EBay madness

[MrWolf]

11 minutes ago, John M Upton said:

People just don't seem to collect things anymore.  Take stamps for example, once very collectible, many were worth silly money and when I discovered my childhood collection that set me back a fair few quid in the 1980's I thought I would sell it and make a few quid.

 

What I actually got for it barely covered the postage and the Ebay fees, the bottom has completely dropped out of the market.

 

Then there is the diecast bus market, went wild at one point, people paying hundreds of pounds for actually not that accurate diecast model buses of particular operators (Southdown was a very popular one) now you are lucky to shift them for a fiver a piece including the postage, no wonder EFE (first incarnation) and Corgi went to the wall in the end.

 

That reminds me of going to a toy and model collectors fair with a friend of mine who had a stall selling some quality vintage O gauge stuff. Most people were complaining that they hadn't sold much (my friend included, but that was because he had misjudged the type of people that the event was aimed at.) But when I went for a mooch round, it was almost entirely modern die cast commercial vehicles, almost all at optimistic prices. There were a couple of stalls of railway items, all hugely overpriced and "rare" and a couple of stalls full of old Dinky toys, again at daft money. One stall holder I got into conversation with pointed out a number of items that he said he didn't actually want to sell, so were big money. Oddly enough, he did sell some of the treasures, at least that would cover his expenses. 

I did think about collecting cars again, I used to have a lot of Corgi and Dinky saloon cars made 1946-66 in line with my interests in full size cars. They, along with a lot of other stuff I had in storage got stolen, so I have little enthusiasm to start again at current prices.

 

[33C]

Toy and Model fairs are a waste of time. I stopped going a few years back because A) Always the same dealers. B) Well over-priced. C) Extortionate entry fees. D) Rude/ Patronising attitudes. E) At least 25% advertised stalls/layouts do not bother to show up. F) Too much modern cr*p. G) Any "bargains" have been bought by other dealers inside before it opens. H) I don't care how much your stall cost you, ("£60 a table and i need these 6 pitches!), your too expensive. And that's why there's Ebay etc.

[Paul H Vigor]

9 hours ago, 33C said:

Toy and Model fairs are a waste of time. I stopped going a few years back because A) Always the same dealers. B) Well over-priced. C) Extortionate entry fees. D) Rude/ Patronising attitudes. E) At least 25% advertised stalls/layouts do not bother to show up. F) Too much modern cr*p. G) Any "bargains" have been bought by other dealers inside before it opens. H) I don't care how much your stall cost you, ("£60 a table and i need these 6 pitches!), your too expensive. And that's why there's Ebay etc.

Toy and Model fairs appear to be run mainly for the benefit of the dealers? They let the modelling public in as just another income stream for the organisers? In many ways model railways have become just another commodity - items to be acquired and traded back and forth? The modelling public are problematic patrons because they have expectations about what they buy, they ask awkward questions that many dealers cannot answer - the most basic can be: 'does it run?'

[andyman7]

9 hours ago, 33C said:

Toy and Model fairs are a waste of time. I stopped going a few years back because A) Always the same dealers. B) Well over-priced. C) Extortionate entry fees. D) Rude/ Patronising attitudes. E) At least 25% advertised stalls/layouts do not bother to show up. F) Too much modern cr*p. G) Any "bargains" have been bought by other dealers inside before it opens. H) I don't care how much your stall cost you, ("£60 a table and i need these 6 pitches!), your too expensive. And that's why there's Ebay etc.

We must be going to different fairs....I don't go to many (well, not any since last March....) but Orpington and Sandown Park were my two regulars - one was small and relatively local, the other a huge international 4 times a year fair. Every time I have always managed to find some bargains, projects, good finds - even at 1 in the afternoon when it's been open ages. Of course there is overprices tat, the same dealers, lots of stuff to ignore but the whole fun is in ferreting out the bargains. One benefit of going regularly is you build up a relationship with those dealers who are likely to have the right stuff at the right prices and of course the more of a regular you are the more you can 'discuss a deal' if one is in the offing.

 

Both ebay and fairs have their ups and downs, but if you have the 'itch' the fun comes from ferreting out the nuggets from the turds, if it was easy there'd be no sport....

[Darius43]

17 minutes ago, andyman7 said:

if it was easy there'd be no sport....

 

...and this thread wouldn’t be 1072 pages long and counting.

 

Cheers

 

Darius

[G-DIMB]

There are one two big eBay dealers who buy all their stock from toyfairs. One in particular is well known round the big ones and is usually first in at early entry time. Traders to a certain extent don't care who they sell to be it trade or public. They have put their price on it which they are happy with and if they sell it great, if not it waits to fight another day where they get that price or their drop it and it sells. For me the best toyfairs i attend are Exeter Matford Centre and Newton Abbot Racecourse run by Ray Heard. Being a railway dealer its very good for railways as a lot of other railway dealers tend to appear some of which travel 200 or so miles to trade there however alot of the big eBay dealers dont go there to buy so sometimes items get past the dealers. They also do a flaming good farmers breakfast at the Matford Centre which is something i miss!

