Cavalex Models All new RTR HAA and variants in 4mm scale

[Mophead45143]

Trains 4U got in touch at the weekend looking for payment, my HOPAB's should be arriving tomorrow they said!

[Trains4U]

We have had some, but not all of the remanufactured wagons delivered 

we are expecting more next week and at least one further batch beyond that.

 

Until they arrive in the UK and are checked, we don’t know for certain exactly what will be arriving.

 

right now, we have two of the six red cradle packs, all three packs of our freight brown HOPABs, our yellow coal sector HAAs and EWS HFAs.

(I don’t know what KMS have)

 

Before we list anything online, we are working through what orders we can fulfil with what we have.  
once the next batch arrives (hopefully at the weekend) we will ship out what we can to anyone who has ordered items from the range delivered to date.

 

I appreciate that the wait has been frustrating, but please bear in mind, the whole batch has been remade.

not fixed… remade, 

 

The problem was identified in mid-May

 

in a little over five months, it has been rectified, tooling modified and thousands and thousands produced, packaged, shipped from China (despite continuing Covid lockdowns and shipping issues) and ready to send out.

 

That, I think, is pretty remarkable!

 

I also appreciate that people wish to be better informed, but we can only tell you what we know, which in all honesty, was not a lot.

 

so now you know what we know.

hopefully by the weekend we can advise what else is available :)

[Mophead45143]

All 9 of my HOPAB's arrived from Trains4U today, and very nice they are too!

 

Cameron

[KMS Railtech]

22 hours ago, Trains4U said:

We have had some, but not all of the remanufactured wagons delivered 

we are expecting more next week and at least one further batch beyond that.

 

Until they arrive in the UK and are checked, we don’t know for certain exactly what will be arriving.

 

right now, we have two of the six red cradle packs, all three packs of our freight brown HOPABs, our yellow coal sector HAAs and EWS HFAs.

(I don’t know what KMS have)

 

Before we list anything online, we are working through what orders we can fulfil with what we have.  
once the next batch arrives (hopefully at the weekend) we will ship out what we can to anyone who has ordered items from the range delivered to date.

 

I appreciate that the wait has been frustrating, but please bear in mind, the whole batch has been remade.

not fixed… remade, 

 

The problem was identified in mid-May

 

in a little over five months, it has been rectified, tooling modified and thousands and thousands produced, packaged, shipped from China (despite continuing Covid lockdowns and shipping issues) and ready to send out.

 

That, I think, is pretty remarkable!

 

I also appreciate that people wish to be better informed, but we can only tell you what we know, which in all honesty, was not a lot.

 

so now you know what we know.

hopefully by the weekend we can advise what else is available :)

Thanks Gareth!

 

just to add , we have one red cradle pack and our yellow cradle coal pack for now. We’ve started shipping what we can so far. As a gesture on our part for the delay, we’re shipping what we can now as a part order and will then ship the remaining part of an order when the items arrive. We know you want to get these marvellous models into your hands asap!

 

Thanks to everyone for their patience and we too are super impressed by the quick turnaround!

[Mophead45143]

Since my Cavalex HOP AB's arrived yesterday, I thought I would have a go at a comparison with the Accurascale equivalents. Since these sort of things can generate quite a bit of debate and even emotion, keep in mind that I have no affiliation with either manufacturer, this is just my own honest assessment. I think both Accurascale and  Cavalex are doing wonderful things for the hobby, and I wish both of them well with these, and future projects.

 

Please excuse the quality of the photos as at times, they aren't great.

 

Packaging

 

Both models come in packs of three in very smart boxes. The Accurascale models are all grouped together in one large box, whereas the Cavalex ones have their own individual smaller boxes, held together by an outer sleeve.

 

 

 

In the box comes a bag of detailing parts. Again the Accurascale ones are all bunched together, whereas the Cavalex ones have an individual bag for each wagon. Of note is that Cavalex have only painted the two brake two pipes (red), whereas the other two pipes are left in black. Accurascale have painted both the brake pipes (red) and the main res pipes (yellow). The Cavalex pipes are curved to represent being secured to the dummy coupling, whereas the Accuracscale ones are more straight to represent an unsecured pipe. 

 

 

First Impressions

 

Both wagons look very smart and sit well next to each other. It's clear straight away that Cavalex have gone for a more matt finish than Accurascale, the latter looking more like a brand new wagon, a condition that didn't last long! After weathering I doubt this will be noticeable though. Both really capture the look and bulk of these hoppers. 

