Hornby 2022 Range - pre-announcement frothing - now closed

[Dunsignalling]

The answer to Hornby not making what we want is clear.

 

Spend the money on something else or with somebody else, Blue boxes, holiday, other hobby, whatever.

 

In times past, in an average year, Hornby got at least a couple of thousand out of me, in the last three, not close to half that, and that's included a few "nice-to-have" clearance offers that I wouldn't normally have bothered with, e.g., half-a-dozen Collett corridors....

 

I spent the surplus on a nice new Compact System camera outfit, more expensive than I originally planned on, and lens number five arrived yesterday. That would have been one level down the range and the kit amassed over a much longer period had Hornby not been making loads of stuff that holds no interest for me and very little that has.

 

Their loss, Panasonic's gain, and IMHO mine too! Thanks, Hornby, I'm enjoying it. 

 

Now, 2022... Back to trains, or a studio lighting system? Am I getting out of the habit of buying trains?

 

John 

Edited January 8, 2022 by Dunsignalling

[Sprint]

How does one identify or know who a Tier 1 dealer is if you wanted to place a pre-order with any of them?

[Pmorgancym]

29 minutes ago, spamcan61 said:

Abso - flipping - lutely, 100% agree. Manufacturers focus on manufacturing and leave retailing to shops. Not the way it's going though ...

Trying to envisage the Hornby equivalent of an Apple store?

Bearded men in identical cardies and beige cords, called Brian and Geoff.

Refusing to fix your broken model but offering to sell you a refurbished one at not quite full price 

 

 

 

[RJS1977]

1 hour ago, Downer said:

You must be in east Surrey, because the Alton Model Shop, just across the western border in Hampshire, is hard to beat.

 

And not to mention Kernow in Guildford and Addlestone Model Centre.

[spamcan61]

13 minutes ago, Pmorgancym said:

Trying to envisage the Hornby equivalent of an Apple store

 

I was thinking this morning that Hornby basically want to be the Apple of the toy trains world; and from a manufacturer's perspective who wouldn't.

[spamcan61]

24 minutes ago, The Stationmaster said:

No - I think some cancellations - certainly for Rails - predated the tier system and the resultant end customer (and probably retailer) outcry was the reason the tier system was introduced.

OK fair enough in terms of Rails specifically, but the point being made remains, the river of tiers has impacted people's 2020 pre-orders. 

[Hroth]

49 minutes ago, Sprint said:

How does one identify or know who a Tier 1 dealer is if you wanted to place a pre-order with any of them?

 

You have to know the correct handshake, for starters....

[adb968008]

54 minutes ago, RJS1977 said:

 

And not to mention Kernow in Guildford and Addlestone Model Centre.

These are my local two.. Addlestone is about 45-60 min drive each way depending on traffic. Kernow is about 1h -1hr30,  Alton is about 90-120 mins .. (I drop in usually at MHR galas ).

 

if you factor in quality time when your there, its not much change from 4 hours minimum.. which is a big chunk of a Saturday (havent investigated if they do nights).

 

Actual closest is Janes in Tooting (and I was there watching 69002/3 on RHTT to Wimbledon on Thursday..but it was nearer to midnight in horrendous rain )… trouble is by car its near impossible, by train on that loop is a risk given 50% service cancelation rates on a 30 min frequency, plus its still 40/60 mins each way… oh and their opening hours are quite works of fiction.. I gave up after 3 attempts…each took 3 hours round trip to find a closed shop that said it was open.

 

Croydon/Redhill/Wimbledon/Clapham area would be a nice location if someone is thinking of opening a shop… I drove past what used to be past Lens of Sutton the other day..both locations.. one is a B&Q, the other a private house, Norwood junctions shop is closed. Mick Charles has gone, as was the shop in Epsom.

 

Considering we have clubs in Croydon, Epsom, Carshalton, Wimbledon, Bromley etc..  and “The” MRC club in the area, its a surprise there is no retail demand on the suburbs of the SWR or SR from London…

 

Sadly mail order, takes minutes, and I takes my chances on a shop when I get lucky in the vicinity of one.

 

The fastest shop to me is Amazon… I can order Hornby and have it delivered within 8 hours, same day, even sundays has happened once.. fulfilled by Amazon from their local hub 4 miles away... whilst I dont want to encourage it though, but it worked.

 

Perhaps a pop-up shop in a retail converted bus is needed “Rails on Wheels” ?.. or a model shop on Deliveroo ?

Edited January 8, 2022 by adb968008

[Widnes Model Centre]

37 minutes ago, Sprint said:

How does one identify or know who a Tier 1 dealer is if you wanted to place a pre-order with any of them?

 

I think the simple answer is, you can't. I know what Tier we are in and I know one shop who is Tier 1, one that is Tier 3.

One might think their local model shop is Tier 1, 2 or 3. But only the owner and Hornby will know.

