“BEYOND DOVER”

[Northroader]

C.F. PUY DE DOME.
 

Anybody watching the Tour?

Edited July 11, 2023 by Northroader

[Andy Hayter]

I certainly am watching.  When it is so hot outside, the incentive to stay in the shade and do little is very high indeed.

 

The railway we saw yesterday is not the same as the one in your PLM poster.

[Compound2632]

1 hour ago, Andy Hayter said:

The railway we saw yesterday is not the same as the one in your PLM poster.

 

Has been rebuilt: 

 

 

[Andy Hayter]

Given that the original line closed in 1926 and went all of the way into the centre of Clement Ferrand, whereas the current line starts at the base of the Puy (Col de Ceyssat) and was built in 2009 - 2012 and is less than half the length, rebuilt is perhaps a bit of a stretch but I suppose it all depends on ones definitions.  

 

What you see in the PLM poster is definitely not in the "rebuilt" section.

Edited July 10, 2023 by Andy Hayter

[Mikkel]

I also got curious when watching the race. There are some nice old postcards here: 

http://railsvagabonds.canalblog.com/archives/2018/08/31/36667242.html

 

One of them features a very small van - for luggage perhaps.

 

[Compound2632]

54 minutes ago, Mikkel said:

One of them features a very small van - for luggage perhaps.

 

Or supplies for the summit station?

[Andy Hayter]

Or indeed supplies for any of the villages on the original route.

But with a laboratory and observatory on the summit, you are probably right Stephen.

[burgundy]

Not Melton Constable!

A 178 km long line in mainland Europe, that was run with 8 Beyer Peacock 4-4-0s, 9 Beyer Peacock Moguls and a solitary Stephenson 0-6-0 tank. 

Any suggestions?

Best wishes 

Eric 

[Northroader]

ALGECIRAS - BOBADILLA RLY.
 

It looks a nice sunny sort of place….

Edited July 28, 2023 by Northroader

[Compound2632]

16 minutes ago, burgundy said:

Not Melton Constable!

 

With that proportion of locomotives to route miles, it could well be!

 

17 minutes ago, burgundy said:

Any suggestions?

 

Well, it does say [R]ENFE on the buffer beam of that Peacock...

[Compound2632]

From a list of Beyer, Peacock & Co. locomotives I downloaded from an I think now defunct site, the company supplied to Algeciras Gibraltar Railway:

 

Order No.         Works Nos.         Qty.      Type          Year

7249                  3163-5                    3        4-4-0          1890

7251                  3166-9                    4        2-6-0          1890

7427                  3354-6                    3        4-4-0          1891             

7426                  3351-3                    3        2-6-0          1891

0469                  5626-7                    2        4-4-0          1912

0598                  5719-20                  2        2-6-0          1913

[Northroader]

Try this, improve your language skills. and whilst you’re there, spread out a bit and browse, it’s a great website.

 

http://trenesytiempos.blogspot.com/search?q=Algeciras+Bobadilla

 

(Me, I’m off to watch the footy, England v. Denmark!)

 

 

Edited July 28, 2023 by Northroader

[Compound2632]

8 minutes ago, Northroader said:

Try this, improve your language skills.

 

Worsdell-von Borries two-cylinder compounds! Now if the Lynn & Fakenham had had those...

 

Described as a "primitive" system of compounding.

[burgundy]

4 hours ago, Northroader said:

Try this, improve your language skills. and whilst you’re there, spread out a bit and browse, it’s a great website.

 

http://trenesytiempos.blogspot.com/search?q=Algeciras+Bobadilla

 

(Me, I’m off to watch the footy, England v. Denmark!)

 

 

Great website - with some lovely examples of the idiocyncracy of Google translate!

Curiously, the Algeciras and Gibraltar railway actually ran from Algeciras to Bobadilla, with Gibraltar being connected to Algeciras by ferry, since the Spanish government objected to the railway crossing the border. 

Spain seems to have been one of the few European countries to buy many British locos, partly because of the lack of indigenous competition and partly because there seems to have been quite a lot of UK investment. It must have been a fascinating place to visit in the 50s and 60s. 

Best wishes 

Eric  

[NHY 581]

Well, I've been drawn in by a couple of rather nice Italian 0.6.0Ts. Both are liveried appropriately to Era ( Epoch ?) 3 which I understand is 1945-1970. However, they are of course from an earlier age. 

