What have you done with your Keyser kit

[hayfield]

8 hours ago, Coach bogie said:

I have a pair of GWR railcars from MTK which were is a one piece body stamped in brass. I have not progressed it with a possibility that Heljan might come up with something. I once saw a test etch of a single railcar, no 22 type from Blacksmith/Mallard for a kit never released due to the Lima one coming out.

 

Mike Wiltshire

 

 

Mike

 

From Memory I thing someone did a conversion kit for the Lima model, I have a thought one may have been for a 2 car unit

 

As for the Westward kits, both need a Lima donor chassis. I detest pancake motors and RTR chassis, but I will need at least one simply to copy the chassis and I hope to use either a Branchlines or High Level motor bogie to power them, plus they will be to EM gauge.

 

I also came across a reasonably priced NuCast GWR steam railcar minus the valve gear fret. With NuCast partners now supplying the kits the silly prices ceased over night and Dave will sell me a fret

[hayfield]

3 minutes ago, Graham456 said:

You know I never even noticed that! Westdale made coaches in O I think ?

i automatically looked at westward kits even though you put westdale so it didn't matter and I think it is one of them

but back to Keyser pannier fun, she is now remotered with a DS10 running the K's gears after letting the bearing fit go off, a bit fast on the top speed but better,than the bin filler you wonder how much profit was wasted on developing such a all full thing, true a nice gearbox would be miles better, but the cost of the gearbox undoubtedly wheels as I can't see them likeing coming on and off to often, I might as well replace the plank chassis with a nice etched one  O! And whilst about plonk a Bachman body on top.

 No she stays as is, putting pick up on all wheels made the greatest inprovment 

only wire loop couplings and my period piece will hit the road apart from needing some numbers as 9705 isn't quite right but I do have a bodyline kit for one more of them (condensing pannier) to build,to add to the other two sat on Bachman chassis.

 

In my opinion there is not much wrong with most of the Keyser loco bodies, but especially with the bodyline kits they lend themselves to super detailing. As I have said I bought a J50 and the builder really went to town, they even fitted a Craftsman (?) milled brass chassis with Romford wheels, but used a X03 rather than a MW005

 

But in todays terms the kits need an upgrade as far as chassis are concerned. The keyhole brass frames tend to be banana shaped, the drilled frames just lack detail. The original wheels are quite coarse, the plastic spoked wheels tend to be damaged from being fitted by inexperienced builders, the non screw type looking the best. As for motors the Mk 1 & 2 are both better than the very early ones and the HP2M's which are cheap and nasty, overheating quite often

 

The likes of Branchlines, Comet and High Level Models all have taken gears to the next level. I have a Wills Pannier tank loco with a RG4 inside, runs like a Swiss watch. A modern motor and gearbox will do the same for any kit or RTR* loco.

 

Back to the K's bodies, they do lack things like lamp irons, sprung buffers help as do the odd brass turnings, but this is knit picking. Back to the humble faithful pannier, with a decent chassis it will out perform any RTR offering and comes with either original or modern cab forms

 

* with an etched chassis. I have a Mainline Pannier tank with an etched chassis, Mashima motor and Comet gearbox. Quietly glides along the track and never been serviced or cleaned!!. 

 

Westward is still available in 0 gauge, K's certainly made both TT and 009 items and even dipped their toes in the 0 gauge wagon market using patterns by R Spiers, and 3 styles of buffer stops

[hayfield]

For me not quite cheap enough, but I think a great buy

 

