Aberdeen Kirkhill T&RSD

[forest2807]

Fantastic work on the charter rake and the layout as a whole. Have you used transfers for the red/white executive livery waist level stripes or are they painted?

[Dunedin]

Fantastic work on the charter rake and the layout as a whole. Have you used transfers for the red/white executive livery waist level stripes or are they painted?

 

Thanks! I am rather pleased with the result myself, but the real test is what other people think, so your comments are very much appreciated.

 

The red/white stripes are by Fox Transfers - a bit fiddley to get them on straight, but I reckon they are easier than trying to mask and spray the stripes and certainly much quicker. I put the transfers on so that the white partially obscured the lower part of the bodyside windows and varnished them to fix them. I then cut the window apertures back out out with a craft knife with a new blade. Even then the stripes are very fragile and they tend to tear, so I touched them back in with matt white paint, re-varnished and the result is as you see. Very time consuming and more challenging than I first thought, but worth it in the end.

[Scottish Modeller]

Good evening everyone.

 

After a weekend at Warley followed by ridiculous amounts of snow in Derby, Glenn and I have managed to do some more fiddling for the layout.

 

Emphasis at the moment is on coaching stock and Glenn will have some photos for you all over the next couple of days with his little projects. In the meantime I'll let you have a look at the latest addition to the coaching stock fleet that was completed ten minutes ago.

 

Yes after exactly 6 months and one day since the last photo I can finally post a completed Mk2D BFK.

 

 

 

Conversion by me, main colours and stripes by Alex (Lochnagar), transfers and finishing details (white handrails) by me. Hope you all like it as much as I do.

 

For anyone who thinks we've just repainted an air-con BSO there is this photo.

 

 

Hi Flood,

 

Seeing the pictures of this coach set me thinking back in time...

 

Then I realised why - I had started the same conversion some 20 years ago on a demonstration stand at an exhibition.

 

Anyway - I had time today to dig in the loft and (eventually) found the exclusive box with 2 Airfix coaches cut into a good number of bits!

 

Will have to try and find the drawing now so I can work out which piece I intended to put where.

 

Inspiration to get something completed indeed!

 

Thanks

[Flood]

On 13/12/2010 at 20:31, Scottish Modeller said:

Hi Flood,

 

...Will have to try and find the drawing now so I can work out which piece I intended to put where...

 

Thanks

Check this scan out for the dimensions

 

 

These next two photos show where the joins are needed. Not many at all.

 

 

Edited April 4, 2022 by Flood

[Scottish Modeller]

Check this scan out for the dimensions

 

 

These next two photos show where the joins are needed. Not many at all.

 

 

 

Hi Flood,

 

Thanks for the photos and drawing...

 

Same start point as me then!

 

I've not done the cuts in the same positions though:o

 

Hopefully I can work it all out!

 

Back to the workbench then.....

 

I worked it all out and now remember why I didn't get any further:angry:

 

I cut the First class section 4mm shorter than I should have. This means that the brake end of the coach is too long and does not line up the windows with the seats at the join between First and Brake sections.

 

Good job I only paid 99p each for the coaches!

 

Ah well...

 

Back to the next box (hmmm - I still have 10 spare Mk2 FO!)

 

Thanks

Edited December 13, 2010 by Scottish Modeller

[P.C.M]

Thanks for the compliment Pete, I'm well chuffed with the result. Most people wouldn't worry about the windows (my excuse is the OCD). There's always the chance you could make it a little winter project for yourself, hopefully you'd manage to complete it quicker than I have.

 

I've always had a soft spot for the air-con FK and BFK coaches. Until I joined BR in 1985 I had 1st class free travel courtesy of my Dad so I enjoyed many a trip in one or the other down the West Country. A compartment first with correctly working air-con was always a very agreeable travelling experience.

 

All I need to do now is finally get round to moving the toilet windows in my four TSOs to make them Mk2Es and the Plymouth - Aberdeen rake will be finished (might just manage it by this time next year!)

