Kernow Bachmann Class 205 Thumper Decorated Samples

[colin penfold]

my 1108 arrived today from Kernow, smashing model I am delighted.

 

It does reinforce one of my niggles with Bachmann though, the lack of basic information given with their models. Nowhere do they tell you how to join the two halves of the unit together.  I suspect there will be many on here who will say "you ought to be able to work it out" and yes, I did. I just think they ought to tell you.

[Robin Brasher]

my 1108 arrived today from Kernow, smashing model I am delighted.

 

It does reinforce one of my niggles with Bachmann though, the lack of basic information given with their models. Nowhere do they tell you how to join the two halves of the unit together.  I suspect there will be many on here who will say "you ought to be able to work it out" and yes, I did. I just think they ought to tell you.

I will now be able to run my two hourly dmu service that you described in Plan of the month Swanage on page 21 of the January 1971 Railway Modeller. The Hampshire demus took over on and from September 4th 1966 and were still running when your brilliant article appeared.

[colin penfold]

I will now be able to run my two hourly dmu service that you described in Plan of the month Swanage on page 21 of the January 1971 Railway Modeller. The Hampshire demus took over on and from September 4th 1966 and were still running when your brilliant article appeared.

 

Hi Robin, the fact that you quoted my post suggests you are crediting me with the article you refer to. Whilst I would love to be credited with it' i'm afraid I did not write an article for RM, aged 9.

[Re6/6]

A short clip of a 'Thumper' on TT2 last night.

 

A very nice runner.

 

[Robin Brasher]

Hi Robin, the fact that you quoted my post suggests you are crediting me with the article you refer to. Whilst I would love to be credited with it' i'm afraid I did not write an article for RM, aged 9.

Dear Colin. I am sorry that I confused you with the Colin Penfold who wrote the article in the Railway Modeller. 

[47606odin]

I want a 3 car, and unless they produce one, i shall not get one, i only ever saw them as 3 cars until they started to mess around with them at Selhurst. but then, the centre cars are a good basis for a BR built 4 EPB and the DT is perfect for a 2HAP or even as a 4CAP, so it is not as if there are no other uses after the initial expenditure of making the moulds

[brushman47544]

I want a 3 car, and unless they produce one, i shall not get one, i only ever saw them as 3 cars until they started to mess around with them at Selhurst. but then, the centre cars are a good basis for a BR built 4 EPB and the DT is perfect for a 2HAP or even as a 4CAP, so it is not as if there are no other uses after the initial expenditure of making the moulds

Whilst I too would prefer a 3 car, I will be happy to buy a 2 car when the livery I want is available hopefully in the next batch.

 

Whilst I agree that a TS would have other uses, don't forget these are Kernow MRC commissions and we don't know their contractual arrangements with Bachmann over use or ownership of the tooling. Even if Bachmann wanted to KMRC might have first refusal or there may be a time limit before Bachmann can use the tooling for other things. I certainly can't see a 3 car being announced until all the promised different 2 car variants have been produced.

[Robin Brasher]

I have just run my green 2 car Thumper on my Corfe Castle layout at the Isle of Purbeck model railway group's club night. It ran very well through Hornby 2nd radius curves and points. The visitors thought the Thumper and the Hornby 2-BIL were equally good. I preferred the illuminated interior and headcodes on the Thumper and I preferred the Bachmann packaging.

 

I always called the Thumpers Hampshire DMUs. On Monday 22nd August 1966 Anthony Trood took a picture of Hampshire 2-coach DEMU no 1125 at Corfe Castle down platform. It looked like it was in BR green livery with an oblong yellow panel on the front end and the headcode 03. The other branch engine was Ivatt 2-6-2T 41320 presumably with two green Bulleid or Mk1 coaches. All the other pictures I have seen  of Hampshire DMUs on the branch line are of 3-coach Hampshire DEMUs usually in BR blue livery. I hope that either Bachmann or Kernow will produce a three car set although a two car set is better than nothing.

[Lady_Ava_Hay]

Whilst I too would prefer a 3 car, I will be happy to buy a 2 car when the livery I want is available hopefully in the next batch.

 

Whilst I agree that a TS would have other uses, don't forget these are Kernow MRC commissions and we don't know their contractual arrangements with Bachmann over use or ownership of the tooling. Even if Bachmann wanted to KMRC might have first refusal or there may be a time limit before Bachmann can use the tooling for other things. I certainly can't see a 3 car being announced until all the promised different 2 car variants have been produced.

 

Providing a three car unit for this model is not straightforward. The coupling between the two cars is a bar type that I have never seen before and is electrically conductive for the head, tail and coach lights. Thus any additional car will have to have the same coupling at both ends with the same electrical conductivity. This might affect the wiring of the existing LED's as they seem to be wired in series to handle 12 volts. Since Led's are polarity sensitive one wonders what would happen if the third coach was connected the wrong way round. With current coach prices, a one off coach for a limited market might prove both expensive and push the three car price to near £200 which would probably prove prohibitive. The 4 Cep has struggled as a 4 car unit at around this price although a four car unit is a bit much for a lot of layouts..

