Hornby 2022 - Diesel/Electric Range

[spamcan61]

On 04/02/2023 at 16:03, vikingsmb said:

hmmm, I've just looked at the Hornby railroad plus class 47, and I could see gears exactly like the lima motor (small geared) i'm wondering (hoping) they are going back to the lima motors that can be serviced, if they are great then I will gladly part my money

Do you mean looking at an actual model, or an image in the catalogue? if the latter then it might well be an old image that's been badly edited, as has happened with other models. I have a vague memory that they couldn't use the original Lima mechanisms due to lack of CE compliance, but wouldn't swear to it.

[Gray69]

14 hours ago, Sir TophamHatt said:

Just double checking I haven't missed any more about the 745 / 755?

 

It is quoted as Winter 2024/2025 on their website, so the project doesn't seem to be going well,

[Great Waterton]

I've recently picked up the ex Lima Railroad 37s that Hornby have released, ("Comet" and "The Northern Lights"), and they both have a newer sealed type motor. Performance is very good indeed and far exceeded my expectations; once properly run in they handled the loads a Lima one could and would probably manage more. We had ours running with a rake of 10 Lima Mk1s (Summer Saturday seaside special) and 22 Lima PTAs (purely as a test) and there were no signs of struggling or slipping or even overheating. The motors themselves are very quiet too and much quieter than my new Bachmann 158s! 

 

That also goes for the ex Lima Railroad 125s as well.

 

I don't know if these motors will be different to the ex Lima 47, but I would assume not?

 

As a side note, we found that after a few hours use there were faint squeaking sounds coming from the loco's. The kind of noise old Hornby motors make when not lubricated or when they've dried out. A quick drop of lubricant in the correct places as per the Hornby instructions solved this issue instantly. 

 

Of course all these ex Lima releases are not perfect by any means compared with the "high end" stuff however they're very robust and solid (there's nothing to fall off which is delightfully simple and refreshing) and a wonderful starting point for detailing, weathering and painting etc. And this is what we like to do. It's incredible the difference it can make. I'd also argue that the colours used are actually more accurate than a lot of Hornby's "premium" releases...

 

I look forward to adding the next releases to the collection. Well done Hornby, credit where it's due. 👍

[Sir TophamHatt]

5 hours ago, Gray69 said:

 

It is quoted as Winter 2024/2025 on their website, so the project doesn't seem to be going well,

 

I found another thread that says Hornby set all their projects to this date until they'd sorted out what was happening with them all.

I'm sure they had an engineering prototype a few months back so would be surprised if it'll be 2024.

[spamcan61]

31 minutes ago, Sir TophamHatt said:

 

I found another thread that says Hornby set all their projects to this date until they'd sorted out what was happening with them all.

 

This seems to be the case for some TT:120 items at least, which were pushed out to winter 2024/25 but have recently been pulled back in a bit to Spring 2024.

[Josiah]

On 18/05/2023 at 15:35, Sir TophamHatt said:

 

I found another thread that says Hornby set all their projects to this date until they'd sorted out what was happening with them all.

I'm sure they had an engineering prototype a few months back so would be surprised if it'll be 2024.

 

I had heard on the grapevine (maybe here somewhere) that there was issues with the articulation part and motors? Might be wrong though. 

[vikingsmb]

On 18/05/2023 at 10:12, Great Waterton said:

I've recently picked up the ex Lima Railroad 37s that Hornby have released, ("Comet" and "The Northern Lights"), and they both have a newer sealed type motor. Performance is very good indeed and far exceeded my expectations; once properly run in they handled the loads a Lima one could and would probably manage more. We had ours running with a rake of 10 Lima Mk1s (Summer Saturday seaside special) and 22 Lima PTAs (purely as a test) and there were no signs of struggling or slipping or even overheating. The motors themselves are very quiet too and much quieter than my new Bachmann 158s! 

