EFE Rail - Winter 2023 Announcements inc. Southern 'Booster'

[John Tomlinson]

3 hours ago, Right Away said:

It is very disappointing (not the least for the owners) to continue to read of this derailing/bogie issue of the EFE “Booster” locomotives. Clearly, not all models are affected and of those that are, it is to varying degrees, as portrayed by the responses and photo/video evidence posted on this forum.

 

Many have ventured to investigate the cause(s) of this problem, with a view to effecting a solution themselves. These efforts are most admirable and in some cases the results have been productive in resolving the issue.

Since the date of release from retailers, albeit only a month, considering the number of affected models reported in this time, it would be heartening to hear EXACTLY what the manufacture has discovered from those that have been returned, e.g. warping, tolerance issues etc. 

 

Could the bogie structure actually benefit from a redesign?

 

As an owner of this model which fortunately has not portrayed (so far) a tendency to derail on Code 75 trackwork, I would still relish an explanation as to the cause and remedy as a result of any manufacture’s investigation - just in case!

 

 

Finding myself in W H Smiths last week I ended up buying the "Hornby Magazine" out of mild curiousity. This featured a review of the "Booster" model, plus quite a nice historical piece.

 

I noticed that the photos included showed clearly that their review example failed the "all wheels touching on a flat surface" test. This didn't seem to have been noticed by the reviewers, who indeed commented that the model "ran smoothly including through points and crossings"!!!

 

John.

[railcar1]

Sad truth with many retailers is if it runs its fine!

Have a look at the Hornby  Mag.,March, booster review main picture,the fault is obvious to see.

As previously reported I have mitigated the issue by adding  shims.This fixes the wheels in contact  with track problem but not the underlying fault. 

In my  opinion the problem is the screwed on side panel of the gear tower is not aligned properly causing  the axles to sit out of true.

This may be a manufacturing issue or perhaps damage in transit. 

This problem does seem relatively  widespread. EFE should really respond. 

[maico]

18 minutes ago, John Tomlinson said:

 

Finding myself in W H Smiths last week I ended up buying the "Hornby Magazine" out of mild curiousity. This featured a review of the "Booster" model, plus quite a nice historical piece.

 

I noticed that the photos included showed clearly that their review example failed the "all wheels touching on a flat surface" test. This didn't seem to have been noticed by the reviewers, who indeed commented that the model "ran smoothly including through points and crossings"!!!

 

John.

 

The shadows in the opening photos in this thread seem to show the same thing

[RThompson]

17 minutes ago, railcar1 said:

Sad truth with many retailers is if it runs its fine!

Have a look at the Hornby  Mag.,March, booster review main picture,the fault is obvious to see.

As previously reported I have mitigated the issue by adding  shims.This fixes the wheels in contact  with track problem but not the underlying fault. 

In my  opinion the problem is the screwed on side panel of the gear tower is not aligned properly causing  the axles to sit out of true.

This may be a manufacturing issue or perhaps damage in transit. 

This problem does seem relatively  widespread. EFE should really respond. 

 

It won't be because of the sides not being screwed properly.

 

I've replied a few bits back as to the reason from my investigation.

[railcar1]

The alignment of the side panel also affects the height of the support arm on that side.

[RThompson]

20 minutes ago, railcar1 said:

The alignment of the side panel also affects the height of the support arm on that side.

Which in turn would also affect the alignment of the wheels, bearings and outside bogie frames as they all relate, connect with each other.

 

If you move the side of the bogie, everything else would move with it and still not fix any affected support arms.

 

Those affected like mine was, the bogies themselves are true and square away from the body weight, just not their support arms which are moulded as part of each side and not a separate one piece item.

Edited February 5 by RThompson

[mikesndbs]

Whoa! stop the press, sluggish high current Booster?

Check this out for the fix.

 

Quite shocked by this one as mine has been poor from the start, guess a more solid PCB would not have done this?

 

 

[Gwiwer]

I haven't measured current draw.  I noticed that mine will maximise at a scale speed of around 70mph against the real things being allowed 75mph even though they were recorded at much higher speeds on occasions.  

 

Not as fast as some other locomotives but presenting at a good scale speed without needing to wind the controller up to "MAX".  And this is true whether loaded or light engine.  

 

Not as sluggish as the DJ class 71s by any means; those are far too slow at top speed.  

