Andrew P Posted January 28, 2015 Share Posted January 28, 2015 Any updates? NO? :no: Oh well back to sleep then :stinker: Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
67A Posted January 28, 2015 Author Share Posted January 28, 2015 Any updates? NO? :no: Oh well back to sleep then :stinker: Oh yes, I have given you an update back on Bitton! 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
67A Posted January 28, 2015 Author Share Posted January 28, 2015 Hi all, Quick midweek update before I go to play trains! Received my custom made selection of signs from Sankey Scenics, and I have to say the look the business... This is one sheet with mainly station signage The second sheet has some larger signs for use on the layout itself The third sheet has bridge plates correct for the area And road destination boards ****** I have not been sitting around though... Here are the two doors for the Waiting Room building, I decided I can do these myself by scribing the 'herringbone' design Here is the building with Ambis Engineering etched windows and my doors in place. That's it for now. 16 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
67A Posted January 28, 2015 Author Share Posted January 28, 2015 Okay Mick 'Donnington Road' - You asked for it! Here are those much sought after behind the scenes shots you wanted... Viewing to the 'south' end you can see the relationship of the spiral to the layout and fiddleyard This is the same spiral viewed from another angle This view shows the entrance from the spiral to the fiddleyard fan of trackwork View looking along from the south end fan Looking along the length of the layout to the 'north' The 'north' end spiral in relation to the layout, bit tighter space wise this end North end fan as it attaches to spiral North end fan area Continued... 13 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
67A Posted January 28, 2015 Author Share Posted January 28, 2015 Now for some other bits... My Stock storage trays Workstation and paraphernalia down the left hand side along with my mate John 'looking busy'! General storage on the shelves etc This is my garage looking from the entrance, I could just about get a Gauge 1' size car in here! The only reason I'm doing anything in here at this time of year! View toward the doors, not the fan at about 2' O'clock, this blows that lovely warm air through to the den. And just to finish, here is the Waiting Room with the windows and doors fitted. No playing trains happened so apologies for that. 15 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
67A Posted January 28, 2015 Author Share Posted January 28, 2015 Hi again, Sorry I meant to add (mainly for Jeff's benefit) there are NO LEGS that's right NO LEGS holding up either the layout nor the fiddleyard! Both are cantilevered off the wall on the aluminium angle you see the photos and nothing has moved since. Result: Loads of space below, cheap in comparison to timber for legs and no kicking the bleeding things in your slippers, yes I am of that age! 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew P Posted January 28, 2015 Share Posted January 28, 2015 That's brilliant Mike, some wonderful shots mate, I could never visualise the size of it before or the fact that it was off the main Garage, love the burner, and your suggested organised chaos, hahahha Cheers for the pics mate. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Donington Road Posted January 28, 2015 Share Posted January 28, 2015 Okay Mick 'Donnington Road' - You asked for it! Here are those much sought after behind the scenes shots you wanted... Damn, I was watching the football and you snuck up on the blind side Mike, those are really good photos that show how it all works, very impressive I must say. I like the way the helixes have created space in your railway room by keeping the railway all to one side allowing for the much needed storage and workbench opposite, and it also provides a nice open operating area for the layout. Perhaps if you convinced Jeff to adopt the cantilever approach he would then have a lot of spare timber to fuel your stove. 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Ray H Posted January 28, 2015 RMweb Premium Share Posted January 28, 2015 Apologies if these have been asked before Mike but . . . . What is the length of the layout? How tight is that semi reverse curve as it leaves the scenic section at the upper level (in the second picture in the series? What are the dimensions of the extended helix? Thanks. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Anotheran Posted January 28, 2015 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 28, 2015 Incredible Mike! I love the scenic section... but as a geek I have to say that your non-scenic areas do it almost as much for me! It's great to see how you've got it all to fit together... and it must take ages for the same train to reappear if it was just left to run around at a scale speed! Kind regards, Neil Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jock67B Posted January 29, 2015 Share Posted January 29, 2015 Mike, Confirms what I've always thought - the craftsmanship/clever button isn't really strong enough IMHO! Mustn't start on the long history of fine engineers from Scotland but that's just what I feel!! Kind regards, Jock. 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Donington Road Posted January 29, 2015 Share Posted January 29, 2015 Mike, Confirms what I've always thought - the craftsmanship/clever button isn't really strong enough IMHO! Mustn't start on the long history of fine engineers from Scotland but that's just what I feel!! Kind regards, Jock. I can't find the biased button for you Jock Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