 

That also goes for the ex Lima Railroad 125s as well.

 

I don't know if these motors will be different to the ex Lima 47, but I would assume not?

 

As a side note, we found that after a few hours use there were faint squeaking sounds coming from the loco's. The kind of noise old Hornby motors make when not lubricated or when they've dried out. A quick drop of lubricant in the correct places as per the Hornby instructions solved this issue instantly. 

 

Of course all these ex Lima releases are not perfect by any means compared with the "high end" stuff however they're very robust and solid (there's nothing to fall off which is delightfully simple and refreshing) and a wonderful starting point for detailing, weathering and painting etc. And this is what we like to do. It's incredible the difference it can make. I'd also argue that the colours used are actually more accurate than a lot of Hornby's "premium" releases...

 

I look forward to adding the next releases to the collection. Well done Hornby, credit where it's due. 👍

I wont be buying Hornby then, 

[andyman7]

13 minutes ago, vikingsmb said:

I wont be buying Hornby then, 

The new chassis tend to be in fairly high demand from people who want to replace the running gear on their Lima models so if you do want one of the Hornby ones but prefer the Lima mechanism I'm pretty sure you'd be trampled in the rush of Lima owners willing to swap the chassis with you

[Great Waterton]

9 hours ago, vikingsmb said:

I wont be buying Hornby then, 

 

I don't think they'll mind.

[HExpressD]

10 hours ago, vikingsmb said:

I wont be buying Hornby then, 

Odd reply to someone heaping some praise

[scouse889]

17 hours ago, andyman7 said:

The new chassis tend to be in fairly high demand from people who want to replace the running gear on their Lima models so if you do want one of the Hornby ones but prefer the Lima mechanism I'm pretty sure you'd be trampled in the rush of Lima owners willing to swap the chassis with you

 

Indeed, eBay always seems to be awash with Hornby 31/37/43/47 bodyshells on a Lima chassis - I've sold several of mine on like that. FWIW, I'm in the "thank you very much Hornby for upgrading the Lima mechanism" camp. Granted, there is a sealed motor so if that develops a fault it isn't readily user serviceable so the only recourse is to replace it, but I have found them to be very reliable. Infact, I have a couple of the GBRF 47s running around as I type, top-and-tailing a set of LNER Mk3s for scrapping...... it works very well and looks the part. Bring back the Lima 60 and 117 as a Railroad model, please (but upgrade the couplings to NEM)!

[GordonC]

3 hours ago, scouse889 said:

 

Indeed, eBay always seems to be awash with Hornby 31/37/43/47 bodyshells on a Lima chassis - I've sold several of mine on like that. FWIW, I'm in the "thank you very much Hornby for upgrading the Lima mechanism" camp. Granted, there is a sealed motor so if that develops a fault it isn't readily user serviceable so the only recourse is to replace it, but I have found them to be very reliable. Infact, I have a couple of the GBRF 47s running around as I type, top-and-tailing a set of LNER Mk3s for scrapping...... it works very well and looks the part. Bring back the Lima 60 and 117 as a Railroad model, please (but upgrade the couplings to NEM)!

 

Was the Class 117 tooling not butchered to make the bubble cars? I'm not sure they can produce that anymore

[scouse889]

4 minutes ago, GordonC said:

 

Was the Class 117 tooling not butchered to make the bubble cars? I'm not sure they can produce that anymore

Hmm, I’m trying to recall now, I think the 121 was based on the 117 but after the release of the 121, didn’t Lima then simultaneously produce a chocolate and cream 121 and 117 for Kernow or someone as a limited edition? I know Bachmann have done that now but I’m sure I recall the pair of Lima models released in the same way.  Shame if they can’t make the 117 anymore, I bet it would look really smart in either Coca Cola livery or Beatles livery!! 🤣🤣

[andyman7]

57 minutes ago, GordonC said:

 

