Hornby dublo

[Great Eastern]

I've taken to using Wilko rattlers, 400ml  two for a tenner !

[Il Grifone]

On 06/07/2022 at 09:59, Great Eastern said:

Hopefully this will work this time, I was up til midnight last night typing this, and when I submitted it, it said saved, and then it all disappeared !!!!!!!!!!!!!!  (cut and paste from Word this time !)

 

Hi SR71,

Thanks for that, I’ve had good results from HMRS ones too, I’m quite partial to their Methfix ones.

 

Hi Il Grifone,

You’re right about the Wrenn bits nowadays, often pricey and hard to come by. I managed to get a Hoveringham 21t a while back from a swapmeet on the cheap, but I doubt I’ll be lucky enough to find another, (I’d like to get a bauxite one and Dublo-ise it too).

The Chlorine tanker is my plan B, its dimensions are pretty close, the 21t hopper, base type 20, is 12ft wb and 21ft 6in headstocks, whilst the Chlorine, base type 17, is 12ft 3in and 21ft 3in; that’s ok it just means that the Parkside Dundas Pipe wagon kit body will need a bit of fettling to fit (or scratch build one), but yes, good idea.

As regards the Tube wagon there are unfortunately a whole multitude of dimensional problems. There are various GW, LMS, BR types with different body/chassis designs. The Open C is a 15ft wb wagon whilst the GW O41 Tube is on a 19ft 6in wb chassis. Most BR types were 18ft 6in wb chassis whilst the Dublo base type 9 is 17ft 9in and was used for the tinplate Mink D, as you said, and also the SD horsebox and Fruit D.   Similarly, the headstock dimensions are out, most Tube wagons were 30 or 32ft headstocks, but Dublo’s is only 28ft. Then there is the issue of 4 plank / 5 plank variants plus strapping, doors etc it all gets a bit tricky, so I had to just compromise (like Dublo did) and do a representation of how I assume/guess Dublo would have done it using a plastic body on base 9.  So I’m afraid it’s not terribly accurate; more trying to be representative of models of that era. There’s a similar problem with the bogie brick wagon, the most accurate rendition of the period was the Triang one, put that on Dublo bogies (weltrol / bogie bolster) and it can look really good, but of course it’s not quite so Dubloesque as the tinplate chassis, (those Triang Bricks seem to be getting pricey now too !)

I’d be interested to see a piccy of your Kenline Mink D, it’s not a model I’m familiar with, sounds good.

You’re right about the Gaeity 062T !!!!! there’s a bit about it on p90 of the Dublo book, I have to say I quite like the coal in the bunker, although it does look a bit like nutty slack !!  Very interesting what you say about the Dublo chassis as regards HO,  given that it was Dublo’s first OO gauge model; because they couldn’t stuff it all into the HO loading gauge. Did it start out as HO and then metamorphosise ??   I’d assumed they’d rejected HO at an early stage, there were other OO models about by then, Bing Tabletop ??  it would also account for small wheel sizes pre-war, (but not the new, post war, loco types). A fascinating area to explore !

Sadly Humbrol GWR green is not one I’ve got / used, thanks anyway, I’ll keep looking.

 

Hi All,

Many thanks for all the likes, they are very much appreciated.

GE

 

 

My first attempt to reply has vanished into cyberspace so I'll try again! (Bl---y pop-ups!).

My theory is that originally they intended H0, but soon met up with the reason 00 was invented in the first place - 'No room for the works!'
There are no records of such a decision apparently, but there wouldn't be....
Bing is a case in point, Originally 'models' of German trains in allegedly H0 scale (if one can use the term with Bing!) they came to the UK in Red (MR), green (GNR) and Black (LNWR). The reply to the observation that they were rather overdimensioned was that they were to 4mm scale and we have been lumbered ever since....

My Kenline MINK D has long since ended up in landfill. It was one of a batch of five of the original series of kits that I bought: a MINK D, a 10ft wheelbase MINK (of generic diagram - so generic that it was also available in LNER livery), an LMS (ex MR) coke wagon, an LMS (ex L&Y) fish van (I gave up on cutting out the framing on this one!) and 2 SR open wagons (you got two open wagons or a van in a kit) an ex LBSCR 5 plank with curved ends and sheet rail and a 3 plank ex SECR open. I did finish this last one - first year of university (1965). I should have been studying but model trains seemed much more intesting than the mathematics of electrical engineering (or rather mechanical engineering, as it seemed that it was important that we electrical engineers should be able to design a bridge!) I was quite pleased with it, but on finding out later on that it was actually one of a batch of MR wagons sold off and used by the SECR as ballast wagons and the K's kit of the same thing was considerably better, this met the same fate as the MINK D.

