What have you done with your Keyser kit

[Blandford1969]

1 hour ago, 41516 said:

If you can wait until this evening, I have the Nu-Cast boxing of the 8F kit in the loft I think is complete with instructions.

Thanks, that would be fantastic. 

[41516]

PM sent.

[BMS]

On 08/08/2022 at 14:43, Steamport Southport said:

The later ones came with transfers as well, a small sheet made by PC models ISTR. All the ones I bought at the time which were brand new 1980s versions in silver/grey boxes, bought from Hattons when they still sold loco kits, had them. 14XX, Dean Goods, Grange, 28XX, Black Five, etc. 

 

It's only recently that I've got ancient ones in orange and red boxes. All bargains as they are mostly types that are readily available RTR and often with bits missing. Usually the things I don't really want anyway such as the wheels and motor.

 

One of the later kits I've got, the Taff Vale 0-4-0ST even has etched brass numberplates and cab. Not one I was after but it came up in Hattons recently so fell in the basket. Might have a look at doing it as an industrial or contractors locomotive as it's a Hudswell Clarke and quite similar to Lord Mayor.

 

https://preservedbritishsteamlocomotives.com/hudswell-clarke-works-no-402-lord-mayor-0-4-0st/

 

Just got to build them all now.....

 

 

Jason

Ambis, I think, do/did a chassis kit for this 0-4-0T; p4 afaik

[hayfield]

A couple of weeks ago I bought three lots of etched brass items from two different sources, the main thing was there were 3 Perseverance chassis and 2 sets of Gibson Mainframes, and I was still left with several other items, the surplus was sold off and nearly covered my costs therefore the chassis will cost me the price of 3 sets of Gibson coupling rods

 

My first whitemetal kit was a K's Dean Goods, I was about 15 years old full of enthusiasm but lacked skills, plus it was stuck together with old fashioned glues, it was an older 70's kit. Rebuilt at least once and re-wheeled with Romford wheels, missing or broken steps, though I have sourced a new set.

 

 

With the lots were these two etchings plus two others, the main one being I believe a Blacksmith etch, the second some form of unknown tender etch

 

 

The second two a Blacksmith tender chassis, and number etches.

 

I think I have a spare Perseverance chassis, so I think the original kit will get a big make over and conversion to EM gauge. When I don't know. But this is one of 5 K kits having this type of major rebuild combining both etched and whitemetal kits. Still this will be a free (ish) upgrade

[Brassey]

That tender footplate etch is Mallard too. On the etch with the numbers you have the belpaire firebox and smokebox so almost a complete Mallard Dean Goods.  I’ve built 3 from such etches…

[Brassey]

 

Believe it or not, the carcass under these brass claddings is a K's GWR Dukedog!  You can just see the whitemetal above the axles. 

 

I filed off all the rivet detail etc. and attached a set of outside frames for a Bulldog Bird class that came with a detailing kit for the Airfix City of Truro.  The roof is also from the Dukedog.  The rest is from a set of Falcon Brass etches for a Bulldog plus some scratchbuilt bits and other detailing from Branchlines for the Bird.

 

Currently working on the tender using the chassis that came with the Branchlines COT motorising and detail kits.  This has been sprung using High Level CSB components and will sit under the K's 3000 gal tender that came with the Dukedog: 

 

[Graham456]

What have you done ! With ?

only gone and bought another blooming one.......AGAIN !

total now 34 keyser locos ......

well I some how never had a pannier from K's so when a e,mail came through from Hattons about a sale which had for one at £26.it looked O,K inconsistent runner, one day later the postman handed it to me along with a star which I am yet to work out whose make it is as their are differences in the castings from my Wills kits not to mention etched chassis for both loco and tender, might be updated south eastern finecast but theirs differences in the footplate and tender castings from my Wills locos,

 anyway back to K'. pannier, opening up reviled the problem  why the running was inconsistent HP2M....now what !

tempted to, well no I will replace the motor for sure as I have in all my kits that came with them even did that when I was young Lad, but hear I am tempted to keep the Keyser wheels and even the gear set for mad originality reasons, after all the loco is never going to even look up to the Bachman pannier and fit another motor if a can find a replacement motor withthe HPcrap2 motors shaft size don't suppose anyone knows of the top of.your heads, the reason I just want to change the motor is so I don't disturb the wheels, Romfords will cost more than the loco and ruin  its look 

Edited August 22, 2022 by Graham456
Editing spell chucker or brain failure

[hayfield]

On 21/08/2022 at 13:17, Graham456 said:

What have you done ! With ?

only gone and bought another blooming one.......AGAIN !

