The Woodhead Route

[Wibble]

Couldn't resist a 83 degrees opposite view taken a few years later, albeit sad, a good comparison.... and duplicated from page 2 of this thread.

 

[Stentor]

On Grandad duty for the football last Saturday. The venue is in Gorton right next to where Reddish Electric Depot used to be.

 

This is the view from where I was watching 

 

Reddish 1.JPG

 

A screen shot of Google Earth. I was about where the pin is and the red line is the direction of view. The outline area is where the depot was and the inner rectangle is the approximate position of the building.

 

Reddish 2.JPG

 

 

Thanks for the update, a sad end to such a bold venture.

 

Do the road names of the new buildings acknowledge the depot or the heritage of the area or has it been completely erased?

 

Best regards

 

Simon

[Jim76]

It is a great pity the depot wasn't retained for Metrolink as originally intended, however this would have required the early conversion of the south east Manchester network to Glossop / Hadfield and Marple / Rosehill also as originally intended in order to be viable. It could have also linked up with the South Manchester line at Chorlton had a right of way been maintained in Fallowfield.

Edited October 15, 2017 by Jim76

[DJM Dave]

While we are on Reddish, I took some pics last year of the estate, the area of the start of the fan of tracks etc in relation to the houses on the estate.

 

They are on my Zenfolio if anyone want to look, under one of the ‘gone but not forgotten’ folders.

 

However, the reason I write is I have need for scale drawings of reddish depot and perhaps ancillary buildings and track layout.

Can anyone help?

 

Cheers

Dave

[Ramrig]

While we are on Reddish, I took some pics last year of the estate, the area of the start of the fan of tracks etc in relation to the houses on the estate.

They are on my Zenfolio if anyone want to look, under one of the ‘gone but not forgotten’ folders.

However, the reason I write is I have need for scale drawings of reddish depot and perhaps ancillary buildings and track layout.

Can anyone help?

Cheers

Dave

Hi Dave. Try Charlie Petty. If he hasn’t got anything he will probably know someone who will have what you require

 

Steve

Edited October 22, 2017 by Ramrig

[DJM Dave]

Cheers mate, I’m seeing him soon so i’ll Ask.

 

Thanks

Dave

[bennyboy]

While we are on Reddish, I took some pics last year of the estate, the area of the start of the fan of tracks etc in relation to the houses on the estate.

 

They are on my Zenfolio if anyone want to look, under one of the ‘gone but not forgotten’ folders.

 

However, the reason I write is I have need for scale drawings of reddish depot and perhaps ancillary buildings and track layout.

Can anyone help?

 

Cheers

Dave

 

I guess that's because you'll need somewhere to run the Class 76 model that you are going to produce?

[DJM Dave]

I guess that's because you'll need somewhere to run the Class 76 model that you are going to produce?

Who knows, I’ve been buying loads of slides off e-bay for the last year, and the Farish 40 would look nice whistling away on the depot wouldn’t it?

 

Never say never......to anything. ;-)

[Red Devil]

Some interesting 'late Woodhead' workings on this.

 

[forest2807]

Absolutely wonderful. I am about 9 years old again. I never wanted it to end. Thank you for posting.

[ColinK]

Glad you enjoyed my video. There are others under ‘ColinK’s Railway Videos’ on here: they are also on Vimeo, but their not so easy to find.

[leopardml2341]

Glad you enjoyed my video. There are others under ‘ColinK’s Railway Videos’ on here: they are also on Vimeo, but their not so easy to find.

Colin,

 

Whom did you use to have the films digitised - I have a some old Cine film, but I am unsure who to choose.....

 

PM me please?

[leopardml2341]

Some interesting 'late Woodhead' workings on this.

 

 

At 01:30 ish, there's a grey (unfitted) hopper in that train; as there is no brake van I assume it must be vac piped........

Edited December 20, 2017 by leopardml2341

[Red Devil]

Glad you enjoyed my video. There are others under ‘ColinK’s Railway Videos’ on here: they are also on Vimeo, but their not so easy to find.

I did, very much. Didn't know the originator was on here! Big thanks for sticking it on Vimeo in the first place.

[eastwestdivide]

At 01:30 ish, there's a grey (unfitted) hopper in that train; as there is no brake van I assume it must be vac piped........

I think there were some HTVs (i.e. vac-braked) in grey. Thought I had a photo but can't find one at the moment.

 

Edit: Paul Bartlett's got some here: http://paulbartlett.zenfolio.com/br21thopperweldrebody

scroll down to B420499 for example

Edited December 21, 2017 by eastwestdivide

[leopardml2341]

I think there were some HTVs (i.e. vac-braked) in grey. Thought I had a photo but can't find one at the moment.

 

Edit: Paul Bartlett's got some here: http://paulbartlett.zenfolio.com/br21thopperweldrebody

scroll down to B420499 for example

At one time I had a BR issued booklet of TOPS codes, but didn't remember HTP. Seemingly there were some:

 

http://www.solihullmrc.org/wagon_tops_codes.html

 

So that could be an explanation too.

[DJM Dave]

On Grandad duty for the football last Saturday. The venue is in Gorton right next to where Reddish Electric Depot used to be.

 

This is the view from where I was watching 

 

Reddish 1.JPG

 

A screen shot of Google Earth. I was about where the pin is and the red line is the direction of view. The outline area is where the depot was and the inner rectangle is the approximate position of the building.

 

Reddish 2.JPG

Not sure this helps, but a damn good modelling aid, showing an overlay of modern progress over reddish depot.

[E3109]

Clearly I've found this thread a bit belatedly, as DJM Dave and I seem to have similar ideas...