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/144470639698?_trkparms=amclksrc%3DITM%26aid%3D1110006%26algo%3DHOMESPLICE.SIM%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D241588%26meid%3D222d47d781bb4fb586752e3e9cfdf03a%26pid%3D101195%26rk%3D11%26rkt%3D12%26sd%3D284936704723%26itm%3D144470639698%26pmt%3D1%26noa%3D0%26pg%3D2047675%26algv%3DSimplAMLv9PairwiseWebMskuAspectsV202110NoVariantSeedKnnRecallV1BERT&_trksid=p2047675.c101195.m1851&amdata=cksum%3A144470639698222d47d781bb4fb586752e3e9cfdf03a|enc%3AAQAHAAABIEro4ql1SUJ1li87bKftud%2BHNR6f%2BZqZvMWaqvYIq1S%2FWkIBqj9FQDQRu6mAcNzuioXWUR932%2F68tDooavd6O6TaSZ1niD8lhSu%2FXFUZ6fmSCYcVdw%2FaQTJc36LVxrfeEVq3ujMQa9lsAqRVYKm2WtTc7woummkvORHmc91sQOSDpVRo92QidQ59JLIzo8b4dVdXj6pAk3LR465nAmbM4SLy%2FWvtujKRhjXNWoelBRtZIWiJCHepfilXUbjmwlUC0axVAaY6Fh6Q%2FaRoEGmc53k4H90FiZFkeUhivJGoKXPqhqJrjQXDXpuvSszi%2BE0W9pfS5Qbfe9VEjv%2Fra2x703N5lm7AhGFn1mbglNqRxMP4BQtU4RPzJwZG%2FardfE1p6w%3D%3D|ampid%3APL_CLK|clp%3A2047675

 

From what I can see its a K's pannier which has lost its chassis

 

It has an etched chassis Comet of Perseverance ? (I dont think the cylinders are Comet)

Romford or Markit wheels

I think I can see some form of motor mount or basic gearbox, perhaps a Mashima DS10 at worst?

 

Anyway look at the cost of a set of Markit wheels and an etched chassis, must be more than the starting price

 

I would not be worried about it not working, probably just a disclaimer. Or wheels need cleaning and or pickups need adjusting. Or shorting against the etched brake shoes. Certainly easier to repair than any RTR mechanism

[BernardTPM]

4 hours ago, Graham456 said:

You know I never even noticed that! Westdale made coaches in O I think ?

They did 4mm scale coaches before that too. I still have one I built back in the mid '70s.

[SR71]

10 hours ago, hayfield said:

For me not quite cheap enough, but I think a great buy

 

https://www.ebay.co.uk

 

*Cough*

 

 

I wouldn't normally blow my own trumpet but having not sold on here these were going on eBay when I next got a chance anyway.

 

I hope no one minds - if you do let me know and I'll hide the post.

[Graham456]

On 25/08/2022 at 19:24, hayfield said:

 

Graham456 

 

Start one, but will it be Wills, Wills Finecast or Southeastern Finecast ?

Well if this thread about Keyser kits can acomadate a bit of flexibility as in autocom and now  newcast partners, why not. if I don't get beaten to it I will start a thread off but am put off by my ancient I pads lack of posting abilities for pictures due to its creeking power and inability to do somethings , it's a bit like some of my locos Old but still working, the flanges might grumble on the chairs but it still goes.

Edited August 28, 2022 by Graham456
Didn't notice auto correct changing newcast to Newcastle!

[Graham456]

20 hours ago, SR71 said:

 

*Cough*

 

I wouldn't normally blow my own trumpet but having not sold on here these were going on eBay when I next got a chance anyway.

 

I hope no one minds - if you do let me know and I'll hide the post.

 I don't mind ,thankfully I missed you advert on here, but please hurry up and sell um on flea bay  I don't need any more kit temptations lockdown enabled me to reduce 27 to eight to Finnish loco kits as demonstrated a bit weak willed hence the five thankfully built Hattons purchase's this week which just needed fiddling with

 

[roythebus1]

I've still got 4 or 5 Ks black fives on offer in case anyone is interested, 2 fitted with Kean Portescap motors, romford wheels and etched chassis, 2 with 005 motors.. Very heavy locos!

 

Edited August 29, 2022 by roythebus1

[Graham456]

Roy the bus your not helping me with the resistance to temptation

 I can vaguely your advert but not the details

hint hint !

Edited August 30, 2022 by Graham456

[Brassey]

Talking of old Wills kits, here's my Small Metro.  Now on its third chassis.

