Bachmann 2017 range

[Dunsignalling]

All this was said about the Unrebuilt Merchant Navy but Hornby did it anyway.

 

We need a U to complement the N but in my view the best bet would be to do the U1, which is an interesting and unusual version of the U and wouldn't compete with the current N, which a standard U might.

Unfortunately, whilst the Us were quite widely distributed, U1s were purely SE section locos for most of their careers.  However, that might not deter Bachmann as their 'Southern' policy (such as it is) seems to favour that area, ceding the South Western to Hornby largely unopposed.

 

A few U1s were eventually sent to replace T9s in North Cornwall, but they appear to have been regarded as inferior to both the elderly 4-4-0s and the Ns already working in the area. That suggests the 73 district sheds had probably taken the opportunity to clear out their duds.

 

John

[The Black Hat]

Don't get me wrong, I'd love a U or several ....

 

Id love a J21, or several... but that's not going to happen...

[it's-er]

Much as a J21 would be desirable, I'd have thought it is much more likely to come from Hornby. Their exquisite J15 is similarly small - it strikes me as a straight transfer of knowledge and expertise from the J15 to produce a superb J21.

 

John

[farren]

U's U1s Ns N1s "I bloody hate algebra!"

[Roy Langridge]

Why? If they make one set of tooling and produce say 1000 locos, surely that's more cost effective that four sets of tooling producing 250 of each. It's nice to have several variations of a particular class but not really necessary for a rtr model. One quality model is better than nothing. Take the SLW class 24 for example. Let's say they produced one version, the longest running loco in one condition, and sold it in green and blue. Would that be a rubbish model because only one version was available? Hell no!

Perhaps if they tooled for one loco and kept it in the range for a couple of years then the cost would be covered. There's no law that says a model may only carry a livery for one catalogue.

As my limited understanding goes. Tooling costs X. Sell locos till X is covered. Continue to sell locos to make a profit.

 

Look at the tooling quotes that have been provided - a loco is now costing £100K+ for tooling alone. Manufacturers are saying that they need to be able to address multiple versions and liveries to get that cost back and to start making profit.

 

Your example is not really realistic. You need to compare making a single loco with a market of 1000 and making 4 versions for a small percentage greater tooling cost and selling 500 of each. That is where the benefits of tooling allowing for multiple versions comes from. The market for 1000 copies of one loco may not be there - therefore risk increases (look at Hornby's mistakes of old).

 

Selling only one version would be ok if that same model could be used to represent multiple locos by the purchaser buying it and simply renumber it (which I still think is very market limiting), but if that is not a realistic model people will not do that. As a result each potential purchaser then becomes a market for one, not multiple copies.

 

Simple business principles means that you need to maximise your market potential: that means lowest investment for maximum potential sales. You mention SLW, they have done exactly that - their tooling allows for different versions of a highly detailed loco.

 

Roy

[cambo74]

I think perhaps I was not crystal clear in the point I was trying to make.  In calling them minority liveries I was referring to the ratio of numbers of that class of loco that carried that livery.  With the Regional Railways livery and headlight positioning limited number of re-numbering options were available with the loco produced.  With a BR Blue loco considerably greater permutations are available.

 

Totally agree with what you're saying but the so say 'clever' marketing men at these companies don't want us to buy models to renumber they want to do obscure liveries which they think will make them collectors items and more desirable.  I think I've said until I'm blue in the face - if you want to make money - do an unnumbered blue 31 / 37 & 47 and watch the money roll in - people can add the number they want / nameplate - you could even supply some in the box ala Heljan and they're 47s ............

 

Then when they've run out - really simple to do another run and as no new tooling would need to be done - there shouldn't be any large price increases .....

 

To quote those pesky meerkats - simples !

 

But what do i know - i didnt go to Uni and get a marketing degree .............. but i do do resprays and renumbering and you'd be amazed how many people ask me for simple BR Blue or the like - sometimes the more anonymous the livery - the more desirable it is .....

 

Ben 

[Hilux5972]

U's U1s Ns N1s "I bloody hate algebra!"

Yeah I missed the maths lesson where they started multiplying letters too haha

[Fenman]

... I think I've said until I'm blue in the face - if you want to make money - do an unnumbered blue 31 / 37 & 47 and watch the money roll in - people can add the number they want / nameplate - you could even supply some in the box ala Heljan and they're 47s ...

 

Fascinating: presumably you think Jason Shron is lying, then, when he tells us that he is discontinuing production of unnumbered Rapido trains because they simply don't sell?