 

Of the others diecast is mainly taking over the tables as Ebay costs make it un-viable to sell much of it on there so toyfairs with the lower overheads are the only place to do it. The NEC is a good one which has very very few railways buyers going as there were more an more diecast retailers there. Because of the lack of buyers the remaining railway traders stopped going so the buyers who do still go don't see much in the way of railway so don't bother to go again hence it gets worse.

 

In terms of HMRC and toyfairs then yes there are lots of dealers masquerading as private sellers. I was once at a toyfair where HMRC did a spot check and was told by a friend to stand back and watch as word got round. Strangely at least half left their stands and disappeared. The same thing happens on eBay though, i know of a few people who sell on ebay with private accounts who are in fact dealers. Saying that eBay to a certain extent doesn't care but obviously there is a line between the two for HMRC. The internet has also made it much easier for people to become "private" dealers who don't tell HMRC. Facebook groups also needs to take a fair share of the blame here as effectively they are cost free so are very attractive. One wonders if HMRC caught up with those trading without declaration what would happen then as i thought the rules now stated that if you bought something with the intention of selling it on for a profit, it would be classed as trading and not included in your personal allowances. But i might be wrong on that!

[PhilJ W]

36 minutes ago, andyman7 said:

We must be going to different fairs....I don't go to many (well, not any since last March....) but Orpington and Sandown Park were my two regulars - one was small and relatively local, the other a huge international 4 times a year fair. Every time I have always managed to find some bargains, projects, good finds - even at 1 in the afternoon when it's been open ages. Of course there is overprices tat, the same dealers, lots of stuff to ignore but the whole fun is in ferreting out the bargains. One benefit of going regularly is you build up a relationship with those dealers who are likely to have the right stuff at the right prices and of course the more of a regular you are the more you can 'discuss a deal' if one is in the offing.

 

Both ebay and fairs have their ups and downs, but if you have the 'itch' the fun comes from ferreting out the nuggets from the turds, if it was easy there'd be no sport....

And another advantage is that later in the day you can pick up even more bargains because the dealer doesn't want to take it home. As said above you have to hunt out the bargains.

[PhilJ W]

Sadly the two toy fair/swap meets local to me may not be back after covid. The one at the Brentwood Centre, one of the biggest in the country and a lot smaller one at Rayleigh. The first as the management company has called in the receivers and the second because with social distancing  the number of tables would be halved making it unviable.

[RobinofLoxley]

9 minutes ago, G-DIMB said:

There are one two big eBay dealers who buy all their stock from toyfairs. One in particular is well known round the big ones and is usually first in at early entry time. Traders to a certain extent don't care who they sell to be it trade or public. They have put their price on it which they are happy with and if they sell it great, if not it waits to fight another day where they get that price or their drop it and it sells. For me the best toyfairs i attend are Exeter Matford Centre and Newton Abbot Racecourse run by Ray Heard. Being a railway dealer its very good for railways as a lot of other railway dealers tend to appear some of which travel 200 or so miles to trade there however alot of the big eBay dealers dont go there to buy so sometimes items get past the dealers. They also do a flaming good farmers breakfast at the Matford Centre which is something i miss!

 

Of the others diecast is mainly taking over the tables as Ebay costs make it un-viable to sell much of it on there so toyfairs with the lower overheads are the only place to do it. The NEC is a good one which has very very few railways buyers going as there were more an more diecast retailers there. Because of the lack of buyers the remaining railway traders stopped going so the buyers who do still go don't see much in the way of railway so don't bother to go again hence it gets worse.

 

In terms of HMRC and toyfairs then yes there are lots of dealers masquerading as private sellers. I was once at a toyfair where HMRC did a spot check and was told by a friend to stand back and watch as word got round. Strangely at least half left their stands and disappeared. The same thing happens on eBay though, i know of a few people who sell on ebay with private accounts who are in fact dealers. Saying that eBay to a certain extent doesn't care but obviously there is a line between the two for HMRC. The internet has also made it much easier for people to become "private" dealers who don't tell HMRC. Facebook groups also needs to take a fair share of the blame here as effectively they are cost free so are very attractive. One wonders if HMRC caught up with those trading without declaration what would happen then as i thought the rules now stated that if you bought something with the intention of selling it on for a profit, it would be classed as trading and not included in your personal allowances. But i might be wrong on that!

Hello, havnt posted in this section before.