 

 

[Barclay]

My current project is this K's LNWR Coal Tank that I obtained from ebay. It came stripped and partially dismantled, but with some new etched chassis frames. The first step was to obtain all the parts I needed. Then the chassis was built up with new spacers - it was chopped  behind the rear drivers to make it about 2mm narrower at the back to improve trailing axle side play. Hornblocks are from London Road Models, the lower firebox/ashpan detail is from brass; and the powertrain uses a 1227 motor from Taff Vale Models, with a High Level Road Runner Plus gearbox. The rods have been modified to articulate them. I will report back when it is complete.

 

 

 

 

[Steamport Southport]

On 25/08/2022 at 09:29, Graham456 said:

Funny you should post that........yesterday was spent going through my stars. Five of them ! Four from wills,of south east Finecast and one recent arrival with the etched chassis, this was numbered 4038 Queen Berengaria fine! But it had the cut out in the cab steps and a extra hole in the frames below the valve rocker hole makeing it one of the first twenty, so wrong name!

 Gently prising the number plate off revealed 4014. Underneath Interesting  I then looked harder at the name plate I had pinged off, and that to was double thickness, result and thank you who ever renamed it before selling it to Hattons, it came off cleanly and the loco is now back as Friday Night , or Knight of the Bath.which is correct for the cab steps and cut out.

  The Keyser pannier has also had open hart surgery! And the HP2m is in the bin, whilst I decide weather to risk removing the wheels from their axels with fingers crossed that the plastic spokes don't brake  as I don't really want to spend fifty quid on wheels for a twenty six pound loco or just try getting away with a motor transplant  let you know!

 

P S I need a what have you done with you Wills kit thread!

 

Saw that and thought I would leave it for someone else. Already got two "fresh" unbuilt SEF Stars in the pile.

 

Funnily enough 4038 Queen Berengaria is one that is on the list as I got the name/number plates in a joblot of something like ten GWR named locomotive plates on eBay a few years back.

 

 

Jason

[Graham456]

2 hours ago, Steamport Southport said:

 

Saw that and thought I would leave it for someone else. Already got two "fresh" unbuilt SEF Stars in the pile.

 

Funnily enough 4038 Queen Berengaria is one that is on the list as I got the name/number plates in a joblot of something like ten GWR named locomotive plates on eBay a few years back.

 

 

Jason

Thank you for passing it over personally I thought it was to cheep to resist even it I now have  six stars, of the five kit built bargains Hattons sold to me three had double name or number plates, and I refitted Queen Berengaria to a more appropriate star which matched queen berengaria steem pipes,and fittings

 one of the double plates locos a Keyser 55xx had the smokbox plate 5570  on the buffer beam which when removed part revealed 5546 under a touched up buffer beam  which made my mind up in that I them spent a while with cotton buds and white spirit fully revealing the numbering to  reattach the plates and renumber the loco back to the original number it was given befor over plating, such fun !

Edited August 30, 2022 by Graham456

[Graham456]

Barclay.

your coal tank doesn't half show up even in its unfinished state what a improvement the chassis  has made to the looks of the body with out the great big slab chassis

[Brassey]

My K's LNWR Coal Tank.  One day I'll finish the lining on the back of the bunker.

 

[Barclay]

13 hours ago, Graham456 said:

Barclay.

your coal tank doesn't half show up even in its unfinished state what a improvement the chassis  has made to the looks of the body with out the great big slab chassis

I think the chassis were the weakest point - those big lumps of brass seldom looked right. I also have the GWR 1361 0-6-0ST and that doesn't even have the right wheelbase - I think they just used the 45xx chassis frames to save money.

 

10 hours ago, Brassey said:

My K's LNWR Coal Tank.  One day I'll finish the lining on the back of the bunker.

 

You've done some work to that - I see better chassis, separate coal rails, a new rear spectacle?

[Brassey]

2 hours ago, Barclay said:

 

You've done some work to that - I see better chassis, separate coal rails, a new rear spectacle?

