RMweb Gold teaky Posted July 8, 2015 RMweb Gold Share Posted July 8, 2015 Is there any reason that this model has dropped so completely off the radar at the moment or has there been a re-jigging of production slots? I think everything that can be said for now, has been said, and the release date has been static for a while. No doubt things will errupt again in a few weeks. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
No Decorum Posted July 8, 2015 Share Posted July 8, 2015 Delayed by modifications to take a skew-wound five-pole motor? To take brass bearings? To re-align handrail knobs? We can live in hope. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Black Hat Posted July 8, 2015 Share Posted July 8, 2015 Is there any reason that this model has dropped so completely off the radar at the moment or has there been a re-jigging of production slots? Maybe Hornby have realised their mistake and that they should have been making a B16/3? 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
stewartingram Posted July 8, 2015 Share Posted July 8, 2015 August was the last date I heard from somewhere, so why should we be worried at this time? Patience is a virtue. Stewart 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mad McCann Posted July 8, 2015 Share Posted July 8, 2015 Not worried per se, Stewart. Just curious; while it's not directly relevant to my core modelling, it's one of the nicer Eastern group 4-4-0s and consequently of interest. It comes when it comes but I was just interested to see if any update on its progress was forthcoming. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold teaky Posted July 9, 2015 RMweb Gold Share Posted July 9, 2015 Hornby website now says 01/08/15. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AGR Model Store Posted July 10, 2015 Share Posted July 10, 2015 Trade says a later date ...... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold teaky Posted July 10, 2015 RMweb Gold Share Posted July 10, 2015 Trade says a later date ...... Ahh, Hornby comms up to their usual standard. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Les1952 Posted July 10, 2015 Share Posted July 10, 2015 Their usual standard? You mean as good as most of their competitors? An honourable few have a gold standard- Hornby is in the pack with the rest (Bachmann, Heljan, most of the Continentals...) Les Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
orford Posted July 12, 2015 Share Posted July 12, 2015 (edited) To put the record straight - The trade (AND Hornby) has been saying 19th August for some considerable time now. Hornby have revised this within the last few days to 1st August. The first batch are apparently in a container right now somewhere on the high seas between China and the UK. It is hardly Hornby's fault if 'the trade' have not yet picked up on the latest information. WHY is it so fashionable right now to knock Hornby at every opportunity? I just bought a Bachmann loco (B1) and in terms of both fineness of moulding AND level of detail, it is nowhere NEAR the Hornby version. Excellent in it's own right I admit - but nowhere near Hornby's standards (and as I have a B1 from both I can do a direct comparison). Why don't we all just get off Hornby's back for a while? Whilst we all know that their production estimates are shall we say, 'approximate' (for very good reasons, mainly Chinese, over which there is little control), the fact remains that they consistently continue to turn out excellent models which without them, probably would not be available. At least they are still with us, unlike many big names in the High Street.....both modelling and otherwise. Why not just let them get on with running their own business in the way they think is best - and just see how things settle down? Edited July 12, 2015 by orford 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
GNR Dave Posted July 13, 2015 Share Posted July 13, 2015 Couldn't agree more. Although to be fair to Bachmann's B1 it is probably several decades older than the far superior (IMHO) Hornby model, new chassis aside. I believe the original tooling was made by Kader for Replica, and was incorporated into the Branchline range with Replica's demise. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hroth Posted July 13, 2015 Share Posted July 13, 2015 Maybe Hornby have realised their mistake and that they should have been making a B16/3? Nahhhh.... It's a halfway-house to a new attempt at a detailed B12/3 - just need to stretch the boiler and add another pair of drivers..... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
