Wright writes.....

[davidw]

1 hour ago, Tony Wright said:

One thing I'm doing for BRM right now is a series on 'budget modelling'; obtaining items, often second-hand, at greatly-reduced prices which require a bit of 'personal' modelling to 'bring them back to life'. 

 

It's not all RTR-based, of course. Take this as an example, for instance................

 

 

I bought this last year, for a very low price. It's a Pro-Scale A4 which the builder had started, then (it would seem in disgust) dismantled what he'd made. Fortunately, no damage was done, all the parts are present and I've started to reassemble it. 

 

I'm building it on top of a set of Comet frames (from stock - I've ordered a replacement A4 chassis from Comet), using Markits wheels all round and a DJH motor/gearbox, ready-assembled combo (the Pro-Scale chassis is way beyond my abilities, though the etched body is a work of the etcher's art). 

 

Obviously, the wheels and the drive are hardly 'budget modelling' - £80.00 odd quid for the drive, and driving wheels at around seven quid each! Neither is a Comet chassis. That said, I'll still end up with a 'relatively' low-cost A4 (what's a current Hornby RTR one cost?).

 

And........

 

There's no doubt they can turn into fine models, especially with an Ian Rathbone paint job (which doesn't qualify as 'budget', either).

 

Part-built loco kits, as long as they're complete and have no building 'damage', can be obtained for very low prices, and are worth investigation. 

 

 

 

 

 

Hi Tony,

A new Hornby BR version (60030) is being released later in the year, RRP 200.00+ discounted  to £196.00. Ebay  is a bit cheaper but not much. The right livery or "special editions"  can go for silly money ( £160 -  £250 or more).  The corridor tendered  versions commanding higher prices. Non-corridor  between  £80.00 - 90.00. casual observation is that late crest versions seem in demand more than early. Possibly because late crest versions have a double chimney - personally I think that gives them better proportions. Though it could be that the market for late crest locos may be stronger than early. Either way I'm happy to be corrected. 

Have you decided which A4 that one will be yet Tony?

[Bucoops]

10 hours ago, St Enodoc said:

 

What glue(s) would be best for those sorts of items?

 

As others have said I'll be using a CA based glue. Probably permabond 910 specifically as it's good for metals - production versions will be going on etched kits.

[thegreenhowards]

I have just finished my latest O gauge project which is this GE six wheeler.

 

 

 

it’s a D&S kit for a D.407 3rd Lav. This nicely fits into the the theme of budget modelling as I found the kit largely built in a rummage box at the Guildford Gauge O Group open day for £40. All I’ve done is fit some missing roof details and then paint, line and weather it. It was my first attempt at carriage lining with a bow pen and at white roof weathering using an airbrush so I’m quite pleased/ relieved at how its come out.

 

It still needs an interior which I’m hoping my club friend, Rob, will 3D print for me.

 

Regards

 

Andy

 

 

[Tony Wright]

10 hours ago, davidw said:

 

Hi Tony,

A new Hornby BR version (60030) is being released later in the year, RRP 200.00+ discounted  to £196.00. Ebay  is a bit cheaper but not much. The right livery or "special editions"  can go for silly money ( £160 -  £250 or more).  The corridor tendered  versions commanding higher prices. Non-corridor  between  £80.00 - 90.00. casual observation is that late crest versions seem in demand more than early. Possibly because late crest versions have a double chimney - personally I think that gives them better proportions. Though it could be that the market for late crest locos may be stronger than early. Either way I'm happy to be corrected. 

Have you decided which A4 that one will be yet Tony?

'Have you decided which A4 that one will be yet Tony?'

 

I have David,

 

It'll be 60032 GANNET. 

 

I've actually had a GANNET running on LB already...........

 

 

 

In little Bytham's early days, not long after the Hornby A4 was completely revamped and much-improved. All I did was renumber/rename it (can't remember what it was originally), close-couple the loco to tender, add a crew and coal the tender, and then weather it slightly. 

 

In a way, GANNET is incongruous for LB in the summer 1958, because she was one of last two (the other being 60009) to receive a double Kylchap, and, thus, for strict historical accuracy, should have a single chimney. However; two things. I think the A4s with single chimneys look puny, and I have very fond memories of seeing '32 on 'The Elizabethan'.

 

I sold the Hornby 60032 quite some time ago. Despite its being a good model (apart from the anorexic valve gear), it's 'just' Hornby to me, requiring so little of my personal input.