67A Posted January 29, 2015 Author Share Posted January 29, 2015 Damn, I was watching the football and you snuck up on the blind side Mike, those are really good photos that show how it all works, very impressive I must say. I like the way the helixes have created space in your railway room by keeping the railway all to one side allowing for the much needed storage and workbench opposite, and it also provides a nice open operating area for the layout. Perhaps if you convinced Jeff to adopt the cantilever approach he would then have a lot of spare timber to fuel your stove. Hi Mick The helixes! Oh yes they were my masterplan! In the old shed I had a roundy-roundy layout (Chestergate & Milne) but was tired of ducking under to get in, even though I had a lift out section it became to cumbersome as more scenery was added it ended up impractical to use so a major re-think for TLGP beckoned. In honesty I had no knowledge of the pro's and con's of the helix until I tried it out. The original circles were a disaster therefore the elongated version was devised to fit in the available space and although still limit certain trains they are performing faultlessly now for 6 months or more. The other criteria for the new build was modelling space and storage space and I think this has been delivered. The garage area is for 'dirty' work and any heavy duty projects. It all works like clockwork!......................Oh heck I thought is was electric! 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
67A Posted January 29, 2015 Author Share Posted January 29, 2015 Incredible Mike! I love the scenic section... but as a geek I have to say that your non-scenic areas do it almost as much for me! It's great to see how you've got it all to fit together... and it must take ages for the same train to reappear if it was just left to run around at a scale speed! Kind regards, Neil Hi Neil,. If I set a train out from the fiddleyard it takes between 4 and 5 minutes to complete the circuit at a scale speed to suit the train. 5 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
67A Posted January 29, 2015 Author Share Posted January 29, 2015 I can't find the biased button for you Jock Jock's not biased he's just confirming what the whole world knows - or should know by now! Och aye! 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
67A Posted January 29, 2015 Author Share Posted January 29, 2015 Apologies if these have been asked before Mike but . . . . What is the length of the layout? How tight is that semi reverse curve as it leaves the scenic section at the upper level (in the second picture in the series? What are the dimensions of the extended helix? Thanks. Hi Ray, Will measure properly later and reply but I can tell you the room is 26ft long so that is the length of the layout over both the fell's, between tunnels its approx 20ft. All curves are the same radius throughout as I used homemade track templates, I think the photo makes it look tight. Others to follow. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Donington Road Posted January 29, 2015 Share Posted January 29, 2015 Hi Mick The helixes! Oh yes they were my masterplan! The original circles were a disaster therefore the elongated version was devised to fit in the available space and although still limit certain trains they are performing faultlessly now for 6 months or more. I have seen many helixes on American layouts on YouTube. They seem to go for larger radii rather than elongation. I guess there is a formula somewhere for optimum efficiency, but yours work for you so that is the main thing. What height is the storage yard from the floor and what height is the track through Dent from the floor? 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Allegheny1600 Posted January 29, 2015 Share Posted January 29, 2015 Hi Mike, I can't add much except to say thanks for those pics of the spirals, they're bloomin brilliant! Cheers, John. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
67A Posted January 29, 2015 Author Share Posted January 29, 2015 I have seen many helixes on American layouts on YouTube. They seem to go for larger radii rather than elongation. I guess there is a formula somewhere for optimum efficiency, but yours work for you so that is the main thing. What height is the storage yard from the floor and what height is the track through Dent from the floor? Hi Mick, I tried the larger radii, I MADE two 5ft dia circles and laid them on the floor - BUT the result was they took up far too much room in the Den and left little room for Dent itself! So I bought a kit off RMWeb classifieds and copied it for the other end and more height to the kit itself. Floor to storage: 31" Floor to Scenic track level: 52" A climb of 21" over 7 levels approx 1:75 with 32yds of track in each spiral per line! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
