OO gauge Crowdfunded APT-P (Warley announcement)

[chris p bacon]

I have received my notification dated 25th July from Paypal of the refund but have not yet got the money. How long does this sort of transaction normally take? Should I be chasing PayPal yet or does it normally take longer?

 

 

Did you pay via Paypal but actually using your credit card ?

 

If by funds in your Paypal account I'd expect it straight away, but if you used your credit card and sent it via Paypal then it could be 24/48 hours to appear on your card statement as it will go back to the card not Paypal.

 

Thats the way I understand it from previous transactions.

[LongRail]

Does it matter if anyone actually has or hasn't ? Are you denied an opinion if you choose not to order one. Maybe he has a lack of trust in the scheme.

 

Lets face it, the irony is that even if you've ordered one, it's being refunded anyway to order again. . .or maybe it isn't being refunded, who knows.

I think it does matter there are far to many keyboard warriors on here who are being destructive not constructive and it appears would like nothing better than to see this fail.

I applaud Dave for his courage to take this on in the first place and then to carry on under continual scrutiny and criticism

And for the benefit of doubt I have ordered a model 

[chris p bacon]

I applaud Dave for his courage to take this on in the first place and then to carry on under continual scrutiny and criticism

 

 

I don't intend to drag this off topic,  but criticism of the model will mean a better one gets produced, and scrutiny of the process also means it will be produced.  

 

Dave is a nice enough chap and has said in the past he has produced award winning models, it would be nice to see an award winning company producing them rather than one that seems to lurch along unable to complete basic tasks required to operate.  

Without being negative but practical,  putting together a means to get funds in should have been the highest priority.  But here it is part way through the project with the ridiculous situation of refunding some deposits, what if not enough re-order ? ( say 50%) you've got the scenario that some have been refunded and kept their money, some have re-ordered and others have lost their deposit as it paid for the CAD but on reflection may have preferred to have their money back. With the result that the model may not go ahead until enough funds are available.

[HillsideDepot]

I think it does matter there are far to many keyboard warriors on here who are being destructive not constructive and it appears would like nothing better than to see this fail.

I applaud Dave for his courage to take this on in the first place and then to carry on under continual scrutiny and criticism

And for the benefit of doubt I have ordered a model 

I'm following this thread but have no interest in a model APT.

 

So why is it of interest?

 

Well, the next project might be the High Speed Diesel Train which would be of some interest, or it could be a Cross Country DMU (120 for preference, but 119 equally attractive) which is at the top of my wish list. How things progress with the APT are therefore potentially of great relevance.

 

I hope all the problems are sorted, and I hope everyone gets the APT models they want in a timely fashion, made to the spec they expect. If that's the conclusion of this tale then I'd have confidence to order/ crowd-fund something which does interest me. Likewise if Hornby, Bachmann or Heljan  etc announced, say, the Cross-Country DMU and I found an unknown to me retailer offering it on a pre-order basis at a great price I'd want to do some research into the likelihood of said model actually being delivered before deciding where to place my order.

 

I don't see that as unreasonable.

Edited July 27, 2018 by HillsideDepot

[eddie an engine]

I applaud Dave for his courage to take this on in the first place and then to carry on under continual scrutiny and criticism

 

I believe it should be highlighted that this "scrutiny and criticism" is actually a legal requirement.

[bill_schmidt1]

I believe it should be highlighted that this "scrutiny and criticism" is actually a legal requirement.

Exactly! This stuff should of been in place from day one  (Nearly five years ago!) for all the projects that DJM have been doing or proposing to do seeing as you can buy direct or express an interest! Yet it's seen as "scrutiny and criticism" to even mention it. 

[tetsudofan]

Does it matter if anyone actually has or hasn't ? Are you denied an opinion if you choose not to order one. Maybe he has a lack of trust in the scheme.

 

Lets face it, the irony is that even if you've ordered one, it's being refunded anyway to order again. . .or maybe it isn't being refunded, who knows.

 

Then maybe there should be two threads:

 

-  one to discuss the APT-P model

 

-  another thread to discuss the method of financing such projects

 

At the moment most of the postings seem to be about financing such projects.....

 

Keith 

[jjb1970]

Then maybe there should be two threads:

 

-  one to discuss the APT-P model

 

-  another thread to discuss the method of financing such projects

 

At the moment most of the postings seem to be about financing such projects.....

 

Keith

Already a thread discussing crowd funding in general and the financial management of such schemes in the modelling musings & miscellany section.

[tetsudofan]

Already a thread discussing crowd funding in general and the financial management of such schemes in the modelling musings & miscellany section.

 

….then why don't those people use that thread instead of winding things up here?

 

I think everybody who has ordered an APT-P are now well aware of what they've got themselves into and don't need any further education.

 

Keith

[eddie an engine]

….then why don't those people use that thread instead of winding things up here?

That thread is discussing crowd funding in our hobby in general. Comments here are very relevant to DJModels and his crowd funding schemes.

However since the behavior of DJModels is not directly related to the APT project, but to all the crowd funded and advance payment schemes being run by Dave Jones, I suggest a separate threat should be started within the DJMODELS section.

