Hills of the North - The Last Great Project

[LNER4479]

14 hours ago, Barry Ten said:

A question about Shap, if I may? If I was reading the baseboard joints correctly at the Manchester show, it looked as if there were rail joiners between the track sections spanning the joints? I thought this was a rather nifty idea for ensuring rail alignment, and the running certainly looked rock solid across the joints. If I'm correct about the joiners, are they just slid on and off at the appropriate times or are they retained in any way?

Hi Barry. Well-spotted - yes, I do use sliding fishplates, for exactly the reason you state. They look even more inconspicuous in Code 75. They simply slide back onto the rail (one each way at each joint) for transportation - no need to remove them altogether.

[LNER4479]

So here we go. I've saved myself the best for last ...

 

Valve gear - my favourite part!

 

I'm using the MRJ steel valve gear fret. Here's the radius rod and expansion link, the latter two piece such that the rod runs in the middle. The notch you can perhaps make out just behind the link in this shot is to allow the rod to move slightly back and forth just below the expansion link pivot point, as if in a low gear position (15-20%).

 

From behind, back and forth movement is achieved thus.

 

For the combination lever to valve spindle link, I've drilled a 0.6mm hole in a strip of phosphor bronze strip then folded it back to create a fork.

 

Thus ready for fitment.

 

And fitted.

 

With union link now also fitted, now preparing the lifting links, which will secure the radius rod in its intended position.

 

Like so.

 

Finally, eccentrics. The eccentric crank is too long ... and the eccentric rod too short! Fortunately, almost all pictures of Patriots show them with plain eccentric rods, so I've made use of the flute and a length of 0.6mm wire to reinforce the joint of two separate lengths of eccentric rod from the fret to make the new rod.

 

I make use of Peco track pins, with the blackening removed, for my moving joints. The usual paper washer trick is used to prevent the solder flooding the joint and fixing it solid.

 

Ready to fit ...

 

Ta daa!

 

(Phew!)

 

 

Edited January 13, 2023 by LNER4479

[LNER4479]

Final, finishing off jobs on the Patriot.

 

Only realised with doing the detail on this build that the valve spindle guide bars are hung off the front of the motion bracket with these original Fowler locos, NOT the later Stanier arrangement where they were on the back of the cylinders.

 

Circular cover for the expansion link pivot point on the motion bracket; mounting bracket for nameplate atop the leading splasher.

 

Cylinder relief valves and draincock pipes.

 

Brake rigging, including mounting the limited clearance middle brake blocks from the rigging upwards; driving wheel balance weights (were supplied plain; I've added the rivets (don't count them)

 

Cab fall plate and doors.

 

Injectors beneath cab - bit plain otherwise.

 

And there we have it. Finished!

 

A quick test run.

 

Now in the paint shop!

 

[gr.king]

On 10/01/2023 at 11:52, LNER4479 said:

Hi Barry. Well-spotted - yes, I do use sliding fishplates, for exactly the reason you state. They look even more inconspicuous in Code 75. They simply slide back onto the rail (one each way at each joint) for transportation - no need to remove them altogether.

Whilst the sliding fishplates at board joints may have been largely successful on Grantham's robust Peco code 100 track (save for a few bent rail ends and broken track bases...) and apparently okay so far on Shap, I wouldn't dream of attempting anything similar with universal employment of finescale code 75 bullhead rail, the inevitably flimsier track bases, glued rigid ballast, and the necessarily smaller, shorter, more delicate fishplates. For the boards I'm building at present, even with rail-ends very firmly soldered to several copper-clad sleepers, these screwed to the baseboard, and rail ends trimmed to avoid projection beyond the board ends, when merely moving boards around the house I've had to be very careful indeed - still not entirely without incident. A system for wrapping the board ends in non-fluffy padding and moving the boards around on a cushion of air would seem to be required, unless end-protector boards are fitted for every simple instance of handling or movement.

