EFE Rail Class 143/144 Pacer

[JDW]

I think those are some very fair points, it's hard to judge or make a sound conclusion without knowing the whole facts, and I don't think the team at Realtrack are the type of people who will want to get engaged in long drawn-out conversations online about business matters. The one thing I have wondered, given that Charlie has said there's an updated 143/144 to come, is why? The existing one might not be quite to the same level of the 142, but it's a very good model already, I doubt there are many people out there clamouring for it to be upgraded. Is that because the tooling was no longer usable for whatever reason, or because they knew that this one was coming and didn't see any point re-issuing the original model themselves, or just a business decision unrelated to this, I wonder?

 

I'd certainly have liked to have seen more liveries released on the 143/144 and to see Realtrack get the reward from those, having developed the product (and the DMU genre more generally), the Regional Railways and TWPTE in particular, as well as older West Yorkshire schemes, so from that perspective the EFE one fills a gap, but as others have said, without knowing the full details, its hard to take a 'moral' view of the EFE version, and I suspect many will either not know or still go ahead and buy one anyway. 

[wombatofludham]

There's still scope for Charlie's upgraded 143/4 to become a definitive model, especially as there are still iconic liveries to be made (WYPTE/early Metro, Provincial blue, non sewage farm dunked GWR and Reggie Rail).  In effect a new definitive 143/4 would be in the same market as the Realtrack 156 versus the other model where my money went oop north rather than darn sarf. Upgraded detailing and features will further differentiate the models.

In a way whatever the provenance of the EFE model I suspect there will be some market left for an upgraded 143/4 model after the 142, which might mean the potential impact for Realtrack and any new model is manageable.

[franciswilliamwebb]

4 minutes ago, wombatofludham said:

non sewage farm dunked GWR and Reggie Rail

 

😄

 

Effluent Flung Everywhere 😉

[adb968008]

2 hours ago, wombatofludham said:

There's still scope for Charlie's upgraded 143/4 to become a definitive model, especially as there are still iconic liveries to be made (WYPTE/early Metro, Provincial blue, non sewage farm dunked GWR and Reggie Rail).  In effect a new definitive 143/4 would be in the same market as the Realtrack 156 versus the other model where my money went oop north rather than darn sarf. Upgraded detailing and features will further differentiate the models.

In a way whatever the provenance of the EFE model I suspect there will be some market left for an upgraded 143/4 model after the 142, which might mean the potential impact for Realtrack and any new model is manageable.

its been 14 years and weve only had a handful of 143/144’s.

who knows that might have a bearing on why these are here and, why now.

 

Theres definitely a market for pacers.

But times like this its charles darwin who decides…

 

Quote

It is not the most intellectual of the species that survives; it is not the strongest that survives; but the species that is able best to adapt and adjust to the changing environment in which it finds itself.

The environment changed.

I think Agile is needed.

 

 If Realtrack still has control over its tooling, turning them out quick, in all the right liveries would imo, beat making customers waiting longer for a better one, unless the wait is another decade. Chosing the right manufacturer, to broadcast a wider range of liveries at once, including via their channels maybe beat piecemeal deliverables that a larger deeper pocketed competitor can move.

if the EFE model is successful, (which looks to be so), they will churn out more, over time and eat that market pushing clamouring demand for a better one ever further out. I’m not sure a third 143/144 would really be wise at the current juncture.

 

In my mind all power to a 142, and maybe a 141.

 

i’m always against duplicate toolings, it doesnt really benefit the customer unless its true innovation plus on the older one. The EFE one is a minor step up on the Realtrack one, hence its now or never… i’m not parting with either as they are the closest ive ever seen two duplicate models… the 142’s however are dog old.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited February 21, 2023 by adb968008

[scouse889]

1 hour ago, wombatofludham said:

non sewage farm dunked GWR and Reggie Rail

 

One of the best quotes of the year so far!  🤣

EFE - please take note, and count me in for a faeces-free version of both.

[ruggedpeak]

2 hours ago, adb968008 said:

But you dont know.

 

We don't know whats between the layers from the retailer, back to the factory, comissioners, designers, architects, tooling manufacturer, product assembley line… we don't know any of it, we dont know the contract in place or its-terms, there could be several companies involved.. we don't know.

 

We dont need to know.

 

But as a consumer you cannot walk the street avoiding Tescos cornflakes because they look identicalish to Kelloggs.

