Bachmann Class 47

[Chris56057]

Hopefully mine will not disappoint; originally a 47035 but it's had "a bit" of work and there's still quite a bit to do.

Looks fantastic Jon, great job!

[the penguin of doom]

Originally a 47035 but it's had "a bit" of work.

And the prize for understatement of the year goes to.....

 

Jon020! ;o)

Edited July 23, 2013 by the penguin of doom

[Jon020]

... thanks chaps.

[The Black Hat]

Seems like the Res and intercity 47s are hitting the shops. Already placed the order for the nameplates to renumber my pair when I get them.

[The Black Hat]

Thought I would share the research I have done to see what my options are for renumbering the class 47s that are arriving.

 

The Intercity one has marker lights of two different kinds, noticed elsewhere in this thread. It does limit some options as not all 47s were run with these, although the great majority seemed to from the early 90s onwards.

 

From what I can tell, numbers 2, 5, 6, 8, 9, 19, 20, 21, 29, 30-39, 41-51 all had the same marker set up as the model, which is 47834.

 

Some class 47/8's recieved flush front early being numbers 10,11,12 and 16, so these would be no good. Likewise some had the marker headcode bulbs fitted at both ends being 7,14, 26, 28, 40 and 54. So that rules out 47826 which was to be my first choice. Pending on the period your operating and from what I've noticed, some 47's that had the marker lights had these removed and replaced with the bulbs and flush front. Ones that had the change were 24, 27, 30, 41, 46 and 53.

 

Some 47s rule themselves out owing to livery. 47801 was large logo, 47802 was mainly in the infrastucture livery it became well known for, and 47852 was in BR blue minus the large logo. 47833 became a BR railtour engine painted into a mock BR green and thus probably wouldnt be a good choice for renumbering. 47818 had oval buffers rather than the round ones on the model so that ones ruled out too. 47824 and 47832 had full yellow ends including cab window surrounds at one point. So they could be one for adding something different. One 47824 I think had a black headcode box too.

 

Happily, a few of the 47/8's were named and thus give something to go over the nameplate where it is on 47834, even if maybe the subject models plates are a bit lower compared with the norm for the livery. Those named where;

 

47805 - Bristol Barton Hill

47809 - Finsbury Park

47821 - Royal Worcester

47824 - Glorious Devon

47831 - Bolton Wanderer

47834 - Fire Fly

47833 - Captain Peter Manisty RN

47835 - Windsor Castle

47840 - North Star

47844 - Derby and Derbyshire Chamber of Commerce and Industry

47845 - County of Kent

47846 - Thor

 

So after all that.... just need to choose which one now...

[Removed a/c]

Have one of each  

[G-BOAF]

Thanks The Black Hat

A very interesting analysis of variatoins.

I would offer one correction (that I am aware of), that of 47840, demonstrating the detail minefield.

From this picture, 47840 gained sealed beam marker lights at its number one end in 1994. Indeed they appear to have been just added in this picture and the frames are not yet painted.

http://class47.co.uk/c47_zoom_v3.php?img=1151052336211#

 

From further searching on Class47.co.uk, the loco had its buffer beam cowling removed 1995/6, meaning that it cannot be modelled using 47834. Shame as this is a loco I want. I will be studying future releases carefully!

 

The Class 47 website is an excellent resource for prototype pictures and other info.

[The Black Hat]

Thanks The Black Hat

A very interesting analysis of variatoins.

I would offer one correction (that I am aware of), that of 47840, demonstrating the detail minefield.

From this picture, 47840 gained sealed beam marker lights at its number one end in 1994. Indeed they appear to have been just added in this picture and the frames are not yet painted.

http://class47.co.uk/c47_zoom_v3.php?img=1151052336211#

 

From further searching on Class47.co.uk, the loco had its buffer beam cowling removed 1995/6, meaning that it cannot be modelled using 47834. Shame as this is a loco I want. I will be studying future releases carefully!

 

The Class 47 website is an excellent resource for prototype pictures and other info.