[thegreenhowards]

I’m using the fishplate approach on my O gauge garden railway which gets packed away in the garage when not in use. I thought that if it’s good enough for Grantham then it’s good enough for me! And the extra robustness of the O gauge track base helps.

[LNER4479]

So, the Patriot has emerged from the paint shop (sort of) ...

 

... but it's black! What on earth is going on?

 

Meanwhile ...

 

... fancied a quick project on the side!

 

This from the recent stash of kits I've helped dispose off. Kept this one on one side.

 

As you can see above, the kit instructions are dated 1976 and the state of tarnishing on the brass could indicate that it's been around for that long.

 

Anyhow, not displeased with that for one evening's work. According to sources to hand, they did exist well into the BR era but this one might be destined for one of the LMS trains, as I have suitable photographic evidence.

 

 

Edited January 22, 2023 by LNER4479

[Jol Wilkinson]

24 minutes ago, LNER4479 said:

So, the Patriot has emerged from the paint shop (sort of) ...

 

... but it's black! What on earth is going on?

 

Meanwhile ...

 

... fancied a quick project on the side!

 

This from the recent stash of kits I've helped dispose off. Kept this one on one side.

 

As you can see above, the kit instructions are dated 1976 and the state of tarnishing on the brass could indicate that it's been around for that long.

 

Anyhow, not displeased with that for one evening's work. According to sources to hand, they did exist well into the BR era but this one might be destined for one of the LMS trains, as I have suitable photographic evidence.

 

 

These were a Limited Edition kit of 600 kits! I have one built in LNWR livery and three more kits still to build. As I model in P4 I built a Sharmanesque underframe with one end axle rigid and the other two on a simple inside bearing bogie.

 

[LNER4479]

20 minutes ago, Jol Wilkinson said:

These were a Limited Edition kit of 600 kits! I have one built in LNWR livery and three more kits still to build. As I model in P4 I built a Sharmanesque underframe with one end axle rigid and the other two on a simple inside bearing bogie.

 

Yes, I did notice the Limited Edition number on the front. I wonder how many of the 600 have actually been built over the last 40 years? This one has been a shelf queen until now.

 

Beautiful looking carriages. I don't plan doing anything fancy with the suspension as I'm on crude OO(!) I might add a fair bit of weight inside though as it's intended to be lead vehicle in a 10 coach train.

[Tony Teague]

Seeing this immediately brought to mind a Southern passenger van that I have which I believe was constructed from a Mallard kit (left one of the pair):

 

 

This pair were given to me by the guy who built them and I was told it was a Mallard model - I think it is of an ex-LSWR passenger van of 1923 to d.2104, excepting that I am not sure whether it should also have louvres in the bottom of the doors. Nevertheless it is a nice model that looks the part in a mixed van train or a short passenger rake.

The model looks to be of a similar vintage to the one you are building.

Tony

[Fishplate]

On 13/01/2023 at 01:23, LNER4479 said:

The usual paper washer trick is used to prevent the solder flooding the joint and fixing it solid.

 

Hi @LNER4479. All looking great. I have many models my Father built and am always fascinated how he managed to do similar. Unfortunately his modelling took place after I left home and moved many miles away, so never discussed the detail of how he did all that intricate work.

 

I'm not aware what that usual method is. Is it written up somewhere ?

[jwealleans]

I use a black marker pen to cover the surfaces I don't want solder to stick to.   Using a fag paper washer gives a very slight clearance so the rods move easily against each other.  It also stops the solder wicking through and sticking the moving rod to the pin as well as the fixed one.

Edited January 25, 2023 by jwealleans

[bbishop]

On 22/01/2023 at 19:59, Tony Teague said:

Seeing this immediately brought to mind a Southern passenger van that I have which I believe was constructed from a Mallard kit (left one of the pair):

 

 

This pair were given to me by the guy who built them and I was told it was a Mallard model - I think it is of an ex-LSWR passenger van of 1923 to d.2104, excepting that I am not sure whether it should also have louvres in the bottom of the doors. Nevertheless it is a nice model that looks the part in a mixed van train or a short passenger rake.