Was the Class 117 tooling not butchered to make the bubble cars? I'm not sure they can produce that anymore

 

48 minutes ago, scouse889 said:

Hmm, I’m trying to recall now, I think the 121 was based on the 117 but after the release of the 121, didn’t Lima then simultaneously produce a chocolate and cream 121 and 117 for Kernow or someone as a limited edition? I know Bachmann have done that now but I’m sure I recall the pair of Lima models released in the same way.  Shame if they can’t make the 117 anymore, I bet it would look really smart in either Coca Cola livery or Beatles livery!! 🤣🤣

I'm pretty sure the 121 was a brand new tool, although I don't have both in front of me the 121 has quite a lot of subtle differences - larger (corrected) headcode boxes, flush glazing etc.

The two main drawbacks of the 117 were the lack of flush glazing and the lack of a correct DMS vehicle. The inclusion of light fittings on the cab end also mean that the body was only ever correct for vehicles from the mid to late 70s onwards - for example the green version was incorrect with cab front lights.

[vikingsmb]

13 hours ago, HExpressD said:

Odd reply to someone heaping some praise

Fyi, I'm not having a go at the poster, just having a go at Hornby for using sealed motors 

[GordonC]

On 26/05/2023 at 19:35, scouse889 said:

Hmm, I’m trying to recall now, I think the 121 was based on the 117 but after the release of the 121, didn’t Lima then simultaneously produce a chocolate and cream 121 and 117 for Kernow or someone as a limited edition? I know Bachmann have done that now but I’m sure I recall the pair of Lima models released in the same way.  Shame if they can’t make the 117 anymore, I bet it would look really smart in either Coca Cola livery or Beatles livery!! 🤣🤣

 

I can't think of there being a release of the 117 tooling since Lima days, possibly the regional railways or NSE ones being last. With how ex-lima tooling has been reintroduced, if it was available I'd have thought we'd have seen it in a red box by now in at least one livery.

[Great Waterton]

On 26/05/2023 at 16:15, scouse889 said:

 

Indeed, eBay always seems to be awash with Hornby 31/37/43/47 bodyshells on a Lima chassis - I've sold several of mine on like that. FWIW, I'm in the "thank you very much Hornby for upgrading the Lima mechanism" camp. Granted, there is a sealed motor so if that develops a fault it isn't readily user serviceable so the only recourse is to replace it, but I have found them to be very reliable. Infact, I have a couple of the GBRF 47s running around as I type, top-and-tailing a set of LNER Mk3s for scrapping...... it works very well and looks the part. Bring back the Lima 60 and 117 as a Railroad model, please (but upgrade the couplings to NEM)!

 

I'd love to see those models back in Railroad form. 

 

Unfortunately I'm not sure we'll see the 60 though because I doubt Hornby would want to steer sales away from their 'premium' model, especially with the upcoming Cavalex/Accurascale( ? I can't keep up) one too. I'd buy the ex Lima ones in a heartbeat. You know exactly what you're getting with them. 👍

 

The 117 might be an interesting one though, given the cost of Bachmann's top of the range version perhaps there would be place in the market for a cheaper and simpler one. I'd certainly buy more despite having all the Lima ones. 

 

It's nice that the 110 is coming back in a previously unreleased livery too, another one on my shopping list. ☺️

 

Controversial opinion here but the 142 Pacer should also reappear in the Railroad range. In fact, I'm surprised it hasn't (yet) given Hornby's recent track record for releasing similar things to other companies what with Realtrack's 142 on the horizon. Maybe next year.. Provincial Blue and Regional Railways please Hornby. 

 

In fact let's just chuck them all in here: 101, 117, 121/122, 155, 156! 

 

I'll stop short at the Dapol 150/2 as that looked terrible even when it came out. 😂

 

Edited May 28, 2023 by Great Waterton

[spamcan61]

4 minutes ago, Great Waterton said:

 

The 117 might be an interesting one though, given the cost of Bachmann's top of the range version perhaps there would be place in the market for a cheaper and simpler one. I'd certainly buy more despite having all the Lima ones. 

