Hornby announce TT:120

[JSpencer]

19 hours ago, D9020 Nimbus said:

The Peco track pins are long and thin. They can be prone to bending (using a pin-pusher helps avoid this). More seriously, if your baseboard is fairly thin the point can penetrate to the reverse side. They aren't specifically N gauge, IIRC.

 

 

The SL-14 are literally to be push through the sleeper and into something soft like sundeala board https://peco-uk.com/products/track-fixing-pins?_pos=1&_sid=489204cb9&_ss=r

 

They also do track fixing nails which require drilling a hole on the sleeper but can then be nailed into say plywood. https://peco-uk.com/collections/peco/products/fixing-nails

 

Hornby do track fixing nails that are rather fat from the last time I brought some 25 years ago!

 

[Hroth]

Just got an email from Hornby reminding me about the 10th.

 

It also highlighted the best selling trainsets of 2022, including "The Easterner", but not "The Scotsman". If thats so, why did they hurry "Scotsman" out for Christmas instead of "Easterner"?

 

Grumble grumble grumble....

 

[cctransuk]

21 minutes ago, JSpencer said:

 

The SL-14 are literally to be push through the sleeper and into something soft like sundeala board https://peco-uk.com/products/track-fixing-pins?_pos=1&_sid=489204cb9&_ss=r

 

They also do track fixing nails which require drilling a hole on the sleeper but can then be nailed into say plywood. https://peco-uk.com/collections/peco/products/fixing-nails

 

Hornby do track fixing nails that are rather fat from the last time I brought some 25 years ago!

 

 

I use SL-14 in plywood - but pre-drill with an undersized drill.

 

That way, the pins go in very easily, and it is possible to adjust the vertical profile of the track prior to ballasting.

 

CJI.

[The Stationmaster]

8 minutes ago, cctransuk said:

 

I use SL-14 in plywood - but pre-drill with an undersized drill.

 

That way, the pins go in very easily, and it is possible to adjust the vertical profile of the track prior to ballasting.

 

CJI.

I also pre-drill (undersize) for track pins when laying track on MDF.

[Hobby]

27 minutes ago, Hroth said:

It also highlighted the best selling trainsets of 2022, including "The Easterner", but not "The Scotsman". If thats so, why did they hurry "Scotsman" out for Christmas instead of "Easterner"?

 

Because it looks better and will be the one featured in the new series on TV next Sunday? TBH I think it's done us a favour, we can see what's happening with the Scotsman sets and will be better prepared for when our Easterner sets arrives to deal with any issues - like ditching that controller!! ;)

[Hroth]

4 minutes ago, Hobby said:

 

Because it looks better and will be the one featured in the new series on TV next Sunday? TBH I think it's done us a favour, we can see what's happening with the Scotsman sets and will be better prepared for when our Easterner sets arrives to deal with any issues - like ditching that controller!! ;)

 

I suppose so, but still...

 

Grump...

 

[Dunsignalling]

37 minutes ago, Hroth said:

Just got an email from Hornby reminding me about the 10th.

 

It also highlighted the best selling trainsets of 2022, including "The Easterner", but not "The Scotsman". If thats so, why did they hurry "Scotsman" out for Christmas instead of "Easterner"?

 

Grumble grumble grumble....

 

 

You really need to ask? 🥸

Edited January 5, 2023 by Dunsignalling

[Porfuera]

2 hours ago, Hroth said:

Just got an email from Hornby reminding me about the 10th.

 

It also highlighted the best selling trainsets of 2022, including "The Easterner", but not "The Scotsman". If thats so, why did they hurry "Scotsman" out for Christmas instead of "Easterner"?

 

Grumble grumble grumble....

 

 

I don't think I've had that email yet so obviously I'm commenting without having seen it, but I think I'd take those 'best sellers' with a pinch of salt if they're saying that a set announced in a new scale in Q4 this year has outsold their long-established and pre-existing sets in OO - things like Satan's Express, Coca-Cola, stuff like that. Plus if I were them I'd be trying to promote stock that isn't selling quite so well in order to get if off the shelves.

 

It seems more likely to me that the 'best sellers' are something (randomly?) computer-generated and/or maybe based on your order history and marketing preferences... I'm not knocking it, just saying it seems a little counter-intuitive.

 

I doubt we'll ever find out but I'd also be interested to know whether 'The Easterner' really has outsold 'The Scotman' given the prestige that the word 'Scotman' has with the public at large when it comes to railways and given that they're the target group that Hornby say they're trying to attract to the new scale. 

 

Cheers, Neil.

[Steamport Southport]

1 minute ago, Porfuera said:

 

I don't think I've had that email yet so obviously I'm commenting without having seen it, but I think I'd take those 'best sellers' with a pinch of salt if they're saying that a set announced in a new scale in Q4 this year has outsold their long-established and pre-existing sets in OO - things like Satan's Express, Coca-Cola, stuff like that. Plus if I were them I'd be trying to promote stock that isn't selling quite so well in order to get if off the shelves.

 

It seems more likely to me that the 'best sellers' are something (randomly?) computer-generated and/or maybe based on your order history and marketing preferences... I'm not knocking it, just saying it seems a little counter-intuitive.