The model looks to be of a similar vintage to the one you are building.

Tony

Tony, actually built from 1909 and yes there should be louvres in the doors. I've just looked at the Mallard one that I'm building one at the moment - no louvres.  The kit was acquired by Blacksmiths, I've looked at those in the stash - louvres.    Bill

[Tony Teague]

33 minutes ago, bbishop said:

Tony, actually built from 1909 and yes there should be louvres in the doors. I've just looked at the Mallard one that I'm building one at the moment - no louvres.  The kit was acquired by Blacksmiths, I've looked at those in the stash - louvres.    Bill

 

Thanks Bill

I think I'll refrain from getting out the Dremel!

Tony

[Barry Ten]

3 hours ago, jwealleans said:

I use a black marker pen to cover the surfaces I don't want solder to stick to.   Using a fag paper washer gives a very slight clearance so the rods move easily against each other.  It also stops the solder wicking through and sticking the moving rod to the pin as well as the fixed one.

 

Since I don't have fag paper I just use the paper Comet instructions come printed on.

[St Enodoc]

50 minutes ago, Barry Ten said:

 

Since I don't have fag paper I just use the paper Comet instructions come printed on.

Baking paper works well and, to an extent, it's heat-resistant.

[lezz01]

Well the reason people use fag papers is because they are thinner than instruction paper.

They are also very useful for making lead flashing. Apply to the roof and flood with solvent, once dry paint with Humbrol Metalcoat Polished steel paint and buff up once dry if you want an older look then add gunmetal to the polished steel.

Blue slim are the best in my opinion and if you're not a smoker then one pack of them will last you forever.

Regards Lez.

[Michael Edge]

I use grease to stop the solder spreading through to where I don't want it, best to be quick with the iron as well.

[LNER4479]

7 hours ago, Fishplate said:

I'm not aware what that usual method is. Is it written up somewhere ?

Hi John,

 

I didn't realise that I hadn't posted a picture of me actually doing this on the recent build.

 

Here are a couple of pix from a few years ago, showing a moving joint being soldered on a signal. Exactly the same principle.

 

The joint is prepared with the paper washer inserted immediately behind where the solder is to be applied, in this case a washer over a fixed piece of wire (the signal arm axle). I apply a drop of flux to the prepared joint to aid rapid soldering and, although not shown here, unless the two parts to be soldered are an interference fit, I use a small screwdriver or some other suitable device to apply light pressure to the parts so as they are close together, separated only by the thickness of the paper. It's then a quick in and out with the soldering iron - if you've got it right, there should be an almost instant 'tzizz' as the soldered flashes over, aided by the flux. Remove soldering iron immediately after this; as Mike says: don't linger, otherwise you'll start to unsolder other parts in the heat chain(!)

 

Once done, then you can tear away the paper washer as shown. The flux will have made it slightly soggy, so it should tear easily. Sometimes, it leaves a few tiny pieces in and around the joint; use the end of a craft knife to work them out if you can't get at them with tweezers.

 

The cruel close up here nonetheless shows that the solder has formed a nice circular fillet between the washer and the wire which is an indication that it flashed over properly. Also, you might be able to detect a slight shadow between the washer and the support bracket beneath it. That's a good indication that we have just enough clearance there for a nice running fit, not too sloppy and not too tight. The paper washer should ensure that. You can check before you remove the washer - if it'll move but is a bit tight, that's probably about right. If it's already sloppy with the paper washer still in place then it's going to be really sloppy once removed. You can - carefully(!) - re-apply the iron with the washer still in place to adjust. Once the washer is removed, adjust at your peril (for fear of making the joint too tight or even soldering the whole thing up solid), although Mike's use of grease (and Jonathan's of the black marker pens) are good tips to guard against the latter.

 

Hope that helps understand a bit further. Thanks to others who have contributed above.