 

Thanks for the pricings, by the way. At around £200.00, the latest Hornby A4 comes out slightly more-expensive in comparison to some extent. Granted, I got the basic kit for a pittance, but the chassis I've just re-stocked comes in at £38.60 (thanks Andrew), the DJH motor/gearbox is about £80.00 and a complete wheelset from Markits is a bit in excess of £50.00. So, not altogether a 'cheap' alternative, especially as it'll be professionally-painted (though I'll barter that). However, mine will be unique and much more in keeping with my personal modelling philosophy.

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

 

 

Edited August 12, 2022 by Tony Wright
typo error

[davidw]

1 hour ago, Tony Wright said:

'Have you decided which A4 that one will be yet Tony?'

 

I have David,

 

It'll be 60032 GANNET. 

 

I've actually had a GANNET running on LB already...........

 

 

 

In little Bytham's early days, not long after the Hornby A4 was completely revamped and much-improved. All I did was renumber/rename it (can't remember what it was originally), close-couple the loco to tender, add coal, a crew and coal, and then weather it slightly. 

 

In a way, GANNET is incongruous for LB in the summer 1958, because she was one of last two (the other being 60009) to receive a double Kylchap, and, thus, for strict historical accuracy, should have a single chimney. However; two things. I think the A4s with single chimneys look puny, and I have very fond memories of seeing '32 on 'The Elizabethan'.

 

I sold the Hornby 60032 quite some time ago. Despite its being a good model (apart from the anorexic valve gear), it's 'just' Hornby to me, requiring so little of my personal input.

 

Thanks for the pricings, by the way. At around £200.00, the latest Hornby A4 comes out slightly more-expensive in comparison to some extent. Granted, I got the basic kit for a pittance, but the chassis I've just re-stocked comes in at £38.60 (thanks Andrew), the DJH motor/gearbox is about £80.00 and a complete wheelset from Markits is a bit in excess of £50.00. So, not altogether a 'cheap' alternative, especially as it'll be professionally-painted (though I'll barter that). However, mine will be unique and much more in keeping with my personal modelling philosophy.

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

 

 

Thanks for the reply. I've vague recollection of seeing a Hornby Gannet on LB in one of my first visits. Though I may have brought  mine. It's surprising what bargains can be had. I'll look forward to the article on budget modelling too. Seem expense everywhere at the moment 

[geoff west]

My Gannet has also put in an appearance on LB. I don't think it's picture was taken though.

It is also a Hornby re named/numbered loco.

[Tony Wright]

19 minutes ago, geoff west said:

My Gannet has also put in an appearance on LB. I don't think it's picture was taken though.

It is also a Hornby re named/numbered loco.

Bring it next time you come Geoff,

 

I'll take its picture then.

 

This GANNET might even be finished.....................

 

 

Plenty of soldering practice needed with something like this.

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

[thegreenhowards]

This hot weather has meant I can’t get in the loft to do things on my OO and have put the garden railway away because the track was starting to buckle! So I have been finishing things off. Today it’s the D&S GCR milk van which I started on holiday in July and showed earlier here.

 

I’ve just finished painting it. I had a debate about whether to paint the ends black or coach brown. mickLNER suggested black (thanks Mick) but in the end I went for coach brown because the other vehicle it will run with has brown ends. If anyone is sure this is wrong, please let me know. Painting it black is easy!

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[jwealleans]

After 1928, conventional thinking is that ends on non-corridor coaching stock (and therefore NPCCS) were black.   However there's evidence that at least some horseboxes continued to have body coloured ends.  That may be down to one Works, I'm really not sure.    Given that the 6 wheeler you've done is in pre-1928 lined livery, I can't see a problem with this.

[micklner]

Very nice, you forgot the Black plastic behind the Louvres , you shouldnt be able to see straight through . That was pointed out to me when I built mine, by others on my thread.

[thegreenhowards]

18 minutes ago, micklner said:

Very nice, you forgot the Black plastic behind the Louvres , you shouldnt be able to see straight through . That was pointed out to me when I built mine, by others on my thread.

I do now remember you told me that. What was inside the van to stop people seeing through?

[30368]

17 hours ago, Tony Wright said:

This GANNET might even be finished.....................

 

 

Tony,

 

I have one to build too so will follow with interest. Looking at my Pro-Scale A4 it seems as if careful alighnment is going to be crucial. Hope I can emulate the neatness of your work.

 

Kind regards,

 

Richard B

[cctransuk]

50 minutes ago, thegreenhowards said:

I do now remember you told me that. What was inside the van to stop people seeing through?

 

Nothing - other than perhaps zinc mesh.