 

I doubt we'll ever find out but I'd also be interested to know whether 'The Easterner' really has outsold 'The Scotman' given the prestige that the word 'Scotman' has with the public at large when it comes to railways and given that they're the target group that Hornby say they're trying to attract to the new scale. 

 

Cheers, Neil.

 

That would be "best seller" on their website though.

 

I would expect people buying the 00 stuff would be buying them from model shops, online retailers or on the High Street more than going straight to Hornby's website.

 

 

Jason

[Porfuera]

16 minutes ago, Steamport Southport said:

 

That would be "best seller" on their website though.

 

I would expect people buying the 00 stuff would be buying them from model shops, online retailers or on the High Street more than going straight to Hornby's website.

 

 

Jason

 

As I mentioned I haven't seen the mail - I was assuming that the best sellers were for all sales across all outlets given it was 'best selling trainsets of 2022' but point taken that it could be just for direct website sales. 

 

In that case maybe TT:120 would outstrip them all given that it is not available anywhere else and also that OO sets will be cheaper on the High Street or almost anywhere rather than direct from Hornby.

Edited January 5, 2023 by Porfuera

[teletougos]

On 19/12/2022 at 10:36, frobisher said:

 

I should really hope not, that's not how modern manufacturing works.  It's normal to maintain a complete set of tooling for each loco (even if parts are shared with another) .  If you're tooling from scratch, which they are, you might as well get it right first time or you'll get roasted by reviewers.

 

Plenty of locos over the years have been manufactured with worse chassis discrepancies than that, and it has meant little.

We’re talking 1.5mm over the total wheelbase here. 

[Dunsignalling]

16 minutes ago, teletougos said:

Plenty of locos over the years have been manufactured with worse chassis discrepancies than that, and it has meant little.

We’re talking 1.5mm over the total wheelbase here. 

The usual gap between loco and tender introduces a greater discrepancy than that.

[frobisher]

1 hour ago, teletougos said:

Plenty of locos over the years have been manufactured with worse chassis discrepancies than that, and it has meant little.

We’re talking 1.5mm over the total wheelbase here. 

 

But "sharing" a chassis is pretty pointless these days, you'll only be saving maybe half a day's CAD work to adjust one to be correct for the other, and then cutting that separate tooling you'd making anyway.

 

[Talltim]

On 10/10/2022 at 12:47, Not Jeremy said:

But where's the Titfield Thunderbolt....©️

 

At the top of the page😉

[andrewshimmin]

6 hours ago, Hroth said:

Just got an email from Hornby reminding me about the 10th.

 

It also highlighted the best selling trainsets of 2022, including "The Easterner", but not "The Scotsman". If thats so, why did they hurry "Scotsman" out for Christmas instead of "Easterner"?

 

Grumble grumble grumble....

 

 

Because they'd already decided to get Scotsman out first before anyone pre-ordered anything and before there were delays? They always said Scotsman would be first. And quite right too 😜.

[Ravenser]

5 hours ago, Porfuera said:

 

I don't think I've had that email yet so obviously I'm commenting without having seen it, but I think I'd take those 'best sellers' with a pinch of salt if they're saying that a set announced in a new scale in Q4 this year has outsold their long-established and pre-existing sets in OO - things like Satan's Express, Coca-Cola, stuff like that. Plus if I were them I'd be trying to promote stock that isn't selling quite so well in order to get if off the shelves.

 

I

 

Cheers, Neil.

 

 

Is this a typo or a startling new item in the steampunk/heavy metal range????

[frobisher]

10 hours ago, Hroth said:

Just got an email from Hornby reminding me about the 10th.

 

It also highlighted the best selling trainsets of 2022, including "The Easterner", but not "The Scotsman". If thats so, why did they hurry "Scotsman" out for Christmas instead of "Easterner"?

 

Grumble grumble grumble....

 

Possibly it was simple analysis of their pre-orders.

• After the manufacturing delays caused by the wheel weight issue, maybe Hornby knew they were going to come up short one way or another to fulfill all the pre-orders accrued to that date.
• As the more expensive set, it is likely the Scotsman orders would lag behind those of the Easterner and had perhaps tailled off to a trickle.
• As such, you could probably fulfil all those pre-orders with a bit of a margin in a production run for Scotsman, whereas orders for Easterner were still accumulating at a fair rate perhaps meaning a larger production batch that time wouldn't permit to fulfil the totality of orders likely by the end of production wasn't possible.
• This leaves three possibilities;

1. Scotsman Only : Pre-orders covered pretty much, and happy punters (mostly) get those sets around Christmas.
2. Easterner Only : Pre-orders covered to some extent, but with some disappointed punters wondering why they didn't get their set around Crimbo.
3. Both Sets produced: Serious shortfalls on both pre-orders causing much disappointment and peeps questioning why some got both sets they pre-ordered, yet others who ordered one getting none, some who ordered both getting one but not the other etc.

• Obviously 1. looks to be the easiest/best path from a PR and manufacturing point of view if production has to be restricted to hit the Christmas deadline.  Also with the higher price point, a better movement within the internal books for the company cashflow wise.