 

As a consumer, its our choice to take sides, boycott or support, but you have to have faith in the system that what your buying or not buying is right… theyve come through customs, gone to the shelves and retailers are selling them.

 

If Realtrack, in an official capacity, feels they have a grievance, they need to go the correct legal routes for recourse, prove it, and get recompense etc.  If not, bad blood in the water has potential to reverse flow back the other way from EFE and say they are damaging their sales...

 

I fully agree, its very unusual but as a consumer its not our fault, we are not responsible so we shouldn't be afraid.

 

i’m sympathetic to Realtracks comments, and what I look at in front of me,  leans their direction, but cant form a balanced view on whats known so far, as not much is known… so as a consumer I have to trust that honesty and integrity has taken place, but that somewhere in this an unhappy outcome may have occurred, but thats for those parties to resolve.
 

It would be nice to know its been made with Realtracks blessing, if that is the case, so far EFE hasnt suggested its needed, neither has Realtrack, if you read between the lines.

Neither has Rapido, who acknowledges their involvement in Newsletter 10, in 2017..

https://myemail.constantcontact.com/Rapido-News-UK-Vol--10.html?soid=1101318906379&aid=6dazJANxFxE#class142
 

We cant judge EFE, they may just have been opportunistic, these could have turned up in someone elses box, we just dont know.. and more surprises may yet follow.

Interesting that you have become a self appointed arbiter of other people can do or think. I can and do judge EFE based upon the available information if I so choose. And I can post that on here (subject to proviso below and the forum rules). I can judge who I like when I like, I AM THE LAW. Oh wait, I'm not Judge Dredd or God so imposing instant retribution or sentencing isn't in my gift😞.

 

I don't eat own brand cornflakes as I know they aren't made by Kelloggs cos 1) they taste different and 2) it says so on the Kelloggs box. I'm also not afraid, not quite sure what I'm supposed to be afraid of in this scenario? As for trusting businesses to tell the truth 🤣 When it gets to the point where I need faith (religion?) to buy model trains then it is time to get a new hobby! Question is do I go Phil Collins (Jesus He Knows Me) or George Michael (Faith) on this one?

 

Anyone involved in any form of consumer activity over the last few decades will be aware that consumers are taking a much greater interest in the back story of their products - Red Tractor, FSC, and similar marks etc. My purchasing is to some degree influenced (conciously or otherwise) by the ethical behaviour of suppliers, and this will often be only partially informed and on occasions may even be wrong 😱. If I perceive underhand behaviour I may make decisions accordingly. Whether it is accurate or fully informed is not overly relevant, particularly since we are all making only partially informed decisions most of the time. I expressed my view, however I doubt EFE or Bachmann could give two hoots 🦉🦉.

 

If I cross a line no doubt the Mods will be along to serve Pulp Fiction style rightful vengeance upon me (or just delete my post)! In the mean time, from what I see and know it looks a bit fishy. That may change but I will be the arbiter of that. Whether I "know" it or not........😉

 

Phil wins, Jesus knows....

 

 

 

[Mark C]

There are so many lines from Jesus He Knows Me that can be applied throughout this site...it's scary (as though Messrs. Banks, Rutherford and Collins (a railway modeller, and proud of it!) had a premonition in 1991 when they wrote it)!!

 

Mark C (with a space)

[adb968008]

1 hour ago, ruggedpeak said:

Interesting that you have become a self appointed arbiter of other people can do or think. I can and do judge EFE based upon the available information if I so choose. And I can post that on here (subject to proviso below and the forum rules). I can judge who I like when I like, I AM THE LAW. Oh wait, I'm not Judge Dredd or God so imposing instant retribution or sentencing isn't in my gift😞.

 

I completely didnt get this, so I translated this to Xhosa..

 

Quote

Kuyanika umdla ukuba ube ngumlamli ozityumbileyo wento enokwenziwa ngabanye abantu okanye bacinge ngayo. Ndiyakwazi kwaye ndiyayigweba i-EFE ngokusekelwe kulwazi olukhoyo ukuba ndikhetha njalo. Kwaye ndingathumela oko apha (ngokuxhomekeke kwiproviso engezantsi kunye nemithetho yeforum). Ndiyakwazi ukugweba umntu endimthandayo xa ndithanda, NDINGUMTHETHO. Owu linda, andinguye uMgwebi uDredd okanye uThixo ngoko ke ukunyanzelisa imbuyekezo ekhawulezileyo okanye isigwebo akukho kwisipho sam😞.

and I still dont understand it in that language either.