 

However, real louvres are actually sloping slats that overlap each other; etched 'louvres' are simply two-dimensional slots.

 

CJI.

[micklner]

2 hours ago, thegreenhowards said:

I do now remember you told me that. What was inside the van to stop people seeing through?

If you look at any Louvre door/blind, you cannot see through them as they overlap each other,  and only allow air to pass through on the top and bottom of the angled louvre.

[Tony Wright]

58 minutes ago, 30368 said:

 

Tony,

 

I have one to build too so will follow with interest. Looking at my Pro-Scale A4 it seems as if careful alighnment is going to be crucial. Hope I can emulate the neatness of your work.

 

Kind regards,

 

Richard B

Good afternoon Richard,

 

My work will be 'neater' after more of the soldered seams have been properly tidied up. Because of the kit's design, the smokebox/boiler/firebox assembly has to be soldered to the 'aerofoil'-shaped footplate from the outside, necessitating a fair bit of cleaning up once fixed. The top parts are ready-formed (quite well), and fit together relatively easily, soldered from the inside. The footplate curve is dictated by the valance strip, which is incredibly flimsy and thin. Having now built (at least the bodywork) three Pro-Scale A4s, I've never managed to fix the strips on entirely to my satisfaction. They bow and cockle under soldering heat, much more so than the footplate, though that can go out of shape when heated. I've had to resort to part-replacement of the valance strips (at the rear end) with appropriate-sized, square-section brass/nickel silver stock; much more robust. 

 

The following pictures illustrate the flimsiness of those valances............

 

 

Certainly not a perfect aerofoil-shape, especially beneath the firebox/cab.

 

 

Possibly better on this side?

 

 

A bit of a 'wobble' here at the rear (note the 'bent' reversing rod as well - the result of exhibition handling).

 

 

This side seems to be worse in both cases. 

 

Ian Rathbone painted both these A4s. 

 

I think Scottish Eric made a neater job with his Pro-Scale A4..........

 

 

He's also incorporated the flexible screen between the cab roof's rear and the tender's frontplate.

 

 

The cabsides are also incredibly flimsy in the state seen in my picture of yesterday. The next job will be to detail the cab and get the roof on ASAP.

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

[30368]

1 hour ago, Tony Wright said:

My work will be 'neater' after more of the soldered seams have been properly tidied up.

 

Thanks so much for the feedback and the tips. Valances are always "little devils" are they not? But A4's must be about the worse.

 

Kind regards,

 

Richard B

 

[Tony Wright]

35 minutes ago, 30368 said:

 

Thanks so much for the feedback and the tips. Valances are always "little devils" are they not? But A4's must be about the worse.

 

Kind regards,

 

Richard B

 

Good evening Richard,

 

I think you're right regarding the A4s' valances. 

 

Looking at pictures of locos in works prior to shopping, every separate component seems to have the individual loco's number stencilled on to them. A4s' cladding, in particular, needed this because bits from another probably wouldn't fit. 

 

In a way, I like the Pro-Scale A4's style of construction. It does introduce the odd anomaly; a bend/buckle/cockle/dent here and there. I don't mean that to excuse shoddy building, but it's clearly been 'made by hand'; not some plastic perfection from the other side of the globe.

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

[grahame]

I don't often check in on RMweb these days but this is one of my rare look-ins with a report should anyone be interested. As usual it's N/2mm and non-steamy. The first is a recently completed NGS kit of a BPV Boplate bogie flat:

 

 

The second is bashing a NGS Loriot wagon kit and Tomytec Poclain TY45 in to a ZYR Lowmac EK mounted with with Poclain grab excavator as used for digging foundation for electrification gantries. There is still quite a bit to do, and, of course, there are compromises, but it progresses well. Here's the progress.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Tony Wright]

Returning to A4s..........

 

These are two RTR comparisons............

 

 

Bachmann.

 

 

And Hornby.

 

Both are certainly 'perfect' in that there are no bodywork-construction wobbles, dings, dents, cockles or ripples. 

 

Not for me, though.

 

 

[Tony Wright]

More on 'budget' modelling as well...............

 

 

Whether this can be classed as 'budget' modelling, I'm not sure. I'll explain; it belonged to a late modeller, whose collection I sold last year on behalf of his bereaved family. It's built from a DJH kit. In fact, visually well-built and nicely painted. However, despite its Portescap motor, its running was erratic and jerky.