 

I don't mind a bit of a coach hack so I might just give it a go. Keep us posted on how you go with the TSOs I wouldn't mind doing that conversion too, from memory it's only the one toilet window that you have to swap. I am not sure of the air cons used on the Euston Holyheads, from pics it looks like a mix of Ds and Es.

 

Merry Christmas Peter.

[Flood]

Two other points for you both. The internal length dimension for the Guard's compartment whether for a BFK or a BSO is 6 ft 9 inches, Airfix made it too long. This isn't too much of a problem on the BSO but when making the BFK the rear wall will be seen straight through a window unless the Guard's compartment is shortened to the correct length. Seeing as the brake interior needs shortening anyway it's well worth doing. Also there should be a length of 3 ft between the wall of the passenger accommodation and the wall of the Guard's compartment (in the vestibule at the coach centre). Airfix has made this too short.

 

On to the Mk 2E stock. Yes, you only need to move one toilet window. I've filled in the left hand toilet window on one side and cut a replacement for the other side out of a spare BSO body (you can use the windows in the brake section, you get four!). A few photos below of work so far.

 

 

 

 

 

I'm not that clever on the WCML or the Holyhead workings in particular but in 1988 you had the following for possible Holyhead diagrams:

 

Mk2D TSOs only at Manchester and all Cross Country allocated (20)

Mk2E TSOs at Manchester either West Coast (only 4) or Cross Country (19) and at Oxley for West Coast (39).

Mk2F TSOs also Manchester either West Coast (85) or Cross Country (only 😎 and at Oxley (114) for West Coast. There were also five based at Euston for Cross Country workings.

 

I'm guessing that Holyhead workings were West Coast allocated but I don't know for sure (and your photos may suggest they were Cross Country workings).

Edited April 4, 2022 by Flood

[Dunedin]

Many of the Holyhead services started from Euston which would suggest that they were West Coast - InterCity Cross Country was defined as the InterCity network which centred on Birmingham as opposed to London. I once saw a Mark 3 set on a Holyhead working at Chester, which again suggests it was West Coast.

 

I travelled to Holyhead on quite a number of occasions in the early '80s and all the sets I travelled on were Mark 2f - apart from one summer Holyhead - Euston working which was Mark 1s with a Class 40 as far as Crewe!

[Merfyn Jones]

I don't mind a bit of a coach hack so I might just give it a go. Keep us posted on how you go with the TSOs I wouldn't mind doing that conversion too, from memory it's only the one toilet window that you have to swap. I am not sure of the air cons used on the Euston Holyheads, from pics it looks like a mix of Ds and Es.

 

Merry Christmas Peter.

 

Yes Peter you will need to do the toilet window swap. Just found some pictures of stock on the Holyhead - Euston and the seconds are 2f and firsts 2e & 2f. Taken 1985/6.

Merfyn.

[Scottish Modeller]

Two other points for you both. The internal length dimension for the Guard's compartment whether for a BFK or a BSO is 6 ft 9 inches, Airfix made it too long. This isn't too much of a problem on the BSO but when making the BFK the rear wall will be seen straight through a window unless the Guard's compartment is shortened to the correct length. Seeing as the brake interior needs shortening anyway it's well worth doing. Also there should be a length of 3 ft between the wall of the passenger accommodation and the wall of the Guard's compartment (in the vestibule at the coach centre). Airfix has made this too short.

Hi Flood,

 

That appears to be the only measure and cut I did correctly!

 

Ah well....

 

Been back to the loft and now have a fresh pair of coaches for a restart on the BFK.

 

Mk2E TSO...

 

How about taking the coach areas off 2 BSO then rebuild with the join in the middle?

 

That way the toilet windows are diagonally opposite.

 

Thoughts?

 

Thanks

[Raffles]

I think that Brian Kirby has done just that.

 

I shall have a trawl of the forum to dig you out a link

 

UPDATE: Here it is, bottom of page 2 but the rest of the thread is a veritable mine of useful info. A definite keeper... ClicketyLink

Edited December 14, 2010 by Raffles

[BernardTPM]

Mk2E TSO...