Describing them as kits was being generous, as you got a sheet of stamped and printed card to cut out and stick together. I didn't realise you were supposed to peel the top layer of card and fold to make the ironwork so made a right mess of most of them.

The second series were rather better containing white castings for the strapping and better instructions, obviously at a rather less economical price.

Sorry I've been waffling on at great length (again!) so I'll shut up.

The range is illustrated here: https://www.vectis.co.uk/lot/kenline-freight-constructed-oo-gauge-wagon-kits_586506

£40 - £60 They must be joking! (I think these are the second series, but even so!) Don't rush but the auction is still running. It looks like they failed to sell at £5 each, but I'm not surprised - £5 for the lot maybe (for the castings, assuming they are the second series). I think they are as IIRC the first series came as a sheet of card in a cellophane wrapper and box states underframe fittings. The Slaters kit of the MR coke wagon is in a completely different league and Try the Ratio kits for LMS opem wagons (If you can find them they seem to have passed into the realm of 'collectable' too).

Sorry waffling again!

 

Edited July 7, 2022 by Il Grifone

[D9020 Nimbus]

At one time a number of German-prototype models were built to a scale of 1:82 — a number of Fleischmann models for example.

[Great Eastern]

Hi Il Grifone,

Thanks for the reply, most interesting to hear about the history of Kenline, I was vaguely aware of the name but that’s all. A lot of those old/early ‘kit’ manufacturers are relatively obscure today, so please don’t think you’re waffling, we need to record them, good and bad.  I bought some old Stelfox pre-grouping kits a while back, but as yet haven’t got around to assembling any. Thoughts anybody ??

Kenline sounds like one of the mediocre ones, the ‘companies’/individuals who produced some of these models were very varied of course. I’ve a couple of the old Q kit locos, which today can get a bad press; which I can completely understand, but to be fair to the guy (in Leeds I think ??) he was using a new material, resin, and at least he had a go. They do need a bit of mouth to mouth resuscitation however !!!  My LMS 10000 body was made with a resin with not quite enough hardener in it, (I think because there had been problems with cracking) so after 25 years (when I at last got around to making it up !!!) it was still sticky !!  however a coat of primer soaked that up ok. Come to think of it I must have bought that about the time I was at university.

I enc a piccy of a Bing Tabletop, from a while back, at the Museum of Power at Langford, Essex. Close to your stamping ground I guess.

GE

PS    Is it just me, or is anybody else freaked-out by that hideous Dachshund down the bottom ???

[Il Grifone]

Don't get me wrong, The Kenline kits were a good starter for those with the necessary skills (which let me out, though The sixth one turned out OK). It was just that the K's model was so much better, Their castings were excellent.

 That could be the same resin 10000 I have (one day I'll finish her - I've acquired two Tr-ang EM2 bogies for power and a set of steel numbers, so I can choose 10000 or 10001. An ID could be that the nose shape is not quite right. Life's too short to do anything about that! Back in the day, I 'copped' both of them in green, which did not suit them IMHO, so mine will be black. (The resin is fine, not sticky.)

The Bing stock will be the MR (or perhaps LMS?) version. You can see where Meccano Ltd. got the idea for their trackwork, even down to the weird yellow ballast. In all the miles/kilometres of railway I've travelled, I have never seen any that colour. Märklin used it too!

An impressive piece of French ironmongery in the background (Jouef?) and a Märklin 'thunderbox'. I have one of those and a Fleischmann version. Don't tell SWMBO (I have strict instructions to not buy any more trains! ??????????), but I just acquired a Märklin Br89 0-6-0T to pull them. She only wanted to go backwards, but that problem was solved by replacing the reverser with two diodes. I think it was only a bit of fluff stuck in the switch, but I have a thing about AC reversers and ruthlessly eliminate them.

And  a nice Hornby low sided wagon right at the back (BR version - I don't have one of those, but do have a GWR one.

Langford isn't that far away, but we are down by the Thames. We keep being informed on the internet that places in Kent are nearby, maybe as the seagull flies, but...!

Freaked-out and hideous are a bit strong for the dachshund, (we collect animals* as well as trains) but, yes!

* During covid we have added two (large) dogs and several cats. Some cats we had before and some just decided to move in, despite the dogs. Cats are supposedly good judges of character!

Sorry waffling on yet again!

