Bachmann Class 47

[G-BOAF]

This latest 47 is fantastic in the flesh, however I thought the banana-shaped bogies were a thing of the past? Mine has just gone back due to bogie (and other) issues. I hope this is not a repeat of my 37 saga last year when I went through 6 locos to get two with a pair of good bogies.

Poor show on the QC front on a model costing £100.

I wait in hope.

[James Makin]

 

 

 

Very good! I know the black ones on the model are for 834, and that 826 Springburn had Black plates, but I was wondering about 47831 Bolton Wanderer or 47854 WRVS, but have not seen pictures of them with black plates before their repaint into Virgin Cross Country when the plates were seen as Black.

 

To add to complications, think some of the later plates were finished in Virgin Dark Grey rather than black as well!

 

I've modelled 47831 before and can confirm it definitely had the red plates while in Intercity and then went to the grey-backed plates when put into Virgin colours after that. Google Images also has a few pics that come up of both liveries to help with nameplate positioning too.

 

Somewhere I have a RES 47 tucked away as my birthday present (had to order it myself, you know the drill!) which I'm hoping to have a butchers at on Monday before getting my modelling teeth into creating some hardcore XLRA members!

[tractor_37260]

This latest 47 is fantastic in the flesh, however I thought the banana-shaped bogies were a thing of the past? Mine has just gone back due to bogie (and other) issues. I hope this is not a repeat of my 37 saga last year when I went through 6 locos to get two with a pair of good bogies.

Poor show on the QC front on a model costing £100.

I wait in hope.

 

What were the problems with the bogies ? derailing / noisey  or what ? If the "banana" shape you refer to, results in the centre axle/wheels being lower than the outer axles, causing derailing and noise, it's a five minute fix with a file to sort them !

Edited August 10, 2013 by tractor_37260

[G-BOAF]

Rattling when on the track, or rather clear evidence that not all 6 wheels were contactin the rails. I didn't even run it, as it clearly not built to spec. I know there are fixes, involving filing out the recess for the central axle. My understanding of this fix is that it prevents the brass bushes from pushing the bogie block appart in the middle, thus raising the outer wheels. However this assumes that there is no permanent deformatoin to the bogie chassis. When investigaitng a previous 37 bogie, I did not find the bogie chassis straightened out upon removing the three wheelsets (when left for 24h). Neither did the calipers indicate any shrinkage of the centre appature.

 

On the basis that good examples must exist somewhere, I figured I'd rather my retailer attempted to find me a good one, than fixing the problem (for which I have zero hours atm!). If not, will resort to enlarging the centre hole, however I fear this may not be so straightforward: on the 47 it seemed to only impact one side of the bogie, the traditional fix which is based on both sides being off.

 

My original post was more to do with the face that I thought Bachmann had redesigned the bogie to sort this out (as they did with the post 2011 37s)

 

EDIT: any chance to a link for corrective action - the only one I could find involved loosing drive to the central axle, which kind of defeats part of hte object for having a Bachmann 47 in the first place!

Edited August 10, 2013 by G-BOAF

[tractor_37260]

Rattling when on the track, or rather clear evidence that not all 6 wheels were contactin the rails. I didn't even run it, as it clearly not built to spec.I know there are fixes, involving filing out the recess for the central axle. My understanding of this fix is that it prevents the brass bushes from pushing the bogie block appart in the middle, thus raising the outer wheels. However this assumes that there is no permanent deformatoin to the bogie chassis. When investigaitng a previous 37 bogie, I did not find the bogie chassis straightened out upon removing the three wheelsets (when left for 24h). Neither did the calipers indicate any shrinkage of the centre appature.

 

On the basis that good examples must exist somewhere, I figured I'd rather my retailer attempted to find me a good one, than fixing the problem (for which I have zero hours atm!). If not, will resort to enlarging the centre hole, however I fear this may not be so straightforward: on the 47 it seemed to only impact one side of the bogie, the traditional fix which is based on both sides being off.