Perhaps pinned until the errant accounts are submitted and the law seen to be complied with? 

[delticfan]

Does it matter if anyone actually has or hasn't ? Are you denied an opinion if you choose not to order one. Maybe he has a lack of trust in the scheme.

 

Lets face it, the irony is that even if you've ordered one, it's being refunded anyway to order again. . .or maybe it isn't being refunded, who knows.

 

Oooh touched a nerve lol. I was trying to establish if this guy was just following the british disease of knocking people, hats off to Dave from me for doing this project a massive learning curve for him I couldn't do be bothered with it but I'm glad to support him. Don't you just love armchair modellers all talk and no action.

[Paul821]

Very slightly OT

 

Looks like demand might go up and a new livery is needed by this breaking news on the BBC

 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-beds-bucks-herts-44979593?intlink_from_url=https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/uk-england-suffolk-44858700&link_location=live-reporting-story

[chris p bacon]

Oooh touched a nerve lol. I was trying to establish if this guy was just following the british disease of knocking people, hats off to Dave from me for doing this project a massive learning curve for him I couldn't do be bothered with it but I'm glad to support him. Don't you just love armchair modellers all talk and no action.

 

 

No, far from it.   I just object to those on a free to use forum who try and moderate a discussion. 

 

I don't have a issue with DJ,  but he has put this project on platform open to all users and so must take what comes. And as it is not the first locomotive he has produced and not the first funded this way it is far from a learning curve. 

[Colin_McLeod]

Colin

are you checking your bank or your papal account

Paid by PayPal

PayPal account shows £0 balance.

Bank account shows the payment going out a few months ago but nothing coming back

[woodenhead]

Oooh touched a nerve lol. I was trying to establish if this guy was just following the british disease of knocking people, hats off to Dave from me for doing this project a massive learning curve for him I couldn't do be bothered with it but I'm glad to support him. Don't you just love armchair modellers all talk and no action.

When you reach the insults stage you've lost your argument

[delticfan]

When you reach the insults stage you've lost your argument

Maybe, but in this case I’ve got one on order so as far as I’m concerned I’m winning lol.

[chris p bacon]

Paid by PayPal

PayPal account shows £0 balance.

Bank account shows the payment going out a few months ago but nothing coming back

 

 

If I've read this correctly you paid using Paypal to access the money in your bank account (it'd be a Direct Debit)  if so then the money should return to your bank account.

 

Was there a 'due date' on the transaction/refund email ?

[Colin_McLeod]

Just checked my bank account again and

the refund came through just after midnight.

 

Now I await the link from Dave to enable me to re-order which I will do when Companies House website shows that the accounts for the year ended 31st July 2017 are no longer overdue.

[tetsudofan]

…...and I've just checked my card account and see that the refund has been processed and credited to my account.

 

Maybe the fact that the refund has been processed as DJM said it would be will, at least, keep the stirrers/trouble rousers/winder-uppers quiet for the time being until they find something else to spout off about.

 

Keith

[chris p bacon]

…...and I've just checked my card account and see that the refund has been processed and credited to my account.

 

Maybe the fact that the refund has been processed as DJM said it would be will, at least, keep the stirrers/trouble rousers/winder-uppers  those concerned for others quiet for the time being until they find something else to spout off about bring to the attention of those extending free credit to a manufacturer.

 

Keith

 

 

There you go.

[tetsudofan]

Thanks for your concerns, think I've been round long enough to look after myself as, I think, many others on here have.

 

Keith

[DavidH]

I don't know anyone who thinks you can't look out for yourself, but we're just pointing out for the umpteenth time that DJM's accounts are 3 months overdue at Companies House; now a week since he promised they were going in (new accountant) and 28 days since they were previously promised they were going in (previous accountant).

It really is the most basic of tasks by which a company proves that it is competent to handle thousands of pounds of our money.

Every time Hornby issue results, it is pored over to the nth degree by every man and his dog on here; Coopercraft was pulled to bits on here; but for some reason DJM is the only modelling company exempt from even the most basic scrutiny.

 

David

[Chris Chewter]

The issue is that this is not the place to be posting it.  I wouldn't post about Hornbys financial status under a thread about Pecketts!  This is a thread about the development of the APT model, and not about DJMs financial condition.  I want to see how the project is developing, not logging on to see the same circular discussions about how Dave should be running his business.  Can we move this back on topic please?

[Mr_Tilt]

............ but for some reason DJM is the only modelling company exempt from even the most basic scrutiny.

 

 

 

If this thread is an example of 'being exempt from the most basic scruitiny' I'd hate to see what an 'in depth scrutiny' would be like!!!! 

[chris p bacon]

The issue is that this is not the place to be posting it.  I wouldn't post about Hornbys financial status under a thread about Pecketts!  This is a thread about the development of the APT model, and not about DJMs financial condition.  I want to see how the project is developing, not logging on to see the same circular discussions about how Dave should be running his business.  Can we move this back on topic please?

 

 

But this is where DJM has been posting about refunds/payments, and if previous customers choose not to re-order it could directly affect the project.  Shouldn't that be within the relevant thread.