Edited July 7, 2022 by Il Grifone

[Il Grifone]

Having just unearthed a box of treasures, I had to test them which raises a couple (or three) of queries (to avoid waffle just read the italics!).
Firstly a Dublo West Country - sorted the won't go caused by the wire to the tender pickups I'd fitted to convert her to 3 Rail (I couldn't/can't afford a 'Dorchester') not being connected, she shot off as if she'd been last run yesterday rather than several years ago. However I noticed the body securing screws are roundhead rather than Meccano Limited's (at least when they made her) preferred cheesehead.
Does anyone know if these are these original or replacements?
Next my 'Bristol Castle' (the one that hasn't suffered my youthful modifications), She ran perfectly too, (of course), but I noticed something I hadn't realised before, she has plastic bogie wheels and driving wheels with shiny tyres insulated on the RHS (i.e a 2 rail chassis). Was this typical of the last (i.e. pre ringfield) Bristol Castles or has she had a replacment chassis? The tender has metal wheels, so this is definitely 3 rail.

The name and number plate transfers are rather tarnished. Can these be restored or is it a case of new transfers or etched plates?
The 3-railed L1 was a little hesitant at first, but soon shot off like a rocket in the typical Tri-ang manner.

The other three treasures, still to test, are a Dublo 8F, a TTR 'Scotsman' and a green Tri-ang Princess, Watch this space!

Edited July 7, 2022 by Il Grifone

[Great Eastern]

Aaaaaaaaarrrrrrrrrrrgggghhhhhhhhh

The editor has just restored all missing text I lost at midnight the other night !!!!!!!!!

having typed it all in again from memory !!!!!

 

Sorry ! I do like animals, ornithology is another one of my interests. Also I've been adopted by a neighbours cat, (as you know you don't own a cat, it owns you !)

 

I have to say I'm a fan of K's, both locos and wagons. The metal wagons seem to run well with Dublo. I was doing mine as 10001, originally in black,then changed my mind and it's now green, but still unfinished !!!  I'll have to rustle up some pics so we can compare.  

 

My O gauge is all finescale, so mercifully I'm spared the joys of AC.  As regards SWMBO, take a leaf out of the ladies book with their dresses etc. When confronted about new trains; Oh this old thing ? I've had it for years OR I'm just repairing it/testing it for someone !  Especially convincing with aged stock from yesteryear!

 

GE

Sounds like a Denbigh loco chassis but Bristol tender.

Edited July 7, 2022 by Great Eastern
Addition

[Il Grifone]

It's true cats own you. One of our waifs and strays was so determined to come in that he spent two days on our front step. We thought he was a female at first, as a kitten turned up as well and they were huddled together on the step. They are now both members of the family. He is 'Whiskers', as he has a really magnificent set and the kitten is 'Dylan'.

 

The distaff side of the family (wife and daughter - both consider themselves SWMBO!) just considers the trains as 'His junk!'

 

We have the Italian crow with grey on the shoulders, the Sardinian warbler and the occasional griffon vulture. These breed not far from us but are not seen very often.

 

Yes it's a 'Bristol' body (and tender) on a  'Denbigh' chassis. I was wondering if it's an official Dublo clear out or spares put together, possibly by someone like 'Hattons'. I'll whip the tender body off and inspect the soldering as she also has two wires connecting loco and tender.

 

I was going to do my diesel as 10001, just to be different and leave space for a Kirdon 10000.... It's another on the 'To do; list.

 

Dunno what happened there! Iit all greyed out and then disappeared. Luckily the editor had saved it!

 

P.S.

The mystery deepens! Inside there is a modernish two pin plug and socket and one wire is soldered to a tag and bolted to the tender floor through the rivet hole (normally holds tender floor and sub-frame together) and the other is connected to the pickup plungers. It looks like the last owner put some spare parts together. It came from eBay 15-20 years ago so anything is possible. It does make a two rail conversion quite easy.

Edited July 7, 2022 by Il Grifone

[locomad2]

4 hours ago, Il Grifone said:

Firstly a Dublo West Country - sorted the won't go caused by the wire to the tender pickups I'd fitted to convert her to 3 Rail (I couldn't/can't afford a 'Dorchester') not being connected, she shot off as if she'd been last run yesterday rather than several years ago. However I noticed the body securing screws are roundhead rather than Meccano Limited's (at least when they made her) preferred cheesehead.
Does anyone know if these are these original or replacements?
 