How about taking the coach areas off 2 BSO then rebuild with the join in the middle?

That way the toilet windows are diagonally opposite.

 

That's what was done when they were first introduced by Airfix; the TSO took a few years to follow the BSO and FO.

[Flood]

As Matt and Bernard have said the two BSO method is pretty good. Brian kept the full length of one roof (as I have done on the BFK) and just replaced the sides, that way you don't get two air-con covers on the roof. You do get an extra set of the grills near the vestibules at one end but these can be easily removed.

 

I probably would have done the same but I'd already started the four TSOs years ago, using a fake toilet window painted on with microstrip edging, so replacing these with spare windows seemed just as good.

[P.C.M]

Thanks for the info on the Holyhead - Euston trains, I had a bit of a serch myself and found that MK2fs are most common. I think I will have to live with it though, I will try and do one at some point.

 

 

Cheers Peter.

[Flood]

For all of you who liked Andy's jigsaws last year I've sorted an Aberdeen Kirkhill one to waste your valuable time this weekend.

 

Merry Christmas to everyone who has contributed to the layout over the last one and a half years including those who have photographed it and those who have asked for it to go to an exhibition. Also a very Merry Christmas to all the posters and readers of this thread. We would still have run the layout without you but your praise has always been a huge bonus to our little project. Special thanks to Glenn, Alex, Richard, Bob in Scotland, Andy Y and all the guys at Rawtenstall.

 

Enjoy...

 

http://six.flash-gear.com/npuz/puz.php?c=v&id=3132737&k=25301240

[Bob Reid]

Watching this layout develop has been the highlight of my modelling year (yes I know it's predominantly coaching stock - quite sad really some would say) however it spurred me on to at least make a start on something for myself. That and the rolling stock conversion threads have been of great interest and I'm keen to see how you develop it in 2011.

 

Best wishes for the season to all of the Clayhills Kirkhill Team

[Mike Bellamy]

For all of you who liked Andy's jigsaws last year I've sorted an Aberdeen Kirkhill one to waste your valuable time this weekend.

Enjoy...

http://six.flash-gear.com/npuz/puz.php?c=v&id=3132737&k=25301240

Thanks Graham - even though I know what the layout looks like it still took me ages to finish and I forgot about the release of the Hornby info at midnight

 

Mike

[Flood]

Right then it's time for bed but just one last parting note...

 

Onwards with the Mk2E stock seeing as Hornby aren't going to make them for at least 2 years.

[Bob Reid]

Mind post your progress on here!

 

Merry Christmas

[Poindexter]

That jigsaw is evil!!! Kinda sucks you in so you HAVE to finish it. Merry Christmas flood and co

 

Guy

[Flood]

On 25/12/2010 at 10:43, Bob-65b said:

Mind post your progress on here!

 

Merry Christmas

Right then...seeing as there has been nothing on the tele all evening.

 

As shown before I had one TSO with the insert added and one without. The one without had had the section with the toilet window removed because it wasn't level (and, for some reason, the plastic had also become brittle and snapped when I was first cutting it out).

 

No problem, I thought, cut out a replacement. Did this tonight, the plastic seemed brittle as it was being cut and, you've guessed it, the replacement snapped.

 

To go along with this I needed some Roevac vents a few months ago for the BFK so started to cut some off this same BSO. The vents kept breaking up, all of them. Tried on another BSO, same problem. Took one off a TSO - totally fine. Something not quite right here.

 

Realising that doing the odd window wouldn't work I tried a whole side section of BSO windows (to add to another BSO) the result was as below:

 

 

Yep, brittle plastic everywhere.

 

I have managed a solution and that is to use the toilet window plus the door from this brittle BSO as per below:

 

 

With a bit of filler and a rub down there will be no problem.

 

What about the last two coaches that need doing? One can use the toilet and door from the other brittle BSO seen above. The last one can have the same treatment from another BSO but this time when I removed a Roevac vent from the roof it came off fine. The answer: the two brittle BSOs are Mainline ones, the other BSO and all the FOs and TSOs I've tampered with are early Airfix and GMR ones. It seems to me that the plastic used by Mainline was not as robust as that used by Airfix.