 

 

The first is a Rivarossi model of a FS Gr 835 0.6.0T of which 370 were produced of the prototype between 1906–1922. 

 

 

The second is a Lima model of a FS Gr 851 0.6.0T of which 207 of the prototype were produced between 1898-1911. 

 

No idea what to do with them but they are so very nice.........

 

Rob

 

[cctransuk]

1 minute ago, NHY 581 said:

Well, I've been drawn in by a couple of rather nice Italian 0.6.0Ts. Both are liveried appropriately to Era ( Epoch ?) 3 which I understand is 1945-1970. However, they are of course from an earlier age. 

 

 

The first is a Rivarossi model of a FS Gr 835 0.6.0T of which 370 were produced of the prototype between 1906–1922. 

 

 

The second is a Lima model of a FS Gr 851 0.6.0T of which 207 of the prototype were produced between 1898-1911. 

 

No idea what to do with them but they are so very nice.........

 

Rob

 

 

Anyone know what the Kitmaster model represented?

 

I don't recall ever having seen a motorised kit.

 

CJI.

[Schooner]

They look glorious @NHY 581!

 

1:87? How do they run?

[Northroader]

On 28/07/2023 at 15:30, NHY 581 said:

Well, I've been drawn in by a couple of rather nice Italian 0.6.0Ts. Both are liveried appropriately to Era ( Epoch ?) 3 which I understand is 1945-1970. However, they are of course from an earlier age. 

 

 

The first is a Rivarossi model of a FS Gr 835 0.6.0T of which 370 were produced of the prototype between 1906–1922. 

 

 

The second is a Lima model of a FS Gr 851 0.6.0T of which 207 of the prototype were produced between 1898-1911. 

 

No idea what to do with them but they are so very nice.........

 

Rob

 

ITALIAN 0-6-0Ts AND THEIR USES
 

Well, Rob, I would hope that by now, using the links on this thread for Italian subjects, and your capabilities at producing superb small scenic layouts that can draw people’s attention, you would be very able to find a use for them. I’ve recently given a Rivarrossi 835 to go to @bgman’s old layout, (currently being progressed by @Re6/6 and friends) although it wasn’t in such good shape as yours looks. Trouble with Rivarrossi, they’re damned good runners, they’re old, so they tend to be well worn.

 

 

 

Edited July 29, 2023 by Northroader

[Northroader]

Meanwhile, back in the South Western corner of Spain, I was interested in getting an idea of the kind of railway those old Beyer Peacocks operated on, soo… (can you spare 90 minutes of your life watching a video??)…

 

It’s a nicely shot video of a cab ride south from Bobadilla, a junction with the Malaga - Grenada line, out into sparsely populated country. The main roads have been regraded to pass over the line on bridges, doing away with the busier level crossings, otherwise it’s much as the original. The Northern section is still signalled with disc distants, and u.q. semaphores at the ends of the loops, and neat little country stations with a nice “house” style. There’s rugged hills in the distance, which the railway sensibly stays away from, although you can feel there’s heavy climbing round the shoulders of the rolling countryside. One scenic feature I liked was where the line crossed what seemed to be an old Roman aqueduct.  Ronda is the biggest station, but then after about an hours run, the mountains close in, and there’s a winding pass through, followed by a descent which culminates in a run through a canyon with quite heavy engineering. I’m afraid he runs out of tape about then which must be when he reaches the coastal plain. Quite a relaxing ride through a different environment.

Edited July 29, 2023 by Northroader

[Northroader]

And the old station at Algeciras was also part of Britain, yes?.

 

https://www.facebook.com/ondaalgecirastv/videos/antigua-estación-de-tren-de-algeciras/344043344439888/

 

Edited July 28, 2023 by Northroader

[NHY 581]

1 hour ago, Schooner said:

They look glorious @NHY 581!

 

1:87? How do they run?

 

58 minutes ago, Northroader said:

Well, Rob, I would hope that by now, using the links on this thread for Italian subjects, and your capabilities at producing superb small scenic layouts that can draw people’s attention, you would be very able to find a use for them. I’ve recently given a Rivarrossi 835 to go to @bgman’s old layout, (currently being progressed by @Re6/6 and friends) although it wasn’t in such good shape as yours looks. Trouble with Rivarrossi, they’re damned good runners, they’re old, so they tend to be well worn.

 

 

 

 

 

Thanks both. 

