Heljan planning a 1361 too

[cctransuk]

30 minutes ago, maico said:

Oh dear...

 

 

 

Do you trust the word of a man who runs his trains on the carpet?

 

I get the impression that this is a 'rubbish' job, designed to promote an alternative; let's hope that I'm wrong!

 

One has to wonder why this review has miraculously appeared now - ages after the model was introduced and exactly when the producers of both versions are trying to offload stock!

 

What, me? Cynical?

 

Regards,

John Isherwood.

[maico]

17 minutes ago, cctransuk said:

 

Do you trust the word of a man who runs his trains on the carpet?

 

I get the impression that this is a 'rubbish' job, designed to promote an alternative; let's hope that I'm wrong!

 

One has to wonder why this review has miraculously appeared now - ages after the model was introduced and exactly when the producers of both versions are trying to offload stock!

 

What, me? Cynical?

 

Regards,

John Isherwood.

 

He has tested hundreds of trains and pays for them out of his own money, so yes, he is in a position to make a judgement.

If he wanted to make money out of an affilate link he would give it a good review!

Edited March 4, 2020 by maico

[truffy]

36 minutes ago, cctransuk said:

I went for the first on the market - the one without the imaginary splashers; (the Heljan one).

 

Yep, the splashers were the problem on the DJM one for me. Unfortunately, Heljan swapped splashergate for smallshirtbuttongate.

[Butler Henderson]

13 minutes ago, maico said:

 

He has tested hundreds of trains and pays for them out of his own money, so yes, he is in a position to make a judgement.

If he wanted to make money out of an affilate link he would give it a good review!

Have we all not had a duff loco - once people returned them, now while some do others make hay on youtube and social media.

[Coppercap]

1 hour ago, truffy said:

 

Yep, the splashers were the problem on the DJM one for me. Unfortunately, Heljan swapped splashergate for smallshirtbuttongate.

 

Shirtbuttons are easier to change than splashers...but didn't Heljan also have handrailgate?

 

Whatever, both my Heljan 0-6-0s (saddle and pannier) run fine, and have been well assembled. Bought them directly from Heljan at the Warley show as they'd discounted to £99. Maybe if I'd have waited, I'd have got one even cheaper, but didn't want to miss the boat...but I'm happy.

Edited March 5, 2020 by Coppercap

[truffy]

6 hours ago, Coppercap said:

but didn't Heljan also have handrailgate?

 

Yes, smallshirtbuttongate was a direct consequence of handrailgate.

 

I was going to refer to it as smallshirtbuttonduetolowhandrailgate, but figured that was something that only the Welsh and Germans would be able to read.

[JohnR]

I like how he says "anyone can go out to China and produce a really good steam locomotive"! 

 

He also seems to major on the fact that the RRP is £159.95 - yet I'd be surprised if he (or anyone else) paid that for it. You can find them everywhere now for half that. 

[Coppercap]

33 minutes ago, JohnR said:

I like how he says "anyone can go out to China and produce a really good steam locomotive"! 

 

He also seems to major on the fact that the RRP is £159.95 - yet I'd be surprised if he (or anyone else) paid that for it. You can find them everywhere now for half that. 

He did say he paid £99.50, from Rails.

[The Stationmaster]

4 hours ago, truffy said:

 

Yes, smallshirtbuttongate was a direct consequence of handrailgate.

 

I was going to refer to it as smallshirtbuttonduetolowhandrailgate, but figured that was something that only the Welsh and Germans would be able to read.

And various other incorrect details on the Heljan engines because they used the same model for all their running number variants, including the one with a different saddle tank from all the others.

[cctransuk]

13 hours ago, maico said:

 

He has tested hundreds of trains and pays for them out of his own money, so yes, he is in a position to make a judgement.

If he wanted to make money out of an affilate link he would give it a good review!

 

I don't dispute that he does reviews - as opposed to testing them; (that would require more than back and forth on a couple of feet of track).

 

My implication is that the timing is - how shall I put it - odd / coincidental? - and his unfavourable review of the Heljan version might favour the rival model; (which is also the subject of a current stock clearance).

 

John Isherwood.

[cctransuk]

Kernow are doing the DJM (splashers) model for £69.99, whereas they're charging £135.99 for the Heljan version; Rails have the Heljan version for £79.50.

 

John Isherwood.

[maico]

5 hours ago, cctransuk said:

 

I don't dispute that he does reviews - as opposed to testing them; (that would require more than back and forth on a couple of feet of track).