 

So for me the speed is not a problem and the current draw is (unmeasured but) well within operational parameters.  

[simon b]

14 hours ago, GWR-fan said:

 

Good luck with getting this fixed as the "experts" believe it is a minor issue impacting on very few models.  My two are similarly affected.   Unless one actually places the model on a flat surface and not the railhead,  then the torsional distortion will not be readily noticeable.    I am sure the problem is more widespread than is being acknowledged.

 

Edit: I am curious if anyone has removed the bogies and placed on a flat surface to see if the standalone bogie is distorted, i.e., the six wheels do not sit flat on the surface,  or if the issue is with the way the bogies are suspended in the chassis.  There have been several "workarounds" to mask the problem.  The apologists will simply state send it back for rectification but as you have found you will possibly just get the same model returned to you with a note,  "Unable to fault".

 

I was hoping that the "booster" would lift the EFE Rail "second tier" market image but it would appear not.

 

8 hours ago, RThompson said:

 

The one I shown a few posts above with the resprayed roof did have bogie problems also.

 

I did a full strip down and report of the bogies and after careful checking, its the bogie support arms that is the issue like they are sloping from one side to the other and not perfectly horizontal, the bogies and frames themselves are perfectly fine.

 

My remedy was to superglue to the underside of the cast body block (20 or 30 thou?) Plastikard to the opposite affected corners to force the bogies to sit level at both ends thus making all the wheels touch the glass.

 

I did note in one model shop there was 4 different locos on display in a glass cabinet, only 1 out of the 4 had a issue, the other 3 had all the wheels touching the glass as they should.

 

So what has happened to some for this to occur, I don't know.

 

8 hours ago, franciswilliamwebb said:

 

Shocking behaviour, I'd go straight for a refund rather than replacement.  "Computer says no" standard of customer service 😲

 

7 hours ago, railcar1 said:

Sad truth with many retailers is if it runs its fine!

Have a look at the Hornby  Mag.,March, booster review main picture,the fault is obvious to see.

As previously reported I have mitigated the issue by adding  shims.This fixes the wheels in contact  with track problem but not the underlying fault. 

In my  opinion the problem is the screwed on side panel of the gear tower is not aligned properly causing  the axles to sit out of true.

This may be a manufacturing issue or perhaps damage in transit. 

This problem does seem relatively  widespread. EFE should really respond. 

 

So to update on this. I have emailed the video to the retailer and they do agree there is definitely an issue with the loco, as such they have agreed to exchange it for another. Now in fairness to them they did also forward me a video of the loco running on their code 100 test layout seemingly without issue. I think it's difficult to see the issue properly unless you put the loco on a known flat surface, checking it whilst on the track wont properly show it.

 

I was reluctant to try to fix this myself for a few reasons, but mainly that if I break something it wont be covered under warranty. And also that I shouldn't have to!

 

Having had a good look at it myself, I've come to the conclusion that the bogie castings are twisted on mine. The axles are a good fit in the molding's, there being no slop as such so each axle should be on the same plane as the others. But the inner axle of each bogie was sitting at an angle with only one wheel in contact with the rail, this in turn lifts the center axle away from the track. Both bogies were exactly the same, so it isnt a chassis issue. 

 

Now to be clear, I am very happy with the models. Only one of the three I have has an issue, and it is now going to be rectified. There is obviously a quality control issue with a certain batch of locos, and I'm in no doubt that some sort of solution will be offered in time. 

 

Overall it is a great looking detailed model, which captures the look of the prototype well. I never thought we would see one of these as a ready to run offering, especially for the price that it is, and I can only applaud Graham Muzz and the EFE team for bringing it to reality.

 

Now about that 4COR........

[RFS]

I've run my black DCC-fitted 20002 and monitored the current draw via my Z21 which has the ability to display booster current usage. With just 20002 running hauling 9 coaches (4 Hornby Maunsells + 5 new-style Bachmann Bulleids) and travelling at a scale 55-60 MPH, it records a current consumption of 200-250ma, which I consider perfectly normal. 