 

I didnt think to check of cowlings if Im honest and the whole process makes me have huge respect for the lads at Barwell who get it spot on every time for an exact time and period of operation. I know theres a few errors in the list but as a rough guide its a starting point. Always helps to research your engine in particular afterwards to the hilt before you start applying numbers but i hope for others its a start!

[G-BOAF]

TBH the cowling are the big thing with this batch of 47s. We've had an IC 47 before (47735 Windsor Castle LE), so its the cut away cab that makes this latest 47 release interesting, and means a number of late life 47s are modelable.

 

 

47840 was not the only loco to have sealed beam lights at both ends, 815 did as well (also interestingly not getting the cut away buffer beam cowl until repaint in FGW livery. I wonder if the tooling will allow the sealed beam at both ends varient.

 

I was wondering why sealed beam light appeared to appear at the number two end only, and have just found the answer, half way down this page (SSF), whole page is worth a read though

http://sulzerpower.com/frontends/headcodepanels.html

[The Black Hat]

TBH the cowling are the big thing with this batch of 47s. We've had an IC 47 before (47735 Windsor Castle LE), so its the cut away cab that makes this latest 47 release interesting, and means a number of late life 47s are modelable.

 

 

47840 was not the only loco to have sealed beam lights at both ends, 815 did as well (also interestingly not getting the cut away buffer beam cowl until repaint in FGW livery. I wonder if the tooling will allow the sealed beam at both ends varient.

 

I was wondering why sealed beam light appeared to appear at the number two end only, and have just found the answer, half way down this page (SSF), whole page is worth a read though

http://sulzerpower.com/frontends/headcodepanels.html

 

Yes I have noticed that the cut away cab really does open up the possibilities for the class to be brought into the modern day 'modern image' scene, ie since privitisation. The Res and Intercity 47s both make modelling their main use in the 1990s to 2000 possible and theres other varients for areas like NSE and freight.

 

I would think that the cabs are indeed seperate and that both ends can be done although they might need to have two cabs of the same type. Maybe the answer would be for a headcode box and bulbs with a flush front - as there are many examples of the class in its later years with that configuration. Another plus for the lads at Barwell is that the configurations they have chosen mean that renumbering is easier, rather than examples only good for doing one, such as Hornby's Fragonset 31452 as a brilliant example as none of the others had the front light in the same configuration. I bet many people dont just get one Res 47, and that two is more likely. The inflation of prices might make that more difficult however.

 

Im sure that next year more releases of class 47 will follow and am sure they will be EWS, Freightliner, Colas. WCRC might feature for a limited ed run by someone as it has been mentioned before.

[The Black Hat]

In view of my attempt to help see which Intercity 47s can be done for my own research to choose one to renumber... looking into the Res 47s has brought these results although, I have started from 47721 as from 47701 to 47721 is a minefield of differnet liveries and uses. The main Res fleet went from 47721 to 47799.

 

Those that would be fine to renumber with the current Bachmann model include 47721, 27, 33, 34, 36, 41, 43, 44, 45, 59, 60 - 63, 65, 67, 69, 70-75, 78, 79-81, 84, 89 and 47791.  

 

Those that had a flush front and thus cant be done are: 725, 26, 42, 46, 47, 64, 76, 87.

 

Those that had light bulb headcodes fitted at both ends, rather than one as per the model and thus cant be done are; 47732, 37, 49, 50, 56, 57, 58, 68, 77, 83, 92 and 47793.

 

Some had oval buffers, akin to a class 60, rather than round ones like the model, so it rules out; 47722, 38, 39, 50, 66, 85, 88 and 90. (47766 had them at one end only... incase you fancy something different!)

 

Ones with black headcodes are 47736, 47772 and 47791. These could be modeled using the current model as a base, but careful with 47772 as it had unique black boxes around its bulbs and retained a yellow area between the two.

 

There are a few to avoid as these became celebs. 47769 became the only 47/7 to go into Virgin XC colours when hired in by Riveria. 47773 became the 47 at Tysley in BR green and 47787 was quite a celeb. Others to watch are those that became part of the EWS fleet that then recieved EWS livery and some even had further mods for reliability in traffic. These could overlap with future releases by Bachmann in the future if you want to save on ordering that repaint and wait for them to produce one, which Im sure they will get round to annoucing next year! *hint hint...*

 

Other ones in a similar vien would be to avoid the WCRC machines as a few of these were former Res kit as again, modelling the twilight of their use with EWS can cross with WCRC and thus the two could possibly be seen together.