 

My implication is that the timing is - how shall I put it - odd / coincidental? - and his unfavourable review of the Heljan version might favour the rival model; (which is also the subject of a current stock clearance).

 

John Isherwood.

 

He does test them.  All locos get an hours running before giving scores and he likes to take them apart to check the motor.

As for Heljan he liked this one

 

 

Edited March 5, 2020 by maico

[stovepipe]

I think the relevant point is that Sam's Trains has 68k subscribers, by some distance the biggest MR channel, and probably double that of any MR magazine. I imagine a lot of his viewers will be from a more youthful demographic, so he deserves some credit for building that level of interest in the hobby.

[lofty1966]

14 hours ago, cctransuk said:

Kernow are doing the DJM (splashers) model for £69.99, whereas they're charging £135.99 for the Heljan version; Rails have the Heljan version for £79.50.

 

John Isherwood.

It's not just the splashers.

It's the fact the cab steps are way out of line with the cab doorways that really jars

Then the sloppy rod holes.

Dodgy Jones really fouled up Kernows product which is a shame.

Thank God he's long gone before the Railmotor !

Edited March 6, 2020 by lofty1966
spellcheck

[Coppercap]

Sam's review of Heljan's 1361 now has over 1.2k comments. I looked through many of them when there were just a few hundred comments, and all I could see (apart from the vast number of the usual silly comments irrelevant to the subject being reviewed and other comments that were clearly from very junior followers) were people agreeing with him in his slating of the model based simply on his review. I couldn't find any comments from people who had actually bought one and were agreeing with him, but at the same time I couldn't find any who were disagreeing with him by praising, or at least defending Heljan's 1361. 

Based on his review there must now be hundreds of people who will say Heljan's 1361 is overpriced rubbish, without having first hand experience themselves. Yes, it has it's faults, but it's not nearly as bad as the review makes out. 

[Legend]

But it was over priced . The fact that they are now selling at £79.50 kind of supports that .  He also points out tight screws on the base plate causes the wheels to seize , which if I remember correctly was as issue brought up on RMweb when it was first introduced . the loco has no proper bearings and it seems that you can't get into the motor . All relevant points .  He doesn't just run it back and forth on a small section of track but runs in locomotives for half an hour  . The fact that it was stalling on points at moderate speed was the thing that put me off .  He did point out that he only got this model now because it was discounted . I suppose many of us may have been tempted as the price went down, so this is a useful review .  Compared to other locos around I think his views on this loco are reasonably fair .  But its like everything else , watch it and make your own mind up . at least in a sams review he shows it warts an all . I usually find his reviews very informative.

Edited March 6, 2020 by Legend

[No Decorum]

I dare say that quite a few people faced the same dilemma as I did, namely, do I buy DJ or Heljan? If Bachmann or Hornby had been an alternative, I’d have chosen them like a shot. DJ models were often very nicely finished, although there were sometimes gaffs. However, their running was truly awful. Heljan, on the other hand, produces gaffs more frequently and bit sometimes fall off. Running, however, is usually good. After experience of both brands, I went for Heljan: a 1361 and a 1366. The 1366 had to be returned but was replaced with a satisfactory model. On the whole, I think I made the right choice, at least for me. Many of the criticisms are justified but the models run well, which counts for a lot.

 

The prices were eye-watering three years ago, a point Sam makes repeatedly. However, the price is eventually forgotten and the models remain. I’m reasonably content with them whereas the other DJ models I have are a constant frustration. My impression of Heljan is of models  rather more  expensive than Hornby of Bachmann but neither so well designed or assembled. They do, though have qualities all their own, in particular, running quality. I’m very curious to see if Ben Jones will correct my impression of Heljan and to see how much the new O2s will cost. With prices generally soaring, Heljan might, just might, turn out to be no more expensive than the rest. 

[GWR-fan]

Two points - 

1)  Sam's reference to a loco costing GBP159.99 is relevant as that was the recommended selling price.  Whether anyone paid that amount is irrelevant,  but a loco with a retail price of "X" should be able to be favourably reviewed when comparing to another brand loco for the same retail price which may be a much better quality model.    Sam's point obviously is that the model is grossly overpriced for what one is buying based on his experience.  Yes,  Sam does run on carpet but that is irrelevant for the simple reason that leads me to point 2) below

 

2)  I believe that I am correct in my assumption that Sam is the same person who for sometime was offering a rebuild service of most brands of locomotive on eBay and possibly privately and given the many positive reviews received it seems that he knows what he is talking about.  His channel is all about reviewing a sample that he purchases,  not a store handout freebie.  Thus he is able to express his opinion of the quality and performance.

