Panic buying

[Ron Ron Ron]

Other commodities that have seen large price hikes on the international markets, are aluminium and raw and synthetic rubber.

Further bad news for the motor manufacturing industry.

 

.

[MarkC]

4 minutes ago, Ron Ron Ron said:

Other commodities that have seen large price hikes on the international markets, are aluminium and raw and synthetic rubber.

Further bad news for the motor manufacturing industry.

 

.

Glad I got new tyres for our cars recently then.

 

Good news for gas carrier companies shipping Butadiene - which is used for making car tyres - though.

[hayfield]

21 hours ago, NorthBrit said:

Panic buyers.   Why? Why?  Oh why?

 

I was in the supermarket today.    A woman was buying pancake mix!     She bought a dozen eggs,  six pints of milk  and a bag of flour.

 

Rediculous!!!

 

Perhaps she has a café

 

I worked in one of the major supermarkets and its surprising how many small convenience stores buy items in bulk when they are on offer. Certain fizzy drinks are sold below wholesale prices

 

At one time this was discouraged by the management, not anymore

 

I guess the owners of smaller shops have to shop around the same as everyone else

 

Edit

 

It may well be that its the cheapest place for the café owner to buy milk, or their supplier cannot deliver due to fuel/driver shortages

 

Pancakes with your latte sir!! 

Edited October 12, 2021 by hayfield

[alastairq]

Also, folk who are shopping for places like kids' homes, etc.....?

 

I recall a distant family birthday meal..dearest daughter's, as it happened, she had booked an American Burger restaurant in Bridlington....5  of us, so not a stingy meal, price-wise. Future SIL also there, he's a Chef as well...anyway, we came to order dessert [puddin']...soon there was a back room argument to be heard, between the chef and FOH....we wanted ice cream..someone had emptied the freezer of ice cream, why was ice cream still on the menu, etc etc?

 

Anyway, next thing we saw, was the kitchen hand hurrying out of the front door with an ampty carrier bag, and a fist full of notes.

Just opposite was a big Tescos, with late night opening.

LAd soon returned, and we were served Tesco's finest ice cream

 

SIL was not impressed, neither was DD, who left a caustic remark on the facebook page...

Me?

I didn't go a whole heap of the burger, never mind Tesco ice cream!

Of late we have had Indian delivered....or SIL has turned up trumps with something exotic.. That's covid for you!

 

 

[Platform 1]

22 hours ago, Sir TophamHatt said:

making the trip to the Isle of Wight

Just did one of those... was worried about filling up on the island but apart from generally inflated fuel prices there (£1.47 seen for petrol!), only one or two filling stations had closed pumps.  Last Saturday, the Co-op in Sandown had normal stocks and near to normal prices too (other filling stations are available).  Maybe islanders have more common sense...

[Steamport Southport]

4 minutes ago, Platform 1 said:

Just did one of those... was worried about filling up on the island but apart from generally inflated fuel prices there (£1.47 seen for petrol!), only one or two filling stations had closed pumps.  Last Saturday, the Co-op in Sandown had normal stocks and near to normal prices too (other filling stations are available).  Maybe islanders have more common sense...

 

They haven't got last months newspapers yet....

 

 

 

[Michael Hodgson]

2 minutes ago, Platform 1 said:

Maybe islanders have more common sense...

I imagine they have the common sense to fill the tank just before boarding the ferry every time they bring the car over.

It's not that big a place - I expect they do a lower annual mileage on average than the rest of us.

[Platform 1]

6 hours ago, MarkC said:

timber costs have indeed gone stratospheric

Quite so - 6ft fence panels were about £20 last year, but now being quoted £40 - or more - each.  Good ol' supply chain again...

[PhilJ W]

4 hours ago, Ron Ron Ron said:

There have been global issues with timber markets and prices are said to have reached record levels earlier this year.

It has been spurred on by high demand in the US, because of the backlog caused by COVID has led to a building boom, resulting in shortages.

Russia has also been holding back on supplies, according to one report I’ve read.

They use a lot more wood for building houses than in Europe.

[Ron Ron Ron]

I ordered a new garden shed, at the beginning of May, direct from the factory (via online) from a fair sized manufacturer.

A lot of companies were showing out of stock on many sizes and long delivery times on most others.

I had to wait 10 weeks, which wasn't as bad as from elsewhere.

 

When I ordered it, the price I paid was £543.

By the time the shed was delivered in July, their website was showing the price had increased to £650 'ish.

It's now showing as £702.

 

It was a similar tale of delay with a garden bench we ordered from Forest, in early April.

It eventually arrived in August.

Most of the designs and sizes they sell, almost permanently showing out of stock.