67A Posted January 29, 2015 Author Share Posted January 29, 2015 Apologies if these have been asked before Mike but . . . . What is the length of the layout? How tight is that semi reverse curve as it leaves the scenic section at the upper level (in the second picture in the series? What are the dimensions of the extended helix? Thanks. Hi Ray, To complete your request: Radii: Inner 17.5" Outer 20" Extended helix overall 88" x 44" As I said I made a pair of ply templates on the bansdaw and all the curved sections were made with these to keep uniformity. As a result of the design you may notice that all trains climbing the spiral actually use the outer radius and the inner radius is for return to fiddleyard, this keeps the friction levels down a little and helps with the ascent. Although they are larger than tight set-track curves my Deltic and DP2 will not run on them as the wheels touch the body skirt - dammitt! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Ray H Posted January 29, 2015 RMweb Premium Share Posted January 29, 2015 Cheers Mike. I'm surprised at the last statement. Your smallest radius is slightly larger than second radius curves and the larger radius is fractionally larger than 3rd radius. I thought most locos these days were designed to tolerate second radius and definitely third radius. I wonder how much more the radius would have had to have been to avoid the need to elongate the circles? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Donington Road Posted January 29, 2015 Share Posted January 29, 2015 Hi Mick, I tried the larger radii, I MADE two 5ft dia circles and laid them on the floor - BUT the result was they took up far too much room in the Den and left little room for Dent itself! So I bought a kit off RMWeb classifieds and copied it for the other end and more height to the kit itself. Floor to storage: 31" Floor to Scenic track level: 52" A climb of 21" over 7 levels approx 1:75 with 32yds of track in each spiral per line! Those Americans seem to have far more space, usually whole basements the size of the house footprint and their helixes seem to be a minimum of 6ft diameter As I said I made a pair of ply templates on the bansdaw and all the curved sections were made with these to keep uniformity. As a result of the design you may notice that all trains climbing the spiral actually use the outer radius and the inner radius is for return to fiddleyard, this keeps the friction levels down a little and helps with the ascent. That's clever Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Joseph_Pestell Posted January 29, 2015 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 29, 2015 Incredible Mike! I love the scenic section... but as a geek I have to say that your non-scenic areas do it almost as much for me! It's great to see how you've got it all to fit together... and it must take ages for the same train to reappear if it was just left to run around at a scale speed! Kind regards, Neil True. With that much length of running line hidden sidings are almost unnecessary. Trains could just follow each other at intervals. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Anotheran Posted January 29, 2015 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 29, 2015 32 yards of track per line in each helix! With your 20' scenic section and the same in the fiddle yard I make that about three and a third scale miles of track in each direction. No wonder it takes four minutes for a train to do a full loop! As Joseph said, you could have trains just following each other round on an automatic block in each direction and watch them go by. Though I'm not sure you'd want them stopping and starting too often on the ascent of a helix! Monumental engineering! 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
67A Posted January 29, 2015 Author Share Posted January 29, 2015 Cheers Mike. I'm surprised at the last statement. Your smallest radius is slightly larger than second radius curves and the larger radius is fractionally larger than 3rd radius. I thought most locos these days were designed to tolerate second radius and definitely third radius. I wonder how much more the radius would have had to have been to avoid the need to elongate the circles? Quite agree Ray, I am dumbfounded, confounded and more than a little annoyed that they will not negotiate even on the outer. I'll bang a washer on the bogie pin! Those were the days eh! It was not the radius which caused the helixes to be elongated it was the fact nothing of a decent length would climb them! Therefore the only solution was to lengthen them by 45" between curves, this gives a total distance of approx 61/2 yds to climb 3" on each circuit. It was a pity I was limited to that 45" had I been able to put in 8ft I would have but the garage wall was in the way! I could have got another 2ft at the other end but it would not have achieved anything so I left it at that. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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