What Age Does a Child Become an Adult?

[Sir TophamHatt]

Was thinking about why children under 5 don't pay for trains, or why there is even a child rate.

 

I understand an "adult" is different in different places.

Ffor example at Alton Towers the adult age is just 12.  Seems stupid to some people, but the reason is that the height restriction for the biggest rides is 1.4m.  At 12 years old, the child is likely to be at or over 1.4m so can access everything.  So why should they pay less when they can access the same amount of attractions as a 20 year old can?

Doesn't seem so silly when you understand.

 

But with train tickets (not so much under 5's I guess), why is there a child age/price?

 

Could fares be restructured so adults pay slightly less but children 5 and over pay the full price?

 

It's not like they don't take up a seat and so looking at the Alton Towers example, it doesn't quite make sense why they pay less.  I appreciate I am probably missing something here.

 

Poll just for added interest (difficult to nail it down to one age for everything, but if you had to choose...).

Edited April 20, 2019 by Sir TophamHatt

[Catkins]

I would say that the child/adult thing is relative.

From a financial point, as the youngest of 3 children, if a ticket for a child over 5 is the same cost as an adult ticket, then a family could quite easily be priced off the mode of transport, and into a car, that is already "paid for", quite possibly going to be used for part of the journey, and most importantly - immediately accessible.

 

It is a question of balancing financial viability with real practicality.

 

The other thing to consider is the various legal ages that persons are considered "responsible" - i.e joining the armed forces at 16, but not being allowed to vote until 18.

Edited April 20, 2019 by Catkins
edited to add the italicised thought.

[Mallard60022]

If someone can Join the Services at 16 then 16 it is for me. If they are old enough to put their life at risk then that will do me. OK so they may well get a 'pass' for train travel but that is incidental. In the context of 'having responsibility' and special restrictions for doing things such as the rides and events, then I suspect the operators can choose what age they like.

There are 16 year olds I have met, worked with, taught that have more common sense and reliability than loads of so called adults in the same circumstances. I shall stop now before I get on my soap-box...………………… (what's a soap box many may ask...……………..)

O.L.D. Codger.

[Brinkly]

I still considers myself a child; although, I am now one of the 'oldest' youngesters at work!  No fair! 

 

I must confess, I don't get the whole 16 to go into the forces, but 18 to have debt etc. I agree totally with you Duck that if someone is prepared to put their life on the line, they are an adult. Do you still have to be 19 to go into combat?

 

Regards,

 

Nick

[cctransuk]

From my experience, many 'adults' never qualified for the transition from childhood !!

 

Regards,

John Isherwood.

[grandadbob]

According to the following you have to be 18 to serve on the front line:

 

https://www.parliament.uk/documents/joint-committees/human-rights/Briefing_from_Forces_Watch_age_of_recruitment.pdf

[Steamport Southport]

1 hour ago, grandadbob said:

According to the following you have to be 18 to serve on the front line:

 

https://www.parliament.uk/documents/joint-committees/human-rights/Briefing_from_Forces_Watch_age_of_recruitment.pdf

 

It's been like that for a while. They are more in "military school" like the American military academies idea until they are older now.

 

 

It's getting older. The child tickets on Merseyside are up to 19 as that's the age the majority of "children" leave school. 18 really, but some of them have birthdays before school finishes. Then many of them go to University so have reduced tickets until they are 21/22 as long as you have student ID.

 

It used to be 5 to 15 for a child ticket. When you were 16 and still at school you used to get a maintenance grant until you left to pay for bus fares. 

 

 

 

Jason

[Enterprisingwestern]

 

Having just been trying to book a package holiday, a child becomes an adult at 12, 16 or 18 depending upon the company.

 

Mike.

[Barry O]

In cricket you must wear a helmet to bat in upto the Under 19 age group.

We have free entry for up to 3 children with every paying adult at the Leeds Show. Keeps it simple!

Baz 

[decauville1126]

I work in the bus industry and my employer uses 16 as the transition from child rate (which is 2/3rds the adult fare) to the adult rate. But those aged 14 to 16 can be challenged to produce proof of age, otherwise full fare may be charged. They work on the basis that the seat is occupied whatever the rate. I won't here go into  myriad exemptions and concessions which can apply!

[TheQ]

There are people alive today in the UK who could have been legally married in the UK at age 12 as that only changed to sixteen in 1929. Under 18 today you still need your parents permission to marry.

 

As mentioned above  you can not fight for your country until you are 18.

Also in the military if you are under 18 when you complete your training and one of your parents is in the military . They can "call you In" that is request you are posted to the same station.  That happened to one of the guys on my intake,  so his first posting was Germany,  which wasnt possible in my trade.. Mind you that can make a mess of your future career.. 

 

So I'd say an adult at 18, however seat occupancy is something different,  I'd be quite happy if you take a seat you pay the full fare.. 

 

[friscopete]

Dunno .I am 73 and still waiting ,at least according to my wife ......

[Dunsignalling]

Physically, emotionally, or legally? Three different answers and only one of them constant (and that only until it gets changed again).

 

John

 

PS. I'm 67 and I still haven't decided what I want to do when I grow up.....

[Enterprisingwestern]

1 hour ago, Barry O said:

In cricket you must wear a helmet to bat in upto the Under 19 age group.

We have free entry for up to 3 children with every paying adult at the Leeds Show. Keeps it simple!

Baz 

 

How do you find the space to play cricket at the Leeds show?

 

Mike.

[stewartingram]

I'd be stumped to answer that one....

 

 

Stewart

[Gareth Collier]

I'd say that as you now have to stay in full time education to until 18 coupled to being the age when you are allowed to do adult things such as drink alcohol and vote that would seem appropriate.

Children under 5 more often than not would be able to sit on a parents lap on a train so can understand why they would pay less.