After a long wait, we received e-mails confirming delivery in week beginning X, only for it to then be put back several weeks.

This happened several times and when Mrs Ron chased them up on each occasion, timber shortages was their main excuse.

Nice bench by-the-way.

 

 

 

.

 

Edited October 12, 2021 by Ron Ron Ron

[PhilJ W]

26 minutes ago, Ron Ron Ron said:

I ordered a new garden shed, at the beginning of May, direct from the factory (via online) from a fair sized manufacturer.

A lot of companies were showing out of stock on many sizes and long delivery times on most others.

I had to wait 10 weeks, which wasn't as bad as from elsewhere.

 

When I ordered it, the price was £543.

By the time the shed was delivered in July, their website was showing the price had increased to £650 'ish.

It's now showing as £702.

 

It was a similar tale of delay with a garden bench we ordered from Forest, in early April.

It eventually arrived in August.

Most of the designs and sizes they sell, almost permanently showing out of stock.

After a long wait, we received e-mails confirming delivery in week beginning X, only for it to then be put back several weeks.

This happened several times and when Mrs Ron chased them up on each occasion, timber shortages was their main excuse.

Nice bench by-the-way.

 

Did you pay the original price?

[Ron Ron Ron]

42 minutes ago, PhilJ W said:

Did you pay the original price?

Yes.

I’ve edited the wording of my post to better reflect that.

 

 

.

[Andy Hayter]

I know John, Hayfield, with his retail experience has assured us that our Christmas goods are already in the warehouses and normally I would agree; however more and more reports suggest that may not be true for all Christmas goods.

 

It seems we have a perfect logistics storm. 

 

Firstly demand for stuff cranked up at the end of last year and Q1 this year.  This started to put a strain on container availability to ship the products. 

 

Then we had the Ever Given issue in the Suez canal that created a traffic jam of  ships between China and Europe and vice versa.  Ships and containers ended up not where they were needed.  The shortage of containers in China became worse and shipping costs started to spiral.  [Most long sea containers are owned by the shipping line.]  

 

Then we have the HGV driver problem which despite whatever spin we want to put on it about being a worldwide problem seems to be most acute in the UK.  This means that when containers are landed they are not always picked up on time and remain on quay.  When the next ship arrives, its containers are put on top of those not yet picked up.  In the melee a few containers do become lost.  When a driver arrives to pick up a container it may now be at the bottom of a pile three rows back and getting to it becomes an issue.  Port efficiency drops.

 

So off-loading containers from ships takes longer and this causes a queue of ships waiting to off load but unable to dock.

 

This then means that the owners of the cargo get charged demurrage and detention costs so the cost of the goods inside the container is going to go up to you the end customer.

 

So where that leaves us is that some goods for Christmas may not yet have been landed due to the delays in shipping, transit, off loading and pick up at the port.  Others may be in the the UK but stuck in one of those port quay stacks.  What percentage of planned deliveries that amounts to is a guess but my guess is that it is not enormous but also not insignificant.  If that is right there will be goods for Christmas but some will be in short supply and ripe for the next panic buy.

 

The situation today is reported as being:

Shipping lines are avoiding discharge at UK ports and Maersk have officially announce this for their ships.  If you are still expecting a Christmas delivery it may well be discharged in Rotterdam, Antwerp, Hamburg or Le Havre.  

UK container ports are completely constipated to the extent that HGV drivers are finding it difficult to return empty containers to Felixstowe and Thamesport (formerly known as Tilbury).   

If the shipping lines are not dropping off in the UK, they are also not taking the precious empties back to the Far East.  The ports are full of empties as well as full containers.   Returning those empties will be too late for this Christmas.

Some firms are looking at getting rail deliveries from the port to their warehouse.  In some cases that will work but often they still need an HGV driver to bring the containers from the railhead to their warehouse.  

 

 

[Ron Ron Ron]

8 hours ago, Andy Hayter said:

.......Shipping lines are avoiding discharge at UK ports and Maersk have officially announce this for their ships.  If you are still expecting a Christmas delivery it may well be discharged in Rotterdam, Antwerp, Hamburg or Le Havre.......

 

 

There are problems at Rotterdam and Antwerp as well.

Only a couple of weeks ago, there were reports of delays in unloading of up to a week or more.

It's caused a big problem and congestion for barge traffic as well.

They are also using barges to store empty containers, according to news reports.

 

Quote

Barges are being turned into floating storage platforms to alleviate pressures on Northern Europe’s ocean terminals, as inland waterway operators report surging congestion.