 

I was buying on ebay yesterday and checked pre existing bids as i always do. MY criteria is that anyone with a rating over 500 is a dealer. Mine is about 120 so I could buy several lifetimes worth of railway without reaching 500. I have a blacklist of people of ebay that I wouldnt buy from just because of how they frame their advertisements. Inclusion of certain word such as 'Rare' for example and its no sale from me.

[G-DIMB]

28 minutes ago, RobinofLoxley said:

Hello, havnt posted in this section before.

 

I was buying on ebay yesterday and checked pre existing bids as i always do. MY criteria is that anyone with a rating over 500 is a dealer. Mine is about 120 so I could buy several lifetimes worth of railway without reaching 500. I have a blacklist of people of ebay that I wouldnt buy from just because of how they frame their advertisements. Inclusion of certain word such as 'Rare' for example and its no sale from me.

By that basis i would be included because i have a feedback rating of 1100ish but i have been on there since 2003. While things like rare do annoy me i just go to what I'm prepared to pay and that's it. As i said i don't really care whether someone is a dealer or a private seller. If the price is right and deal is right then its a deal. If its too much or there's stuff I'm not happy with i move on to the next one. For me the best bargains are still at toyfairs as you can barter, inspect the items for sale and generally also have a little bit of chat with friends. Certainly the big toyfair organizers are looking to restart May/June/July dependent on restrictions and i know i will be back in the queue for the first one reasonably local to me.

[andyman7]

13 hours ago, John M Upton said:

People just don't seem to collect things anymore.  Take stamps for example, once very collectible, many were worth silly money and when I discovered my childhood collection that set me back a fair few quid in the 1980's I thought I would sell it and make a few quid.

 

What I actually got for it barely covered the postage and the Ebay fees, the bottom has completely dropped out of the market.

 

Of course that works the other way too. I still have my childhood stamp collection and when I retrieved it from my parents' home about 20 years ago I was reminded of the gaps in it that my pocket money wouldn't let me fill. It was a pleasant surprise to find that my adult earning power coupled with the collapse in ordinary stamp prices allowed completion at a very modest cost....

[andyman7]

1 hour ago, PhilJ W said:

Sadly the two toy fair/swap meets local to me may not be back after covid. The one at the Brentwood Centre, one of the biggest in the country and a lot smaller one at Rayleigh. The first as the management company has called in the receivers and the second because with social distancing  the number of tables would be halved making it unviable.

Rayleigh is scheduled for 27th June this year (I assume subject to the 21st June date being met for lockdown lifting)

[John M Upton]

One year in the days of the infamous Bachman Scrum at Ally Pally some years back, I noted a few individuals were at the front of the queue to go in at 09:30 and then saw them heading home, shopping bags crammed full before 10:00.

 

A scan of Ebay later that evening revealed a lot of newly listed Bachmann returns stuff with the labels stating as such torn off being advertised for RRP and more....

 

Meanwhile I who wanted to buy a few bargain items for my own use was left with little to choose from worth buying.  

 

 

[woodenhead]

3 minutes ago, John M Upton said:

One year in the days of the infamous Bachman Scrum at Ally Pally some years back, I noted a few individuals were at the front of the queue to go in at 09:30 and then saw them heading home, shopping bags crammed full before 10:00.

 

A scan of Ebay later that evening revealed a lot of newly listed Bachmann returns stuff with the labels stating as such torn off being advertised for RRP and more....

 

Meanwhile I who wanted to buy a few bargain items for my own use was left with little to choose from worth buying.  

 

 

Imagine how big the pile is going to be this year at Warley!!

 

I've only ever picked up one item from the scrum - a nice GWR liver Dukedog - lovely runner even it if only made a couple of journeys before I packed all my OO up.  It was a meant to be purchase, I walked away twice and on the third time back I said to myself if it's still there I should buy it.  Used the same tactic on the Ellis Clark table at Milton Keynes and didn't buy anything, regretted not purchasing some N gauge Mk1 suburbans but that turned out fortuitous as they were maroon and wouldn't fit the time period I am now working in.

[tomparryharry]

Hmm.  I think I'm over 500, but I'm not a dealer.  I started going to railwayana auctions  back in the early 80's, and the first lesson I learned is that objects can & do go around. In that case, I'll just bide my time.  When Heljan released the Night Owl, I thought " I must have that," but the issues of quality & price don't match. Plus, of course, they worked away from my preferred area. I did indeed have a cursory glance last night, but I tempered that with " Hang on, I can afford something more in keeping with that money."

 

Right now I'm re-equipping my workshop. Certain tools are reasonably cheap ATM, so I'm getting  'into stock'.   

 

However, someone was selling an 0-1" micrometer for the unbelievable knock-down price of £916.... And no, it's not a typo.... 