HOTTODDY Posted July 14, 2015 Share Posted July 14, 2015 To put the record straight - The trade (AND Hornby) has been saying 19th August for some considerable time now. Hornby have revised this within the last few days to 1st August. The first batch are apparently in a container right now somewhere on the high seas between China and the UK. You have inside info? I hope you are correct. This is top of my wants list and I hope it doesn't disappoint like Book Law, J15 and SR 700 has. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Maltazer Posted July 14, 2015 RMweb Gold Share Posted July 14, 2015 To put the record straight - The trade (AND Hornby) has been saying 19th August for some considerable time now. Hornby have revised this within the last few days to 1st August. The first batch are apparently in a container right now somewhere on the high seas between China and the UK. You have inside info? I hope you are correct. This is top of my wants list and I hope it doesn't disappoint like Book Law, J15 and SR 700 has. You were disappointed by the J15? I guess there's no pleasing some people... Mal Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Ian Hargrave Posted July 14, 2015 RMweb Gold Share Posted July 14, 2015 You were disappointed by the J15? I guess there's no pleasing some people... Mal I don't think he meant it to represent his views alone. His posts on the J15 are both positive and informative .We are a "broad church" and maybe some criticisms are extreme,to say the least.One man's meat is another man's poison.But we pride ourselves on freedom of expression etc.and also to silently bite our lips and grind our teeth as the pain we bear in the defence of such a fine and very British tradition.Shut your eyes and think of England,I advise ,with tongue bitten in bleeding cheek and fingers curled around the handle of my spittoon. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Maltazer Posted July 14, 2015 RMweb Gold Share Posted July 14, 2015 I don't think he meant it to represent his views alone. His posts on the J15 are both positive and informative .We are a "broad church" and maybe some criticisms are extreme,to say the least.One man's meat is another man's poison.But we pride ourselves on freedom of expression etc.and also to silently bite our lips and grind our teeth as the pain we bear in the defence of such a fine and very British tradition.Shut your eyes and think of England,I advise ,with tongue bitten in bleeding cheek and fingers curled around the handle of my spittoon. And I'm sure he can respond himself, in his own good time, if he found my comment to be out of order. Freedom of expression works in many directions. Mal Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Ian Hargrave Posted July 14, 2015 RMweb Gold Share Posted July 14, 2015 And I'm sure he can respond himself, in his own good time, if he found my comment to be out of order. Freedom of expression works in many directions. Mal Apologies.Post 88 appears to be from Orford.In fact it is not and the comment in question originates with Hot Toddy who has picked up on criticisms made elsewhere on the forum.My post must then necessarily apply to him.Maybe with the rider that he should apply his own critical judgement rather than leaving it to others to decide for him.I have no hesitation in recommending without reservation both the J15 and the 700 .For me,the flaws with Book Law cause no trouble with enjoyment of the model but I accept,tongue in cheek,that it does trouble some members of this forum.For what it's worth,I believe Orford is correct in his call that it's time to let Hornby get on with the job.They have fine models on the market with more imminent. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bernard Lamb Posted July 15, 2015 Share Posted July 15, 2015 You were disappointed by the J15? I guess there's no pleasing some people... Mal I for one was disappointed with the J15. Just like Book Law it had so many little niggles that could have been avoided with a tad of research. Read some of he J15 thread to see the points raised and what people, including me, did to correct them. A lot of people seemed to like my version. I never did get an answer as to the purpose of the holes in the tender buffer beam, present on the real thing but not replicated by Hornby. The crazy thing with Hornby is that they get a detail correct on one model and then get it wrong on another. They simply lack adequate QC procedures. Sorry for repeating myself but with over 30 years in QC I do know and care about such things, but admit I probably do look with a more critical eye than most people, particularly when it is a subject in which I have an interest. Stop kicking Hornby? OK if you want to go back to design clever. If that had not been met with a deluge of adverse comment would Hornby have dropped it? They have made progress but the fundamental problem remains. Bernard Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