 

 

 

Edited January 25, 2023 by LNER4479

[PhilMortimer]

I use household tin foil (or Aluminium foil) instead of fag paper. Solder doesn't stick well to tin / ally foil. Same principle otherwise though, just doesn't go soggy with flux. You can easily pre-pierce the foil for the pin without it tearing. (OK, you can do the same with paper, but I find it doesn't work as well). Along with use of grease / vaseline and / or marker pin, should keep those parts that should not be soldered from becoming so.

[LNER4479]

On 22/01/2023 at 16:46, LNER4479 said:

 

 

 

Getting a bit carried away all of a sudden ...

 

Here's another item of NPCCS about to be tackled.

 

Another kit from an earlier era. Note the slab of PCB as the 'floor'. Solebars are prepared with footboard already soldered on before soldering to the floor where it's been pencil marked as per instructions. No slot n tab here!

 

I've added internal bracing pieces to try and keep the body sides reasonably flat and give a good location for the roof.

 

And with bogies assembled, not looking too bad. Nice solid vehicle shell and very steady on the track.

 

Reason for this burst of activity was the realisation of a mistake on my part in putting together the 'up' (downhill!) LMS train for the start of the Shap exhibition sequence (1937). The train is supposed to depict the 1937 Midday Scot and I've based the formation on the info in the Clive Carter LMS Passenger Train Formations book. These always quote the formation for the 'down' direction - this includes the time-honoured through GWR (Plymouth) coach(es), attached at Crewe. I've included it in my 'up' train ... but subsequent examination of pictures doesn't appear to show it (them) in the train? It then dawned on me (doh!) that it would never had made it to Plymouth not leaving Glasgow till the early afternoon! It must therefore have been conveyed as far as Crewe on the Glasgow - Birmingham service, which was a morning departure. BR era pix of the Glasgow - Birmingham train seem to confirm this.

 

SO - these new vehicles will be by way of replacement. There's a lovely Treacy picture of the train heading south from Carlisle (headed by none other than No.6201 herself) with three NPCCS vehicles at the head of the train, including the WCJS milk/fish van. The LNWR brake shown above is a credible alternative to the actual vehicles shown. Should add character to the train. Anybody want a GWR liveried BCK?(!)

 

Meanwhile ...

 

How often does this happen? My trusty roll of solder has finally expired! I estimate that I've been using it for the last 25 years, starting as a full roll. Switched to a new one - which is actually of same vintage, and will probably see me out at that usage rate.

 

Edited January 26, 2023 by LNER4479

[Killybegs]

Tissue paper soaked in light oil for me. Easy to remove afterwards.

[LNER4479]

Meanwhile ...

 

Bit of a big job about to break out at the chapel 

 

After nearly a year of waiting patiently (usual builders scenario) ...

 

Internal tie-bars going in. No great structural worries, more peace of mind than anything. Almost as importantly, will be a more practical structure to hang a better lighting arrangement from.

 

And some steel work! Its raison d'etre will become clear in subsequent posts (no pun intended).

 

Obviously, there's been a major clearance in the chapel to make space for this work. And it can only be done now. Once full scheme is set out, it'll be impossible to do work such as this.

 

Can't wait to resume work in earnest once these improvements have been completed😉

[Denbridge]

3 minutes ago, LNER4479 said:

Meanwhile ...

 

Bit of a big job about to break out at the chapel 

 

After nearly a year of waiting patiently (usual builders scenario) ...

 

Internal tie-bars going in. No great structural worries, more peace of mind than anything. Almost as importantly, will be a more practical structure to hang a better lighting arrangement from.

 

And some steel work! Its raison d'etre will become clear in subsequent posts (no pun intended).

 

Obviously, there's been a major clearance in the chapel to make space for this work. And it can only be done now. Once full scheme is set out, it'll be impossible to do work such as this.

 

Can't wait to resume work in earnest once these improvements have been completed😉

Mezzanine floor for Grantham 😉

[2750Papyrus]

Spiral to the fiddle yard in the sky?

[5BarVT]

4 hours ago, 2750Papyrus said:

Spiral to the fiddle yard in the sky?

It’s a chapel, would it not be a one way fiddle yard, is that really what you want?!

Paul.