 

Now, what to do? It would be impossible to sell it for the cost of its component parts and who'd want a dud-running kit-built A1? Well me, if I'm prepared to get it to go properly; which I did. I stripped it down mechanically, tweaked the pick-ups and ironed-out any tight spots. I also detailed it and renumbered/renamed it.

 

Geoff Haynes brought it to life with his weathering.

 

Now, does it qualify as budget modelling? Being dispassionate, I sold it to myself for £150.00 (way below its components' price) and charged myself nothing for my time. Now it runs beautifully, it's definitely a 'sound investment', and (I'd hope) worth a considerable amount more. 

 

But worth more than RTR equivalents? Like these?

 

 

 

Bachmann A1s. I don't know what the current price for something like these is, but, as 60157 should be roller-bearing-fitted, it's not very accurate.

 

Finally, a real 'bargain'..........

 

 

This loco appears in the latest issue of BRM as part of an introduction to budget modelling. I was presented with about six Hornby Stanier Fives, all bought off eBay (not by me, of course) and all needing some TLC. I mixed and matched to produce this (and others) for the princely sum of £35.00. There were a few detailing costs, but it's certainly worth more than £35.00 now. I'll be describing it and its like in BRM in due course. 

 

 

[30368]

36 minutes ago, Tony Wright said:

Not for me, though.

 

Good evening Tony,

 

Yes I am in agreement, original WC/BB and MN also suffered from the "hand built" look that, as you suggest, just doesn't work with a plastic moulding. I seem to remember someone covering a Hornby WC moulding with very thin brass sheet to create that "lived in" look. I might have a go at that myself.

 

To extend the point a bit further. Most cab side sheeting had imperfections created by manufacture, damage, poor re-assembly after repair etc. I guess though the area is so much smaller so we can, perhaps, let that pass?

 

Kind regards,

 

Richard B

 

[robertcwp]

I wonder if the assembled expertise of those who follow this thread might be able to identify the odd, tank-like loads on some of the wagons in this train, please?

 

92095_Charwelton by Robert Carroll, on Flickr

 

Closer view:

92095_Charwelton_crop by Robert Carroll, on Flickr

 

It looks as though Charwelton has already been rationalised by the date of the image, so possibly mid-1960s not long before closure of the GC London Extension as a through route.

[Clive Mortimore]

49 minutes ago, robertcwp said:

I wonder if the assembled expertise of those who follow this thread might be able to identify the odd, tank-like loads on some of the wagons in this train, please?

 

92095_Charwelton by Robert Carroll, on Flickr

 

Closer view:

92095_Charwelton_crop by Robert Carroll, on Flickr

 

It looks as though Charwelton has already been rationalised by the date of the image, so possibly mid-1960s not long before closure of the GC London Extension as a through route.

Hi Robert

 

They are not tank wagons, they are tanks being transported on flatrols or weltrols or could even be on four wheeled trolleys. Can you enlarge the section with the tanks. 

[Northmoor]

5 minutes ago, Clive Mortimore said:

Hi Robert

 

They are not tank wagons, they are tanks being transported on flatrols or weltrols or could even be on four wheeled trolleys. Can you enlarge the section with the tanks. 

They look a bit like tanks (accumulators) for industrial compressed air systems.

[Woodcock29]

Not long ago I bought a batch of 50 wagons from the auction of a deceased estate in NSW. They comprised a range of mostly kit built NER and LNWR wagons to EM Gauge. Easy to change the gauge to OO. There were a lot of D&S, 51L or David Geen models amongst them. Including postage they worked out at $5.62 or ~ £3 ea. Another local BRMA member bought a batch of 75 wagons from the estate, interestingly all OO. He wanted the horse boxes in that batch in particular. He was aiming to build up a train or two of pre grouping wagons so was very willing to swap a range of pre-group wagons from my batch for some of his. I gained a D&S Dia 87 LNER Milk Van, Dia 5 Horsebox, NE Road Van, L&Y CCT, a pair of D&S GN ballast wagons, Jidenco LMS Cement wagon as well as few others. I was willing to swap two of mine for each of his but no he was happy with one for one swaps.  They all need some work - the brass models in particular will need to have their paint stripped and fine details fitted better. The only two I've worked on so far are the two GN ballast wagons which were built but unpainted. I needed to remove a bit of excess low melt solder and finish them off. I had been looking for one of those for while to add to my engineering train but to get two was great!

 

The main cost to me will be the time so most have gone into a drawer for when I have time or need a particular wagon/van to add to a train.

 

That's what I consider to be budget modelling.  

 

Here are the two GN ballast wagons. they'll need to be weathered in due course.

 

Andrew