Hornby does not give details of who is in what Tier, I can understand the confidentiality side of this or do I?

We were informed this week that we had once again failed in our appeal to get to Tier 1. No reason was given which doesn't help. Hornby are well aware of our frustration at this and we see it as counterproductive to our maintaining and growing our business.

We have and will remain loyal customers to Hornby, their products are important to us and I have a family history with my mother and pretty much every aunt who all worked at Binns Road. There are some really nice people at Hornby and many we would refer to as friends.

 

Just to repeat the information we received from Hornby:

 

"As we moved into 2021 and acknowledging that the allocation system was not functioning as hoped we introduced a Tier system where each of our existing retailers were placed in one of the three tiers. Tier 1 relates to those retailers that amongst other things maintain a clean and well laid out store and who promote several of the Hornby Hobbies ranges. These retailers will usually have an effective website and mail order service. Importantly they should also be able to provide help and guidance to their customers as well as having a good credit and payment history, while at the same time adhering to the Hornby Hobbies terms of trading.

Those who have been nominated to Tier 2 tend to be the types of outlet that include heritage centres or museums. Those outlets designated Tier 2 must also be able to offer help, support and advice for their customers and are willing to promote Hornby products. Good credit and payment history must also be a factor and their willingness to accept and work within the Hornby Hobbies terms and conditions of trading. Tier 2 will also include those on-line retailers who are also prepared to offer help, support and guidance to their customers."

 

This was the frustrating element for us. Referring to the "Types of outlet that include heritage centres and museums.... include those on line retailers who are prepared to offer help etc.....".

 

That really hurt being put into that classification. If it had said anything but as above I think we would have been happy. My wife, Gill was particularly upset as she well remembers and overheard conversation between two reps "I'll give them six months before they close". That was in February 2011. Nearly eleven years later we have built a "superb shop and business". Not my description. We have helped other model shops set up and assisted as best we can with advice etc.

 

What I would say; is get your order in early to your local model shop, preferred seller and give them a chance to supply your new order. Otherwise you may lose your local shop, seller due to not knowing what Tier they are in. We have told all our customers our Tier Status. It is better to be upfront, that is our opinion. On Friday of this week we asked all our customers to get their orders in as quickly as possible. If we cannot supply them they will be the first to know.

Support your local shop, preferred supplier otherwise they may end up in Tiers or Tears.

Looking forward to Monday, but it may well be a bit of a Jim Bowen Bullseye moment..... "Here's what you could have won".

We will certainly be placing our orders as soon as allowed to do so.

[Dunsignalling]

Sounds like the Tier system is primarily a "divide-and-rule" strategy on Hornby's part.

 

John

 

Addition:

 

It all looks quite rational on the surface, but the advantage conferred by carrying multiple Hornby brands automatically benefits those with the largest premises,

 

If you specialise in model railways (and therefore are likely to be better at that than a generalist shop) but don't have the space to carry Airfix, Scalextric etc. you are automatically penalised at least one Tier. Unless, of course, one is willing to expel other railway brands to make room (Lightbulb Moment). However, who in their right minds would place their entire egg-supply in the Hornby basket?

 

In the medium/long term, this arrangement can only encourage small/medium shops into the arms of the competition, so Hornby would be wise (for their own benefit) to reconsider the structure. Unless, of course, that is what they want.... 

 

As this hobby becomes more expensive, the real money is increasingly being spent by established enthusiasts who are all too aware of the alternatives, not newcomers who have never heard of anyone but Hornby.

 

John

Edited January 8, 2022 by Dunsignalling

[adb968008]

 

1 hour ago, Widnes Model Centre said:

What I would say; is get your order in early to your local model shop, preferred seller and give them a chance to supply your new order. Otherwise you may lose your local shop, seller due to not knowing what Tier they are in. We have told all our customers our Tier Status. It is better to be upfront, that is our opinion.

Support your local shop, preferred supplier otherwise they may end up in Tiers or Tears.

Looking forward to Monday, but it may well be a bit of a Jim Bowen Bullseye moment..... "Here's what you could have won".

We will certainly be placing our orders as soon as allowed to do so.

100%… if you dont you could end up living in an area where I am living in…

 

where needing a packet of wheels, or some track pins, becomes a 3 day and £4.99 postage thing.
Its the accessories that hurt the most, when breaking my worm puller, and my option is waiting 20 days for another to come from China, as the item is too niche for any mail order shops to list, and you've no where to go buy one…

 

ive a Bachmann 4MT heading on 3 months now awaiting a worm puller strong enough to remove it.. Ive broken 2 pullers already trying to get it off…Chinese ones are cheap, but you can't handle them first for durability.

 

Thats what imo Hornby is missing, if they are encouraging everything via their site and burying retail… they might win the headline, but lose a less seasoned customer, and the shop too down the road.