 

My 2 rail Barnstaple has 2 cheesehead brass  body securing screws just under cab and a long chimney screw at the front almost sure these are original 

[MikeCW]

I haven't posted on here for quite a while but David's comment on the affordability, or rather lack thereof, of a H-D "Dorchester" prompted me to provide photos of my example.  This was an original "Dorchester", with box, which I bought from Hattons, less VAT plus pre-Covid postage, for 68 GB Pounds.   But there were several problems.  The engine had been converted to 2-rail, "detailed" with real coal on the tender, vac pipe though the front buffer beam, and Wrenn bogie wheels, and had suffered some other brutalities. It was also filthy. But with cleaning and careful, minimal cosmetic restoration (such as Dublo-style lining transfers on the cylinders), an original 3-rail pick-up, mild mechanical overhaul, and the swapping of some parts with my other more "restored" H-D and Wrenn West Country Pacifics, I have a near-original "Dorchester" on the shelf at a budget price.  The one major departure from stock (as the Americans would say) is that the locomotive retains insulated drivers on the RH side.  I broke the insulation by drilling through the insulated bush and driving a brass pin between axle and wheel,  This can just be made out, under zoom, at the 1 o'clock position on the rear driver in the last of these three photos.  I have no intention of passing it off as an unmolested example and have a piece of paper in the box describing its provenance.

 

If anyone's interested I can put up some photos of some other Dublo restorations and repaints.  Some are recent, some may have been posted here a few years ago but have been lost in the great cataclysm. 

 

Mike

 

 

 

 

[MikeCW]

"Launceston" is a conversion of a 2-rail Hornby-Dublo "Barnstaple" to 3-rail.  The engine was bought on the local internet auction site for the equivalent of around 50 GB Pounds.  At some time in its life it had received etched nameplates from, I suspect, Fox Transfers.  That, and the fact that it ran, were about the only good things to say about it, as can be seen from the photo which accompanied the auction listing.  The seller wasn't even sure which way round the tender should face.

This one required more than a sensitive cosmetic make-over.  Getting out the heavy duty paint stripper was the first step towards a complete repaint. Surprisingly the tender body and paintwork were in good shape.  So I simply cleaned the tender body and donated it to the "Dorchester" refurbishment described above.  I repaired and repainted the tender body from "Dorchester" and used it in this much more thorough-going restoration. 

 

Herewith the finished article: 3-rail pick-up fitted; insulation broken on the driving wheels as on "Dorchester" above; magnet turned 180 degrees for "right way" running; remagnetised; cleaned and serviced. Machine screws and hardware were polished and chemically blackened if the original nickel plating was completely degraded. The engine and tender received a complete repaint with my own brew of BR green.  The basis is a locally produced gloss enamel called, I recall, "Forest Green".  As this is a slightly yellow shade I add Royal blue, drop by drop, until I get a match with the Hornby-Dublo paint.  This mix has served me well for several repaints of "Castles" and "Duchesses".  Stainless handrails, Fox lining and etched nameplates and a spray of satin polyurethane completed the restoration.

[Il Grifone]

I've seen tenders ars back to front in model shops before now (I will name no names, but they used to be everywhere and then went bust (probably because they were full of useless plastic kits?)).

 

I've 3 railed a fewf 2 rail Dublo locomotives. and find  a single phosphor bronze strip behind one of the driving wheels to be quite adequate and if located with care does not result in any permanent alteration to the model. It only stalls on the dead closure rails of pointwork so any break is momentary. I did think about making the closure rails live using the switch in isolating points, but decided life is too short!

 

To continue the saga of the treasure box I thought I'd try the Trix 'Scotsman'. This still has the Trix reverser, because 1. it works! (For once) and 2. the neutral position is used fot the tender uncoupling device. Trix claimed it would uncouple anywhere on the track, forgetting the proviso, "Except where you want it to!"

The sequence is rather bizarre. Every time you stop,  the reverser clicks on one postion forward- uncouple- reverse-uncouple. forward and so on. To stop and then continue in the same direction you have to leave the power on, but stalled!  The brush tension should be set so the locomotive will only start with six volts. They are not quite as critical as Dublo, but it does mean they can't be 'fine tuned'.

Märklin's reverser is more logical and reliable. It uses an overvoltage pulse to step the reverser. You still don't know which way it will go though. All this nonsense is why I modify them to DC using diodes!

Anyway she set off happily (once I realised I hadn't turned the mains on), so I passed her as OK.

The timer has just gone so I can eat my lunch and then try out the Blu-ray player that has just arrived from eBay.

Hi-Fi/video - another expensive hobby!