Wait times at Rotterdam have sky-rocketed over the past week to almost seven days.......
......ocean-side congestion is having a knock-on impact, with yards and terminals well over capacity, in terms of storage, and now refusing to accept new boxes without evacuation of the backlog....  

 

Quote

.......Alliance networks operating between Asia and North Europe are experiencing delays of up to a month due to worsening port congestion at both ends of the trade lane.
Asia-North Europe loops with a pro-forma round-trip transit time of around 75 days are now taking 100 or more, with carriers obliged to juggle schedules at the last minute.

According to a Maersk advisory, vessel wait times at Antwerp are already up to 10 days, with lesser – albeit significant – delays impacting all North European hub ports.........

 

 

 

The problems at Americas ports has also been widely reported, sparking worries about supplies in the run up to "the holidays season".

 

 

.

Edited October 13, 2021 by Ron Ron Ron

[hayfield]

13 hours ago, Michael Hodgson said:

I imagine they have the common sense to fill the tank just before boarding the ferry every time they bring the car over.

It's not that big a place - I expect they do a lower annual mileage on average than the rest of us.

 

Going back 30+ years was there not requests from ferry companies for motorists not to have full tanks of petrol when using ferries ?

[hayfield]

8 hours ago, Andy Hayter said:

I know John, Hayfield, with his retail experience has assured us that our Christmas goods are already in the warehouses and normally I would agree; however more and more reports suggest that may not be true for all Christmas goods.

 

It seems we have a perfect logistics storm. 

 

Firstly demand for stuff cranked up at the end of last year and Q1 this year.  This started to put a strain on container availability to ship the products. 

 

Then we had the Ever Given issue in the Suez canal that created a traffic jam of  ships between China and Europe and vice versa.  Ships and containers ended up not where they were needed.  The shortage of containers in China became worse and shipping costs started to spiral.  [Most long sea containers are owned by the shipping line.]  

 

Then we have the HGV driver problem which despite whatever spin we want to put on it about being a worldwide problem seems to be most acute in the UK.  This means that when containers are landed they are not always picked up on time and remain on quay.  When the next ship arrives, its containers are put on top of those not yet picked up.  In the melee a few containers do become lost.  When a driver arrives to pick up a container it may now be at the bottom of a pile three rows back and getting to it becomes an issue.  Port efficiency drops.

 

So off-loading containers from ships takes longer and this causes a queue of ships waiting to off load but unable to dock.

 

This then means that the owners of the cargo get charged demurrage and detention costs so the cost of the goods inside the container is going to go up to you the end customer.

 

So where that leaves us is that some goods for Christmas may not yet have been landed due to the delays in shipping, transit, off loading and pick up at the port.  Others may be in the the UK but stuck in one of those port quay stacks.  What percentage of planned deliveries that amounts to is a guess but my guess is that it is not enormous but also not insignificant.  If that is right there will be goods for Christmas but some will be in short supply and ripe for the next panic buy.

 

The situation today is reported as being:

Shipping lines are avoiding discharge at UK ports and Maersk have officially announce this for their ships.  If you are still expecting a Christmas delivery it may well be discharged in Rotterdam, Antwerp, Hamburg or Le Havre.  

UK container ports are completely constipated to the extent that HGV drivers are finding it difficult to return empty containers to Felixstowe and Thamesport (formerly known as Tilbury).   

If the shipping lines are not dropping off in the UK, they are also not taking the precious empties back to the Far East.  The ports are full of empties as well as full containers.   Returning those empties will be too late for this Christmas.

Some firms are looking at getting rail deliveries from the port to their warehouse.  In some cases that will work but often they still need an HGV driver to bring the containers from the railhead to their warehouse.  

 

 

 

Andy 

 

I was referring to supermarkets and larger ones at that, the smaller the outlet the less can be carried. In the supermarkets the warehouses are normally empty (you cannot sell anything that is stacked away), now they will be getting full as seasonal long dated items will have been mostly delivered and the warehouses will be quite full, and frozen containers will be in the goods in delivery parking area for extra frozen food space, these will start filling in late November.  Listening to the supermarket bosses they seem quite confident, but there are always shortages of some products at some time

 

As for toys electronics there is always shortages of some items, especially the must have items of each year. My wife always bought the toys for my daughter first. Remember Hestons first Christmas pudding with an orange it !! There are fads every year

 

As for items stuck in port, I guess most will leave port in time but whether they get into shops is another matter

 

As for Christmas, presents are a bit overblown. For the extended family we send presents for birthdays rather than Christmas, simply less pressure on those who can afford the least. As for close family its more the thought that counts these days, rather than money spent. 

[rockershovel]

24 minutes ago, hayfield said:

 

Going back 30+ years was there not requests from ferry companies for motorists not to have full tanks of petrol when using ferries ?

