Bachmann announce all new Class 37

[Daddyman]

10 hours ago, The Fatadder said:

Significantly better than the Accurascale one as well….

Agreed! Finally got rid of my Accurascale one this evening on ebay, just in time to take advantage of the MRD offer and get some proper 37s!    

Edited December 14, 2023 by Daddyman

[The Fatadder]

21 minutes ago, dj_crisp said:

Although i wouldnt mind a Bachmann 37/6 ;)  Specifically some St Blazey ones.... 

if you ever fancy converting a 37/4 into one I can sort you out with some new nose grills per 674 and 521 (will be on Will’s 674 eventually as well)

[dj_crisp]

4 minutes ago, The Fatadder said:

if you ever fancy converting a 37/4 into one I can sort you out with some new nose grills per 674 and 521 (will be on Will’s 674 eventually as well)

 

Cheers Rich! I'm doing a bit of armchair modelling 37 wise... just being lazy and waiting to see if Bachmann do one for me 😀

 

 

[andyman7]

50 minutes ago, dj_crisp said:

 

I have fond memories of my lima 37s but times move on and I don't own any anymore. 

 

It's probably just a case of a bit of saturation of models causing a dip in prices. Maybe also some overstocking by individual shops as there's more offers around atm extending beyond Bachmann.

 

Accurascale definitely have the better marketing of the two manufacturers and perhaps the model of pre-ordering works better to maintain prices and assess demand. 

 

Maybe it's as simple as people are just enjoying their older models more too. I know i am.... and I have too many anyway so will be moving alot of mine on and I'm not looking to replace. I get the feeling I'm not alone. 

 

Although i wouldnt mind a Bachmann 37/6 ;)  Specifically some St Blazey ones.... 

 

 

I don't think Bachmann and Accurascale are in quite the same place regarding their marketing intentions. The Accurascale approach is very much tailored to pre-ordered batch production with the intention that casual purchase will be in the minority. Bachmann's models are 'stock' items, certain liveries or specs may sell out quickly but 37s (and 47s, and 90s) you can expect to find on the shelves for a couple of years particularly if you are flexible on livery.
Once the initial six-week discounting (beyond 15%) embargo is over, individual retailers will make choices over what they want to shift to create cash flow. Remember, a VAT-registered Limited Company business can justify selling some leftover inventory at a loss and offset that against tax so the hit is nothing like the 'headline' effect.
There is no 'best' retailer out there - I have occasionally had great bargains from small local retailers, whilst TMC, Kernow, Rails, Bure Valley Railways and Hattons will periodically produce a 'best' sale price that leave the others behind - no one retailer is 'always' cheapest. 
As I have said before, there have been A LOT of 37s released in the past year and the prospect of more liveries to come so it is entirely understandable if a retailer decides that they have taken the bulk of the profit that they are likely to from batches released to date and will seek to free up cash and space by letting some stock go at or near cost price.
I've ended up with three of the new Bachmann 37s, one Accurascale one plus one sold on as it was out of period; I've also got two Bachmann older ones too. That's still way more than I 'need' (as much as I 'need' any of this) 🙂 

[97406]

I think the recent prices have made up my mind to wait for my 37069. In the meantime I had a look at Model Railway Solutions’ website (following an earlier post) and there’s plenty of DCC ready for £160, sound fitted for £220 and SFX for £250 without the need for Twitter/X. A shame in a way that I have pretty much all the 37s I wanted from the current production runs, only really waiting for flush-fronted refurbs.

[NHY 581]

8 hours ago, andyman7 said:

I don't think Bachmann and Accurascale are in quite the same place regarding their marketing intentions. The Accurascale approach is very much tailored to pre-ordered batch production with the intention that casual purchase will be in the minority. Bachmann's models are 'stock' items, certain liveries or specs may sell out quickly but 37s (and 47s, and 90s) you can expect to find on the shelves for a couple of years particularly if you are flexible on livery.
Once the initial six-week discounting (beyond 15%) embargo is over, individual retailers will make choices over what they want to shift to create cash flow. Remember, a VAT-registered Limited Company business can justify selling some leftover inventory at a loss and offset that against tax so the hit is nothing like the 'headline' effect.
There is no 'best' retailer out there - I have occasionally had great bargains from small local retailers, whilst TMC, Kernow, Rails, Bure Valley Railways and Hattons will periodically produce a 'best' sale price that leave the others behind - no one retailer is 'always' cheapest. 
As I have said before, there have been A LOT of 37s released in the past year and the prospect of more liveries to come so it is entirely understandable if a retailer decides that they have taken the bulk of the profit that they are likely to from batches released to date and will seek to free up cash and space by letting some stock go at or near cost price.
I've ended up with three of the new Bachmann 37s, one Accurascale one plus one sold on as it was out of period; I've also got two Bachmann older ones too. That's still way more than I 'need' (as much as I 'need' any of this) 🙂 

 

 

Sorry to correct you, Andy but it is a six month period before discounting can exceed 15%. 