Edited July 8, 2022 by Il Grifone

[Great Eastern]

Hi Il Grifone,

Apologies if you already know this, but it was fairly common practice among some retailers to swap bodies of Dublo locos depending whether you wanted 2 or 3 rail bodies; as long as they thought they could flog what was left, I remember such discussions as a child in model shops. As yours is a mixture I would suspect it has been changed later. There were late ones done for Beatties which had stickers on the box saying 2 rail Dorchester for Beatties or whatever. I've got a mint 3rl CoBo with a 2rail chassis I bought in the 60's with a handwritten masking tape label saying 2rail. There were some strange things back then, I remember we went to a blokes house in Kent or Sussex to look at a mountain of Dublo stock; he'd either bought out a shop or more likely bought from Mecanno. He was some sort of businessman but not a Dublo man, he marvelled at the padding moulded on the inside of SD horsebox door for example!!  Hattons of course had loads of stock, I bought new SD carriages from them in 1989, and bauxite Presflos etc !!

 

I enc pics of my Q kits 10001....

1  Black and silver showing body as moulded roof detail and nose shape, (to compare with yours).

2  My modifications to the roof, panelling and etched grille. (Some panels tended to be a bit squiffy in the resin moulding).

3  Repainted in green (just because it fits in with the era I model most, but you're right they did look good in black and silver).

4  On bogies, I used a Mainline Peak mechanism with the Q kits sideframes. 

Still not finished as you can see.

Also Q kits came with a really good strong brown cardboard box with big staples. It's big enough to keep the finished model in (something some other manufacturers failed to do !!) and quite distinctive if you've got it.

 

Another of my never ending projects is a Trix Scotsman, the later 70's era Liliput one, changing from LNER to BR, as it was rather knackered. 

 

On another note how do you get your piccies to be in the middle of the text, all mine are down the bottom. I can't find any instructions (for anything really !)

 

 

Ornithological section :

Had a good morning in the East Anglian sunshine cycling and bird watching; lots of skylarks in a fallow summer field, lovely !!  Many buzzards these days, perhaps the grey squirrel population helps ? One buzzard being mobbed by rooks.  Also a pair of linnets (long time no see !) and a flock of goldfinches, (maybe a family).  Saw a fox, quite dark markings, he didn't see me to start with and I followed him for a short while, (I wear camouflage). Also attacked by some woman's mongrel; dachshunds revenge no doubt !!!! 

Don't know the Italian crow; is this related to the hooded ? or some other corvidae ?

 

GE

 

[Great Eastern]

Hi MikeCW,

Excellent work sir !   A couple of questions if I may :

 

Your paint finish is superb !

10 hours ago, MikeCW said:

The basis is a locally produced gloss enamel

may I ask what this is ?  Also your satin polyurethane has a  fine/sheer look.  I've found some can be a bit viscous (droplet size can be a bit big) and therefore the surface finish can be a bit thick and uneven. Which one do you use ? (aerosol ?)

 

How did you do your chemical blackening ?  I read a report in an engineering mag a year or two back where they tested various jollops, their conclusion was that heating bits up and quenching in used engine oil was nearly as good as the better jollops, (and free) any thoughts ?

 

I agree with you, stainless wire is a good option, and permanent. Can I ask which paintstripper ? I use Nitromors on Dublo bodies (also B&Q version) it seems very successful. Like an idiot I tried it on a plastic body once, Derrrrrrr!!   An old Jouef class 40 body.  Then I discovered the marvellous Dettol ploy !  and haven't looked back.

GE

 

PS  Do you know how do you get your piccies to be in the middle of the text, rather than all down the bottom like mine ?

[Il Grifone]

My memories are of a more insipid paler green with a broad pale cream stripe, which would explain my dislike. The dark green actually looks very good.

 I remembered afterwards that Hattons for one, offered Dublo locos with the bodies swopped (at a premium of course - Dublo locos were expensive to start with, especially the rebuilt West Countries). Mine could well be one of these. I could even have done the three rail conversion back in the mists of time and forgotten about it. I do keep records of my stock but the earlier ones  rely rather too much on memory (never my strong point and it hasn't improved with age!)

I'll have to see if I can find mine and post a picture

The Italian crow is I believe the hooded crow corvus cornix. Here in the UK it is quite rare (at least I've never seen one). In Italy it's the other way round! I believe they are actually variants of the same species as they can interbreed. The Italian version has grey on the shoulders. Again, when I return at the end of next week,I'll see if I can persuade one to pose for its portrait  (though probably it will require a better camera than mine).

The Blu-ray worked (as it should have done -it was sold as working) (Donna Summer CD, Avatar DVD and Zootropolis Blu-ray) Now I need a remote. A genuine LG one is likely to cost nearly as much as I paid for the player! For now, I'll fall back on my trusty universal 'ONE FOR ALLl'

Incidently the rebuilt West Country is one of the few designs where the return crank leans backwards with the coupling rod at the bottom, as can be seen here: https://upload.. Dublo got this right. The Trix Scotsman is a bit undecided, but as the chassis comes from a German Pacific.... (Br01 IIRC  - it states 'Foreign', which fools no one). Tri-ang have one forward and one back, which would result in the poor thing internally haemorrhaging. Even now, having acquired the Hornby name, they still get it wrong!