 

My original post was more to do with the face that I thought Bachmann had redesigned the bogie to sort this out (as they did with the post 2011 37s)

 

EDIT: any chance to a link for corrective action - the only one I could find involved loosing drive to the central axle, which kind of defeats part of hte object for having a Bachmann 47 in the first place!

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

No link as such, but I'll pass on my own findings after many hours experimenting to find the causes of the noise and the derailing etc

 

One question, if as you state "I didn't even run them" how did you know there was a problem  ? All models require running in, to help the drive mechanism bed in etc.

 

I first found problems with Bach 6 axle drive 37's.  Some of these were very noisey and tended to derail occasionally.  On all the problem locos, I found that the centre axle/wheels were lower than the outer ones, causing the bogie to rock back and fore on the centre wheels under drive. Putting a straight edge across the the 3 axle/wheel treads, hard against the flanges, confirmed the centre wheelset was lower than the outers, both sides of each bogie require checking, both sides are normally out, sometimes one side more than the other. I also found the problem more common on the No1 end bogie for some reason, but occasionally on both bogies.

 

The solution: Firstly, on any bogie with a lower centre axle , remove the centre axle/wheelset - and then test run the loco, and access the results.  There should be a noticeable reduction in noise etc, it should also no longer derail.

Before refitting the centre wheelset, using a round file, carefully increase the depth ONLY of the brass bearing housing holes on each side of the bogie, a little at a time, refit the centre axle wheelset and re-check that all the wheel treads are now in line.

There is normally enough "play" in the centre gear meshing to allow the axle to fit slightly higher/lower depending how you look at it.

I've found the above mod has cured all my problem Bach 37 and 47 models.

 

One other issue to watch out for, which so far I've only had problems on 37's with, is on some models the plastic cup in the flywheels where the drive shaft connects sometimes comes loose, and turns with the drive shaft, this results in very poor running and stalling etc, but again is easy to fix, once you strip down the chassis to get at it !  Glue the cup into the flywheel recess with some Araldite - sorted.

 

As for 6 against 4 axle drive  - try putting a Bachmann 47 and a Heljan 47 head to head , the Heljan normally wins hands down - it will push a dead Bach 47 - but the Bach will slip/spin the wheels being unable to push the Heljan

 

Hopefully this will prove helpful to yourself and others

 

Regards

Ken

Edited August 12, 2013 by tractor_37260

[G-BOAF]

 

 

One question, if as you state "I didn't even run them" how did you know there was a problem  ? All models require running in, to help the drive mechanism bed in etc.

 

...

Before refitting the centre wheelset, using a round file, carefully increase the depth ONLY of the brass bearing housing holes on each side of the bogie, a little at a time, refit the centre axle wheelset and re-check that all the wheel treads are now in line.

 

 

I took the loco out of the packaging, placed it on a dead-flat surface (composite bathroom flooring offcut), and each bogie rattled on its outer wheels. Also, if a model is pivoting on its centre axle, wiggling the bogies will result in very little resistance, nor will the loco end wiggle much. I have refined these initial tests in having had 6 class 37s pass through my hands!

 

Interesting that you say only the depth - I thought the problem was the width of the slot and the brass bearing 'pushing' the rest of the bogie away from itself, hence pushing 'up' the outer wheelsets?

 

If I need to go down this route, it will be with care.

 

Thanks

[Jon020]

... and here's what I'm still doing with mine. Now reassembled and ready for some weathering. Phew! this has been a long-haul project

... at least I think it was worth it though. 

[45059]

Very nice Jon020, here's my latest addition, formerly Modelzone 47972.

[45059]

And one or two others..

[D400]

Does anyone know if Bachmann are going to do another batch of 47715? I've missed out on the first batch and they seem to be out of stock and most places already!!

[The Black Hat]

Does anyone know if Bachmann are going to do another batch of 47715? I've missed out on the first batch and they seem to be out of stock and most places already!!

 

Google and ebay are your friends there...