[GreenGiraffe22]

I ran a double header with my merchant navy for the sheer joy of it 😅

 

-insert rule 1-

 

[Fair Oak Junction]

2 minutes ago, GreenGiraffe22 said:

I ran a double header with my merchant navy for the sheer joy of it 😅

 

Not quite as nonsensical as you may think. During some of the terrible winters of the 1940s, it wasn't uncommon for the SR to have pilot steam locos on EMU services as they were struggling with iced 3rd rails. So, your fun running session does have a certain amount of prototypical merit 😉

[GreenGiraffe22]

11 minutes ago, Fair Oak Junction said:

 

Not quite as nonsensical as you may think. During some of the terrible winters of the 1940s, it wasn't uncommon for the SR to have pilot steam locos on EMU services as they were struggling with iced 3rd rails. So, your fun running session does have a certain amount of prototypical merit 😉

 

I KNEW someone would have a response like this 😅  I feel like because the early 1940s are so un photographed, all sorts are possible 

[Fair Oak Junction]

11 minutes ago, GreenGiraffe22 said:

I KNEW someone would have a response like this 😅  I feel like because the early 1940s are so un photographed, all sorts are possible 

 

It's well described in the fantastic book Alfred Raworth's Electric Southern Railway by Peter Steer. It specifically mentions the winter of 1940, which brought temps of -20°C to southern England. EMU services were severely affected, and so steam locos were roped in to help. Ex-LBSC locos with Westinghouse pumps made the pilot operation on the Central Section easier.

Edited February 6 by Fair Oak Junction

[RFS]

13 minutes ago, GreenGiraffe22 said:

 

I KNEW someone would have a response like this 😅  I feel like because the early 1940s are so un photographed, all sorts are possible 

 

The first two locos were built at Ashford, whereas 20003 was built at Eastleigh both of which places were "off grid".  So all works visits will have required them to be hauled to and from the works.  Not found any pictures of these trips though. 

[LNERGE]

I purchased a blue with yellow ends version. No problem fitting a decoder. Straight into service and has run beautifully in both directions with a reasonable load over gradients etc. I'm reasonably impressed so far.

[Fair Oak Junction]

Oh, and another nice thing about the book I mentioned above is that it has a set of drawings for CC1 which shows the overhead wire poles the SR used.

Useful for anyone wanting to model them. Very clearly shows the lightweight nature of the SR yard overhead, looking basically like tramway OHLE.

Edited February 6 by Fair Oak Junction

[mvwilson]

Mine was derailing all over the place. Thanks to the advice in this forum it was an easy fix. I glued a piece of 40 Thou plasticard  to the chassis above the bogie guide and now it doesn't derail. 

[Southernman46]

There is a photo in the latest Model World showing 20001 in Black / Silver with the silver (it is a B&W photo so it could even be any light colour) extending over the whole roof so it looks like this was the case for both locos at some point.

[RFS]

9 minutes ago, Southernman46 said:

There is a photo in the latest Model World showing 20001 in Black / Silver with the silver (it is a B&W photo so it could even be any light colour) extending over the whole roof so it looks like this was the case for both locos at some point.

 

A number of photos of the locos in this album here - https://railphotoprints.uk/p293667875 - all of which show 20001/2 with silver cabs. 

[Gwiwer]

My ‘02 was a derailer.  Upon close inspection it also had only three of four body-fixing screws in place. The pan-spring was loose in the box. 
 

I would like to thank Kernow MRC and specifically @Graham_Muz for quickly accepting and managing a return. I now have what I suspect is a replacement rather than a rectified loco. 
 

It does not derail, it has four fixing screws and the pan spring is on the lugs where it should be. 
 

Very much appreciated.  Quality customer service. 

[97xx]

This is something of a prototype comment, but posting here for interest.

 

In May 1950 The Railway Magazine, an article "From Tunbridge Wells to Eastbourne via Heathfield" containing:

 

"Just before Hellingley, one of two principle streams forming the Cuckmere River is crossed. This station, in contrast to all the others, has no passing loop or signals although there are interchange sidings with an overhead electrified line leading to the metal hospital, the tower of which can be seen about half a mile away on the left."

 

(My highlight).

 

A non-electrified line with an overhead electrified siding?

Edited March 3 by 97xx

[Oldddudders]

The hospital tramway. A small steeple-cab loco was motive power.

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hellingly_Hospital_Railway#References

Edited March 3 by Oldddudders

[dave75]

"to the metal hospital" where all the locos with with Mazak Rot could get treatment?

[wainwright1]

2 hours ago, Oldddudders said:

The hospital tramway. A small steeple-cab loco was motive power.

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hellingly_Hospital_Railway#References

I recall that Phil Parker modelled that.

 

All the best

Ray