I must refit the blinkers to my West Country before they get lost (again!). She had been thickly covered in green sludge before I got her. This was remedied at once, but I have still to add the lining and 'Bodmin' plates.

Edited July 8, 2022 by Il Grifone

[SR71]

34 minutes ago, Great Eastern said:

PS  Do you know how do you get your piccies to be in the middle of the text, rather than all down the bottom like mine ?

 

Hi. Type your message. Load your pictures. Pick where you want to put your picture to go in the text. Put the cursor there and insert (click) the picture you want. I find it best to put a line in before and after (before inserting the picture) to stop the picture attaching  to the text.

 

Enjoying reading the stories of restorations and resurrection.

[Great Eastern]

Hi SR71,

Thanks for that I'll give it a try.

Sorry for the delay in replying,  I've got a page/forum about my DP1 query and I've been trawling through the replies.

I guess you're an aircraft guy, if it's of interest I've seen an odd thing twice in the last 6 months or so, on the Suffolk/Essex border.  A procession of B52's and B1 Lancers at altitude (30 to 40,000 ft) with tanker support heading  due west, I presume stateside. They are spread out, not in formation, like they've taken off and just gone. Maybe an exercise or maybe making airbase space for something else.  Also seen an Atlas at lower altitude heading east !!

 

Hi Il Grifone,

Perhaps the 10000 livery was when they had the primrose yellow roofs ?? or pale blue stripe ??

I've not seen a hooded crow here either, mostly rooks !!!!

 

 

Edited July 8, 2022 by Great Eastern

[MikeCW]

3 hours ago, Great Eastern said:

 A couple of questions if I may :

Thank you for your kind comments on my work.  It doesn't always go according to plan but I seem to get there in the end.

There's nothing original about my approach. Pretty much all my repainting of H-D BR Green engines is done with good quality, domestic gloss enamel, apart from the black for cab roofs, smokebox, running plate etc which is Humbrol enamel No 85.  The latter have disappeared from the shelves as we know but I still have a couple of tins in stock.

 

 

On the left is the "Rainforest Green" which I let down slightly with the "Royal Blue" to make BR Locomotive Green.  The polyurethane happens to be the brand I'm using at the moment - an Australian-made product available through the local home improvement store.  (I'm in New Zealand and these brands are unlikely to be available in the U.K.)  All these are traditional enamels and thinned with regular mineral turpentine (including the Humbrol paint). 

 

Most of the time I don't bother about a primer.  But if the body casting is really pitted then Tamiya fine primer in a spray can is my choice. The base colour  is sprayed with an airbrush, a Badger "Patriot"; the black is brush painted with a quality synthetic brush.  Larger areas of black, such as tender chassis, are sprayed.  The paints are mixed in a small jar and screened through fine mesh to remove all lumps and nits.  The mesh is life-expired nylon tights donated by my wife. If the paint and varnish won't go readily through this sieve, then it's too thick.

 

I thin the paint using a trick I read many years ago. The jar in which the paint is mixed and thinned has a lid.  Thinner is added bit by bit.  At each step the jar is capped and shaken and only when the sides of the jar start to run clear as the paint settles after the shaking is it thin enough to spray.  This can seem much too thin but it works every time for me.

 

I spray at about 30 psi on a fine spray setting, taking my time and steadily building up colour.

 

After the transfers for lining and numbers have been applied - either Dennis Williams/Dublo Surgeon reproductions, or Fox Transfers "scale" transfers - I varnish with good quality domestic satin polyurethane. Depending on how thick the well-stirred varnish is straight from the can, I thin it from 30% to 50% with mineral turps.  I let this varnish coat harden off for a week or so before fitting handrails.

 

Chemical blackening is with Birchwood Casey Super Blue, used on firearms and available in the UK from "outdoors" stores.  It works cold but even better if the item to be blackened is warmed up.

 

There is one more restoration process I have used on H-D engines - nickel plating.  Another interest is vintage motorcycle restoration and I have the ability to nickel plate steel at home.  It is a faff to set up the "plant" for a couple of bits of wire but I have done it on this "Castle".  The nickel plating on Dublo valve gear can be very thin and wears away to reveal the brass as on this Romford-fitted example I restored.

 

I decided that it would annoy me every time I looked at it and that it had to be re-plated.  Herewith the result.  I added only a few microns as I didn't want to seize the crosshead/con rod joint.  I think it looks better.