[locomad2]

18 hours ago, Northmoor said:

My experience of both eBay and swapmeets is that there are a tremendous number of people pretending not to be traders (but who seem to have almost limitless "personal collections" for sale) which HMRC would probably be quite interested in.

 

 

Having sorted out quite a few "estates" HMRC class model trains as "toys" so apparently no inheritance tax to pay.

 

Many charities claim they are not allowed to sell model trains left to them as again classed as "toys" and for Health and safety can't resell. Apparently some trading standards councils also class model trains as "toys" and its against the law for traders to sell them. Certainly if you purchased 2nd hand and it didn't work you have no rights.

 

Finally my council regards them as un recycling waste, stock with no motors un recycled plastic waste, those with motors un recycled electrical waste, so you could say they are all " rubbish", having watched this Ebay thread there is a lot of that about. Finally as a trader you need a waste disposal licence or some waste carrier licence to move them about.

[Blandford1969]

Our friend Gostude is up to his old tricks again. Not sure if this is a bridge too far though. Supposedly a Malcolm Mitchell 28xx in fully running condition.  Only problems are he never made a 28xx and from the photos it looks like a K's model. Nicely put together with extra detail, but still very misleading. 

MALCOLM MITCHELL KIT BUILT GW GWR GREEN 2-8-0 CLASS 2800 LOCOMOTIVE 2873 nx | eBay

[PhilJ W]

5 hours ago, andyman7 said:

Rayleigh is scheduled for 27th June this year (I assume subject to the 21st June date being met for lockdown lifting)

Thanks for that information. The organisers of the Brentwood toy fair (www.j-jwebbtoyfairs.com) will not be restarting any toy fairs until September at the earliest and the Brentwood fair is listed as 'Subject to confirmation'.

[Enterprisingwestern]

50 minutes ago, Blandford1969 said:

Our friend Gostude is up to his old tricks again. Not sure if this is a bridge too far though. Supposedly a Malcolm Mitchell 28xx in fully running condition.  Only problems are he never made a 28xx and from the photos it looks like a K's model. Nicely put together with extra detail, but still very misleading. 

MALCOLM MITCHELL KIT BUILT GW GWR GREEN 2-8-0 CLASS 2800 LOCOMOTIVE 2873 nx | eBay

 

MALCOLM MITCHELL MODELS

KIT BUILT

OO GAUGE for 2 Rail Operation.

This locomotive has been Professionally assembled and painted from a White Metal Loco kit with a brass tender.

 

He contradicts himself by line 4 by stating it is a White Metal Kit, some sort of record?

 

Mike.

[MartinWales]

2 hours ago, Enterprisingwestern said:

 

MALCOLM MITCHELL MODELS

KIT BUILT

OO GAUGE for 2 Rail Operation.

This locomotive has been Professionally assembled and painted from a White Metal Loco kit with a brass tender.

 

He contradicts himself by line 4 by stating it is a White Metal Kit, some sort of record?

 

Mike.

Wonder if it's worth an email.......

[MartinWales]

6 hours ago, woodenhead said:

Imagine how big the pile is going to be this year at Warley!!

Never mind that, just think of the size of the crowd...........

[MartinWales]

On 14/03/2021 at 20:27, andytrains said:

£39-50p, 2nd hand from Rails. https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/THE-EM-GAUGE-SOCIETY-EM-GAUGE-SL-EM2-B6-LEFT-HAND-POINT/193955142292?hash=item2d28a09a94:g:p~gAAOSwLrNgTO9f

or

£27.00p new from the EM society!

 

Yes! Offered that and guess what.........

[MartinWales]

On 14/03/2021 at 21:25, Paul H Vigor said:

It would appear that the modelling public plays second fiddle to the trade, regardless of where and when model railway trading occurs?

You know what....choose your fair and take them at their own game, why not grab a table and see what you can get?

[PhilJ W]

6 minutes ago, MartinWales said:

You know what....choose your fair and take them at their own game, why not grab a table and see what you can get?

I have taken a table at a toy fair a couple of times. I don't think I will be troubled by HMRC unless they have a tax refund for me as at the end of the day there was only a very small profit. I was disposing of surplus items and a few things from a deceased member of our MRC that were of low value and/or no club members were interested.  

[John M Upton]

"Never been opened" and "Bargain" apparently.

What we in fact have is the ye ancient the instructions were translated from the original Latin Triang Class 37 on the Class 47 bogies monstrosity and yours for a few pence change out of a hundred and twenty sheets.... 

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Rare-Hornby-BR-37260-Co-Co-Diesel-Electric-Class-37-Locomotive-Never-Unwrapped/124637338446?hash=item1d04f6db4e:g:uGgAAOSw2m1gPPLI