Bluebell Railway news

[St Enodoc]

2 hours ago, papagolfjuliet said:

Announcement from the Chairman: "I am very pleased to announce that after todays PLC Board Meeting and the previous Society Board Meeting, we have approved that 323 Bluebell will go into the workshops in early 2024 and it is planned to have the loco back into service by the summer. This is a real step forward and it will be great to see this wonderful engine and our flagship back in steam."

 

So that's an operating fleet of nine Southern engines to look forward to in the fairly near future.

Will 323 come out in "original" Bluebell Blue, with the cast nameplates?

[phil-b259]

On 22/09/2023 at 16:09, thegreenhowards said:

Personally I think that we have too many locos which never get to steam and the Dukedog doesn’t really fit the Southern theme. So we should either sell or lease it to another railway for them to restore and use.

 

Andy

The Dukedog was gifted to the railway with a specific clause in it that the loco MUST remain based on the Bluebell for perpetuity.

 

Moreover it’s actually quite a useful engine falling into the mid range power bracket (I.e. like the C class), plus is an ‘unusual’ looking design which even non enthusiast can apreciste.

 

In short it’s not going anywhere (other than short visits for galas and suchlike)

[St Enodoc]

7 minutes ago, phil-b259 said:

The Dukedog was gifted to the railway with a specific clause in it that the loco MUST remain based on the Bluebell for perpetuity.

 

Moreover it’s actually quite a useful engine falling into the mid range power bracket (I.e. like the C class), plus is an ‘unusual’ looking design which even non enthusiast can apreciste.

 

In short it’s not going anywhere (other than short visits for galas and suchlike)

Plus, having lived at Bluebell for more than 50 60 years, that must surely be its natural home.

Edited October 1, 2023 by St Enodoc
Can't count.

[phil-b259]

On 22/09/2023 at 13:53, The Evil Bus Driver said:

That's fantastic news. I do remember seeing the Adams Radial in steam once (just once) back in the 1980s. It'll be amazing to see it running once again.

It’s not going to be a quick overhaul - the existing boiler is so bad it would probably be cheaper to build a new one! The Frames are also in poor condition too.

[Oldddudders]

3 minutes ago, St Enodoc said:

Plus, having lived at Bluebell for more than 50 years, that must surely be its natural home.

Exactly, John. It isn't Southern, but adds variety and has been there since before many enthusiasts were born. 

[phil-b259]

23 minutes ago, St Enodoc said:

Will 323 come out in "original" Bluebell Blue, with the cast nameplates?

Don’t know - but actually I prefer it’s current livery, one that is basically the standard SECR scheme with the colours and actual letters changed but otherwise keeps to the SECR theme.

[The Evil Bus Driver]

6 hours ago, phil-b259 said:

It’s not going to be a quick overhaul - the existing boiler is so bad it would probably be cheaper to build a new one! The Frames are also in poor condition too.

Yes that's been a talking point in Bluebell News for quite a few decades. 

[Torn-on-the-platform]

11 hours ago, phil-b259 said:

Don’t know - but actually I prefer it’s current livery, one that is basically the standard SECR scheme with the colours and actual letters changed but otherwise keeps to the SECR theme.

I agree wholeheartedly. The current livery is beautiful whilst being a nod to the loco's origins.

 

I can never find where I read this but I'm sure No 27 is planned to be outshopped in Maunsell Olive.

 

Presumably having been restored from a rather life expired state, 178 could also be a relatively speedy overhaul?

[Dan Hamblin]

From comments elsewhere it appears 178's chassis will need a lot of work but the boiler is pretty good, whereas 323 is the opposite. The boiler off 178 will therefore be used on 323.

 

Regards,

 

Dan

[papagolfjuliet]

178 suffered a cracked cylinder a while ago and spent its last couple of years in service restricted to light duties as a result. Hardly surprising really: the Bluebell's loco shortage of a few years ago resulted in both serviceable Ps being worked much harder than would normally be the case. The experience of pounding upgrade through Sharpthorne tunnel behind 178 and 323 with six on during that period is not one I will soon forget.

[Nick C]

22 hours ago, phil-b259 said:

It’s not going to be a quick overhaul - the existing boiler is so bad it would probably be cheaper to build a new one! The Frames are also in poor condition too.

I got the impression from discussions a few years ago that it was largely a case of "jack up the whistle and build a new loco underneath", with most of the principle components needing either replacement or very major work.

[Michael Hodgson]

22 hours ago, phil-b259 said:

In short it’s not going anywhere (other than short visits for galas and suchlike)

 

I hope it will go from one end of the line to the other from time to time.

[adb968008]

Could they do a loan agreement with the Dukedog ?

 

either static or a steaming agreement ?

 

it was nice seeing it at Llangollen, a restore and run isnt permanent.

I dont think we will ever see Truro again, but  maybe someday Didcot produces a County 4-4-0 to pair with it.

 

Maybe once Beachy Head is done, they could suggest a new build Radial.. getting the parts design research wouldnt be hard with an exact copy to reference.

Edited October 2, 2023 by adb968008

[Oldddudders]

59 minutes ago, adb968008 said:

Maybe once Beachy Head is done, they could suggest a new build Radial.. getting the parts design research wouldnt be hard with an exact copy to reference.

I feel an Atlantic tank is the missing Brighton loco, frankly. Four classes and none seen in 60 years. An I3 would be a fine addition to the Brighton/Bluebell roster. 

[phil-b259]

1 hour ago, adb968008 said:

Could they do a loan agreement with the Dukedog ?