 

You can see in the top photo where, on this engine, "Launceston Castle", I have broken the insulation of these early Romfords at the rim.  This is very noticeable in the photos but not at all visible in practice. "Launceston Castle" was a battered, 2-rail, non-runner, already fitted with Romfords, which I brought back from the brink and converted to three rail.  If I can find a decent photo of the finished project I'll post it here.

 

I hope this answers your questions.

 

Mike

 

 

 

 

 

Edited July 9, 2022 by MikeCW

[MikeCW]

Found them!  "Launceston Castle" was another cheap buy from Hattons.  It was painted in an odd olive green shade, fitted with Romfords and those old-school Jackson bogie and tender wheels which, as always, were missing the plastic spoke inserts.  Rusty handrails were in the plain brown box and "Launceston Castle"  nameplates were stuck to the motor magnet (!?).  I kept the Romfords but replaced the bogie and tender wheels.  It was a non-runner and the restoration would take too long to describe.

 

It runs through Dublo points but would be, and look, happier on a layout with more sweeping curves and l larger radius turnouts.

 

Ignore the two-rail track in the photos of the finished article.  The engine was parked there for the photo-shoot. When the photos of the restored model were taken it was awaiting 3D printed decal numberplates from Railtec, since fitted.

 

 

 

 

The replacement wheels show to advantage just how good this model was for 1958.

Mike

 

Edited July 9, 2022 by MikeCW
Better photo found

[Il Grifone]

The plastic inserts were a later add-on at an extra price* and not always available they sort out the spokes but have a tyre that is much too thick. I think Romford driving wheels were designed for H0 as they have too many spokes, (What is it with manufacturer's and their surfeit of spokes? I would have thought that 'less is more' here as the more there are the more they cost to produce.) I believe they are also a bit thicker than BRMSB dimensions** (they date from before their publication IIRC), which is probably why they can negotiate Dublo pointwork (a pernicious beast where the gauge widens considerably at the tip of the point blades - a result of faulty geometry). The curved stock rail is continously curved and the straight one is (obviously) straight. Once we get to the blade tips (about an inch in) the gauge has widened by about 1.5mm which allows 'scale' wheels to drop in. A recess in the stock rails to take the blades (also bad practice) does not help. Pre-war points*** have longer baldes and this problem does not arise (the gauge widening is rather less). I have tried taking a pair of pliers to the rail and bending it inwards a bit, but there is little room to manoeuvre as the blade throw is quite precise.

* At 1/4d for rolling stock a shot they were expensive enough to start with! There are at least two variations in axle diameter 1.9 (14 SWG?) and 2mm The Peco Insulaxle (still available they mut hsve large stocks! is the original (and long obsolete) 15 SWG specification (bike size - spoke cheap and guaranteed straight) and nowadays fits nothing. (I could rabbit on, but will refrain at this point! If anyone is still reading that is!)

** 2.5mm thick - 2mm tread and 0.5mm flange. Not reallt 'scale', the real thing is 5" in the UK (at least in the period most of us model) : Europe uses something metric obviously).

*** If you can find any in the first place and free of zinc pest in the crossing in the second. I did make one a new crossing from spare rail, but it is yet another unfinished project, (I have boxes full of these!)

Now shut up Grifone and flap off back to your nest in the mountains!

Our Griffons are rigorously protected by people as fanatical about them, as we are about trains, See link below - a knowledge of Italian helps, but the pictures are good! Occasionally we do manage to see one. I have a photo, but, by the time we had found somewhere to stop, it had flown quite a distance and is just a speck on the horizon. I know it's a griffon, but....

Two flew over once (no camera obviously); magnificent creatures, they were just using the tips of their wings to fly!

 

Edited July 9, 2022 by Il Grifone

[Il Grifone]

Just to finish off the testing saga (just skip if you're not interested!)

Reloaded Donna Summer (on the NAD CD player this time*) and tried the 'Princess Elizabeth' She seemed a bit 'dry' and would only manage about 125 mph (scale of course). A quick mini-service (read oil-round) soon fixed that!

Then the *F (one of my few engines bought new, but it was half price in the early sixties!) No problems her (she is Dublo after all) but she does go the wrong way! This is probably a relic of her two rail days. I'll leave it alone as I may convert her back again. I did notice that her pony truck has Tri-ang wheels. That will be sorted!