 

There won't be many, if any retailers who will discount to the extent MRD have just done. 

I suspect there are a number of retailers who have relatively large stocks of Bachmann 37s left on the shelves due to the sales of the Accurascale equivalent and this in turn  is reflected in the stocks remaining with Bachmann themselves, hence the recent '37 bundles' now on sale with various retailers. 

 

Rob

[97406]

11 hours ago, Southernman46 said:

Stand AS's 37001 & Bachmann's 37034 next to each other and they are equally as good - performance wise (on DC) close as makes any odds - £122 is an absolute bargain for the Bachmann 37's IMHO.

We are lucky to have such choice and abundance - remember when 😲

 

 

It scrubs up quite well though! 😁😜🙃

 

[GordonC]

14 hours ago, Matt said:

Or could Bachmann have had unopened pallets at the back of the warehouse as orders weren’t as expected - after a while they “relaunched “ them to try shift them?  I’m sad that these models aren’t selling well as likely to result in less new releases in future - they are a nice bit of kit (snowploughs aside). I think these models ARE a significant improvement on the old Bachmann 37 (more so than 47 was vs old Bach model) but have arrived on the market at the wrong time with AS’s competition and people’s finances being a little tighter probably.

 

I wonder whether there could possibly also be an impact from how many models are released from the same area in the same batch where buyers would be interested in multiple - 37043, 37401 and 37423 will all have been 1980s Eastfield locos so possibly competing for buyers cash at once. Admittedly if a 37/4 model is produced, the bulk of the fleet will have been at Eastfield in a variety of liveries for a good chunk of time.

 

not that I mind, thats what I model and have bought all

Edited December 14, 2023 by GordonC

[dj_crisp]

2 hours ago, 97406 said:

 

It scrubs up quite well though! 😁😜🙃

 

 

I think I can see the difference.... you've changed the couplings.

[andyman7]

3 hours ago, NHY 581 said:

 

 

Sorry to correct you, Andy but it is a six month period before discounting can exceed 15%. 

 

There won't be many, if any retailers who will discount to the extent MRD have just done. 

I suspect there are a number of retailers who have relatively large stocks of Bachmann 37s left on the shelves due to the sales of the Accurascale equivalent and this in turn  is reflected in the stocks remaining with Bachmann themselves, hence the recent '37 bundles' now on sale with various retailers. 

 

Rob

No need to apologise, indeed thanks for clarifying!

I agree that MRD is the extreme end of discounting, and noting Bachmann's policies they are careful to avoid 'stock dumping' so we can expect 37s fed to the market at a steady state with various retailer promotions.

[adb968008]

On 14/12/2023 at 08:15, NHY 581 said:

 

 

Sorry to correct you, Andy but it is a six month period before discounting can exceed 15%. 

 

There won't be many, if any retailers who will discount to the extent MRD have just done. 

I suspect there are a number of retailers who have relatively large stocks of Bachmann 37s left on the shelves due to the sales of the Accurascale equivalent and this in turn  is reflected in the stocks remaining with Bachmann themselves, hence the recent '37 bundles' now on sale with various retailers. 

 

Rob

Ive bought nearly 10 Bachmann 37’s.

none of them have been over 6 months old, and all are purchased greater than 15%.

indeed its lead to me canceling pre-orders, because its wasteful. 

its not just Bachmann, ive someone elses loco from Warley is winging its way back, as I bought it £50 cheaper just 2 weeks later from the same seller.

mass discounting 2 weeks before christmas, is actually very worrying imo…

 

whats concerning me more though is one major retailers bargain sale is undelivered, 16 days later and are in a tit for tat with their logistics company about whether it was actually despatched or not… only to find I’m not the only person currently in the same situation with that retailer,  and suspect theres maybe others too.

 

 

Edited December 15, 2023 by adb968008

[brushman47544]

3 hours ago, adb968008 said:

mass discounting 2 weeks before christmas, is actually very worrying imo…

I quite agree. Christmas is when retailers would normally expect to see better overall sales than at any other time of the year.

 

I suspect Bachmann has found itself between a rock and a hard place with its new 37s. No doubt they will have already committed to substantial development costs when Accurascale made its announcement so couldn’t withdraw or delay. Now that both Bachmann’s and Accurascale’s 37s are available the market has become saturated and in that case do you sell at close to cost while there is strong interest at that price, to dispose of inventory, or hold on and hope that sales continue but slowly over a year or more? I would say that the latter carries the greater financial risk as you could end up not selling them at all.

