016 Old computer comes to the rescue.... This is the view along Railway Road from point east of Coal Drops/footbridge showing curve in wall that follows the curve in the road. At the end it kicks slightly out. 001.JPG This is a view from effectively the end of platform 4 over the Coal drops. 003.JPG Lovely patna - a weathering challenge for you. 002.JPG This is the point where main wall ends at the coal drops. 006.JPG I'll sort some more pictures out of 'town' end showing buildings and more detail. Regards KK Old computer comes to the rescue.... This is the view along Railway Road from point east of Coal Drops/footbridge showing curve in wall that follows the curve in the road. At the end it kicks slightly out. 001.JPG This is a view from effectively the end of platform 4 over the Coal drops. 003.JPG Lovely patna - a weathering challenge for you. 002.JPG This is the point where main wall ends at the coal drops. 006.JPG I'll sort some more pictures out of 'town' end showing buildings and more detail. Regards KK When I looked at the plan of the foot bridge posted earlier. I noted that there was a step in the wall between the coal drops and the start of the main station wall and a small building shown in this indentation. KK your photo shows part of this indentation and the ground appears to have been laid with stone blocks. Does anyone have any idea what this building was. You could speculate that it was associated with the coal drops when they were used to supply coal to the gas works but I have no recollection of a building there. Any ideas? Tom Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ronchatt Posted April 5, 2016 Share Posted April 5, 2016 Tom no memory of building or steps in the 40s. But Andrew, I would love a copy of that plan, where can I get a copy ??, every time you look at it some thing new shows up I hadn't even seen the steps and building until Tom found them Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ronchatt Posted April 6, 2016 Share Posted April 6, 2016 Tom Could the small building be a weigh bridge, looks like the one next to the bridge on the south side Ron. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kiwirail Posted April 6, 2016 Share Posted April 6, 2016 KK Thanks for the photos. It's great to be able to check details from the other side of the world! I agree that the view down Railway Rd shows a straight wall, but what really happens beyond the old subway entrance? We need a shot or two in the other direction This is the bit I'm interested in. I agree with the other posters who reckon there's a bit of a bend on this last bay. Certainly that's how it looks on the aerial photos and my ancient old plan. The problem with the Google car is that it drive in the middle of the road, not rather more helpfully along the footpath! If anyone else is after the plan I have (which is a work of art in itself, to be honest) I will set up a dropbox and post a link to it. I also have a version for AutoCAD if that'll help anybody. And - always conscious of hijacking your thread Pete, it includes the shed area too! Cheers Andrew Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LMS29 Posted April 6, 2016 Share Posted April 6, 2016 (edited) Andrew,I would also like to see the full plan, looking at the section you posted, threw up details I did not know and there may be more. I may even find the location of the tar loading point! Again conscious of Pete's thread.I could also post photos of area around station, if that helped.I will be in Ilkley in next couple of weeks and check the wall from subway entrance which is now blocked off and the eastern end of staton wall.Tom Edited April 7, 2016 by LMS29 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kingmoorkid Posted April 6, 2016 Share Posted April 6, 2016 KK Thanks for the photos. It's great to be able to check details from the other side of the world! I agree that the view down Railway Rd shows a straight wall, but what really happens beyond the old subway entrance? We need a shot or two in the other direction Capture.JPG This is the bit I'm interested in. I agree with the other posters who reckon there's a bit of a bend on this last bay. Certainly that's how it looks on the aerial photos and my ancient old plan. The problem with the Google car is that it drive in the middle of the road, not rather more helpfully along the footpath! If anyone else is after the plan I have (which is a work of art in itself, to be honest) I will set up a dropbox and post a link to it. I also have a version for AutoCAD if that'll help anybody. And - always conscious of hijacking your thread Pete, it includes the shed area too! Cheers Andrew I'll take a few photos tomorrow - the wall doesn't exist much further than shown in above photo its now an opening to a loading bay for M&S and a retail shop currently being converted to yet another restaurant - there must now at least 20 eating establishments in the town already. We seem to have hijacked the original thread but all adds to the general theme I think. KK Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kiwirail Posted April 8, 2016 Share Posted April 8, 2016 KK Yes - if you could get a shot equivalent to the one you took looking west, then I can get my eye right down that wall. On my plan there looks to be at least 500 mm of offset by the end, (so the station roof would be 500 mm narrower at the Skipton end than at the Leeds end). This seems a daft way to build a structure like that, so a bit of clarity here would be good. For the plan watchers, I just checked and my TIF version is 2.5 MB, which is too big to post here. Here's a MUCH smaller version: This does show the oil delivery pipe in the siding next to the signal box! Probably the best bet for anyone who wants a decent copy is to email me: andrew(at)tfel.co.nz Remove the antispam measure and replace with the @ sign. I'll send it out to those interested. I note that mine is stamped 1911, so that could explain the discrepancy between what you guys remember and what was there at the turn of the century. Cheers Andrew Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LMS29 Posted April 9, 2016 Share Posted April 9, 2016 (edited) Andrew, What I have found, whilst browsing are two photos that might shed