 

 

Decoration

 

As far as decoration is concerned, the Accurascale model (below) wins on the wealth of printed detail. Everything from lamp irons to builders plates have been picked out and text is clearly legible. The only minor thing, and it's minor, is that the OHLE flashes appear slightly larger and perhaps over scale than the Cavalex ones, but that's being really picky. 

 

 

By contrast, the Cavalex model (below) is more modestly decorated, the builders plates for example have been left all black. But in all honesty, anyone planning to weather these will not need to be concerned by this, as all these details were pretty well hidden under a layer of filth!

 

 

 

Of note is that in their first run, Cavalex have produced all three of their packs in the original mid 1960's style of Pre-TOPs lettering. Accurascale have produced this version too, but each pack is slightly different in application of livery details, and they have also produced some TOPs versions too. Each Accurascale pack models the changes in decoration that could be found on these wagons from the mid 1960's to the late 1970's. As such, if you model the mid - late 70's, they are all suitable, as it it was a mix of both Pre-TOPs and TOPs markings then.  

 

Fit & Finish

 

Not much to choose between the two here. When my Accurascale hoppers arrived a few months back, there were only two parts that had fallen off in the box in total, not bad given I ordered a whole rake! Likewise, one piece of the internal door apparatus within the hopper body had come loose on just one of the Cavalex models. Another Cavalex model seemed to be a bit misfortunate however, and suffered from a few defects. Namely, a cradle that didn't quite sit in the chassis properly, a slightly bent buffer, and a slightly larger whole in the hopper body below one of the supporting struts (picture below), and through this could be seen the brown cradle. This was just ONE wagon though, so not indicative of the standards set across the batch, the rest being very well put together.

 

 

Part 2 to follow..........

 

 

Edited November 3, 2022 by Mophead45143

[Mophead45143]

Detailing

 

Both wagons, as expected, are very well detailed. However, I would say that in some areas the Accurascale model has a little bit more finesse and relief. Accurascale have made more use of separately fitted parts, whereas Cavalex have used moulded detail in a few places (such as pipes along the chassis), albeit it's been well executed. The OLEO buffer shanks are slightly finer on the Accurascale model too. These observations do not change perceptions of either model overall, as you would need to be holding them in your hands to notice the difference.

 

Someone with more knowledge on these wagons might be able to explain here, but it's noticeable that the bufferbeam detail is not the same on these models, and that also the pipes on the Accurascale model are fitted to the chassis underneath / behind the bufferbeam, whereas the Cavalex pipes fit directly into the bufferbeam. Is one wrong? Or were there two different versions? It's hard to tell from most of the pictures on Paul Bartlett's website, as once fitted, the pipes will be in roughly the same position. 

 

 

Another thing I noticed was the brake arrangement in the opposing corners of the wagon. As far as I can tell, both are supposed to represent the same design, yet the Cavalex version (top) has more plastic 'flash' around the detail, whereas the Accurascale version (bottom) is clearly defined. This was the case on all of my Cavalex models.

 

 

 

Rivet detail is really nicely picked out on both models, both inside and out. However, Cavalex have missed the rivets on the cradle at the ends of the wagon, whereas the Accurascale model includes these.

 

Shape / Compromises

 

Both models really capture the look of these wagons, gone are the days of the inferior Hornby products! Both models aren’t exactly the same however, the Accurascale model having a slightly more pronounced curvature to the top ends of the hopper, and the overall internal diameter of the hopper on the Cavalex model being ever so slightly longer. I would suggest that Cavalex have got the proportions slightly more accurate here. Both hoppers work out at approx. 102mm long, despite these minor differences.

 

 

However once inside the hopper, the Accurascale model starts to let itself down a bit. There is a seam line along the upper edge on both sides, which is not present on the Cavalex model or the real thing. This is presumably to aid manufacturing of the different varieties of wagon in the MGR family?

 

The other issue which has caused comment before is the fictitious wheel arch on the Accurascale model, which was designed in to accommodate the under scale back to back dimensions of 00 gauge wheels. However, Cavalex have not had to do this on their wagon, and the wheels appear to be the same size (I didn’t have a set of calipers to hand to confirm).

 

Looking underneath the wagon, you can see how the two manufacturers have taken on the challenge. Have Cavalex (bottom) adjusted the dimensions of the bottom of the hopper to suit 00 gauge wheels? If so, it’s not really apparent, and looking back inside the hopper, everything looks correct, with the slight taper in the bottom edge at both ends. It’s hard to say with the wheel arches present if the Accurascale (top) model actually has this taper. Either way, the Cavalex model definitely wins here.

 

 

Interestingly, I noticed some of the levers / linkages on the chassis sides have been modelled in differing positions by each manufacturer. Again, someone with more knowledge may be able to add more info here.