HOTTODDY Posted July 15, 2015 Share Posted July 15, 2015 You were disappointed by the J15? I guess there's no pleasing some people... Mal Yep, on two counts. Wrong alignment of the handrail knobs and choice of LNER loco number of an early scrapped loco.The latter is just my preference, but the former is a DEFECT and should not have escaped from the factory like that. The 700 has the same DEFECT and examples of Book Law beggers belief!!! Where are Hornby's QC department? Obviously not doing their job! Why are we expected to accept to these errors and try to fix them ourselves. Buying a brand new car with door handles in the wrong place wouldn't be accepted and certainly a new owner wouldn't even consider replacing them. A DEFECT is a DEFECT pure and simple. Send it back to supplier or manufacturer and keep sending defective goods back until you get satisfaction. Its your CUSTOMER RIGHT . Its a pain I know, but I've done that and it works. Be factual and good mannered with the complaint and eventually you get there. For the prices we are expected to pay we should expect the quality of goods to justify it. I rest my case.........! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
GNR Dave Posted July 15, 2015 Share Posted July 15, 2015 (edited) Sorry but I think DEFECT is too strong a word. The handrail issue is a conscious decision by Hornby. It is a compromise to simplify manufacturing. All model trains have compromises. If you're unhappy with those compromises, don't buy the model. The model is not defective because it is supplied and works as Hornby have specified it. Again if you are not happy with the way Hornby have spec'd the model, don't buy it. If enough people don't buy their product they will get the message and up their game, and presumably their prices. I would suspect however, that the vast majority of purchasers are / will be more than happy with their 700s & J15s, most will not even be aware of the handrail issue and most of those that are, won't let it spoil their enjoyment of a couple of lovely models (IMHO) Getting back on topic, I think the D16s look superb. To my eye it is a beautifully proportioned loco and I'll be getting an LNER and British Railways example, no matter what angle the handrails are at (So long as they're not moulded on !) Edited July 15, 2015 by GNR Dave 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Ian Hargrave Posted July 15, 2015 RMweb Gold Share Posted July 15, 2015 And before long hopefully one in Pre War Royal Train guise in LNER Apple Green ? Perhaps a limited edition with Royal Train Coaches to match..a thought.I anticipate the Claud with relish and yes,as you say,I'm "one of the vast majority of purchasers " who won't be fazed by defects difficult to spot with the naked eye.These are mass produced boys toys made in China.They are what they are and only that.Having said that,they are damned good and I for one am a very happy bunny speaking as one who started at Christmas in 1950 with a Hornby Dublo Sir Nigel Gresley and a couple of tinplate coaches.Handrails anyone? 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium 31A Posted July 15, 2015 RMweb Premium Share Posted July 15, 2015 Sorry but I think DEFECT is too strong a word. The handrail issue is a conscious decision by Hornby. It is a compromise to simplify manufacturing. All model trains have compromises. If you're unhappy with those compromises, don't buy the model. The model is not defective because it is supplied and works as Hornby have specified it. Again if you are not happy with the way Hornby have spec'd the model, don't buy it. If enough people don't buy their product they will get the message and up their game, and presumably their prices. I would suspect however, that the vast majority of purchasers are / will be more than happy with their 700s & J15s, most will not even be aware of the handrail issue and most of those that are, won't let it spoil their enjoyment of a couple of lovely models (IMHO) Getting back on topic, I think the D16s look superb. To my eye it is a beautifully proportioned loco and I'll be getting an LNER and British Railways example, no matter what angle the handrails are at (So long as they're not moulded on !) 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium 31A Posted July 15, 2015 RMweb Premium Share Posted July 15, 2015 Sorry Ian, not used to replying on this "smart phone" thing; I meant to click "agree" but couldn't find the buttons and seem to have just quoted your response in error! Anyway, I agree! Oh dear it gets worse - I agree with Dave AND Ian!! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
stewartingram Posted July 15, 2015 Share Posted July 15, 2015 Does anyone know yet what differences to expect from the different versions Hornby have announced? Certainly with the J15 there were differences (and I was just expecting a livery change), but which version do I need to reserve at the model shop? Stewart Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium 31A Posted July 15, 2015 RMweb Premium Share Posted July 15, 2015 There certainly seem to be two different types of front framing - basically the top of the frames drop either in convex or concave curves below the smoke box. I think this reflects the different valve arrangements the real engines had? Last time I looked the images on Hornby's web site reflected this. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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