 

The 835 is from the latest version produced by Rivarossi. It runs very well and I'll be fitting a decoder to it ( when I can figure out how to get into it-instructions are "suggestive" rather than instructive ) . The level of detail is tremendous and overall it's built to a really good spec. 

 

The 851 is from the Lima Expert range. No longer available.  Again, it runs very well, flywheel helps. There is a slight issue with the valve gear on this one ( drive to undercab mechanical lubricator). Otherwise, once again the level of detail is stunning. 

 

It is,  in no small part, due to Grahame, God bless him, that I have a quiet interest in Italian steam. We used to chat about his plans to build a small Italian layout and his scratchbuilt  buildings are just wonderful.

I do envisage a small layout in the future but I have too much going on a present. 

 

But yes, these two would form a nice loco roster for such a project and thank you for those kind words regarding my approach to trainset building. 

 

Rob

 

 

[burgundy]

1 hour ago, Northroader said:

And the old station at Algeciras was also part of Britain, yes?.

 

https://www.facebook.com/ondaalgecirastv/videos/antigua-estación-de-tren-de-algeciras/344043344439888/

 

Built partly so that officers' ladies could escape from the Rock and enjoy Spain. I assume that other ranks were unaccompanied and their wives stayed in the UK. 

Best wishes 

Eric  

[Joseph_Pestell]

3 hours ago, Northroader said:

Meanwhile, back in the South Western corner of Spain, I was interested in getting an idea of the kind of railway those old Beyer Peacocks operated on, soo… (can you spare 90 minutes of your life watching a video??)…

 

It’s a nicely shot video of a cab ride south from Bobadilla, a junction with the Malaga - Grenada line, out into sparsely populated country. The main roads have been regraded to pass over the line on bridges, doing away with the busier level crossings, otherwise it’s much as the original. The Northern section is still signalled with disc distants, and u.q. semaphores at the ends of the loops, and neat little country stations with a nice “house” style. There’s rugged hills in the distance, which the railway sensibly stays away from, although you can feel there’s heavy climbing round the shoulders of the rolling countryside. Ronda is the biggest station, but then after about an hours run, the mountains close in, and there’s a winding pass through, followed by a descent which culminates in a run through a canyon with quite heavy engineering. I’m afraid he runs out of tape about then which must be when he reaches the coastal plain. Quite a relaxing ride through a different environment.

 

Bobadilla is a fascinating place for us railfans. A junction in the middle of nowhere really and now with a high speed station as well. We visited Andalucia in Jan 2017 for my 60th birthday. We stayed in Ronda for a couple of nights but I somehow missed out on the railway station there.

[sncf231e]

5 hours ago, cctransuk said:

 

Anyone know what the Kitmaster model represented?

 

I don't recall ever having seen a motorised kit.

 

CJI.

The Kitmaster model (Italian Tank No 8) was a Gr 835. The same prototype as the RivaRossi model shown above and also made in earlier, simpler, versions by RivaRossi.

Regards

Fred

[5944]

19 hours ago, NHY 581 said:

Well, I've been drawn in by a couple of rather nice Italian 0.6.0Ts. Both are liveried appropriately to Era ( Epoch ?) 3 which I understand is 1945-1970. However, they are of course from an earlier age. 

 

 

The first is a Rivarossi model of a FS Gr 835 0.6.0T of which 370 were produced of the prototype between 1906–1922. 

 

 

The second is a Lima model of a FS Gr 851 0.6.0T of which 207 of the prototype were produced between 1898-1911. 

 

No idea what to do with them but they are so very nice.........

 

Rob

 

With the original oil lamps, they're appropriate up until the mid 30s at the latest. Later on they were fitted with electric lights of roughly the same size, but without the triangle on the front. In the 60s smaller, brass electric lights became the norm. They'll be ok with the two-tone brown (castano and Isabella) coaches and wagons labelled FS Italia.

 

851s were designed for local passenger work, so one of them with a couple of coaches and a van is appropriate. Later they became more used for shunting and station pilot work, but a few were still used for local passenger services until 1969. The last few were withdrawn in the early 70s.

 

The 835s were purely shunting locos, used in yards and as station pilots. The last one (835.166) was still in use, as a depot pet at Falconara, until January 1984! Being solely shunting locos, Rivarossi's decision, both on the late 90s version and this modern one released a few years ago, not to include or even give provision for a front coupling is very bizarre!