This is of course based on the assumption that almost everyone who ordered the Scotsman before a certain date have either now got it or knows it is on the way, and is no way based on actual insider information being purely speculative.

[Porfuera]

3 hours ago, Ravenser said:

Is this a typo or a startling new item in the steampunk/heavy metal range????

 

I blame autocorrect 🙄

[Ravenser]

18 minutes ago, Porfuera said:

 

I blame autocorrect 🙄

 

It's the very devil....

[bradfordbuffer]

On 05/01/2023 at 22:45, frobisher said:

 

Possibly it was simple analysis of their pre-orders.

• After the manufacturing delays caused by the wheel weight issue, maybe Hornby knew they were going to come up short one way or another to fulfill all the pre-orders accrued to that date.
• As the more expensive set, it is likely the Scotsman orders would lag behind those of the Easterner and had perhaps tailled off to a trickle.
• As such, you could probably fulfil all those pre-orders with a bit of a margin in a production run for Scotsman, whereas orders for Easterner were still accumulating at a fair rate perhaps meaning a larger production batch that time wouldn't permit to fulfil the totality of orders likely by the end of production wasn't possible.
• This leaves three possibilities;

1. Scotsman Only : Pre-orders covered pretty much, and happy punters (mostly) get those sets around Christmas.
2. Easterner Only : Pre-orders covered to some extent, but with some disappointed punters wondering why they didn't get their set around Crimbo.
3. Both Sets produced: Serious shortfalls on both pre-orders causing much disappointment and peeps questioning why some got both sets they pre-ordered, yet others who ordered one getting none, some who ordered both getting one but not the other etc.

• Obviously 1. looks to be the easiest/best path from a PR and manufacturing point of view if production has to be restricted to hit the Christmas deadline.  Also with the higher price point, a better movement within the internal books for the company cashflow wise.

This is of course based on the assumption that almost everyone who ordered the Scotsman before a certain date have either now got it or knows it is on the way, and is no way based on actual insider information being purely speculative.

Wow we have gone from 10th October's Andy York announcement for Hornby tt120 to this post! Was much simpler in 80s you caught the bus to town walked to beatties...bought a Lima 31 with the money you saved from your paper round and was well chuffed even if it had faults...

No one speculated on what why and how!

Let's leave the business case, logistics and marketing to the experts....enjoy the models play trains and let's not pretend to be MDs of international companies! Unless you are! then please continue with in depth analysis and speculating. 

 

Edit note!...just for clarity this little rant not directed at any one post but the general direction thread drifting in...

Edited January 8, 2023 by bradfordbuffer
Clarity

[Hroth]

Ok.

Just to muddy the waters a bit...

 

In the March 1957 issue, RM announced "TT IS HERE!", covering the release of what we now call Triang TT3.  By the May 1957 issue, retailers were advertising TT sets, locomotives, carriages, wagons and track off the shelf. Other manufacturers were producing track* too.

 

Here we are, a similar distance in time between announcement and now, and all there is to show is an out of stock first release trainset and some scraps of track, all only available from Hornby.

 

TT120 is all very laudable, and I'd like it to succeed in gaining a market space, but it looks like Hornby are about to shoot themselves in the foot.

 

* Peco and Gem.  There may have been locos too, but the mag isn't to hand at this very moment...

 

[Jeff Smith]

50 minutes ago, Hroth said:

TT120 is all very laudable, and I'd like it to succeed in gaining a market space, but it looks like Hornby are about to shoot themselves in the foot.

Such a negative view and indicative of the current time of instant gratification........

[Ravenser]

57 minutes ago, Hroth said:

Ok.

Just to muddy the waters a bit...

 

In the March 1957 issue, RM announced "TT IS HERE!", covering the release of what we now call Triang TT3.  By the May 1957 issue, retailers were advertising TT sets, locomotives, carriages, wagons and track off the shelf. Other manufacturers were producing track* too.

 

Here we are, a similar distance in time between announcement and now, and all there is to show is an out of stock first release trainset and some scraps of track, all only available from Hornby.

 

TT120 is all very laudable, and I'd like it to succeed in gaining a market space, but it looks like Hornby are about to shoot themselves in the foot.

 

* Peco and Gem.  There may have been locos too, but the mag isn't to hand at this very moment...

 

 

Peco track and buildings are also available

[Porfuera]

11 minutes ago, Ravenser said:

Peco track and buildings are also available

 

Yes I just checked and L/H and R/H points and also DCC clips are now available. When did that happen? I set up stock alerts for all three but I haven't received anything. Not that I'd have anything to run on track yet... although I suppose I could always model a Beeching branch line until some stock arrives...

Edited January 6, 2023 by Porfuera

[andythenorth]

3 hours ago, bradfordbuffer said:

let's not pretend to be MDs of international companies! Unless you are! then please continue with in depth analysis and speculating. 

Some of us are 🙂  And there are also some people on rmweb who seem to know a lot about international logistics and manufacturing 🙂

 

But yes, fair point well made.

Edited January 6, 2023 by andythenorth