 

It seems normal for these special commissions to last without competition for about 18 months but there will be an agreement about it which might prove to be fluid in terms of release date for general issue. I did read somewhere that Kernow have 1000 orders to fill and have probably got most of the way through the first batch.

 

If you want one I would order one from Kernow as a two car unit and not hold my breath for a three car unit. We waited several years for this one!

 

In general the model is really good and is much admired when I take it out and about.

[brushman47544]

Providing a three car unit for this model is not straightforward. The coupling between the two cars is a bar type that I have never seen before and is electrically conductive for the head, tail and coach lights. Thus any additional car will have to have the same coupling at both ends with the same electrical conductivity. This might affect the wiring of the existing LED's as they seem to be wired in series to handle 12 volts. Since Led's are polarity sensitive one wonders what would happen if the third coach was connected the wrong way round. With current coach prices, a one off coach for a limited market might prove both expensive and push the three car price to near £200 which would probably prove prohibitive. The 4 Cep has struggled as a 4 car unit at around this price although a four car unit is a bit much for a lot of layouts..

 

It seems normal for these special commissions to last without competition for about 18 months but there will be an agreement about it which might prove to be fluid in terms of release date for general issue. I did read somewhere that Kernow have 1000 orders to fill and have probably got most of the way through the first batch.

 

If you want one I would order one from Kernow as a two car unit and not hold my breath for a three car unit. We waited several years for this one!

 

In general the model is really good and is much admired when I take it out and about.

 

Interesting about the wiring - I assumed it would be the same as the 4-CEP so a TS could be added without problems as long as inserted the correct way round. Anyway, I already have a 2-car on order, but it's for one of the liveries not yet produced.

[Gwiwer]

The extended wait for those models so far released has not been within Kernow MRC's control and I'm sure they have torn hair and gnashed teeth in frustration every bit as much as we have.  It is, after all, their money up-front and not ours which pays for the R&D, production, marketing and all until the models arrive and we actually pay for them.  I consider the decision to defer some liveries eminently sensible.  Not only are tooling changes required in some cases but the sheer volume of stock if seven versions arrived together would be very difficult for the business to cope with in the short term.

 

Kernow has always said that any future 3-car version will depend upon sales of the 2-car ones.  My suggestion is therefore that we support the present initiative to the extent we can and await future developments.  That might mean another few years or there might never be a 3-car version.  Or it may come about by other means such as a general catalogue item.  We don't known and neither do we know what private commercial arrangements might exist between Kernow MRC and the manufacturers.

 

I have expressed my personal preference to the business of 3-car units were to be considered in terms of an FYI and have not had - nor do I expect to have - any form of response other than an acknowledgement.

[darren01]

HI 

Very nice indeed , I have a photo of a Thumper along way from home.

Taken at Barnstaple Station

Darren01

[brushman47544]

I'm not normally a conspiracy theorist, but why is Bachmann accepting all the new special Commissions we have heard about recently (such as from Invicta, the LT Museum etc.) if as we are being told it hasn't got production slots for the next batch of Thumpers...

[Gwiwer]

Have we been told it doesn't have those production slots?

 

I understood it was the case that there would be slots but that the entire range could not be accommodated at one time meaning we have some now but the rest in (possibly more than one batch) later.

 

I don't see any statement from Kernow MRC to the effect that the outstanding items cannot be produced.  I can however understand Bachmann accepting new commissions as it ensures a constant flow of work for some time ahead.  If I were in that sort of business I'd want to secure my cash-flow and product supply for perhaps 3 or 4 years into the future.

[brushman47544]

Maybe I generalized too much. KMRC's website says "There is no production capacity available in 2013 so these models will not be produced until 2014 at the earliest." 

 

This suggests to me that Bachmann is not even prepared to give an assurance that a production slot will be allocated in 2014. Yet at the same time, Bachmann seems to be producing limited editions for other retailers and is continuing to accept new commissions as well, some of which have been stated by the commissioner as appearing in 2014. It is now quite some time since the production of the Thumpers was transferred to Bachmann and the first batch appeared, the rest should by now be quite high in the production queue but do not seem to be in that other commissions announced later are appearing first.

[Gary H]

HI 

Very nice indeed , I have a photo of a Thumper along way from home.

Taken at Barnstaple Station

Darren01

When roughly was that taken, Darren?

[Bomag]

When roughly was that taken, Darren?

 

 

25/5/05 accoring the the Hastings unit website. 