Edited December 14, 2023 by brushman47544
Clarity

[IOW O2]

6 hours ago, adb968008 said:

........whats concerning me more though is one major retailers bargain sale is undelivered, 16 days later and are in a tit for tat with their logistics company about whether it was actually despatched or not… only to find I’m not the only person currently in the same situation with that retailer,  ..........

Any clues to who this is, had a notification earlier from a current major player who is knocking DCC ready ones out at £161 inc. p&p, I may wish to avoid hitting the 'buy' button tomorrow?  Would consider cancelling my Accura for the same model.

Edited December 14, 2023 by IOW O2
Diction

[adb968008]

59 minutes ago, IOW O2 said:

Any clues to who this is,

At the moment that would be unfair on the retailer, who should have benefit of the doubt, there could be more or less to it.

I suspect if its more than a couple of coincidental isolated incidents and the retailer doesn't resolve it,  then no doubt its own thread will appear.

 

In my case, its now with my credit card company to resolve.

Edited December 15, 2023 by adb968008

[scottrains29]

16 hours ago, NHY 581 said:

There won't be many, if any retailers who will discount to the extent MRD have just done. 

I suspect there are a number of retailers who have relatively large stocks of Bachmann 37s left on the shelves

All the big retailers occasionally discount by >50%. Hattons have just had a big sale with many new models well over 50% off. TMC regularly have similar sales and Kernow can often be one of the cheapest for certain models.

 

Kernow, Rails, TMC etc all currently seem to have a large amount of Bachmann 37s to shift. I highly suspect we'll see further discounts on the 37s in the coming weeks. MRD probably wanted to get in early before the boxing day/ jan sales start with other retailers.

[Daddyman]

6 hours ago, scottrains29 said:

Kernow, Rails, TMC etc all currently seem to have a large amount of Bachmann 37s to shift. I highly suspect we'll see further discounts on the 37s in the coming weeks. MRD probably wanted to get in early before the boxing day/ jan sales start with other retailers.

Agree. I got 401 from MRD while the going was good, but didn't go for 194 at £160 in the TMC offer as I suspect there'll be better after Christmas. 

 

By the way, if anyone wants a real bargain, Hattons have 37034 second hand for - wait for it - £196!  

Edited December 15, 2023 by Daddyman

[NHY 581]

6 hours ago, scottrains29 said:

All the big retailers occasionally discount by >50%. Hattons have just had a big sale with many new models well over 50% off. TMC regularly have similar sales and Kernow can often be one of the cheapest for certain models.

 

Kernow, Rails, TMC etc all currently seem to have a large amount of Bachmann 37s to shift. I highly suspect we'll see further discounts on the 37s in the coming weeks. MRD probably wanted to get in early before the boxing day/ jan sales start with other retailers.

 

As highlighted in bold, this is the issue and one which I suspect could well a change in the way Bachmann will do things. 

If retailers are holding large stocks then yes, they may well discount them to death, to free up the capital they have tied up in these dust gatherers...........but........this potentially means that come the next batch, there will be an adjustment made to how the retailers order, i.e, they order less. This means that Bachmann may be left holding the excess stock.....leading to,  as we're seeing now, Bachmann offer bundle deals to retailers to empty the warehouse.....in turn Bachmann eventually decide to produce less of each variant or even less variants.

 

So, when a retailer slashes the prices of their stock, as MRD have just done whilst good for us the customer it's actually bad for the retailer concerned. 

 

Rob. 

[IOW O2]

9 hours ago, adb968008 said:

I suspect if its more than a couple of coincidental isolated incidents and the retailer doesn't resolve it,  then no doubt its own thread will appear.

Fair dos'.

[MikeParkin65]

For whatever reason the original RRP of the Bachmann 37 was always going to be a problem which was compounded by comparison with the AS offering.

 

Taking price out of the equation for a moment the models are much closer together in terms of accuracy, detailing, finish and functionality than perhaps is the common perception. I've got both Bachmanns D6710 and AS's D6700, the former in SFX spec at the point where Rails had them for £30 more than an AS sound fitted example. For that £30 I get 'tinted windows' which are very effective (and mask the slight prismatic effect of the untinted Bachmann glazing). I also get a spinning fan. £30 worth of added value I feel. I am very happy with both models but I do think that the Bachmann version is better than the AS in the following ways:-

• Paint finish is deeper, has a realistic sheen and to my eyes is a better rendition of BR Green
• Zimo chip rather than ESU which runs smoothly straight from the box. AS D6700 smooth with sound off, with sound on wont move until speed step 10 at which point it sets of quite abruptly. Appreciate this will be adjustable via CV's but shouldnt need to do this. Had the same with the AS Deltic. 
• Painted black wheels (or if they are blackened its more effective than the AS blackening).
• The indicator gauge on the fan end nose (sorry - dont know its proper name) has a marker present  - its blank on the AS version.