 

 

1 hour ago, ruggedpeak said:

I don't eat own brand cornflakes as I know they aren't made by Kelloggs cos 1) they taste different and 2) it says so on the Kelloggs box. I'm also not afraid, not quite sure what I'm supposed to be afraid of in this scenario? As for trusting businesses to tell the truth 🤣 When it gets to the point where I need faith (religion?) to buy model trains then it is time to get a new hobby! Question is do I go Phil Collins (Jesus He Knows Me) or George Michael (Faith) on this one?

 

Phil Collins, he was in the Great Train Robbery remake in 1985.

 

1 hour ago, ruggedpeak said:

 

Anyone involved in any form of consumer activity over the last few decades will be aware that consumers are taking a much greater interest in the back story of their products - Red Tractor, FSC, and similar marks etc. My purchasing is to some degree influenced (conciously or otherwise) by the ethical behaviour of suppliers, and this will often be only partially informed and on occasions may even be wrong 😱. If I perceive underhand behaviour I may make decisions accordingly. Whether it is accurate or fully informed is not overly relevant, particularly since we are all making only partially informed decisions most of the time. I expressed my view, however I doubt EFE or Bachmann could give two hoots 🦉🦉.

 

I totally agree.

 

1 hour ago, ruggedpeak said:

 

If I cross a line no doubt the Mods will be along to serve Pulp Fiction style rightful vengeance upon me (or just delete my post)! In the mean time, from what I see and know it looks a bit fishy. That may change but I will be the arbiter of that. Whether I "know" it or not........😉

 

Phil wins, Jesus knows....

 

 

 

Ole phil. good choice

 

I think you put quite a lot of thought to that reply.

But I think you may have misinterpreted what I said, or at least taken it too personally.

 

But its certainly lightened up the last page.
 

Edited February 21, 2023 by adb968008

[ruggedpeak]

7 minutes ago, adb968008 said:

But I think you may have misinterpreted what I said, or at least taken it too personally.

 

I have absolutely no idea what you were trying to say, by the time I got to the cornflakes bit I was really lost!! But fun anyway.

 

I don't take it personally and hope you don't either. I'm in bed with COVID so it has made the afternoon slightly more bearable.

Edited February 21, 2023 by ruggedpeak
typo

[andyman7]

13 minutes ago, Mark C said:

There are so many lines from Jesus He Knows Me that can be applied throughout this site...it's scary (as though Messrs. Banks, Rutherford and Collins (a railway modeller, and proud of it!) had a premonition in 1991 when they wrote it)!!

 

Mark C (with a space)

I don't know about saving anyone's soul but was thinking to myself of the enormous savings that could be made by boycotting first Hornby, and then Bachmann/EFE 🙂

Edited February 21, 2023 by andyman7

[adb968008]

2 hours ago, ruggedpeak said:

I have absolutely no idea what you were trying to say, by the time I got to the cornflakes bit I was really lost!! But fun anyway.

 

I don't take it personally and hope you don't either. I'm in bed with COVID so it has made the afternoon slightly more bearable.

I’m all good.

 

As Lyneux said on the other page, I care, so I tend to go deep into it. Sometimes maybe I come across too passionate.

(though i’m not admitting to counting rivets).

 

 

hope you get well !..

i thought at one point you were going REM though…

 

 

 

Ive bought plenty of Realtrack 143’s (its assembly is a pain in the butt). Ive bought one EFE… its assembly is a bit ho-hum too. I hope the 142 learns from both. ive a guess which factory I think made this EFE 143 now ive been through it end to end, but not one of the names so far. Its got the tinest fly wheels on those twin motors ive seen in oo… Why its got twin motors in one coach, and nothing in the other seems odd.. plus it means two different chassis… maybe it was a rush, shortcut ?.. i’m worried the twin motors longevity in the efe one, especially if one dies making the whole unit useless.

 

If it were me designing this i’d have done it the same way as BR.. treat the chassis as a wagon frame, inside the frame of the coach, so it drops out as a cradle. Both attempts here are a faff and messy to dissassemble. Hornbys for that matter wasnt much better but was easiest of the lot, even if its oversized for its day. Personally I think just give it one motor and traction tyres, or grooved wheels, end the pain…
 

 

Edited February 21, 2023 by adb968008

[scouse889]

26 minutes ago, ruggedpeak said:

I don't eat own brand cornflakes as I know they aren't made by Kelloggs cos 1) they taste different and 2) it says so on the Kelloggs box.