 

either static or a steaming agreement ?

 

it was nice seeing it at Llangollen, a restore and run isnt permanent.

 

 

Long term loans / hires are banned due to the legally enforceable terms by which the loco came into bluebell ownership - terms which quite clearly state that the Bluebell is to be its base in perpetuity.

 

Anyone going against that could very easily land the Bluebell with a large legal mess if a member of the society chose to contest it.

 

So I repeat, the Dukedog is not going anywhere for a long periods - and that includes being on static display or a 'restore and run' type deal.

[Neal Ball]

This is from the unofficial Bluebell page on Facebook:

 

 

Looks amazing, well done to everyone who has been involved.

[burgundy]

Pullman car Aquila has turned up at a garden centre near Weston-super-Mare. 

Somewhere along the way, it seems to have acquired a bit of a dent just below the roof line on one side. 

Best wishes 

Eric 

[papagolfjuliet]

On 01/10/2023 at 11:10, phil-b259 said:

It’s not going to be a quick overhaul - the existing boiler is so bad it would probably be cheaper to build a new one! The Frames are also in poor condition too.

 

The latest issue of 'Atlantic News' confirms that a new boiler will be required, but also states that the frames are "not as daunting as first thought."

[SR71]

Good day on giants of Steam today. If you are able to get there well worth a visit over the weekend. Weather is supposed to be clear with plenty of sun. Not sure the Bluebell should have let @NHY 581 near Manston while in possession of weathering powders though.

[John Besley]

Beautiful just as I remember them as a small boy..

[SR71]

I wouldn't want every engine to be like it but it's like one of those 'steam's Indian Summer' type books has come to life.

 

[Darius43]

Spent a great day out with friends on the Friday.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Cheers

 

Darius

[adb968008]

On 02/10/2023 at 22:02, phil-b259 said:

 

Long term loans / hires are banned due to the legally enforceable terms by which the loco came into bluebell ownership - terms which quite clearly state that the Bluebell is to be its base in perpetuity.

 

Anyone going against that could very easily land the Bluebell with a large legal mess if a member of the society chose to contest it.

 

So I repeat, the Dukedog is not going anywhere for a long periods - and that includes being on static display or a 'restore and run' type deal.

sounds like a millstone than a blessing.

Are you sure that contract permits it north of  Horsted Keynes ?

Where is it currently, I didnt see it last weekend ?

 

I have seen it at Didcot and Llangollen, last time I looked they were not part of the Bluebell railway, so something must have permitted it… was temporary not defined ?

 

going off published sources instead…

 

https://www.bluebell-railway.co.uk/bluebell/pic2/gwr/dukedog.html

 

Quote

The locomotive has now been donated to the Bluebell, with the requirement that the locomotive is to remain normally on the Bluebell Railway.

 And qualifying normal has been tested…

 

Quote

This class of locos was widely used on the Cambrian lines. At the time this loco was saved for preservation the Bluebell was the only line where it could run, and it has been in Sussex ever since, apart from a few years spent at the Great Western Society, at Didcot, and more recently occasional visits to other lines.
 

 

so I think maybe your interpretation is a little extremist.

 

if the loco had Bluebell as its normal home, it could for example earn its keep on tour on a line suitable for summer loadings and return home for seasons useful to Bluebell, plus display, maintenance etc.

 

A few years, out of 63 is hardly stretching normal.

 

 

Edited October 17, 2023 by adb968008

[phil-b259]

14 hours ago, adb968008 said:

sounds like a millstone than a blessing.

Are you sure that contract permits it north of  Horsted Keynes ?

Where is it currently, I didnt see it last weekend ?

 

I have seen it at Didcot and Llangollen, last time I looked they were not part of the Bluebell railway, so something must have permitted it… was temporary not defined ?

 

going off published sources instead…

 

https://www.bluebell-railway.co.uk/bluebell/pic2/gwr/dukedog.html

 

 And qualifying normal has been tested…

 

 

so I think maybe your interpretation is a little extremist.

 

if the loco had Bluebell as its normal home, it could for example earn its keep on tour on a line suitable for summer loadings and return home for seasons useful to Bluebell, plus display, maintenance etc.

 

A few years, out of 63 is hardly stretching normal.

 

 

First thing to point out is that the loco was only gifted to the Bluebell (with the must be ‘normal based’ at the railway clause) in the past decade or so.

 

From when it first arrived up until the early 2000s it was owned by a private individual and as such extended visits / loans were simply dependent on what the owner thought about them at the time and as such the loco was not formally tied to the railway.
 

Secondly, it does kinda depend on your definition of normal - but the general gist is like this. A two week visit to a couple of other railways per year would still fit with the spirit of a ‘must normally be based at the Bluebell as for the majority of that Callander year the loco would indeed be based on the Bluebell

 

A longer loan or hire for say 6 months might also count as not breaking the terms providing the following two years sees it remain at the Bluebell.

 

In other words if you average things out over 10 years (the maximum operating window) then to satisfy the ‘normally based at the Bluebell’ then it would have to remain in Sussex for around 7 of those 10 years.

[adb968008]

11 hours ago, phil-b259 said:

 

 

A longer loan or hire for say 6 months might also count as not breaking the terms providing the following two years sees it remain at the Bluebell.

 

In other words if you average things out over 10 years (the maximum operating window) then to satisfy the ‘normally based at the Bluebell’ then it would have to remain in Sussex for around 7 of those 10 years.

Sounds reasonable to me.

I can think of a few locos that have been suggested to have been restored on similar arrangements.