Thanks and Yes. London Road chassis. Scratch built Brass footplate and valance. new tool boxes and backhead from LRM too. Added handrails to cab and front of tanks. And blower valve on the left hand side. Missing the front footsteps and whistle though…

Edited August 31, 2022 by Brassey

[Graham456]

Here I go again, a.couple of weeks ago I surcomed to temptation  a bought a K,s pannier which I remotered to get rid of the hp2m, the rest I kept as keysers supplied as it was OK really for its age, all fine and dandy !

 Until a visit to Ray Heard's Newton Abbott toy fair where another not needed Keysers pannier waved at me, 

SIX POUNDS ?

 Well it had no motor ! But 6 quid...I have only bought another damm one, I only just finished the other one, but this one I will update a bit..........the chimney is poor being undernourished and leaning, a quick test by pressing a bit proved it was glued on, which it no longer is ! Spair  box raided for old dizzy Walker casting, eyeing up the mainly trains etch for pannier window guards, but what to do with the chassis,? Do I go mad and blow the expense?

 Or keep the keyser wheels (D shape axel location)  if I fit markits wheels and a decent gearbox this time remember it only cost the price of ONE WHEEL !

 Why do I do this to my self ?...........I did pass on the £5 14XX ...I would prefer to tackle a airfix 14XX than a Keyser one as I became very proficient with them working in a model shop back in 1980/81 but I am running out of  new plunger pickups keeping mine going from new for fourty years, ...as my old boss is now dead,  I can admit yes I did pick the best runner when testing the delivery back then

Edited September 20, 2022 by Graham456
Spair auto corrected to Spain ?

[BernardTPM]

What is a Spair anyway?

[hayfield]

28 minutes ago, Graham456 said:

Here I go again, a.couple of weeks ago I surcomed to temptation  a bought a K,s pannier which I remotered to get rid of the hp2m, the rest I kept as keysers supplied as it was OK really for its age, all fine and dandy !

 Until a visit to Ray Heard's Newton Abbott toy fair where another not needed Keysers pannier waved at me, 

SIX POUNDS ?

 Well it had no motor ! But 6 quid...I have only bought another damm one, I only just finished the other one, but this one I will update a bit..........the chimney is poor being undernourished and leaning, a quick test by pressing a bit proved it was glued on, which it no longer is ! Spair  box raided for old dizzy Walker casting, eyeing up the mainly trains etch for pannier window guards, but what to do with the chassis,? Do I go mad and blow the expense?

 Or keep the keyser wheels (D shape axel location)  if I fit markits wheels and a decent gearbox this time remember it only cost the price of ONE WHEEL !

 Why do I do this to my self ?...........I did pass on the £5 14XX ...I would prefer to tackle a airfix 14XX than a Keyser one as I became very proficient with them working in a model shop back in 1980/81 but I am running out of  new plunger pickups keeping mine going from new for fourty years, ...as my old boss is now dead,  I can admit yes I did pick the best runner when testing the delivery back then

 

The chances are that the K's 14xx will still be going long after the Airfix, certainly far easier to repair

[hayfield]

2 hours ago, Graham456 said:

Here I go again, a.couple of weeks ago I surcomed to temptation  a bought a K,s pannier which I remotered to get rid of the hp2m, the rest I kept as keysers supplied as it was OK really for its age, all fine and dandy !

 Until a visit to Ray Heard's Newton Abbott toy fair where another not needed Keysers pannier waved at me, 

SIX POUNDS ?

 Well it had no motor ! But 6 quid...I have only bought another damm one, I only just finished the other one, but this one I will update a bit..........the chimney is poor being undernourished and leaning, a quick test by pressing a bit proved it was glued on, which it no longer is ! Spair  box raided for old dizzy Walker casting, eyeing up the mainly trains etch for pannier window guards, but what to do with the chassis,? Do I go mad and blow the expense?

 Or keep the keyser wheels (D shape axel location)  if I fit markits wheels and a decent gearbox this time remember it only cost the price of ONE WHEEL !

