RMweb Premium spamcan61 Posted January 3, 2012 RMweb Premium Share Posted January 3, 2012 Its fair enough if they are priced accordingly, but with a lot of these ex Airfix or Lima re releases they are expensive, and contain errors that are a complete pain to correct. In terms of pricing then I agree that at anything like list price some of these items aren't good value, and yes, the detail errors can be annoying to some; at the end of the day if nobody buys them the price will fall (at those outlets actually wanting to shift the stock) to a point where they will shift. Not so good if you're a retailer aiming to shift them at near list price of course, it's up to them to make a judgement call on what proportion of their clientelle will buy at what price point. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
D605Eagle Posted January 3, 2012 Share Posted January 3, 2012 emmm interesting pricing. I wonder how well the 72xx is going to sell with that hefty price tag. If they had been in the 70 to 90 range I'd have probably bought possiably 4 or 5 over the years, but at that price I'll just have the one I think. My layout is already over populated with 2-8-0s. What really was needed far more than an O1 was a humble 0-6-0 tender engine. I would expect it would have sold in huge numbers compared to something as obscure as an O1. That will become a very slow mover like the L1. nothing else of any interest so Hornby wont be straining my wallet this time. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pennine MC Posted January 3, 2012 Share Posted January 3, 2012 Given that Hornby's product development resources are more or less finite, one wonders if locos and coaches offer a better return on investment than wagons, particularly the around 9-10' WB wagons and vans that are the staple diet of 1920s-1960s modelling, the kind of thing Bachmann are really good at. ... I think we got a hint of the way things are last year when two highly priced (initially) revisions to the 'older BR' wagons were promised. Doesn't matter what folk thought of them the initial pricing was way off market and was followed by Hornby reducing the price (no doubt just to encourage trade orders if what I heard was any sort of guide). Agreed (and with Dil's later post). I'm getting an inkling now that the backpedalling over prices with the brake and the tippler has made Hornby think that they cant really compete with Bachmann in this field. At least, where fresh investment is concerned; they'll still churn out 1970s and '80s ex-Airfix and Dapol mouldings at similar or greater prices to Bachmann equivalents. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pennine MC Posted January 3, 2012 Share Posted January 3, 2012 I'm always surprised by the vitriol directed at Hornby for continuing to produce models from the old Lima, Airfix/Mainline and Dapol ranges. It's as if models have some kind of "best before" date and must be retooled at regular intervals, even if the existing model is really good. Whatever you think of the given models - and I agree, the quoted 101 above the solebar is excellent - it constantly amuses me that people think Hornby would even consider retooling them whilst the current models keep selling. 'Continous improvement' doesnt really cut it at Margate in the same way as it does at Barwell, and other than the 60 and 67 which have obviously met some magic criteria, it's just not a very Hornby thing to do. TBH I often wonder if many people can actually analyse what's wrong with the models they criticise, or if they're just repeating the 'it needs a retool' mantra cos everybody else says it Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Belgian Posted January 3, 2012 Share Posted January 3, 2012 Both the 13' and 14' wheelbase tenders are correct. The 1st Nine Elms series came out with 14' w/b but these were soon swapped with Watercarts from the Hoppers. When T9s were exported to SECR territory, they received 14' w/b tenders. The later batch exported to the LBSCR received 13' w/b tenders. You will need to look in Bradley for numbers but I'm pretty certain that all six variants of tender and cab were extant. Bill OFF-TOPIC ALERT! Sorry Bill, that's wrong. I've just re-measured the wheelbase of my Hornby T9 6-wheel tender and it measures 26 + 26 mm, ie,. a scale 13' + 13' (unless my ruler is wrong). EDIT: In view of what others have pointed out below, I should have said '26 + 26 mm, ie,. a scale 6' 6" + 6' 6" (it was me that was wrong, not my ruler!). All the same, I stand by what follows . . . The 10 T9s sent to the Eastern Section in 1925 (nos. 300/1/4/7/10-14/36) received 13' tenders from 20 700s, which received 14' tenders from 20 L11s, which received the 8 wheelers from the T9s. (I do agree that T9s originally had 14' tenders when built, but these had gone to K10s in exchange for 8 wheelers built at that time, and this all happened in 1902 when