total now 34 keyser locos ......

well I some how never had a pannier from K's so when a e,mail came through from Hattons about a sale which had for one at £26.it looked O,K inconsistent runner, one day later the postman handed it to me along with a star which I am yet to work out whose make it is as their are differences in the castings from my Wills kits not to mention etched chassis for both loco and tender, might be updated south eastern finecast but theirs differences in the footplate and tender castings from my Wills locos,

 anyway back to K'. spannier, opening up reviled the problem  why the running was inconsistent HP2M....now what !

tempted to, well no I will replace the motor for sure as I have in all my kits that came with them even did that when I was young Lad, but hear I am tempted to keep the Keyser wheels and even the gear set for mad originality reasons, after all the loco is never going to even look up to the Bachman pannier and fit another motor if a can find a replacement motor withthe HPcrap2 motors shaft size don't suppose anyone knows of the top of.your heads, the reason I just want to change the motor is so I don't disturb the wheels, Romfords will cost more than the loco and ruin  its look 

 

Chris at High Level does cheap small motors with 1mm shafts*, however will be much better if you use one of his Compact gearboxes. Hp2M motors do come on to the market if you want to keep it original.

 

* I think the HP2M had a 1mm shaft but the worm gear may well have been 1.5 mm

 

Southeastern Finecast Locos fall into 2 categories. The Revised locos which include an etched chassis and usually additional parts. The Star falls into the non-revised kits and still requires a Triang/Hornby B12 chassis. It may be a from another company (M&L or Westward ?) or even have a aftermarket etched chassis

Edited August 26, 2022 by hayfield

[RodneyS]

I'm fairly certain the HP2M had a 1/16'' dia shaft.

I remember enlarging the hole in a 1.5mm worm once (many years ago I hasten to add) so it would fit the K's shaft.

Rodney

[Graham456]

46 minutes ago, hayfield said:

 

Chris at High Level does cheap small motors with 1mm shafts*, however will be much better if you use one of his Compact gearboxes. Hp2M motors do come on to the market if you want to keep it original.

 

Southeastern Finecast Locos fall into 2 categories. The Revised locos which include an etched chassis and usually additional parts. The Star falls into the non-revised kits and still requires a Triang/Hornby B12 chassis. It may be a from another company (M&L or Westdale ?) or even have a aftermarket etched chassis

NO THANKS !

i don't want to keep it that original! I could keep it original by not changing the one that's in there keeping the original crap running abilities I do have a high level gearbox I could put in it but actually when poked the gear set runs quietly it just has a rice pudding skin non disturbing motor and changing the gear set might up the wheels hence the mad thought of only changing the motor

 hum ! Westdale for the star? I have a look at my Scott,s chassis for similar pointers, the only GWR M&L locos I have are 850.tanks or No111 nether likely to give clues, but thanks for the pointer as it definitely isn't S E Finecast if the kit hasn't been upgraded to many suble differences in the castings from my wills locos

[Graham456]

44 minutes ago, RodneyS said:

I'm fairly certain the HP2M had a 1/16'' dia shaft.

I remember enlarging the hole in a 1.5mm worm once (many years ago I hasten to add) so it would fit the K's shaft.

Rodney

Thanks Rodney, when it comes to it between coming out the loco and meeting the bin I have to measure the shaft ,I was just trying to plan ahead with a motor change but no one has yet owned up to knowledge of HP2M not that I blame them

 

HP2M wonder what HP1M was as that name didn't apply to the double ended motors that came before it .......unmade bigger disaster?

Edited August 21, 2022 by Graham456

[RodneyS]

Graham, since posting that I've had the chance to measure one of the HP2M shafts.

It is 1/16'' so the memory is not too bad.

However I had forgotten that, if you bought a motor separately , it came with a brass sleeve 3/32'' in diameter to suit Romford gears.

 

I remember reading an article about the motor in an EM Gauge Society newsletter which recommended using a piece of the brass sleeve to replace the plastic front bearing.

Evidently this improved it considerably.

Rodney

 

 

[Graham456]

Rodneys thanks for that ...a  cunning plan is forming !

1/16 is 1.588 mm so I might rip the motor out some when over the next couple of days and use one of my 1.5mm shafted motors with a bit of bearing fit lockseal with a pad of miliput to seat the motor on as by useing the keyser gears I have no motor mount, wondering as I type this is a ds10 a inprovment ?  Remember chaps it's still a K's kit that's not worth a portescap though my two 44xx and a bulldog run lovely with them!

Edited August 22, 2022 by Graham456

[RodneyS]

That is probably worth trying.