Theres a reason why Manufacturers manufacture, and why Retailers Retail.. each has their excellence…

 

Edited January 8, 2022 by adb968008

[CUCKOO LINE]

1 hour ago, spamcan61 said:

I was thinking this morning that Hornby basically want to be the Apple of the toy trains world; and from a manufacturer's perspective who wouldn't.

But Apple, Samsung etc seem to make enough to keep everyone happy , even if the initial batch sells out more follow eventually

[ruggedpeak]

Hornby are not Apple on so many levels. Simon Kohler doesn't wear a black turtle neck for a start.          

[No Decorum]

3 hours ago, wombatofludham said:

That was appalling and to me is indicative of Hornby's lack of interest in post-steam modellers.  They had to be dragged kicking and screaming into another run of the hugely popular and high demand Intercity version, then having gone to the expense of fitting the electronics to control lighting functions by DCC, "forget" to seal the lighting unit.  They might as well have removed the circuitry and lighting and marketed it at the price of a hauled coach.  Fortunately I had one from the first batch, and although I did buy one of the light bleeders for a second rake, I can always use the second one as hauled stock following a TDM failure, at least until I can get round to fixing the light bleed.

However, when this sort of thing happens it is almost always on non-steam items and just stokes the arguments many of us have about Hornby not being serious about their non-steam customers.

Hornby is certainly falling badly behind when it comes to diesel and electrics but it equally certainly isn’t because Hornby takes care with its steam models. About a year ago, Mr. Kohler said in a video to contact him and let him know which models we would like Hornby to make. There are some steam models I would particularly like but after reflection, I decided that I didn’t particularly want Hornby to make them. Consequently Mr. Kohler remains without my (ha ha) invaluable help and advice.

Edited January 8, 2022 by No Decorum
Superfluous word removed.

[The Stationmaster]

24 minutes ago, Kim Durose said:

Not the best place to meet girls either at a guess 

Well they do seem to appear in Apple shops but the most unusual one  I have come across was in our local branch of Jewsons a while back and she was enquiring about the different sizes and availability of cable ties.  She didn't say of she wanted them in various shades of grey but she definitely had the attention of both staff and other customers.

[No Decorum]

2 minutes ago, The Stationmaster said:

Well they do seem to appear in Apple shops but the most unusual one  I have come across was in our local branch of Jewsons a while back and she was enquiring about the different sizes and availability of cable ties.  She didn't say of she wanted them in various shades of grey but she definitely had the attention of both staff and other customers.

She doesn’t sound like the sort who would bring you tea and a suggestive biscuit in bed. 

[Markwj]

2 minutes ago, No Decorum said:

She doesn’t sound like the sort who would bring you tea and a suggestive biscuit in bed. 

I hope you meant to type suggestive biscuit it made it so much funnier!

[BlueLightning]

6 hours ago, farren said:

Sorry of topic slighty but still related. If I order X from Hornby the price stays the same even if X then has multiple price increases before release. Is it the same for retailers on their orders? 

 

With the latest price rises I got an email from Hornby at my shop saying prices for any existing orders would stay the same, and that I had another week to order at the old price, can't say about previous prices rises, as I haven't been at the shop that long.

 

Gary

[spamcan61]

52 minutes ago, CUCKOO LINE said:

But Apple, Samsung etc seem to make enough to keep everyone happy , even if the initial batch sells out more follow eventually

True, I was thinking more of their degree of control over the retail network and selling price.

[D9020 Nimbus]

I'm wondering if there's any connection between the two YouTube videos on Monday — and which of the arranged their slot first. The Rapido video appears to have the title "cat among the pigeons", so perhaps it just refers to Lion…

[No Decorum]

12 minutes ago, Markwj said:

I hope you meant to type suggestive biscuit it made it so much funnier!

Thank you. I did.

[BlueLightning]

6 minutes ago, D9020 Nimbus said:

I'm wondering if there's any connection between the two YouTube videos on Monday — and which of the arranged their slot first. The Rapido video appears to have the title "cat among the pigeons", so perhaps it just refers to Lion…

 

Hornby's appears "earlier" in my subscription feed, meaning they scheduled their slot first, judging by the videos in between by a couple of hours at least

[wombatofludham]

If Hornby did coffee, would it be instant cappuccino?  All froth and a definite unpleasant aftertaste?

[sirwilliamfrs]

From left field, how about a Class 93 Tri-mode? By the time Hornby could produce it they will be in service. 

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_Rail_Class_93_(Stadler)

 

 

[newbryford]

58 minutes ago, sirwilliamfrs said:

From left field, how about a Class 93 Tri-mode? By the time Hornby could produce it they will be in service. 

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_Rail_Class_93_(Stadler)

 

 

 

Already announced by Revolution Trains.

edit: info

February 2021: https://www.revolutiontrains.com/revolution-goes-tri-mode-with-rog/

 

Edited January 8, 2022 by newbryford