* No rubbish here! This came my way with intermittent skipping, but a nice new Sony laser fixed that. I would have thought NAD would have used something better (I must have replaced dozens of the wretched things over the years!) but I suppose they have to cut corners somewhere to keep the price down. There appears to be a steady supply of b**l-s**t after market replacements for the two pre-power jumpers in the matching amplifier. Good solid devices, I can see no valid reason to replace them, but snake oil has always sold well. One consisted of two phono/RCA plugs ( OK gold plated!) joined by a piece of wire (No screening or connection on the deck side!) There is no way this can possibly make any difference and, even if it did, the price charged is exorbitant - 4 plugs and two bits of wire - a couple of quid at most!

For anyone (no one?) who is interested there is a picture here:

https://audiokarma.

and a load of guff!

[MikeCW]

I confess that I've never seen the plastic inserts for Jackson bogie and tender wheels "in the flesh".  I recall an article in the model railway press, perhaps in the 1960s, suggesting that the rim of the plastic inserts could be cut away between each spoke, effectively lengthening the spokes and doing away with the over-thick look of the tyres when the plastic inserts were used "out of the box".

 

On track matters, I thought at one point that I might make a simple circular 3-rail layout using Peco Code 100 track and points to avoid the fearsome radius and other disadvantages of Hornby-Dublo's 3-rail pointwork.  I went so far as to build a test bed out of recycled track to prove the idea.  It works well but age and too many other projects have effectively overtaken the idea.

 

Mike

 

   

[Il Grifone]

No great loss!

I've tried cutting the plastic tyre off, but it's very fiddly and the spokes tend to break off the hub. I have also tried just gluing plastic strip to the spokes and gave up through sheer boredom and the end result wasn't very good as the spokes are really too wide as well as too shallo copled with the thick internal flange on the tyre. Filing this down is a definite no-no, since better wheels are available (e.g. Hornby - at least until they priced themselves out of the market. At less than £3 for10 wheelsets, they were a bargain, but at nearly £20 (I've seen them even more!) they have ceased to be Grifone friendly!

 

Way back in the distant past, Peco did a centre rail for Streamline IIRC. Their stud contact strip lasted rather longer (and maybe is still available?). Maybe if Dublo had copied Märklin and gone for stud contact  they may have been more successful? or maybe not.  They had serious problems in the late fifties. Smaller houses had meant no room for gauge 0, Meccano was losing ground to Lego (I still don't understand why (new generations too lazy to do the job properly with nuts and bolts?), slot racing was hitting sales of trains (again a passing fad, but fatal) and the arrival of Mettoy's Corgi Toys hit Dinky  hard. (Even Tri-ang failed here!). I'll gloss over the rest ofthe demise of Meccano Ltd.. There is also a whole thread on it already

 

There is a snag with 3 railing 2 rail pointwork. The collector shoe shorts to the running rail on pointwork (unless you induge in obscenities like plastic frogs).

Edited July 9, 2022 by Il Grifone

[Hroth]

1 hour ago, MikeCW said:

 

On track matters, I thought at one point that I might make a simple circular 3-rail layout using Peco Code 100 track and points to avoid the fearsome radius and other disadvantages of Hornby-Dublo's 3-rail pointwork.  I went so far as to build a test bed out of recycled track to prove the idea.  It works well but age and too many other projects have effectively overtaken the idea.

 

Mike

 

   

 

A neater way to get 3-rail using modern track is to solder stiff phosphor-bronze wire to pins between the running rails.  Its almost invisible in use.  A quick caveat, I've never tried it, but I saw it described in an old Model Railway Constructor from December 1964 (The Exhampton Line p314-7).

 

Quote

There is a snag with 3 railing 2 rail pointwork. The collector shoe shorts to the running rail on pointwork.

unless you induge in obscenities like plastic frogs.

 

Surely with 3-rail, dead frogs aren't a problem?

 

 

Edited July 9, 2022 by Hroth

[Il Grifone]

2 hours ago, Hroth said:

 

A neater way to get 3-rail using modern track is to solder stiff phosphor-bronze wire to pins between the running rails.  Its almost invisible in use.  A quick caveat, I've never tried it, but I saw it described in an old Model Railway Constructor from December 1964 (The Exhampton Line p314-7).

 

 

Surely with 3-rail, dead frogs aren't a problem?

 

 

 

The first solution was always deprecated by 'those in the know'. I can't see why, apart from expansion problems?

 The problem with the frogs is that they are plastic, not that they are dead. Of course it does rely on three rail locomotives picking up from both rails and not using the Trix double three rail system.

This can be wired to allow two and three rail locomotives to run together. (My test track is like this. Unfortunately I used Trix fibre track (for the larger radius 15¾" radius -13½" radius* is a non starter) and the connevtions fail to connect and the rails are a dirt magnet.

 

* It's actually a weird metric measurement (342mm IIRC) from its German origins.