It's a long time since I last went there, but part of the game of going to the IoM for the TT or MGP was that the Steam Racket Company pumped out the tanks on bikes before loading them, no compensation or credit, so you aimed to arrive with the minimum in the tank 

[alastairq]

14 hours ago, Michael Hodgson said:

I imagine they have the common sense to fill the tank just before boarding the ferry

 It's this thing called 'common sense'' that helped create the fuel issue in the first place.

[rockershovel]

9 minutes ago, hayfield said:

 

Andy 

 

I was referring to supermarkets and larger ones at that, the smaller the outlet the less can be carried. In the supermarkets the warehouses are normally empty (you cannot sell anything that is stacked away), now they will be getting full as seasonal long dated items will have been mostly delivered and the warehouses will be quite full, and frozen containers will be in the goods in delivery parking area for extra frozen food space, these will start filling in late November.  Listening to the supermarket bosses they seem quite confident, but there are always shortages of some products at some time

 

As for toys electronics there is always shortages of some items, especially the must have items of each year. My wife always bought the toys for my daughter first. Remember Hestons first Christmas pudding with an orange it !! There are fads every year

 

As for items stuck in port, I guess most will leave port in time but whether they get into shops is another matter

 

As for Christmas, presents are a bit overblown. For the extended family we send presents for birthdays rather than Christmas, simply less pressure on those who can afford the least. As for close family its more the thought that counts these days, rather than money spent. 

I'm quite looking forward to an actual Xmas this year. We have taken the decision to cut down on "stuff" by about 75% and so far, so good. 

[alastairq]

For Christmas, there's always Lidls?

 

What we need is a return to basics.....?

 

But then, if everybody went back to basics, there'd be all that Christmas guff sitting in containers, ready for next year..or the year after?

 

Which wouldn't do the economy any good whatsoever.

 

In fact, I suspect the reality is, what we don't need is for folk to ''go back to basics''...as its the consumer greed which powers a big percentage of our economy....

 

Oh well, head down, load the shotgun [just in case..it's a good covid precaution]...and hope the winter fuel allowance isn't too late in coming?

[rockershovel]

17 minutes ago, alastairq said:

For Christmas, there's always Lidls?

 

What we need is a return to basics.....?

 

But then, if everybody went back to basics, there'd be all that Christmas guff sitting in containers, ready for next year..or the year after?

 

Which wouldn't do the economy any good whatsoever.

 

In fact, I suspect the reality is, what we don't need is for folk to ''go back to basics''...as its the consumer greed which powers a big percentage of our economy....

 

Oh well, head down, load the shotgun [just in case..it's a good covid precaution]...and hope the winter fuel allowance isn't too late in coming?

You appear to have exactly identified the inherent fallacy of trying to run an economy without actually producing anything....

[alastairq]

5 minutes ago, rockershovel said:

You appear to have exactly identified the inherent fallacy of trying to run an economy without actually producing anything....

 PLEASE, don't tell anybody else.......I don't want to have to live up to anything , at my time of life.

[PhilJ W]

9 hours ago, Andy Hayter said:

Some firms are looking at getting rail deliveries from the port to their warehouse.  In some cases that will work but often they still need an HGV driver to bring the containers from the railhead to their warehouse. 

That might be an advantage, depending on the distance between the railhead and the warehouse. The drivers could make two or three runs in a day and then go home to the wife and kids.

[APOLLO]

Looking forward to Christmas.

 

This year we as a family have now agreed (youngest the twins are 21 in February) to go back to the basics of Christmas

 

No presents that might not be needed. Can't afford to throw money away these days. If what anyone wants cant be sourced then they will receive cash. Were all getting sick of the Christmas shopping yearly fiasco.

 

No binging on food or drink, yes just a few bottles of tipple and beer. A few treats if available, if not then "sod it",

 

If traditional Christmas dinner ingredients are unavailable (which I doubt) then we will have a Thai buffet (nicer food also). We will see.

 

As for pigs in blankets, make your own. Wife uses thin sausages wrapped in Prosciutto ham - (but all don't run to Lidl and buy it all up) !!!!!!!!

 

I'm alright (Jack) - I've got my pressy - a two volume book off Ebay - The Railroads and Ferries of New York Harbour - (Everything worked just dandy back then !!)

 

Brit15

 

 

[rockershovel]

5 minutes ago, PhilJ W said:

That might be an advantage, depending on the distance between the railhead and the warehouse. The drivers could make two or three runs in a day and then go home to the wife and kids.

.... assuming their families live in Tilbury, Southampton or Felixstowe....