.....but I'd rather have a bowl of coco-pops?

[SHerr]

I was looking at the T&W model yesterday in my local shop as I’m changing my layout to something based around Hexham area.

 

I noticed that the model on display seems to have significant amounts of paint ‘sag’ at the bottom of the roof within each rivet bay. It didn't seem as noticeable on the Valleys one and the 2 weathered ones looked fine (ignoring the weathering!).

 

The shop was too busy to ask for a look at others in stock, has anyone else noticed similar or is this a one off bad un?

[adb968008]

Heres mine with lights on..

 

seems very white…

 

 

 

9 minutes ago, SHerr said:

I was looking at the T&W model yesterday in my local shop as I’m changing my layout to something based around Hexham area.

 

I noticed that the model on display seems to have significant amounts of paint ‘sag’ at the bottom of the roof within each rivet bay. It didn't seem as noticeable on the Valleys one and the 2 weathered ones looked fine (ignoring the weathering!).

 

The shop was too busy to ask for a look at others in stock, has anyone else noticed similar or is this a one off bad un?

roof close ups..

 

 

[SHerr]

26 minutes ago, adb968008 said:

Heres mine with lights on..

 

seems very white…

 

 

 

roof close ups..

 

 

Thanks for that, looks better than the one in the shop. Possibly the widening of the strips on the roof has accumulated a bit of paint and also accentuated the appearance of the paint sagging. I hadn’t realised the strips were not easily width all the way across. I don’t think the gloss helps either which is maybe why the weathered roof looks better. 

[Ouroborus]

5 hours ago, adb968008 said:

I’m all good.

 

As Lyneux said on the other page, I care, so I tend to go deep into it. Sometimes maybe I come across too passionate.

(though i’m not admitting to counting rivets).

 

 

hope you get well !..

i thought at one point you were going REM though…

 

 

 

Ive bought plenty of Realtrack 143’s (its assembly is a pain in the butt). Ive bought one EFE… its assembly is a bit ho-hum too. I hope the 142 learns from both. ive a guess which factory I think made this EFE 143 now ive been through it end to end, but not one of the names so far. Its got the tinest fly wheels on those twin motors ive seen in oo… Why its got twin motors in one coach, and nothing in the other seems odd.. plus it means two different chassis… maybe it was a rush, shortcut ?.. i’m worried the twin motors longevity in the efe one, especially if one dies making the whole unit useless.

 

If it were me designing this i’d have done it the same way as BR.. treat the chassis as a wagon frame, inside the frame of the coach, so it drops out as a cradle. Both attempts here are a faff and messy to dissassemble. Hornbys for that matter wasnt much better but was easiest of the lot, even if its oversized for its day. Personally I think just give it one motor and traction tyres, or grooved wheels, end the pain…
 

 

.

Just to clarify, both the EFE and Realtrack have twin motors in one car and the other free running.  On the Realtrack version, the cogs are exposed.  The EFE will spin its wheels very 'happily' and slow running is poor.    Unless you really want the livery, I don't think it's worth the money

[adb968008]

52 minutes ago, Ouroborus said:

.

Just to clarify, both the EFE and Realtrack have twin motors in one car and the other free running.  On the Realtrack version, the cogs are exposed.  The EFE will spin its wheels very 'happily' and slow running is poor.    Unless you really want the livery, I don't think it's worth the money

Realtrack has 1 motor, centrally mounted under the body with two drive shafts, one to each axle.

below is an image of both..

 

upper image is the EFE one, you can see the two 2mm brass fly wheels  off the ends of the two motors mounted to the axles (yes when you remove the lump weight, they do spring upwards and hang loose held by soldered wires as seen).

 

The lower one is the Realtrack mount, which is actually more reminiscent on the new class 158, and 121.. a central motor going directly at low level to the axles… which was an innovation at its time.

 

imo that Realtrack drive mechanism is better than the twin motor set up on the EFE one, which I fear may in the future be prone to problem or failure, given its small size and risk of fighting each other over time.

 

That said both are somewhat messy to assemble / dissassemble due to the desire to have a sprung bounce effect (which I dont think really works as the chassis weight on the spring turns it into a damper).