A late friend built many locos with DS10 motors.  After running in they were virtually silent and performed well.   He had one fitted with a Portescap and you could hear that coming a mile away.

 

I have a K's Taff Vale 0-4-0ST built as intended but I used a Gibson 38:1 gearbox as I thought the supplied plastic gears were rather too low a ratio.   

It was a long time ago but I think there were bearings and sleeves for the worm to suit differing armature shafts, none of which were 1/16''.  I put a 1/16'' drill through the 1.5mm bearings and sleeve so I remembered there was very little difference in size.

 

The gearbox took the load off the troublesome front bearing and I think it ran quite well.

However I never got the pick-ups right so it didn't have a lot of use. In the end it was just put away and forgotten about.  Last year, after discovering this thread, I dug out the loco and it still runs - sort of.  The wheels are a bit rusty and the pick-ups still need replacing.

Obviously a winter project.

Rodney

 

 

[Steamport Southport]

21 hours ago, hayfield said:

 

Chris at High Level does cheap small motors with 1mm shafts*, however will be much better if you use one of his Compact gearboxes. Hp2M motors do come on to the market if you want to keep it original.

 

* I think the HP2M had a 1mm shaft but the worm gear may well have been 1.5 mm

 

Southeastern Finecast Locos fall into 2 categories. The Revised locos which include an etched chassis and usually additional parts. The Star falls into the non-revised kits and still requires a Triang/Hornby B12 chassis. It may be a from another company (M&L or Westdale ?) or even have a aftermarket etched chassis

 

Comet Castle chassis fits the Star.

 

https://www.wizardmodels.ltd/shop/locomotive/lcp24/

 

https://www.wizardmodels.ltd/shop/locomotive/lf24/

 

 

 

Jason

[Graham456]

On 22/08/2022 at 13:38, Steamport Southport said:

 

Comet Castle chassis fits the Star.

 

https://www.wizardmodels.ltd/shop/locomotive/lcp24/

 

https://www.wizardmodels.ltd/shop/locomotive/lf24/

 

 

 

Jason

Funny you should post that........yesterday was spent going through my stars. Five of them ! Four from wills,of south east Finecast and one recent arrival with the etched chassis, this was numbered 4038 Queen Berengaria fine! But it had the cut out in the cab steps and a extra hole in the frames below the valve rocker hole makeing it one of the first twenty, so wrong name!

 Gently prising the number plate off revealed 4014. Underneath Interesting  I then looked harder at the name plate I had pinged off, and that to was double thickness, result and thank you who ever renamed it before selling it to Hattons, it came off cleanly and the loco is now back as Friday Night , or Knight of the Bath.which is correct for the cab steps and cut out.

  The Keyser pannier has also had open hart surgery! And the HP2m is in the bin, whilst I decide weather to risk removing the wheels from their axels with fingers crossed that the plastic spokes don't brake  as I don't really want to spend fifty quid on wheels for a twenty six pound loco or just try getting away with a motor transplant  let you know!

 

P S I need a what have you done with you Wills kit thread!

[RodneyS]

I recently removed some K's wheels with the plastic spokes from a Terrier I was given years ago.  The plastic was very brittle and the first one just shattered into many pieces.

 

I managed to get the rest off by supporting the wheel across open vice jaws with two pieces of metal close to the wheel centre.  I used some old 13 amp brass plug pins.  Then the axle was tapped out with  hammer and an old nail as a punch.

Of course, I should have done that in the first place !

 

However, one wheel had the crank pin broken so I was going to replace all the wheels anyway.

 

Do you need to remove the wheels from the axle ?

I am assuming that perhaps it's just to remove the gear ?

 

One version of the K's wheels had a large headed screw in the end of the axle holding the wheel in place.  The slot may be filled with paint.   That type would be a lot easier to dismantle.

 

Good luck.

Rodney

 

 

 

 

[Barclay]

Yes I managed to break one of the older K's wheels - I assume they were pre-assembled at the factory and therefore a pretty tight fit.

 

Re: a Wills kit thread - why not start one ?!

[Graham456]

5 hours ago, Barclay said:

 

Re: a Wills kit thread - why not start one ?!