 

Paul

[Steamport Southport]

When Heljan did the unnumbered class 47s they were left on the shelf in Hattons because nobody wanted them.

 

 

Many people who buy RTR can't even fit the bits in the packet nevermind add transfers. It's a non starter I'm afraid.

 

 

 

Jason

[ianmaccormac]

So multiple uses from a tool being required, why not something like the LB&SCR D and E tanks? Main boiler and front of cab is the same for both. Roof same. Front splashers in two types, rear cab sides two lengths. An 0-4-2T and an 0-6-0T both started in the 1870s and lasted to date with the E1 currently being restored on the IOW. Some D tanks used in various parts of the country for war work, one used outside Preston at a mental hospital,(so acceptable for the LNWR bloke!). Lots of liveries and specials - fire engine for WW2 - BR, SR, LB&SCR liveries (about 5 liveries there alone). Tank locos for passenger and freight use. Maybe a bit of innovation by casting the footplate and the chassis as one piece and gluing all the plastic body parts to them?

I would love about a dozen.

Cheers

Ian

[Moxy]

 Some D tanks used in various parts of the country for war work, one used outside Preston at a mental hospital,(so acceptable for the LNWR bloke!).

 

County Mental Hospital Whittingham.  A fascinating private railway, picture of their D tank here https://photos.smugmug.com/Trains-Railways-British-Isles/Miscellaneous/Private-and-light-railways/i-FLwd74r/0/S/Private_CMHWR_1_Whittingham-S.jpg and another here with the line's late model Sentinel https://c1.staticflickr.com/9/8337/8268116638_a9c8a6e7a8_b.jpg

 

/off

 

Back to Bachmann 2017 speculation.

 

Moxy

[Captain Kernow]

Are we being asked what we'd like to see in the forthcoming Bachmann announcement?

 

Oh, jolly good then, this is what I'd like to see them produce - a cute little 16XX pannier tank please.

 

That's all.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

PS. There's no such thing as a non-cute pannier tank, in case someone wanted to try to be clever.

[lyneux]

When Heljan did the unnumbered class 47s they were left on the shelf in Hattons because nobody wanted them.

 

Many people who buy RTR can't even fit the bits in the packet nevermind add transfers. It's a non starter I'm afraid.

 

I disagree: be careful establishing cause and effect here!

 

I would argue that nobody bought the Tubby-Duff not because they didn't want un-numbered versions, but because at that time, better versions were available from Bachmann and ViTrains for less money. I bought the Bachmann blue one for £39 instead of the Heljan one at £50-odd and re-numbered it myself. If an un-numbered Bachmann model was available, I'd have bought that (if the price was right).

 

Guy

[rue_d_etropal]

Bachmann have always taken ages to get new models released. All you need is patience.

Thing is to justify costs you have to be pretty certain you will make money, and it is still only a reatively small range of already produced models that sell year after year, eg Flying Scotsman.

It will be interesting to see what non OO models are announced, such as the OO9 ones. Bachmann are hoping for interest there, but again delays don't help. What about otherscales. It was something suggested by Simon Kohler said in a recent publication online, when he suggested launching  range of TT models would make good business sense. Not so sure about TT, as persuading people to change track might be difficult and then there would be a debate about which gauge to use. Maybe some British HO models as they use same track as OO, and could then duplicate some of the existing big sellers.  These big sellers would also have more chance of selling outside the UK, thus increasing potential sells. Remember we are talking about commercial opportunities, not providing for the specialist collector.

[Dunsignalling]

So multiple uses from a tool being required, why not something like the LB&SCR D and E tanks? Main boiler and front of cab is the same for both. Roof same. Front splashers in two types, rear cab sides two lengths. An 0-4-2T and an 0-6-0T both started in the 1870s and lasted to date with the E1 currently being restored on the IOW. Some D tanks used in various parts of the country for war work, one used outside Preston at a mental hospital,(so acceptable for the LNWR bloke!). Lots of liveries and specials - fire engine for WW2 - BR, SR, LB&SCR liveries (about 5 liveries there alone). Tank locos for passenger and freight use. Maybe a bit of innovation by casting the footplate and the chassis as one piece and gluing all the plastic body parts to them?

I would love about a dozen.

Cheers

Ian

Trouble with that is that the D1 offers no opportunity for the "base load" provided by releasing at least one BR livery version. All the D1s remaining at nationalization were withdrawn by 1950 without being renumbered. I don't think we are yet at the point where either of the big boys will risk making a r-t-r model with no BR option though the evident popularity of Hornby's industrial locos may hasten the day.