 

Im not saying such a list is conclusive. Its best to check any particular engine your interested in fully, before embarking on attaching your new Bachmann model as some with the likes of changing the buffers could be fine and others not!

 

That said, Ive just bought some nameplates and spare buffers to do 47790....

Edited July 29, 2013 by The Black Hat

[GD]

In view of my attempt to help see which Intercity 47s can be done for my own research to choose one to renumber... looking into the Res 47s has brought these results although, I have started from 47721 as from 47701 to 47721 is a minefield of differnet liveries and uses. The main Res fleet went from 47721 to 47799.

 

Those that would be fine to renumber with the current Bachmann model include 47721, 27, 33, 34, 36, 41, 43, 44, 45, 59, 60 - 63, 65, 67, 69, 70-75, 78, 79-81, 84, 89 and 47791.  

 

Those that had a flush front and thus cant be done are: 725, 26, 42, 46, 47, 64, 76, 87.

 

Those that had light bulb headcodes fitted at both ends, rather than one as per the model and thus cant be done are; 47732, 37, 49, 50, 56, 57, 58, 68, 77, 83, 92 and 47793.

 

Some had oval buffers, akin to a class 60, rather than round ones like the model, so it rules out; 47722, 38, 39, 50, 66, 85, 88 and 90. (47766 had them at one end only... incase you fancy something different!)

 

Ones with black headcodes are 47736, 47772 and 47791. These could be modeled using the current model as a base, but careful with 47772 as it had unique black boxes around its bulbs and retained a yellow area between the two.

 

There are a few to avoid as these became celebs. 47769 became the only 47/7 to go into Virgin XC colours when hired in by Riveria. 47773 became the 47 at Tysley in BR green and 47787 was quite a celeb. Others to watch are those that became part of the EWS fleet that then recieved EWS livery and some even had further mods for reliability in traffic. These could overlap with future releases by Bachmann in the future if you want to save on ordering that repaint and wait for them to produce one, which Im sure they will get round to annoucing next year! *hint hint...*

 

Other ones in a similar vien would be to avoid the WCRC machines as a few of these were former Res kit as again, modelling the twilight of their use with EWS can cross with WCRC and thus the two could possibly be seen together.

 

Im not saying such a list is conclusive. Its best to check any particular engine your interested in fully, before embarking on attaching your new Bachmann model as some with the likes of changing the buffers could be fine and others not!

 

That said, Ive just bought some nameplates and spare buffers to do 47790....

Further discount 721,733,734,741,759,762,763,769 and 774 as these have spanner boiler ports, 779 and 785 i don't think ever had cut away cabs and 727, 761, 770, 771 and 772 had the high eth position.  

[45059]

I was going to mention the boiler ports, but GD beat me to it! These can however be shaved off and replaced with an etched replacement spanner port from Shawplan, especially if you plan to weather the roof.

[BR(S)]

For anyone interested in the RfD Class 47, pictures are available on the Rails of Sheffield site.  A cursory glance suggests Bachmann have got the livery correct, following their changes to the colours:

 

https://railsofsheffield.com/class-47-47365-diamond-jubilee-br-railfreight-distribution-free-uk-post-32-816-JJJA18921.aspx

Edited August 1, 2013 by BR(S)

[the penguin of doom]

I was going to mention the boiler ports, but GD beat me to it! These can however be shaved off and replaced with an etched replacement spanner port from Shawplan, especially if you plan to weather the roof.

Hi 45059.

 

That's a useful post. I'm trying to source some info on which plrts are which, (spanner etc). I was sure I'd read something on this site before but can't for the life of me find where.

 

Would it be possible for someone to either link to what I'm looking for if they know where it is or, alternatively, pop a picture of each type fitted to the 47's on here.

