RMweb Gold 57xx Posted November 30, 2016 RMweb Gold Share Posted November 30, 2016 I agree the suspension is very undernourished and the axle boxes look like roller bearings. But, why the comment about the roof end cappings. These had a clear strip which was bolted down. Precious few models make any attempt to show how the roof covering was fixed to the end. Paul Good spot on the axleboxes, Paul. I don't think they represent any type of GWR axlebox I've ever seen. Hopefully it's still fixable at this stage. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miss Prism Posted November 30, 2016 Share Posted November 30, 2016 Yes, I hadn't spotted the underside of the axleboxes - uurrrgghhh! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold gwrrob Posted November 30, 2016 RMweb Gold Share Posted November 30, 2016 Yes, I hadn't spotted the underside of the axleboxes - uurrrgghhh! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold 57xx Posted November 30, 2016 RMweb Gold Share Posted November 30, 2016 Yes, I hadn't spotted the underside of the axleboxes - uurrrgghhh! At least it should be "easily" fixable by removal of material from the mould. Would be a lot harder if it need material adding back in. He says simplistically with no mould making experience... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miss Prism Posted November 30, 2016 Share Posted November 30, 2016 Footboard aperture should be straight, not dished: Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miss Prism Posted November 30, 2016 Share Posted November 30, 2016 What type of axleboxes do Hornby want to portray? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold 57xx Posted November 30, 2016 RMweb Gold Share Posted November 30, 2016 What type of axleboxes do Hornby want to portray? It should be the 4.5" round-top axlebox IIRC. (with a square bottom) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hmrspaul Posted November 30, 2016 Share Posted November 30, 2016 (edited) It should be the 4.5" round-top axlebox IIRC. (with a square bottom) Agreed on type, perhaps the size needs checking? Because these don't have any long footboards they show the axlebox reasonably well. Sorry I don't have a close up [i think] http://PaulBartlett.zenfolio.com/gwrbrakevan/e24846f32 http://PaulBartlett.zenfolio.com/gwrbrakevan/e21f492ee Paul Edited November 30, 2016 by hmrspaul 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold tomparryharry Posted December 1, 2016 RMweb Gold Share Posted December 1, 2016 It should be the 4.5" round-top axlebox IIRC. (with a square bottom) It's a 10 x 5" box on a Toad. Size is incremental, depending on the weight of the vehicle, which in this case is 20 tons, spread over 2 axles. Ian. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold tomparryharry Posted December 1, 2016 RMweb Gold Share Posted December 1, 2016 Apparently not.... That's interesting. Both of the vehicles I see regularly have tube hangers for both leading & trailing positions. If you had to replace the angle variety, it would be a real pain, as they sit under the sandboxes, in their own recess. The tube variety are bolted external to the solebar, the reason being they go first, in the event of derailment. I guess that's a local C&W modification, done for reasons of expediency. The thing to remember about Toads, is that they had a long life, and as such, earlier models got upgraded as they went through works. It was quite common for an earlier van to lose its horizontal planking, and gain a steel sheet, up to verandah height. Brakes got upgraded, as seen in your photos, from solid brake shoes, to the split variety. Nice photos, btw! Cheers, Ian Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jjnewitt Posted December 1, 2016 Share Posted December 1, 2016 It's a 10 x 5" box on a Toad. Size is incremental, depending on the weight of the vehicle, which in this case is 20 tons, spread over 2 axles. Ian. Interestingly the BR 20T brake vans had 9" x 4 1/2" journals in the axleboxes. GWR 20T Toads did have 10" x 5" ones but I'm not entirely sure why. Size of the axlebox is incremental but it is related to total wagon weight when loaded. In terms of a brake van this is effectively the tare weight as there is very little load and 20T is less than a fully loaded 16T mineral weighs when you include the weight of the wagon. 16T minerals had 9" x 4 1/2" journals. Justin 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Porcy Mane Posted December 1, 2016 Share Posted December 1, 2016 (edited) And plenty of excuses for fitting non GWR axleboxes. Accepted that this is a Diagram AA21 Brake. P Edited December 1, 2016 by Porcy Mane Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jcm@gwr Posted December 1, 2016 Share Posted December 1, 2016 Interestingly the BR 20T brake vans had 9" x 4 1/2" journals in the axleboxes. GWR 20T Toads did have 10" x 5" ones but I'm not entirely sure why. Size of the axlebox is incremental but it is related to total wagon weight when loaded. In terms of a brake van this is effectively the tare weight as there is very little load and 20T is less than a fully loaded 16T mineral weighs when you include the weight of the wagon. 