 

Probably worth noting by anyone else who wants to dabble with air-con stock. The BFK was made from two Dapol coaches and I had no trouble with that - I can't tell you what the Hornby plastic is like, I've never tried messing around with it.

 

Give me until the end of the week and I might have four Mk2E TSOs for either Alex's or Glenn's paint shop.

Edited April 4, 2022 by Flood

[Flood]

Yep you've guessed it. There has been absolutely nothing worth watching on tele for the last two days. I did watch Top Gear but, like the program from last Tuesday, I felt that it wasn't on par with previous episodes.

 

Anyway I've digressed. With nothing else to do I've had to resort to model making (or in this case converting). Here we have a photo of 4 Mk2E TSOs, all but the top one have been rubbed down and the altered areas painted white to show any blemishes. First viewings seem to suggest no refilling is required and very little additional rubbing down.

 

 

I'm also showing close-ups of two of the coaches. The first is from the first coach done with just the window area being altered. In this case two lots of filling and smoothing were required and the area near the door handle (which I wish to keep) is particularly hard to get smooth. I do need to just go over this area again and also by the top left hand corner of the toilet window.

 

 

The last photo is how the other three are all done, using the complete corner of a BSO with the vent above the toilet window being removed. These coaches have the other join through the centre of where the corridor connection will be added so this will be totally hidden. So mush easier to stick the new section in place and the door handle area is left unaffected. It looks like part of the rain strip needs to be filled so I'll check that tomorrow.

 

 

Rubbing down of the last coach will be done tonight, any tidying of all four coaches will be done tomorrow. Also to note is that the roof vents nearest to each toilet window have been removed. The end opposite to the air-con hatch has two vents but one is mounted on the roof centre line inboard of where the other vent is. The second coach up in the top photo has already been done and you can just see the revised vent to the left of the white paint at the right hand end of the coach roof. I very carefully use a very sharp knife to remove any vents that are not required off the roof so I can re-use them in new positions or on other coaches (eg late build Mk2C stock) as required. The other three coaches will have their vents sorted tomorrow.

 

After that it'll be taking them over to Glenn's and waiting a few weeks for them to be painted. Three will be in InterCity executive, one will be in blue and grey. Once I've added the transfers I'll show you all the finished result.

Edited April 4, 2022 by Flood

[Flood]

I quick update. We finally got the layout up and running last weekend for the first time since October and everything worked first time! There are about eight weeks to Nottingham Exhibition so we're mainly tweaking the sequence and making sure everything runs ok. I need to try to fit the Scottish Landcruise set into the schedule - the day coaches are easy but the sleepers could cause the odd headache.

 

Glenn has been fitting kadees to the last few coaches that need them, mainly the Inverness rake and a Mk2a BSO. I took the executive HST set home last weekend to get the stock numbered then I've only the other two sets to do plus one of the Kings Cross sleeper rakes and the Mk2e stock when it's painted. Talking of the Mk2e stock they are now at Glenn's for painting and lining. We're hoping they can be ready for Nottingham but only time will tell, the same goes for the last few ScotRail Mk2 aircons but we don't have a desperate need for any of this stock yet.

 

Alex is talking about making another 47 for the layout so I'll have a chat with him on Friday at the club about this.

 

Additional battery charger socket points and 'Not to be moved' signs will be added to the layout as time permits.

 

The layout should be in the April Railway Modeller which will be out about 3 days before the Nottingham exhibition so hopefully that will be good publicity for both the layout and the exhibition.

 

If anyone has any questions then please ask plus I'll try to give you photos of the latest stock as it's completed. Cheerio for now.

[Mark 37]

Well I just had to join this forum to congratulate you both on a fantastic layout. I thourghly enjoyed reading through this thread. Well done!

 

Regards,

 

Mark

[Flood]

Many thanks for the compliment Mark.

 

If you're anywhere near the East Midlands (or even if you're not) please come and say hello at Nottingham Exhibition on 19th/20th March this year.