[Gary H]

Maybe I generalized too much. KMRC's website says "There is no production capacity available in 2013 so these models will not be produced until 2014 at the earliest." 

 

This suggests to me that Bachmann is not even prepared to give an assurance that a production slot will be allocated in 2014. Yet at the same time, Bachmann seems to be producing limited editions for other retailers and is continuing to accept new commissions as well, some of which have been stated by the commissioner as appearing in 2014. It is now quite some time since the production of the Thumpers was transferred to Bachmann and the first batch appeared, the rest should by now be quite high in the production queue but do not seem to be in that other commissions announced later are appearing first.

Did this coincide with the closure of one of the big Chinese factorys 18 months or so ago?

I was reading an archived piece on the subject a few days ago and the fact that it would be putting a squeeze on all the model railway / model railroad manufacturers in general for some considerable time to come.

 

The news article about the Chinese factory's- http://www.caboosehobbies.com/catalog/miscnews.php

[dibber25]

Maybe I generalized too much. KMRC's website says "There is no production capacity available in 2013 so these models will not be produced until 2014 at the earliest." 

 

This suggests to me that Bachmann is not even prepared to give an assurance that a production slot will be allocated in 2014. Yet at the same time, Bachmann seems to be producing limited editions for other retailers and is continuing to accept new commissions as well, some of which have been stated by the commissioner as appearing in 2014. It is now quite some time since the production of the Thumpers was transferred to Bachmann and the first batch appeared, the rest should by now be quite high in the production queue but do not seem to be in that other commissions announced later are appearing first.

Imminent production slots for existing models and accepting new commissions have no link whatsoever. New commissions have to go through research, development, engineering prototypes, decorated samples etc before they ever require a production slot. Any new commissions accepted now will be probably two years away, when there may very well be production slots available. The lack of availability of production slots this year (if, indeed, there is a lack of them) will be because of the amount of current product going through the factory, set against the current labour shortages etc. Limited editions - livery variants - are 'bolted on' to Bachmann's own production runs to make the best use of those production slots.

[Butler Henderson]

I want a 3 car, and unless they produce one, i shall not get one, i only ever saw them as 3 cars until they started to mess around with them at Selhurst. but then, the centre cars are a good basis for a BR built 4 EPB and the DT is perfect for a 2HAP or even as a 4CAP, so it is not as if there are no other uses after the initial expenditure of making the moulds

Also waiting for a green 3H but it has occurred to me that one of the Replica Suburbans could be used

http://www.replicarailways.co.uk/ready-to-run-items/self-assembly

Question being how good a match, or not, are the Replica and Kernow/Bachmann greens. If not a good match anyone know of a suitable paint that matches the Kernow/Bachmann green

 

As for the issue of the power passing through the couplings have thought it might be possible to use the Roco 40345 couplings instead of the Bachmann coupling bars http://www.roco.cc/en/product/22609-0-0-0-0-0-0-003005/products.html Cannot however find anywhere the dimensions of those couplings

[roundhouse]

I picked up one of the Replica suburban green bodies but so far g

I have not remembered to try and see how close a match the green is.

[Ceptic]

Also waiting for a green 3H but it has occurred to me that one of the Replica Suburbans could be used

http://www.replicarailways.co.uk/ready-to-run-items/self-assembly

Question being how good a match, or not, are the Replica and Kernow/Bachmann greens. If not a good match anyone know of a suitable paint that matches the Kernow/Bachmann green

 

As for the issue of the power passing through the couplings have thought it might be possible to use the Roco 40345 couplings instead of the Bachmann coupling bars http://www.roco.cc/en/product/22609-0-0-0-0-0-0-003005/products.html Cannot however find anywhere the dimensions of those couplings

 

I picked up one of the Replica suburban green bodies but so far g

I have not remembered to try and see how close a match the green is.

 

 

See photos on this thread page.

http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/12317-class-205-in-conjunction-with-kernow-model-shop/page-14

[roundhouse]

 

Forgot about your posts. Thanks for the reminder..

 

Ian

[southernelectric]

So does anyone think we might actually see the rest of the variants that were originally announced by Kernow later this year? I have a blue one on pre-order and would like to get a green with SYP and NSE versions but Kernow stopped taking pre-orders for these versions a while back. I did ask one of their staff about it at Ally Pally, and it was implied that announcements on the remaining models would come soon but that was all, and nearly two months has passed since then...

[Gwiwer]

"Nearly two months" is not that long in the scheme of things.

 

I realise many of us have been waiting more like five years from first announcement of these models but they have not been canned and are still in the pipeline based on the last official world from Kernow MRC some time back.

 

The various changes to the model-producing landscape may have altered any target for production but unless we hear a corpulent female raising her voice from Camborne then it ain't over.

 

But this year?  I'm not laying bets.  The entire supply chain is too volatile and unpredictable for that.