 

The E1 is a (slightly) better bet with 26 passing into BR ownership, though that fell to 11 by 1955, including 4 on the island. The total was down to two by 1959 and I think the last was withdrawn from Fratton as late as 1961. A more likely pairing than the D1 and E1 might be the E1 plus the E1R 0-6-2T conversion which would have more in common.

 

The E1 extant on the IoW today survived via colliery ownership and entered preservation with a boiler salvaged from an industrial loco. I understand that is being replaced with a newly constructed one to the original pattern as part of the current overhaul.

 

 

John

[Steamport Southport]

I disagree: be careful establishing cause and effect here!

 

I would argue that nobody bought the Tubby-Duff not because they didn't want un-numbered versions, but because at that time, better versions were available from Bachmann and ViTrains for less money. I bought the Bachmann blue one for £39 instead of the Heljan one at £50-odd and re-numbered it myself. If an un-numbered Bachmann model was available, I'd have bought that (if the price was right).

 

Guy

 

But the numbered Heljan ones did sell.

 

They couldn't give away the unnumbered ones. They had loads of them in stock for ages.

 

Hornby tried it. Also a failure.

 

 

Jason

[Dunsignalling]

I disagree: be careful establishing cause and effect here!

 

I would argue that nobody bought the Tubby-Duff not because they didn't want un-numbered versions, but because at that time, better versions were available from Bachmann and ViTrains for less money. I bought the Bachmann blue one for £39 instead of the Heljan one at £50-odd and re-numbered it myself. If an un-numbered Bachmann model was available, I'd have bought that (if the price was right).

 

Guy

The problem is that, like you, most people who want locos with different numbers are capable of removing them as well as applying new ones and will therefore buy the cheapest model around, with or without a number. Even in the much larger US market, unnumbered models seem to be out of favour.

 

There's no benefit for Bachmann in producing a run of unnumbered models if everyone expects them to be sold at clearance prices.

 

John

[choo1choo]

So multiple uses from a tool being required, why not something like the LB&SCR D and E tanks? Main boiler and front of cab is the same for both. Roof same. Front splashers in two types, rear cab sides two lengths. An 0-4-2T and an 0-6-0T both started in the 1870s and lasted to date with the E1 currently being restored on the IOW. Some D tanks used in various parts of the country for war work, one used outside Preston at a mental hospital,(so acceptable for the LNWR bloke!). Lots of liveries and specials - fire engine for WW2 - BR, SR, LB&SCR liveries (about 5 liveries there alone). Tank locos for passenger and freight use. Maybe a bit of innovation by casting the footplate and the chassis as one piece and gluing all the plastic body parts to them?

I would love about a dozen.

Cheers

Ian

 

 

Evening All,

 

I'm with you Ian . Several of each in the appropriate LBSCR livery would be luvverly.

 

Cheers,

 

Craig.

[SouthernBlue80s]

Being an 80s BR Blue man.

I so want Bachmann to produce

 

1. A blue disc headcode class 40

2. A class 45 with the flat yellow end

3. A blue class 47 that has not got the rivet effect around the windscreens

 

All un weathered. with whatever numbers they want, as we can weather them and change the numbers.

 

They seem to produce odd stuff like 97407 with some sketchy weathering on it.

When many of us Rail Blue guys just want good base models of the stuff that was seen everyday in the 80s.

[Stanley Melrose]

I.e. one person . .  .

 

They seem to produce odd stuff like 97407 with some sketchy weathering on it.

When many of us Rail Blue guys just want good base models of the stuff that was seen everyday in the 80s.

[Black 5 Bear]

A green type 4 with small yellow panel and disc headcodes is on my personal wish list. This has got to be on the cards as they have already done the centre headcode and twin box versions.

[phil gollin]

.

 

Could anyone confirm the time of Bachmann's 2017 announcement.  Having been caught without a cup of tea and bikkies for Hornby's, it would be appreciated.

 

Thanks

 

.

[50030]

 

All un weathered. with whatever numbers they want, as we can weather them and change the numbers.

 

Agreed. Had Bachmann done 97407 pristine then I would of purchased 2 or 3 to renumber.

47436 was a good example 47 to do, no flush fronts, no weathering with many renumber options so again I buy 2 or 3 instead. I get the loco's I want and Bachmann gets more of my pounds and pence.

[BR Blue]

.

 

Could anyone confirm the time of Bachmann's 2017 announcement. Having been caught without a cup of tea and bikkies for Hornby's, it would be appreciated.

 

Thanks

 

.

10am

[gelboy45]

In todays Kernow's newletter:

 

http://www.kernowmodelrailcentre.com/c/766/Bachmann 

 

Gerry