 

Running

 

Both models have a good weight, with my Accurascale hopper weighing in at 53g and the Cavalex at 56g, so not much in it between them. Both hold the road really well.

 

Except for a couple of the Cavalex models which will need some adjustment, both models are free running. However, the Accurascale model is definitely the best. They will start rolling by themselves on even the slightest of gradients, and my Bachmann 08 was capable of hauling 27 with ease! The 08 could never manage 15 of the 1970’s Hornby hoppers without slipping!

 

Rest assured though, videos posted by Cavalex recently have shown that their new class 56 is very capable of hauling a full rake of 36 of their hoppers, and I’m sure other mainline loco classes from different manufacturers will be able to do the same.  

 

 

The Cavalex model wins on close coupling, as can be seen in the pictures (Accurascale above, Cavalex below). That being said, some of the Cavalex coupling weren’t that straight, and didn’t naturally line up properly. The Accurascale ones have a lot more play, but they always return ‘home’. However, I haven’t noticed issues with either model on my points / curves when being pulled or propelled.

 

 

Price

 

Price wise, the Accurascale model is clearly cheaper when buying in bulk, with a saving of about £225 on a rake of 30 when buying direct off their website (they offer a 10% discount on multiple purchases).

 

However, as for which model offers the best value for money, that is really subjective, as I know some people are quite put off with the compromises that Accurascale have adopted inside the hopper for example. That being said, the Accurascale model has better decoration in my opinion, and in one or two areas only, slightly better detail. 

 

Summary

 

In summary, they are both great models that you can run together on your layout. At normal viewing angles the only subtle difference is the shinier finish on the Accurascale wagons, and that won't show up with weathering.

 

I have purchased both, and I am happy with both. Both models have pros and cons, but I can honestly recommend them both to anyone!

 

Cameron

Edited November 3, 2022 by Mophead45143

[Mophead45143]

A couple more photos showing the two side by side (Accurascale left, Cavalex right). The seam line and wheel arch on the Accurascale model is visible here.

 

 

 

Finally, an image of the two types together in a short rake. The closest three to the camera are Accurascale, the rest Cavalex.

 

 

Regards,

 

Cameron

Edited November 3, 2022 by Mophead45143

[RBE]

Thanks Cameron for the in-depth and fair review. We will of course take any comments that customers make that presents to us as less than delightment and revise the model in those areas for future batches.

 

Our aim is complete customer satisfaction.

[Mophead45143]

3 minutes ago, RBE said:

Thanks Cameron for the in-depth and fair review. We will of course take any comments that customers make that presents to us as less than delightment and revise the model in those areas for future batches.

 

Our aim is complete customer satisfaction.

 

You've done a lovely job with them overall, and I am certainly very satisfied! I would be interested in more runs of the early HOP AB, both Pre-TOPs and TOPS!

 

Regards,

 

Cameron 

[RBE]

Also if you are not happy with the wagon with the 'hole' in it, which is very odd, then we will be happy to replace the model for you. 

[Mophead45143]

39 minutes ago, RBE said:

Also if you are not happy with the wagon with the 'hole' in it, which is very odd, then we will be happy to replace the model for you. 

 

Thank you for the kind offer and customer service, but it's something I'm happy to tidy up myself. They'll be getting weathered eventually anyway, so one imperfection won't be noticeable.

 

Cameron

[Roy Langridge]

Thanks for the review @Mophead45143 They are looking very good, and I am very much looking forward to my full rake of red cradle HAAs being here.

 

Roy

[adb968008]

Thanks thats a very interesting review.

 

I’m drawn to the “wheel arches” on the picture it doesnt look big, but it shouldnt be there. How obvious is it ?

[Mophead45143]

35 minutes ago, adb968008 said:

Thanks thats a very interesting review.

 

I’m drawn to the “wheel arches” on the picture it doesnt look big, but it shouldnt be there. How obvious is it ?

 

To be honest, you can only see them when looking directly down from above. My layout, like most, is between waist and chest height, so if the train is halfway across the baseboard, you'll only see part way into the hopper anyway. 

 

Obviously if you're planning on running them loaded, you don't need to worry!!!

 

Cameron

[dj_crisp]

13 hours ago, Mophead45143 said:

 

To be honest, you can only see them when looking directly down from above. My layout, like most, is between waist and chest height, so if the train is halfway across the baseboard, you'll only see part way into the hopper anyway. 

 

Obviously if you're planning on running them loaded, you don't need to worry!!!