Fine distinctions I know but the Bachmann model should really be considered as more than an 'also ran'. I think the market does now have more class 37's than it an absorb in one go but I'm not so sure the Bachmann markdowns are a sign of desperation. I think its more an acknowledgment that the RRP was pitched too high at the beginning and consequently the momentum was lost as potential buyers hung on for the later delivery of the AS model at a keener price. Some real bargains being had at the moment but I doubt they are being sold at a loss - just not as much profit as was originally envisaged. 

 

 

Edited December 15, 2023 by MikeParkin65

[SulzerPeak]

There dosent seem to be the sound or failing motor issues with Bachmann?

[IOW O2]

Your right, not like the other manufactures 55's,92,37's, now at 91% motor issue with these over 42 models via my local.

 

Have decided to go with Bach for my b/blue37 and renumber, and will cancel my pre-order for a 31 and 37 from the other maker.

 

A question, how easy would it be to convert the Baccy domino to a numerical one using Accra 55 leftover ones, the only good thing about the 55, ease of change of head code?

[55020]

58 minutes ago, IOW O2 said:

not like the other manufactures 55's,92,37's, now at 91% motor issue with these over 42 models via my local

 

If that were representative then AS would no longer be in business.  Although I'm at 100% of my AS locos not having any issues 😉

 

 

Steve

[97406]

10 hours ago, SulzerPeak said:

There dosent seem to be the sound or failing motor issues with Bachmann?

 

I’ve had a motor run rough on one of my 40s, but as I’d lowered the height and done other things to infringe the warranty I bought a replacement from the very excellent Bachmann Spares website for around 20 quid! There is also the risk of a screw dropping in and making its way into the motor compartment and jamming the motor. Fortunately no permanent damage resulted in that case, but I had to dismantle the loco to investigate and retrieve said screw. Using up to 8 screws to hold a locomotive body on is perhaps my biggest gripe with Bachmann models. The times I’ve done the ‘final’ reassembly and noticed something that needs the body off again, or when the screws cross thread in the hole! Clips are (or should be) the future!

 

As regards Class 37s, 6 Bachmann retools and 4 Accurascale 37s all run fine, though 2 of the Bachmann models (both bought as 37430 Cwmbran) had one of the pickup wires detached from one of the bogies that I fixed myself.

 

I suspect any issues with Bachmann locos are dealt with by their support less publicly due to them working on stuff more behind closed doors.

[NHY 581]

11 hours ago, IOW O2 said:

Your right, not like the other manufactures 55's,92,37's, now at 91% motor issue with these over 42 models via my local.

 

Have decided to go with Bach for my b/blue37 and renumber, and will cancel my pre-order for a 31 and 37 from the other maker.

 

A question, how easy would it be to convert the Baccy domino to a numerical one using Accra 55 leftover ones, the only good thing about the 55, ease of change of head code?

 

Mindful of the fact that not every purchaser of Accurascale locos is a contributing member of Rmweb, what we see on here is a  small percentage of overall sales therefore a small percentage issues.

But, I have to cast doubt on those figures you quote. Working at an Accurascale stockist, we have sold similar, if not more 92s and 37s and have not had one returned by a customer for any issue, let alone a motor issue. This includes instore as well as those sent mail order.  Neither have we had cause to return one to Accurascale  for an issue discovered pre sale, i.e testing prior to concluding a ssale.Therefore, it's fair to conclude that overtime these locos remain as sold and have not developed any issues. 

 

In addition, given our relationship with our customers, if there had been any issues or returns direct to Accurascale, I'm pretty confident we'd be aware of this as it would soon filter through. 

 

So, based on the above personal experience I have to say  those figures have to be viewed as incorrect. If they weren't we'd see far more comment than we have done regarding motor issues and, given their engagement and transparency, no doubt there would be comment from Accurascale themselves. 

 

Rob. 

 

 

[NHY 581]

1 minute ago, BachelorBoy said:

 

It would be helpful to know how many have you sold.

 

Dozens? Hundreds? Thousands?

 

As I say similar numbers, certainly close enough to cause me to doubt the suggestion that roughly 4 locos out of 42 were fit for purpose. 

 

Rob.