the T9s were in their original form). This was to accommodate the T9s on the short Eastern Section turntables. From then on there were 10 700s with 13' and 20 700s with 14' tenders. A second batch of T9s were sent to the Central Section in 1928 but turntable lengths weren't so much of a problem so they simply swapped tenders with 6 K10s, which had 14' tenders. These T9s were 281/2, 303,704/26/29. Hornby did 30726 in weathered form with a 13' tender ie, the original 700 one, not the more widespread 14' one which this engine had in reality. Thus the SR liveried T9 (no. 729) was also, strictly speaking, 'wrong'. All the other 6-wheel tender T9s that Hornby have issued are wide-cab ones, which, except for early withdrawal 303, had the 13' tenders, thus the new issue will be the first 'correct' BR period one. Jeremy Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mighty Posted January 3, 2012 Share Posted January 3, 2012 I was particularly happy to see we can get two different numbered push pull sets in the first year and the useful extra Maunsell coaches. With those and the Kernow O2's and coaches I think 2012 is going to be an excellent year for Southern modellers. The b&g Vep has it's faults but it's the face that is the most obvious next to the CEP so I'll wait and see one in the flesh before I commit. With a plethora of NE models too that I could fall for on impulse it seems a good year. If you take all the releases from all the manufacturers and special commisions there's an awful lot of options and I suspect many would struggle to purchase all that they want. I know on a personal note with the M7's & coaches, O2's and gate stock, Bachmann BP, dapols promised mi wagons and a couple of G scale models my budget for the year isn't likely to suffice so I'll try to decide what's likely to hang around a bit. It strikes me that the Midland modellers have the fewest new models to save for. I think that's a pretty good assessment of where we are from a Southern modeller's point of view. Yes, I'd have loved a new tooled Southern locomotive such as an S15 or a smaller goods (Drummond 700 anyone?), but I've already got the O2 (£92) and the gate stock (£100) on order from Kernow, with a possible impulse buy of a BWT when they bring out the next batch (£92). There's also the Bachmann C which I'll have at least two of, maybe three (£140-210), along with a couple of the 25T brake vans (£40). That's a *lot* of money that I'll be spending. Add in one or two of the new Hornby luggage vans and a couple of the open third Maunsells (probably around £30 each) and I'm glad my other half isn't looking over my shoulder as I type this. Fortunately for me, the Maunsell push-pull set is too late for me, or that would be another hit to the wallet. On a wider perspective, I think the attitude taken this year by Hornby is sensible. The Thompson O1 seems a little odd given everyone was after an 0-6-0 LNER goods engine, but perhaps this is the compromise - something that saw wide service and can be used by everyone? The GWR locomotives seem a bit left-field, but I suppose it might be a run on from GWR 175. I think LNER modellers must think all their Christmas's have come at once over the last year or two. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
autocoach Posted January 3, 2012 Share Posted January 3, 2012 Oh dear....between Kernow, Bachmann and now Hornby, the banks are going to earn a lot of Foreign Exchange fees this year. And there is 2012 Bachmann still to come. (Black SR T9(s) for renumbering to withered arm habitues, SR 3rd Open, Van B...and could the WC Exeter be returned to pre-1948 without a repaint?) Let us not forget the new wagon kits coming from Cambrian and Parkside in 2012. As one who has a decidedly Southern interest at the moment these will fill the shunting yard very quickly. RTR can only do so much. Also after all these years the 42xx/52xx/72xx I used to wish for in my GWR days will arrive. I may have to buy the GWR versions "for the collection" just like the Bachmann Duke of Earl (quick a chorus of Duke, Duke, Duke of Earl...from Motown.) And my other Southen, SP MT4 with skylinen casing finally coming in February will mean some new up to date SP/PFE stock to run behind it. This means I cannot retire...I have to keep working to support my hobby aquisitions and have no time to build the ultimate layout.... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Downer Posted January 3, 2012 RMweb Premium Share Posted January 3, 2012 Sorry, but I can't let that pass - Gene Chandler (the Duke of Earl) was a Chicago man, nothing to do with Motown. . Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ozexpatriate Posted January 3, 2012 Share Posted January 3, 2012 I can't see much of a market for the big 8-coupled GWR tanks and the near copy of a Bachmann LNER 2-8-0 engine, but as the 2013 releases depend on Hornby doing well, I hope I am wrong. The 8-coupled tanks were consistently the highest polled GWR items (though not specifically by me). I think there continues to be a dedicated cadre of GWR and Western enthusiasts who will snap these up quickly. I certainly indend to, assuming that at some point I get an idea of their specific liveries. (Hornby has been imprecise about communicating liveries on GWR announcements for a while. For a very long time, Tintagel Castle was listed as "GWR green".) Will they continue to be volume sellers, year in and year out? Well no, but nothing (except Flying Scotsman and Tornado) are sold this way anymore. I was very surprised by the O1 announcement, given the existing (and popular) O4. Nevertheless, there seem to be a lot of Eastern modellers who are delighted by the announcement of the O1. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Stationmaster Posted January 3, 2012 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 3, 2012 emmm interesting pricing. I wonder how well the 72xx is going to sell with that hefty price tag. If they had been in the 70 to 90 range I'd have probably bought possiably 4 or 5 over the years, but at that price I'll just have the one I think. My layout is already over populated with 2-8-0s. What really was needed far more than an O1 was a humble 0-6-0 tender engine. I would expect it would have sold in huge numbers compared to something as obscure as an O1. That will become a very slow mover like the L1. nothing else of any interest so Hornby wont be straining my wallet this time. The problem they face with the 72XX - in the 'modeller' market at any rate - in my view is choosing the right variant to give a reasonable range of renumbering choices plus giving the maximum 'time in traffic' coverage and if they get that right they can run the loco on & off over a number of years fairly safely (and tempt me to buy more than one). http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/49734-gwr-8-coupled-tank-engines/ If they get the choices right with the 42XX and 5205 they could potentially look at racking up quite substantial sales with plenty of opportunity for customer renumbering/minor detail change covering an awful lot of locos especially post-war. Even if they get the choice wrong my area of interest means I'll be in for a couple, plus another if someone comes up with a handy set of outside steampipes to update the 42XX. We live in interesting times (well some of us do ). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold gwrrob Posted January 3, 2012 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 3, 2012 Whilst the GW tanks are most welcome,depending on livery of course I'm disapppointed with the choice of Hawksworth tender for the GW liveried castle 'Wellington'.She didn't get one till 02/48 ! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rovex Posted January 3, 2012 Share Posted January 3, 2012 My goodness seven pages of froth since 9am and most of its rancour free, I'm impressed. As to Hornby's 2012 range and I'm also fairly impressed, especially given the economic climate. As a devout Western man its nice to see someone having a go at the heavy GWR tanks especially as I've amassed two built ones and kits for two more over the last year. Oh well hopefully I can sell them on Ebay for not too much of a loss and it will fund buying a couple of replacements (ah but which ones) Otherwise not much for me, when I heard the announcement of the B set and autocoach I expected resprays rather than new tooling. Hopefully in a year or so we'll have some suburban stock for the GWR to match the quality of the Gresley and (presumed quality of) the Thompsons, and then more than just a B set. Right - whens the next free listing day on Ebay or can I interest anyone in some hardly used K's kits - lol Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rovex Posted January 3, 2012 Share Posted January 3, 2012 Of course all I need now is for Hornby/Bachman to announce an Aberdare/Taff Vale tank or class 1361 and my kit buying will have been completely in vain :-) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Oldddudders Posted January 3, 2012 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 3, 2012 I've just re-measured the wheelbase of my Hornby T9 6-wheel tender and it measures 26 + 26 mm, ie,. a scale 13' + 13' (unless my ruler is wrong). Umm. Do I recall that OO is 4mm to the foot? If so, then 26mm divided by 4 is 6.5, not 13. Something is not altogether right here, maybe.... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Oldddudders Posted January 3, 2012 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 3, 2012 Sorry, but I can't let that pass - Gene Chandler (the Duke of Earl) was a Chicago man, nothing to do with Motown. . Yeah, but did you buy the 45rpm single? I have it somewhere. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Fatadder Posted January 3, 2012 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 3, 2012 Whilst the GW tanks are most welcome,depending on livery of course I'm disapppointed with the choice of Hawksworth tender for the GW liveried castle 'Wellington'.She didn't get one till 02/48 ! I hadnt managed to find the photo of that yet, most dissapointed to see that given my renaming plans. Guessing the likelyhood of finding a loco that can use the Hanksworth tender with the early build loco from the last GW release is pretty slim...... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Belgian Posted January 3, 2012 Share Posted January 3, 2012 Umm. Do I recall that OO is 4mm to the foot? If so, then 26mm divided by 4 is 6.5, not 13. Something is not altogether right here, maybe.... But you've missed the + sign: 26 + 26 = 52. 52 divided by 4 is 13! JE Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Butler Henderson Posted January 3, 2012 Share Posted January 3, 2012 So the push-pull set is only available with a M7 or am I missing something. Expect a number of retailers will be splitting the sets if that the case. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Oldddudders Posted January 3, 2012 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 3, 2012 it measures 26 + 26 mm, ie,. a scale 13' + 13' (unless my ruler is wrong). Still baffled. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ozexpatriate Posted January 3, 2012 Share Posted January 3, 2012 I would be surprised if they manage to keep the 8 coupled tanks down to the £100 RRP mark if they are (as I hope) 'hi-fi', however if they do come in at 'mid-fi' and it means scraping off a few moulded handrails and replacing them I'm not going to moan. Mike, since your comment (above) was made before the pricing was out, I presume you're no longer contemplating the appearance of moulded handrails on the eight-coupled GWR tanks. (At least let's hope not at >£100.00.) Even most of the larger Railroad items have separately fitted handrails (like the Churchward and I think, the Hawksworth Counties). A notable exception is Tornado, and I suspect soon, (based on Pat Hammond's comments) the new Flying Scotsman Railroad tooling. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Oldddudders Posted January 3, 2012 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 3, 2012 So the push-pull set is only available with a M7 or am I missing something. Expect a number of retailers will be splitting the sets if that the case. No, it is available separately - hopefully with different numbers - but not expected in the same quarter. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pennine MC Posted January 3, 2012 Share Posted January 3, 2012 I can't see much of a market for the big 8-coupled GWR tanks and the near copy of a Bachmann LNER 2-8-0 engine, but as the 2013 releases depend on Hornby doing well, I hope I am wrong. . I was very surprised by the O1 announcement, given the existing (and popular) O4. Nevertheless, there seem to be a lot of Eastern modellers who are delighted by the announcement of the O1. As was I with the Tommo subs, but as a couple of lads said earlier of the O1, they're complementary - O1s and O4s ran together, as did Gresley and Thompson coaches. I think we're so used to thinking that Hornby dont do joined up thinking that we dont recognise it when they do. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Stationmaster Posted January 3, 2012 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 3, 2012 Mike, since your comment (above) was made before the pricing was out, I presume you're no longer contemplating the appearance of moulded handrails on the eight-coupled GWR tanks. (At least let's hope not at >£100.00.) Your final words in brackets say it all! The RRP is coming out at the sort of level I was expecting so I'm hoping for hi-fi and the right choices of footplating etc (see above and the link). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluex5 Posted January 3, 2012 Share Posted January 3, 2012 As I eluded to in the original thread - On finding out about the 01 I did a goodle image search and found a pic of one at Brough on an oil train in 1959, about 3 miles from my house. Anonymous freight locos are my favourite type, especially the eight coupled variety, and while I always liked the look of the 01 (and some talented yet crazy guy on the LNER forum built a fantastic one using the Bachmann 04 chassis and drivers) I never thought they strayed up my neck of the woods. I shall be preordering very shortly! I'm resigned to the fact if I want a B16/2 or /3 It's time to buy the PDK kit and subcontract it! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigherb Posted January 3, 2012 Share Posted January 3, 2012 But you've missed the + sign: 26 + 26 = 52. 52 divided by 4 is 13! JE Read you post again 13' + 13' that makes it a 26 footer Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.