[wombatofludham]

With regard to fares, I think the child rate is outdated and a hangover from when children were smaller, well mannered and therefore would expect to give up their seat to an adult paying full fare.  Doesn't happen now and many parents are so self entitled (you know, the sort who complain they can't afford to take their precious darlings to Disney world in the school holidays so take them out of school, then bitch when they get fined) they would kick off if an adult pointed out to them a child travelling at reduced rate should vacate a seat if needed by a full fare adult.  So, as the Government is looking to simplify and rationalise the fares system, how about this for a radical solution:

If you get a seat and occupy it, full rate.

If there are NO seats available (sorry Jezza, sitting on the floor doesn't count) all standees get a third discount.

If your train is delayed more than 15 minutes as well, a further third off for all.

 

The principle?  If you can't sit but are still travelling, you are getting the benefit of the train travel, running safely to a timetable without the hassle of town centre parking etc, but less comfortably, so you get a discount for discomfort.  If the train is significantly late on top of that, you suffer the loss of the predictability a timetable should deliver, which can have consequences, so you get a further third off for that inconvenience, but you still pay for the fact train travel is safer and generally less hassle than car driving.

If this fare system makes it expensive for families, then the family railcard should be promoted and beefed up which allows discounted travel on the basis that once bought, families are more likely to use the train more often, offsetting the discount with additional journeys that theoretically they might not have used, and of course, they would be limited to off peak.  

Of course a system based on the quality of service and defining the right to a seat won't happen because it will force rail operators to address the issue, or cram more seats in to minimise revenue loss.  But given my local petrol station doesn't give me a discount when I'm treating my niece to a day at the seaside, or Gwynedd Council give me half price parking if I have her car seat in the car, logic suggests that the fares system should reflect the fact that many children continue to occupy seats when adults are standing and come into the 21st Century.

[luckymucklebackit]

Under the old BR, you were and adult at 14 during the week and 16 at weekends!

 

 

 

You could buy a child fare weekend return up to 16!!

 

 

[jjb1970]

I may be the other way around, regardless of the £5k+ pa I spend on my season ticket I'll happily give up my seat (assuming I have one) if I see a small child standing.

[jonhall]

1 hour ago, Gareth Collier said:

I'd say that as you now have to stay in full time education to until 18 coupled to being the age when you are allowed to do adult things such as drink alcohol and vote that would seem appropriate.

 

 

Getting young people used to using public transport as a young age is a positive habit that will (IMO) benefit in the long run. Young people have just the same mobility needs/desires as everyone else, except they lack the earning power, and why shouldn't society subsidise that access to transit? 

 

Most of the buses I've travelled in recently I've been one of the few who actually seemed to pay the full fare. If there is to be a pecking order to those getting a seat (and sometimes getting on the bus at all) please can we have those of us actually paying to be on the bus, then the kids paying half fare, and then the silver surfers who aren't*

 

*and don't give me all that twaddle about paying for it during your working lives, by the time today's kids get to your ages there won't be such a thing as retirement - none of them will be able to afford it.

 

Jon

[brianusa]

Gone are the days when older people were offered a seat from a younger traveller.  Now they ignore you behind a mobile phone or other device with wires stuck in their ears!

     Brian

[decauville1126]

 

 

1 hour ago, jonhall said:

 

then the silver surfers who aren't*

 

Jon

 

The ENCTS scheme may appear to offer "free" bus transport but this is only so at "the point of usage". An agreed fee per ride is paid to the transport provider by the local authority and there is the facility for charging  back direct to the card issuing area authority - very important in seaside resorts which have a very high proportion of out-of-county visitors. The amounts paid to the transport provider are usually deemed to be of a confidential contractural nature which makes it sometimes difficult to accurately assess the cost of the scheme. Special arrangements are used in London, and possibly elsewhere, where bus services are operated on a tendered-for basis and ENCTS cards do not register on Oyster machines.

 

But users will be contributing at their "home" ends via their local taxes.

 

Some local authorities offer the facility of a discount on a Senior Railcard in lieu of a bus pass.

 

[friscopete]

interesting. Tonight my 40 year old daughter who it has to be said looks more like 20  questioned me on just how many Jacks n coke I down  when playing blues jam nights at the same pub she visited today .She noted that an extra shot is only 50 p more  so I got the the old  one two about my drinking habits .My pleas that no self respecting blues man goes up on stage sober  cut little ice.A few year sago it was me doing a Gestapo job on her .

[Gwiwer]

"What age does a child become an adult?"

 

Legally, morally or mentally?  And in which country?

 

Examples:- 

1.  A nephew is 28, suffers with ASD and is closely dependant upon others for his overall welfare but is able to work within certain limitations and can sometimes travel alone.  Mentally he remains (and has not progressed in years) about age 12 but in some respects is closer to 20.

2.  In the Australian State of Victoria the law on age of sexual consent is notoriously vague.  While it is generally considered to be 16 it appears, as the law is read, that two persons not more than 24 months different in age and both between the age of 12 and 15 may lawfully engage. However once one turns 16 and until the other does the law decrees that a crime has been committed if the same act occurs.  Between the ages of 16 and 18 partners may again not be more than 24 months different in age.  

3.  Anyone caught in the act of "throwing their toys out of the pram" usually in an internet context but it can happen just as easily in real life.

 

Who is an adult in those scenarios?  And whose job is it to define "Adult"?

 

In answer to the question "How old are you?" my usual answer, context permitting, is "Old enough to know better - and young enough to remember".  

[Barry O]

8 hours ago, Enterprisingwestern said:

 

How do you find the space to play cricket at the Leeds show?

 

Mike.

 We can arrange the floorspace to provide 2 or 4 cricket nets inside the exhibition hall. Helmets are compulsory In  anet