16T minerals had 9" x 4 1/2" journals. Justin Overweight guards? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Porcy Mane Posted December 1, 2016 Share Posted December 1, 2016 Overweight guards? No such thing as an overweight guard. BR chose some portly gentlemen as guards to increase efficiency (braking). P 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold 57xx Posted December 1, 2016 RMweb Gold Share Posted December 1, 2016 (edited) It's a 10 x 5" box on a Toad. Size is incremental, depending on the weight of the vehicle, which in this case is 20 tons, spread over 2 axles. Ian. On plate 17 in "GWR Goods Wagons" you can clearly see the journal size of 41/2" on the side of the boxes on the one at Didcot (AA15 68684). According to the later text (pp475-477) AA15's were a derivative of the AA11 and AA13 which had 8x4.5" journals on J hangers. Only the last Lot, 932 68501-600 had the RCH 10x5 journals with T hangers . Eitherway, I don't think I'll notice the 0.166mm difference in size Edited December 1, 2016 by 57xx Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miss Prism Posted December 1, 2016 Share Posted December 1, 2016 So, in effect, the Hornby as it currently stands (small box on J-hangars, and T-hanger footboard stanchions) is a hybrid between AA13 and AA15. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clive Mark Posted December 1, 2016 Share Posted December 1, 2016 I would still rather tackle these problems than scrape handrails off a Ratio kit, which if I remember correctly was a bit hybrid itself. I started scraping a Ratio toad side about thirty years ago and nearly finished that first side. With one or two rivets lost I just could not go on. Intense madness and boredom took over. No Archers rivet transfers in those days and Geoff Kent's rivet creation was uknown to me. The toad kit went in a bin eventually. I still feel "hallelujah" at Hornby's new development. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold 57xx Posted December 1, 2016 RMweb Gold Share Posted December 1, 2016 So, in effect, the Hornby as it currently stands (small box on J-hangars, and T-hanger footboard stanchions) is a hybrid between AA13 and AA15. No, the T hangers were referring to the spring hangers, not the footboards. It's not a hybrid, it's an AA15 from one of the early lots with small round top axleboxes that need altering so they have a square bottom instead of the round one they have. The statement that "Toads had 10x5 axleboxes" is incorrect - there were many different diagrams of Toad so you can't generalise like that, only later diags had the larger boxes as-built. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miss Prism Posted December 1, 2016 Share Posted December 1, 2016 Ok, thanks, 57xx. I need to check out the bible when I get back to it. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Porcy Mane Posted December 1, 2016 Share Posted December 1, 2016 (edited) Ok, thanks, 57xx. I need to check out the bible when I get back to it. Model Railway Constructor for May & July 1976 may also prove useful . Edited December 1, 2016 by Porcy Mane Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hmrspaul Posted December 2, 2016 Share Posted December 2, 2016 I would still rather tackle these problems than scrape handrails off a Ratio kit, which if I remember correctly was a bit hybrid itself. I started scraping a Ratio toad side about thirty years ago and nearly finished that first side. With one or two rivets lost I just could not go on. Intense madness and boredom took over. No Archers rivet transfers in those days and Geoff Kent's rivet creation was uknown to me. The toad kit went in a bin eventually. I still feel "hallelujah" at Hornby's new development. Oh dear, I always take a few bolts (rivets?) off plastic kits. Few wagons would retain all of them perfectly after a few years use. Paul Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Saunders Posted December 2, 2016 Share Posted December 2, 2016 My greatest dissapointment with the "New" model is that it has Eye Bolt suspension rather than the Single Link type, that appears on the one I would be modelling! Mark Saunders Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold gwrrob Posted December 3, 2016 RMweb Gold Share Posted December 3, 2016 http://www.gwr.org.uk/nobrakes.html A useful site with sample allocations to help rebranding. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rovex Posted December 16, 2016 Share Posted December 16, 2016 Now with some great images on the Engine Shed Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miss Prism Posted December 16, 2016 Share Posted December 16, 2016 Yes, a rather good article by Hornby, but I don't think any Toads ran with split-spoke wheels. 10-spoke I think was normal for 20T Toads. (I wait to be shot down as usual!) Nice to see the correction to the footboard apertures, and Hornby could make a fortune if they sold those s/c buffers separately. This is RTR of a very high standard. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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