I've been scouring the net for a good while, for decent pics of RS. Took a few when it was being demolished in 1991, Including up on the crane and need to get these scanned and uploaded on Flickr to be honest. But for the moment they've helped me immensely.

 

What I would really like is if anyone has any shots of the western elevation of the depot after the locos vacated, my guess is that Dave will be after the same? The window layout is obscured by locos on most shots, although I've done my best!

 

Also interior shots would be a massive boost, especially of the offices, and the specialised workshops such as the pan room.

My mate used to visit Reddish regularly during operations (being a Stockport lad) and he told me there was a class 76 tapestry hanging up at the office entrance... Never seen any photos of that sadly.

 

Please excuse the political bit here, mods feel free to edit or delete if appropriate.

 

But the MSW closure and more to the point its destruction, is to my mind one of the most egregious travesties and worst examples of industrial vandalism ever to befall this country.

 

It was never a 'freight only' railway, it's just that it was decided it was by people who don't know a tapchanger from a Pandrol clip.

Do I blame Thatcher? No, not necessarily as she was clueless about our railways although her minister Ken Clarke was the man who signed its death warrant, aided and abetted by 'socialist' Barbara Castle some years earlier.

Add to that the M67 plan and it's game set and match.

 

Just remember that the MSW was the only 'freight' route that has ever been subjected to Closure Notice scrutiny and yes of course the findings were a whitewash, although to be fair I accept that 1981 standards do not apply now so I say this with the benefit of hindsight.

 

The point is, the route and its infrastructure should've been protected. That would've made reopening a damn sight cheaper and let's be frank, it would be used to the max now.

 

In a nutshell. Woodhead Tunnel No3 is lost. Bore the old ones out. Job done.

If I see trains from Hadfield to Penistone again in my lifetime, I'll be happy with that.

 

And if any Sustrans types object.......

Hmmm well the less said about them the better, perhaps.

 

Sorry for the rant, but if If those in power in Scotland can reopen the Waverley then we can do this.

 

Anyway. Back to RS, 9G, 9C....

 

Any photos most welcome. Dunno about you Dave but I'm content with a representation of Reddish. However, as it needs to stable 2x506 it still needs to be 400ft long.... I did think about making a smaller version but I want two units to fit inside!

[E3109]

I forgot to mention on the above post,

 

BR claimed Woodhead was losing circa £2m in 1981.

37 years on, £2m x 37 (years) = £74m.

Quadruple that for inflation, gives £296m.

 

Multiply this figure by three to allow for 'consultancy' fees and then add a few bob for safe measure.

Let's call it a round billion.

 

What would reopening cost in 2018 figures?

I'll go and boil my head now...

 

Anyway I look forward to 'what might have been' sessions on E3109's layout.

 

I already have an excuse to have 87s there (traction/power pack mods) during the 1970s so all is well!

 

My GG-1 already looks the part...

 

Incidentally did any DC Altrincham Units ever make their way there?

I know 304s, 504s and even ex LMS Merseyrail EMUs did, but at least the Alty sets could be panned up in anger.

 

Cheers

E3109

[Owd Bob]

I'll try and look through my really bad fading prints E3109 and see if i have any pics' of Reddish depot that may help you. Heres one from Guide Bridge in 1980-ish.

[Enterprisingwestern]

Is this the western aspect of which you enquire?

 

 

Mike.

[Dava]

This website by a S&T Engineer, P. Spowatt, has a very good series of pages on the Woodhead route and related locations, it's a new one for me.

 

The opening BTC poster of Woodhead says it all.

 

http://signalboxes.com/the-woodhead-route.php

 

Dava

[eastwestdivide]

...

After doing so it still made a profit of 1million so then they started to divert trains away from it to make it not economical to run and shut

...

To put an alternative point of view, the fact that they were able to divert trains away from it probably tells you all you need to know about (over)capacity on the various trans-pennine routes at the time.

[MarkC]

To put an alternative point of view, the fact that they were able to divert trains away from it probably tells you all you need to know about (over)capacity on the various trans-pennine routes at the time.

Exactly, and even 37 years ago, nobody could imagine the renaissance that the railways would have.

 

As for protecting the route, again, hindsight is a wonderful thing, but there's only really the 1954 tunnel that's been properly 'lost', and as we now know, this wouldn't be acceptable for modern 25kV anyway, so a new bore would be needed.

 

Potential traffic? Well, there's still no real residential development betweed Hadfield and Penistone, so there's no 'new' traffic to be gained there, and Hope Valley services seem to handle Manchester-Sheffield demand. There's also still spare capacity on that route, and as the raison d'etre for the Woodhead line in its later years, coal traffic, has almost completely disappeared, there's no need to supplement the Hope Valley with a rebuilt Woodhead line in order to carry freight - yet...

[eastwestdivide]

...there's no need to supplement the Hope Valley with a rebuilt Woodhead line in order to carry freight - yet...

Indeed - and if you look at the freight currently booked via the Hope Valley, the vast majority is to/from the Buxton area quarries or Hope Cement, not ideal candidates for a Woodhead routing. More return on any investment by installing more freight/passenger passing loop capacity there (and using longer passenger trains*) than a rebuilt Woodhead line.

Freight via Huddersfield seems to be about 12-15 paths a day (both directions included), of which 6 are between midnight and 6am, and freight via Hebden Bridge about 35 paths a day of which 10 between midnight and 6am. How many on either route actually run regularly I've no idea.

 

*I think TransPennine are due to double up to 6-car trains on the Hope Valley in the next couple of years as their new stock comes into use elsewhere.