light on where the wall starts to 'curve'. The first one taken at the time the rail was being lifted, suggests the roof was symmetrical and looking through the hole in the wall, suggests that the curving took place between the end of the station wall and the start of the Brook Street Bridge. The second one shows that the roof has six consistent arches at the other end of the roof. What I cannot find and KK may be able to help with is a shot of the end wall from the Brook Street end to show if the 6 arches are symmetrical from that side. Failing that I will have a look on the ground hopefully next week, Tom Edited April 9, 2016 by LMS29 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kiwirail Posted April 9, 2016 Share Posted April 9, 2016 Tom Thanks for that insight. Yes - I don't think that the 'curve' or 'narrowing' or whatever we want to call it amounts to very much, but it would be very interesting to confirm whether it is there at all. I agree that it does look like there might be a bit of a curve beyond the hole in the wall. What we need is somebody to buy an overpriced sandwich in M&S and have a quick peek along the inside. Mind you - it's free to take a walk down Railway Road and that should yield the same information! Ron - I will send you a copy of that plan when I am next at my desk. Cheers Andrew Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jamesas Posted April 9, 2016 Share Posted April 9, 2016 The curve starts at the 4th arch from the Brook Street end, this within the covered station area. It is not really possible to see this in a photograh as the change of direction is on the line of a down pipe. I suspect that the line follows a curve in the existing road given that these two platforms were added at a later date. The roof line at the opposite end is different and does not meet the side wall of the station in quite the same way. Link below is to an opposite end view of the wall. https://www.facebook.com/ilkleychat/photos/pb.518436761577943.-2207520000.1460206722./911728535582095/?type=3&theater regards James Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ronchatt Posted April 12, 2016 Share Posted April 12, 2016 Hello Folks First Andrew, thank you so very much for the plan, I will try to get it blown up as big as I can, so little changed in the first 60 years since it was made, then so much in the next 60. Tom. If you haven't got one do so, it shows the fog signal hut and Your tar delivery pipe. James . not trying to put you down but please remember that wall would have been started about 1885 . Most roads where nothing more than cart tracks in those times .most of Ilkley as we know it had not been started. The land for the Town Hall was not acquired until 1890 when a farm house and out buildings where demolished . so the curve in the wall was more likely due to land or a building owned by the church or aristocracy in the way, they were the only ones that could object to parliamentary permission, but even so You and me seem to believe the curve is there, but please folk check the edge of the curb the curve is much more pronounced there with no narrowing of the pavement Some of the info here came from the book : History & guide Ilkley by Mike Dixon published 2002 byTempus Publishing ISBN 0 7524 2603 6. Later Ron Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LMS29 Posted April 12, 2016 Share Posted April 12, 2016 (edited) Andrew, I have just returned from a visit to The Station. I am not sure if James had walked the ground, but I did and there is a definitely a small curve starting as James says around the 4th bay back from the end of the station. I did try and photograph it in the pouring rain and photo is attached. It shows the view towards Brook Street taken from the 'stoned up' subway entrance. Clearly there is a curve and at this point I estimate it to move in about a foot to the left before the end of the station wall. As I said earlier this curve continues to where the Brook Street bridge stood and this movement to the left takes away most of the width of Platform 4. The photograph in the link James posted does show that the left hand of the six ends to the station canopy is shorter on the left hand side than the rest and this might suggest some curving of that half of the outside section of the canopy. Again, this is clearly visible when I looked at it today. I resisted going into M&S to buy a sandwich but not sure if it would reveal any more! Ron, I did get a copy of the plan and have seen the tar pipe and hut......... good news! I also saw where the weigh bridge was situated opposite the goods shed in the station yard and so am amending my model again! I am currently trying to find out about the small rail crane that Greens used to load their logs onto the rail wagons. Can anyone help, please? Tom I did rotate the photograph on my PC, but it reverted on attachment, sorry Edited April 12, 2016 by LMS29 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kiwirail Posted April 13, 2016 Share Posted April 13, 2016 Guys Seems pretty clear from that photo. Thanks very much for all the various inputs. Weathering that stone wall is going to be a fair challenge! Cheers Andrew Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jub45565 Posted April 13, 2016 Author Share Posted April 13, 2016 Weathering that stone wall is going to be a fair challenge! Hi Andrew, It is an interesting mix of grey, green & yellow! Presumably it would have been a bit grimier in days gone by, or would the direction of weather help keep it clean(er)? I have made a bit of progress and hopefully will get something posted next week - this weekend is Scalefour North so I'll be taking my time to look at the scenic effects on Halifax King Cross, among others! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kiwirail Posted April 14, 2016 Share Posted April 14, 2016 Yes - and dependent on the time of year as well. Much more green on the north (Railway Road) side in winter. And like you say Pete, it may well have had a clean since the days of steam! Good to compare with the colour shots on the Embsay site. Be good to see what you've been up to as well. Cheers Andrew Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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