 

It would be most helpful to me and others I'm sure.

 

Cheers.

 

Sean.

[GD]

 

2 cotswold 47s at Barrow Hill, the round boiler is a plated over spanner boiler (47813 i think) and the oblong is the Stones or Clayton type as is on the Bachmann 47745 (could be 47828 in the photo).

 

Dave

[GD]

Right then the second photo is 47828 so the previous identity's are 47266 and 47629 and she stated life as D1966 which means it is a stones vapor boiler. 

 

Spanner boilers are D1500-D1615, D1682-D1781

Stone Vapor D1616-D1635, D1837-D1874, D1948-D1976, D1101-D1111

Clayton boiler D1636-D1681, D1901-D1947, D1977-D1999, D1100

No boiler D1782-D1836, D1875-D1900. (still had a blanked off boiler port similar to a Stones)

 

Regards

 

Dave

[45059]

Right then the second photo is 47828 so the previous identity's are 47266 and 47629 and she stated life as D1966 which means it is a stones vapor boiler. 

 

Spanner boilers are D1500-D1615, D1682-D1781

Stone Vapor D1616-D1635, D1837-D1874, D1948-D1976, D1101-D1111

Clayton boiler D1636-D1681, D1901-D1947, D1977-D1999, D1100

No boiler D1782-D1836, D1875-D1900. (still had a blanked off boiler port similar to a Stones)

 

Regards

 

Dave

Yep, like GD said! Beaten to it again- damn these night shifts!!

 

Great shots of the blanking plates BTW.

[the penguin of doom]

Thanks chaps.

 

Just one thing, (Columbo moment there), the Lima 47 had a square, weaved type grill. Would this be the Stone Vapor or Clayton type?

 

Thanks again.

 

Sean.

[The Black Hat]

Did Intercity Cross Country class 47/8s always have red nameplates? Im sure I remember some of them being Black, and that it was in their final years before VXC red was painted. Looking at pictures for research Im not sure....

[45059]

Thanks chaps.

 

Just one thing, (Columbo moment there), the Lima 47 had a square, weaved type grill. Would this be the Stone Vapor or Clayton type?

 

Thanks again.

 

Sean.

I'd say that it was a stones type, the grill being the exhaust port that hadn't been plated over.

[GD]

Thanks chaps.

 

Just one thing, (Columbo moment there), the Lima 47 had a square, weaved type grill. Would this be the Stone Vapor or Clayton type?

 

Thanks again.

 

Sean.

Err I don't think it representing anything other than a poor attempt at a stones boiler.  Although the stones and clayton boilers were different when in use, once plated over they look pretty similar as this picture of 47237 (D1914) with a plated over clayton boiler shows. It certainly doesn't look any different to the photo of the plated over stones.

 

http://www.class47.co.uk/c47_zoom_v3.php?img=0503051360211

 

Dave

[45059]

Did Intercity Cross Country class 47/8s always have red nameplates? Im sure I remember some of them being Black, and that it was in their final years before VXC red was painted. Looking at pictures for research Im not sure....

Like the black ones on FIRE FLY?

[the penguin of doom]

I'd say that it was a stones type, the grill being the exhaust port that hadn't been plated over.

  

Err I don't think it representing anything other than a poor attempt at a stones boiler.  Although the stones and clayton boilers were different when in use, once plated over they look pretty similar as this picture of 47237 (D1914) with a plated over clayton boiler shows. It certainly doesn't look any different to the photo of the plated over stones.

 

http://www.class47.co.uk/c47_zoom_v3.php?img=0503051360211

 

Dave

Thanks guys.

 

The reason I'm asking is because the ones I'll be modelling will still have the boilers fitted so although I think I have the correct parts to do the ones I intend to, I want to double check if I can.

 

Cheers.

 

Sean.

[The Black Hat]

 

Like the black ones on FIRE FLY?

 

Very good! I know the black ones on the model are for 834, and that 826 Springburn had Black plates, but I was wondering about 47831 Bolton Wanderer or 47854 WRVS, but have not seen pictures of them with black plates before their repaint into Virgin Cross Country when the plates were seen as Black.