 

One issue I disagree with him about though is his regular criticism of a loco with its initial run snail's pace crawl straight out of the box.  The model in question in this thread has been around for a while as reviews date back some years so any model purchased for testing may have sat on a shelf for a long period of time and any grease is subject to temperature fluctuations and hardness over time.  This could cause resistance in the mechanism and as such any criticism is unfounded as a true crawl pace test should occur after a running in period and not immediately upon removing from the package.

[Legend]

1 hour ago, GWR-fan said:

Two points - 

1)  Sam's reference to a loco costing GBP159.99 is relevant as that was the recommended selling price.  Whether anyone paid that amount is irrelevant,  but a loco with a retail price of "X" should be able to be favourably reviewed when comparing to another brand loco for the same retail price which may be a much better quality model.    Sam's point obviously is that the model is grossly overpriced for what one is buying based on his experience.  Yes,  Sam does run on carpet but that is irrelevant for the simple reason that leads me to point 2) below

 

2)  I believe that I am correct in my assumption that Sam is the same person who for sometime was offering a rebuild service of most brands of locomotive on eBay and possibly privately and given the many positive reviews received it seems that he knows what he is talking about.  His channel is all about reviewing a sample that he purchases,  not a store handout freebie.  Thus he is able to express his opinion of the quality and performance.

 

One issue I disagree with him about though is his regular criticism of a loco with its initial run snail's pace crawl straight out of the box.  The model in question in this thread has been around for a while as reviews date back some years so any model purchased for testing may have sat on a shelf for a long period of time and any grease is subject to temperature fluctuations and hardness over time.  This could cause resistance in the mechanism and as such any criticism is unfounded as a true crawl pace test should occur after a running in period and not immediately upon removing from the package.

 

Yes Sam does have a loco servicing business too , so he does know his way around mechanisms . I've sent him some fairly old Tri-ang and Wrenn locos for servicing and he's transformed the running qualities . Very happy and servicing is relatively inexpensive too.

 

In relation to slow running speed . he does test straight from box but then re also usually retests once its run in . The 1361 was certainly done that way. I find his views very refreshing to be honest .

Edited March 6, 2020 by Legend

[MikeParkin65]

11 hours ago, stovepipe said:

I think the relevant point is that Sam's Trains has 68k subscribers, by some distance the biggest MR channel, and probably double that of any MR magazine. I imagine a lot of his viewers will be from a more youthful demographic, so he deserves some credit for building that level of interest in the hobby.

68K subscribers?! If you are right about the demographic being young does that mean those of us on here (who I assume predominantly like me  - 50+ and older) are actually in the minority  - especially in the RTR market?

 

Suddenly Hornby's 'Signal Box' and Steampunk excursion start to look like they are making sense.

[stovepipe]

I would not necessarily infer that, after all I'm in your demographic, just about, and I watch his vids occasionally, though not as a subscriber. But a quick read of the comments from subscribers, gives the impression that, yes it is younger people than me in the main. The difference is I suppose that without an indulgent parent, or a well-paid job, then the purchasing power of this group is on average somewhat smaller.

[maico]

Sam says the channel is his main source of income. You can see the earning estimates here

 

https://socialblade.com/youtube/user/mrsamstrains

 

They have really cut down on the monitization rates though in recent times. I used to have a film

channel that without much effort lead to regular cheques coming through. To make money now you need to make original content stuff about popular things like cats, cars etc.

 

 

 

 

Edited March 6, 2020 by maico

[truffy]

35 minutes ago, maico said:

I used to have a film

channel that without much effort lead to regular checks coming through.

 

Some types of film are more likely to be checked than others!

[maico]

6 minutes ago, truffy said:

 

Some types of film are more likely to be checked than others!

 

Whoops, that's what happens when you have an American spell checker

[maico]

21 hours ago, stovepipe said:

I think the relevant point is that Sam's Trains has 68k subscribers, by some distance the biggest MR channel, and probably double that of any MR magazine. I imagine a lot of his viewers will be from a more youthful demographic, so he deserves some credit for building that level of interest in the hobby.

 

1.2 million views a month but most will be dipping in and out. He will have the watch times on the analytics page.

 

After the negative Tango review I asked him if Heljan had been in touch and he said no. I can only conclude they are an absolute shower!

 

 

Edited March 6, 2020 by maico