I think it suffers being ahead of its time.

Imo having a sub frame, that drops out the two axles and motor as a separate unit from a mainframe would be cleaner. There could be several improvements to the intercoupling wiring and light bars too.

Similarly a cast chassis (and I hate to say it, but traction tyres on one axle) could solve many of its problems.

 

 

Edited February 21, 2023 by adb968008

[Ouroborus]

1 minute ago, adb968008 said:

Realtrack has 1 motor, centrally mounted under the body with two drive shafts, one to each axle.

below is an image of both..

 

upper image is the EFE one, you can see the two 2mm brass fly wheels  off the ends of the two motors mounted to the axles.

 

The lower one is the Realtrack mount, which is actually more reminiscent on the new class 158, and 121.. a central motor going directly at low level to the axles.

 

imo that Realtrack drive mechanism is better than the twin motor set up on the EFE one, which I fear may in the future be prone to problem or failure, given its small size and risk of fighting each other over time.

 

 

Apologies, yes, should have been clearer in what I posted.

 

I wasn't exactly thrilled with the running of my Realtrack version, it was much noisier and i seem to have lost directional lights at one end.  Still, it has stood a while.

 

The dcc on the EFE is bloody weird.

 

The more i watched the EFE trundle back and forth, the more i thought of the Hornby 142.  Aside from the lighting...

[adb968008]

20 minutes ago, Ouroborus said:

 

 

The dcc on the EFE is bloody weird.

 

the whole chassis, motor, wiring and springing is.

imo its got suspension thats competing against the weight designed to give it traction.

 

The bus wiring does look a little “familiar” to other products though, which maybe a clue as to who revamped what.

 

20 minutes ago, Ouroborus said:

 

The more i watched the EFE trundle back and forth, the more i thought of the Hornby 142.  Aside from the lighting...

 

Hornby 142 was basic but worked, once you through wired it. Later in the 1990’s Hornby even made it 1 motor too… and its all plastic with just a small “wagon” weight… so it shows it was possible to do it, and not only pull itself but something else too.

 

There secret was not to make it too heavy, but the motor strong enough, and having weight in the right place… on the motor itself (ie a metal frame encapsulating it dragging it down).

Today an equivalent smaller 5 pole motor should do the job fine. I think Hornby missed a trick not running it in the 2018-2020 period, but its window is now gone.

 

Assuming lessons learned on the new 142 all will be good. If the new 142 is like either of these 143’s i’ll be moaning… they work, they look good but they are a bit messy when they stop… reminds me of changing the armature in Airfix royal scots… thats not the easiest either.

 

 

 

 

 

Edited February 21, 2023 by adb968008

[Rhydgaled]

10 hours ago, wombatofludham said:

There's still scope for Charlie's upgraded 143/4 to become a definitive model, especially as there are still iconic liveries to be made (WYPTE/early Metro, Provincial blue, non sewage farm dunked GWR and Reggie Rail).

Could it be significant, I wonder, that the Realtrack website has been advertising class 143s in GWR and Regional Railways liveries (presumably sans sewage) for some time?

 

On 20/02/2023 at 23:26, adb968008 said:

The chassis itself is the same, but with modifications, the motor cradle for the Realtrack design is still present, but instead the model uses twin motors to each axle. The positions for the screws holding the coach floor weight are in different locations…

Despite what I wrote here on Sunday, I've not been able to bring myself to send the e-mail to Rails Of Sheffield requesting a refund-return - I've had a ValleyLines Pacer on my model railway 'wants list' for years so I'm finding it hard to part with this one. So perhaps you can help me out by answering a couple of questions:

1. are those coreless motors (in the EFE and Realtrack class 143s)?
2. can the interior (and destination blind) lights on the EFE class 143 easily be disconnected/turned off/disabled without breaking them or going DCC?

Edited February 22, 2023 by Rhydgaled

[Rhydgaled]

1 hour ago, adb968008 said:

Hornby 142 was basic but worked, once you through wired it. Later in the 1990’s Hornby even made it 1 motor too… and its all plastic with just a small “wagon” weight… so it shows it was possible to do it, and not only pull itself but something else too.

 

There secret was not to make it too heavy, but the motor strong enough, and having weight in the right place… on the motor itself (ie a metal frame encapsulating it dragging it down).

Today an equivalent smaller 5 pole motor should do the job fine. I think Hornby missed a trick not running it in the 2018-2020 period, but its window is now gone.