[G-BOAF]

AC models Eastleigh are advertising stock (via ebay store)

Cheltenham Model Centre indicate 2 in stock,

Peter's Spares showing 2 in stock

Model Railways Direct showing 4 in stock

 

30 seconds on google...!

[garyw1970]

in most of your opinions you would say that Bachmann makes the best oo gauge class 47 . i have a few lima and Hornby i think lima ones dont look to bad  barring there age but adore my Bachmann 47

[Jon020]

in most of your opinions you would say that Bachmann makes the best oo gauge class 47 . i have a few lima and Hornby i think lima ones dont look to bad  barring there age but adore my Bachmann 47

It's down to personal opinion; they all have good points and poor points; Bachmann are pretty close with theirs and you can sort out the problems with it if you're looking for perfection (or in my opinion close to as perfect as possible) but the real trick is that if you're going to have a few, don't mix and match... all bach, all Heljan or all ViT will give you a good fleet... as will limas or Hornbys with some rework.

Anyway.... here's what you can do with a Bachmann one if you're so inclined: (now finished weathering but not taken any more photos)

HTH

Jon

[Rugd1022]

Jon that looks the business, it really does - and it takes me right back to the 1974 / 75 early Tops era with headcode blinds still in use. When the Bachmann Brush 4 first came out I was a bit sceptical about it's appearence in certain areas, but looking at what you've achieved with 47 415 has changed my mind considerably.

 

Spot on Sir, spot on!

Edited September 6, 2013 by Rugd1022

[Jon020]

thanks Nige,

 

just to complete this off-topic (ish) point, here's another shot that I grabbed earlier today with all weathering finished... and 23 months after I started it... job done.

 

Jon

[James Makin]

Glad that the latest batch of proper 47s have arrived...the fun is starting!

 

My usual task on the Bachmann 47 is unbending the buffers - anyone else noticed this? 

 

Got 4x 47 and 6x 57 and they all came with buffers pointing skywards! Drop of poly cement to soften the surrounding plastic soon cures this but funnily enough you never see this picked up by reviewers! But careful how you play with it or you'll get a drooper!!

[37403]

It's down to personal opinion; they all have good points and poor points; Bachmann are pretty close with theirs and you can sort out the problems with it if you're looking for perfection (or in my opinion close to as perfect as possible) but the real trick is that if you're going to have a few, don't mix and match... all bach, all Heljan or all ViT will give you a good fleet... as will limas or Hornbys with some rework.

Anyway.... here's what you can do with a Bachmann one if you're so inclined: (now finished weathering but not taken any more photos)

IMG_0690aLR.jpg

HTH

Jon

Sir, take a bow, that 47 looks stunning. The weathering on the bogie areas is particularly effective as is the roof colour. I would be very pleased with myself if i produced anything along these lines.

[Marcyg]

Does anyone know if the TDM cables on the 47/7s are available as a spare?

[Nobby (John)]

Does anyone know if the TDM cables on the 47/7s are available as a spare?

Have you tried asking Bachmann directly?

[The Black Hat]

Hello all,

 

Here is my Bachmann class 47, fresh from its renumber and work done to turn it into 47790 'Saint David/ Dewi Sant'. Will have to start a thread on all the conversions Ive done!

 

[tractor_37260]

Does anyone know if the TDM cables on the 47/7s are available as a spare?

Plenty Heljan 47 spare ones about - possibly nearer scale also 

[45059]

Plenty Heljan 47 spare ones about - possibly nearer scale also 

Do you know anyone who still has them in stock? Howes has been sold out for as long as I've been looking for them. I think I may end up just replacing them with wire.

[45059]

A quick couple of pictures taken last night of some of my Bachmann Duff fleet. 47s 156, 301, 515, 579, 596, 612 with 295 loitering at the back.

[Matt]

45059 have you amended the dominos on nse and ic versions? They don't look as oversize (my only real beef with the Bach 47). If so wht did you do? Or is just illusion with black backing plates?

 

M

 

Nice models btw