 Why do I do this to my self ?...........I did pass on the £5 14XX ...I would prefer to tackle a airfix 14XX than a Keyser one as I became very proficient with them working in a model shop back in 1980/81 but I am running out of  new plunger pickups keeping mine going from new for fourty years, ...as my old boss is now dead,  I can admit yes I did pick the best runner when testing the delivery back then

 

1 hour ago, hayfield said:

 

The chances are that the K's 14xx will still be going long after the Airfix, certainly far easier to repair

 

 

The K's kits do lend themselves to both super detailing and chassis upgrading, I do have both K's 14xx with etched chassis, decent wheels, motor and gears. The weight coupled with decent motion does take them to another level, even a decent motor and gear set makes a massive difference

 

I sold my Airfix 14xx whilst it was still working, I have a defunct Airfix 14xx chassis and have an  Airfix 14xx with an etched chassis, and decent wheels and motor, best of both worlds only missing a bit of extra lead in the side tanks. Both Airfix and K's 14xx can be greatly improved, and if you are lucky cheaply

[jimwal]

5 hours ago, BernardTPM said:

What is a Spair anyway?

Spair for repair? Which may need a spare or two! 🤔 

[Barclay]

13 hours ago, Graham456 said:

Here I go again, a.couple of weeks ago I surcomed to temptation  a bought a K,s pannier which I remotered to get rid of the hp2m, the rest I kept as keysers supplied as it was OK really for its age, all fine and dandy !

 Until a visit to Ray Heard's Newton Abbott toy fair where another not needed Keysers pannier waved at me, 

SIX POUNDS ?

 Well it had no motor ! But 6 quid...I have only bought another damm one, I only just finished the other one, but this one I will update a bit..........the chimney is poor being undernourished and leaning, a quick test by pressing a bit proved it was glued on, which it no longer is ! Spair  box raided for old dizzy Walker casting, eyeing up the mainly trains etch for pannier window guards, but what to do with the chassis,? Do I go mad and blow the expense?

 Or keep the keyser wheels (D shape axel location)  if I fit markits wheels and a decent gearbox this time remember it only cost the price of ONE WHEEL !

 Why do I do this to my self ?...........I did pass on the £5 14XX ...I would prefer to tackle a airfix 14XX than a Keyser one as I became very proficient with them working in a model shop back in 1980/81 but I am running out of  new plunger pickups keeping mine going from new for fourty years, ...as my old boss is now dead,  I can admit yes I did pick the best runner when testing the delivery back then

I find it very hard to resist an old K's kit. The Comet pannier chassis is very good, by the way.

[hayfield]

1 hour ago, Barclay said:

I find it very hard to resist an old K's kit. The Comet pannier chassis is very good, by the way.

 

Its always worth looking a bit closer at any loco kit/kit built loco. Many no mater how bad they look may be hiding expensive gems

 

A set of Markit wheels will set you back £45 ish for an 0-6-0 loco, etched chassis start at £20 but can go up to £40 or more

 

I found a cheap but very well built (with added detail) and painted GNR J50, has a set of Romford wheels on a Triang chassis. I bought an inexpensive etched chassis from Crispy Bacon and just need a decent gearbox and motor. These were the basic bodyline kits and once the chassis is built its far better than anything RTR offers. The fact is I could have simply changed the axles and added a few washers and had a very simple EM conversion

[Coach bogie]

I have several Panniers all picked up cheap/incomplete/damaged. I cannot resist. I kept them for a rainy day. Here are two one has modern motor gearbox, the other built as the kit with K's wheels / motor. I have shown them before. The last one was to win a bet a prove a point that you can get K's to run as the kit, and it does. Note the early cab. K's put a choice of cabs in some Pannier runs but not others. When the kit came out you had to ask K's direct for the early cab, not that they told anyone. this was discovered when my dad called into Banbury and saw them along with Bird frames for the Bulldog.

 

 

Now if you fancy a true challenge. I picked up a part kit for the Beyer. Combined with parts from my pool of Pannier spares I made the Beyer Pannier rebuild. Not perfect but has the right look.

 

Mike Wiltshire