Are the equipment boxes etc. on the underframe very different between the class 142, 143 and 144? If not, could they possibly tool up new basic class 142 and 143/144 bodys (two bodies representing the three classes) to fit their existing class 142 chassis as a 'Railroad' model for the modeller on a budget. Or is it just not econmic to produce new toolings for 'budget range' products and only super-detail models are worth the manufacture's while?

[adb968008]

7 hours ago, Rhydgaled said:

Are the equipment boxes etc. on the underframe very different between the class 142, 143 and 144? If not, could they possibly tool up new basic class 142 and 143/144 bodys (two bodies representing the three classes) to fit their existing class 142 chassis as a 'Railroad' model for the modeller on a budget. Or is it just not econmic to produce new toolings for 'budget range' products and only super-detail models are worth the manufacture's while?

Realtrack has made a new 142, here..

I guess not that long before its due.

 

 

With 2 companies potentially able to offer a 143/144, and a Hornby 142 which already is railroad, imo  it wouldnt make sense to do a Railroad one, but stranger things have definitely happened already around this model.

 

I’d prefer a 141 myself once the dust has settled after these.. then for the brave theres this..

 

 

Edited February 22, 2023 by adb968008

[russ p]

1 hour ago, adb968008 said:

Realtrack has made a new 142, here..

I guess not that long before its due.

 

 

With 2 companies potentially able to offer a 143/144, and a Hornby 142 which already is railroad, imo  it wouldnt make sense to do a Railroad one, but stranger things have definitely happened already around this model.

 

I’d prefer a 141 myself once the dust has settled after these.. then for the brave theres this..

 

 

 

Is there any hope of that running again,  I remember looking round it at Holbeck when doing my driver training in the 80s

[No Decorum]

On 19/02/2023 at 18:44, Rhydgaled said:

Not for long in this case for me - the big nasty world outside came crashing down onto my layout as soon as I tried to couple the DMS and DMSL of my shiny new ValleyLines Pacer. The 8-pin electrical coupling is angled upwards and therefore doesn't line up with the 8 little holes on the other carriage - so the two won't go together. I showed my mechanically-minded brother who said that, even if I'd received one which wasn't broken, he didn't think the coupling was very robust and would soon break if one was to couple/uncouple it often. I've not had a model with an electrical coupling between coaches before, so I don't know if the lights on the dummy car are supposed to work when not coupled to the motor car (the head/tail lights on the old-tool Bachmann 158s are certainly supposed to work on both cars without being coupled, but then they don't have an electrical connection). If they are supposed to work without being coupled to the motor car, then the dummy car lights are another thing that is broken on mine.

 

For something that cost me £212.45 I expected to have knocked off or broken several tiny seperately fitted detail parts by now, but the only thing that fell off is the hook from one of the tension lock couplers - which I have put back on ready to return the model. This Pacer is very disapointing for the price, the fact you get a full interior / the motor is hidden being the one big win I can see. That aside, it seems we are being asked to pay for things like sound (I think I read that there is a speaker in the thing somewhere) and interior lighting which cannot be taken advantage of without futher expense converting to DCC (or a stayalive of some sort for the lights). I tried to turn the lights off with the switch underneath but that only took out the directional lighting - the interior lighting still flashed on and off as I turned the power dial...

 

Maybe I'd keep it if it had been sold at the £170 price tag of the FirstGW-liveried example on the RealTrack website, since nobody is likely to do a ValleyLines Pacer in 00 again, but even that would be a bit expensive for me.

One of my Realtrack models shorted when I applied power. A crack, smoke and total failure. At the time, Charlie told me it had happened to three models. I returned it but it got “lost”, so I admit to being a bit jaundiced about them. There certainly seemed to be a tendency by Rapido models to produce models which were difficult to get into; perpetuated in the GNR single and 16XXs, although the Austerity seems to be a bit better from that point of view. As for EFE, sometimes a decent model is produced but a lot seem to be a half-way house. The Pacers don’t seem to have even got half way. Is the general idea that the real things were flawed, so models should be too?

[Pillar]

I've been test running my T&W PTE version. In general it runs ok, but at low speeds and when starting off it has quite a severe 'cogging' effect. Has anyone else experienced this with theirs or am I looking at a faulty example?

 

I'm running it on a Loksound V5 from Legomanbiffo (which is excellent as always).