 

Cameron

 

Does the shape of the hopper mean they needed to put the arch in? It is a bit odd

[RBE]

I don't think it's hopper shape so much as it's down to manufacturer design decisions. Quite rightly OO back to backs mean that there is less space between them for the hopper body than on the prototype. As a result we have designed our model with the external hopper door level below the solebar at the correct level and because of the necessary material thickness and our door moulding, we have raised the inner floor level by about a millimeter to give clearance for the wheels and negate the wheelarches. Accurascale have also modelled the outer level below the solebar at the correct level, however they have also chosen to go as low as possible internally as well, which is still not quite as low as the prototype due to the real wagon having a 5mm thick skin (which scales to 0.066mm) and the model needing approximately 1 to 1.5mm of plastic in order to mould. This has resulted in introducing the wheelarches internally to account for it. It all comes down to design considerations at the end of the day and we chose to make the internal level of the hopper doors slightly less deep, and thus more plastic in the door thickness to accommodate the wheels and avoid visible wheelarches that aren't on the prototype over trying to get the internal floor a tad nearer to the correct level. 

Edited November 5, 2022 by RBE

[black and decker boy]

Happy to have picked up two packs of HOPABs off Trains4U at Spalding show. Couldn’t get them on the layout as had no suitable EM wheels in my box and none on sale but I’m sure I’ll have them converted soon.

 

A very lovely model. Can’t wait for my preordered red & yellow packs to arrive over next few weeks. I can then set to weathering them into 1990 Scotland condition.

[Lyddrail]

On 03/11/2022 at 13:08, Mophead45143 said:

 

 

 

The Cavalex model wins on close coupling, as can be seen in the pictures (Accurascale above, Cavalex below). That being said, some of the Cavalex coupling weren’t that straight, and didn’t naturally line up properly. The Accurascale ones have a lot more play, but they always return ‘home’. However, I haven’t noticed issues with either model on my points / curves when being pulled or propelled.

Cameron,

Thank you for your review, very helpful. I received some wagons today. The reason the coupling at one end is not straight is the distributer has small pipes which push the coupling to one side. These pipes could be cut off if necessary. 

Cheers.

Edited November 10, 2022 by Lyddrail
spelling

[Grimleygrid]

HAA Project Update

 

 

We are pleased to have received the first two batches of our HAA project which have been delivered to KMS Railtech and Trains4U. The factory is working hard to deliver the rest of the range as soon as practically possible.

 

 

We would like to thank everyone for their patience and understanding over the past few months during this challenging period.
The factory will be sending the remainder of the range in batches over the next month.
Updates will be provided as and when more information becomes available.
 

[Nick-L]

Picked up my first batch of these. I have to say they are mint.  Apart from being a superb rendition of the real thing they have been a doddle to convert to P4.  Great to see the promise to deliver a P4/EM compatible HAA carried through.  Dropped a set of Blackbeetle’s in and we are off. Superb. 
 

[mevaman1]

Great to chat to both Alex and Cav over the Warley weekend.  As a Cornish modeller, I am excited to see the exquisite rendition of the tarpaulin covers on the CDAs.  
 

This is another livery worth considering.  Note how the ECC logo on the side has been removed but you can still see the edge of the blue ‘box’ of colour.  We (Redruth MRC) have modelled this using Hornby wagons.

Edited November 29, 2022 by mevaman1
Typo

[The Fatadder]

9 minutes ago, mevaman1 said:

Great to chat to both Alex and Cav over the Warley weekend.  As a Cornish modeller, I am excited to see the exquisite rendition of the tarpaulin covers on the CDAs.  
 

This is another livery worth considering.  Note how the ECC logo on the side has been removed but you can still see the edge of the blue ‘box’ of colour.  We (Redruth MRC) have modelled this using Hornby wagons.

I badger Alex and Cav about this every time I see them (and Will even more frequently), though in reality I will be removing the logo from my first 6 (or 8) and then weathering.

 

Do you have any more close ups of the real thing like the photo you shared?  Ideal inspiration for weathering

 

[mevaman1]

3 minutes ago, The Fatadder said:

I badger Alex and Cav about this every time I see them (and Will even more frequently), though in reality I will be removing the logo from my first 6 (or 8) and then weathering.

 

Do you have any more close ups of the real thing like the photo you shared?  Ideal inspiration for weathering

 

I’ll take a look through my CDA photos and share any more that I have.

[mevaman1]

CDAs behind 37675 in RfD livery at Par on 07/08/93.  These clearly show the blue square outlines on the sides.

[The Fatadder]

I never realised the outline was blue, I was always under the impression it was grey for some reason (with the mark being left when the blue ecc vinyls peeled off).  
 

how did you go about modelling it last time?  My thinking was tending toward drawing a transfer for the thin surround