 

 

I'm sure I read somewhere Lima modified the 117 tooling to create their 121, so unlikely to make a comeback. Agree with the thought it would be nice to see a return of more of the ex Lima with the Horby upgrades, particularly the MUs.

[Type 2]

On 26/05/2023 at 21:54, vikingsmb said:

Fyi, I'm not having a go at the poster, just having a go at Hornby for using sealed motors 

Why?  Every manufacturer uses sealed motors now as far as I know

[Halvarras]

5 hours ago, spamcan61 said:

I'm sure I read somewhere Lima modified the 117 tooling to create their 121, so unlikely to make a comeback. Agree with the thought it would be nice to see a return of more of the ex Lima with the Horby upgrades, particularly the MUs.

 

You may well have read it somewhere but it was probably no more than one person's opinion. The Class 121's improved roof headcode box, roof ribs 'inwards' instead of 'outwards' and sharper corners to the window openings to me indicate new tooling. However the 117 powered chassis tooling appears to have been adjusted to fit the single unit at the brake end so presumably no longer entirely suitable for the DMBS of a possible upgraded 117.

 

For many of us the Lima Class 117 was arguably one of their most important ever releases as, with various levels of butchery, it enabled the modelling of all manner of suburban DMUs at minimum cost (in money if not in time!) Yes, a DMS would have made the 117 considerably better and saved much razor saw activity over the years, but until Heljan introduced its Class 128 DPU the Lima 117 and Lima then Hornby 121 were the only OO long-frame DMU models available until Bachmann's versions appeared.

 

IMHO there is too much wrong with the Lima 117 to make a simply remotored reintroduction of the original viable - reworked headcode box shape, a new DMS (and interior) tooled to match the four-decades-old DMBS & TC tooling and flush-glazing all round is a lot to ask for a model of something already made by another manufacturer. Also anyone who has put a Hornby 121 up against Lima 117 vehicles will have noticed that the ride height is different - more tooling changes required to the unpowered vehicles. Looking at the RRP of the soon-to-be-resurrected Class 110 the recovery of such extra tooling costs would negate any hope of bargain pricing. Nope, can't see it myself!

[vikingsmb]

6 hours ago, Type 2 said:

Why?  Every manufacturer uses sealed motors now as far as I know

because its a waste, years ago you had a motor that you could service, now its a throwaway job and buy another motor, not exactly sustainable is it

[Type 2]

1 hour ago, vikingsmb said:

because its a waste, years ago you had a motor that you could service, now its a throwaway job and buy another motor, not exactly sustainable is it

Sealed motors can still be serviced if you so wish, but there are plenty of Lima motor bogies and chassis frames that can be fitted into the new Railroad models, and you can sell on the Hornby equivalents 

[Great Waterton]

6 hours ago, vikingsmb said:

because its a waste, years ago you had a motor that you could service, now its a throwaway job and buy another motor, not exactly sustainable is it

 

I certainly understand where you're coming from. As a very demented and strange individual I enjoy looking after our Lima motors. They're almost pampered! 😂 I can't be the only one that likes the smell either...

 

But on the other hand the updated Hornby motors have never let me down yet (watch them all blow up now...) despite getting a lot of use, and they much quieter, so I guess it's a bit of a catch 22 situation.

[Sir TophamHatt]

On 26/05/2023 at 21:54, vikingsmb said:

Fyi, I'm not having a go at the poster, just having a go at Hornby for using sealed motors 

Do you have a go at car manufacturers for the same thing?

It's the way tech is going - easier to build the unit as a complete unit rather than lots of smaller bits.

Then just replace the whole thing.

[adb968008]

You can buy replacement motors for those sealed units.

 

Places like Lendons sell railroad bogies complete very cheap too anyway.