 At the moment I am busy with keysers kits as said earlier currently I thinking about motors for the pannier, whilst distracted by giveing pick-up on all wheels, rather than the outer four which may be a factor in the hesitat running, other than the motor factor, 

also distracted by the postman just arriving with more from Hattons bargain  sale,,,,guess what it's only another blooming keyser kit built, that I never built when you could get them, £36 for a 55xx with what looks like through the gap DS10 again.and romfords,

 it's a bit glossy and the top of the tanks is green rather than black  which shouldn't be a problem to sort along with blacking down the nickel wheel rims, interest ly yet again double number plates 5570 on top of 5546 anyone  know of these locos were any different from each other as to which set to stick on

  Re wills thread,,, with the 55xx came two more stars 4056 princess Margaret with a dinged cab roof  and 4056 princess Augusta  with what looks like brass hamblins wheels which probably  dates its age and one name plate missing, but then £25 of reasons why it came my way. 

I must sort the pannier out before touching  the stars or 55xx,,,,,O sugar I have already prized the double number plates off !

Edited August 25, 2022 by Graham456

[hayfield]

9 hours ago, Graham456 said:

P S I need a what have you done with you Wills kit thread!

 

Graham456 

 

Start one, but will it be Wills, Wills Finecast or Southeastern Finecast ?

[hayfield]

On 21/08/2022 at 17:18, Graham456 said:

NO THANKS !

i don't want to keep it that original! I could keep it original by not changing the one that's in there keeping the original crap running abilities I do have a high level gearbox I could put in it but actually when poked the gear set runs quietly it just has a rice pudding skin non disturbing motor and changing the gear set might up the wheels hence the mad thought of only changing the motor

 hum ! Westdale for the star? I have a look at my Scott,s chassis for similar pointers, the only GWR M&L locos I have are 850.tanks or No111 nether likely to give clues, but thanks for the pointer as it definitely isn't S E Finecast if the kit hasn't been upgraded to many suble differences in the castings from my wills locos

 

 

Sorry but I have just seen a Typo

 

I said a Westdale as another guess, it should have read Westward !!!

 

Another guess may be DJH, they seem to have supplied quite a large range of locos in the past many not available now

 

Any photos of the star please

[Coach bogie]

On 25/08/2022 at 09:29, Graham456 said:

Funny you should post that........yesterday was spent going through my stars. Five of them ! Four from wills,of south east Finecast and one recent arrival with the etched chassis, this was numbered 4038 Queen Berengaria fine!

 One option is to use the Wills/SEF Castle chassis. I did this one some time ago when Dave Ellis owned SEF. I bought the frames direct and asked for the Castle front frame extensions/ slide bars etc which were kindly supplied as well.

 

Mike Wiltshire

[hayfield]

18 minutes ago, Coach bogie said:

 One option is to use the Wills/SEF Castle chassis. I did this one some time ago when Dave Ellis owned SEF. I bought the frames direct and asked for the Castle front frame extensions/ slide bars etc which were kindly supplied as well.

 

Mike Wiltshire

 

 

Looks so much better than using a Triang B12 chassis, even if re-wheeled

 

I know prior to his death Chris Parish wanted to make all the Perseverance chassis available, sadly his passing brought a halt to this.

 

I thought these chassis would fit in with John Redrup's London Road Models range, I did hear a rumour that this was a possibility but heard nothing since. I was also hoping that the range of Westward GWR railcars would also remerge, but I have now obtained both the single Railcar No 18  and double Railcar No 35 & 36  

[Coach bogie]

11 hours ago, hayfield said:

 

I was also hoping that the range of Westward GWR railcars would also remerge, but I have now obtained both the single Railcar No 18  and double Railcar No 35 & 36  

I have a pair of GWR railcars from MTK which were is a one piece body stamped in brass. I have not progressed it with a possibility that Heljan might come up with something. I once saw a test etch of a single railcar, no 22 type from Blacksmith/Mallard for a kit never released due to the Lima one coming out.

 

Mike Wiltshire

[Graham456]

22 hours ago, hayfield said:

 

 

Sorry but I have just seen a Typo

 

I said a Westdale as another guess, it should have read Westward !!!

You know I never even noticed that! Westdale made coaches in O I think ?

i automatically looked at westward kits even though you put westdale so it didn't matter and I think it is one of them

but back to Keyser pannier fun, she is now remotered with a DS10 running the K's gears after letting the bearing fit go off, a bit fast on the top speed but better,than the bin filler you wonder how much profit was wasted on developing such a all full thing, true a nice gearbox would be miles better, but the cost of the gearbox undoubtedly wheels as I can't see them likeing coming on and off to often, I might as well replace the plank chassis with a nice etched one  O! And whilst about plonk a Bachman body on top.

 No she stays as is, putting pick up on all wheels made the greatest inprovment 

only wire loop couplings and my period piece will hit the road apart from needing some numbers as 9705 isn't quite right but I do have a bodyline kit for one more of them (condensing pannier) to build,to add to the other two sat on Bachman chassis.