Dapol Class 323 in OO

[TRAILRAGE]

That is amazing news. Well done Dapol. Lets hope its as good as the real thing but if the 68 is anything to go by its gonna be a real stunner.

 

Cheers Trailrage

 

[NBL]

1 hour ago, letterspider said:

Q2 2025 - rathr brave of Dapol to announce this so early - unless they are offering early bird prices, there will be risks of price rises, delays and ....duplication? Hopefully not. A great announcement and I am saving up for this

Q2 2025 is only 18 months away really, not that long

[Craig1989]

Although not my region as I model a mix of East Midlands and tfw it’s nice to see a new unit being done and hope it sells well 

 

cheers Craig 

[BMacdermott]

Hello everyone

 

Congratulations to Dapol on this EMU announcement - we wish them every success with the project.

 

Within The 00 Wishlist Poll, the class has tended to be Low Polling. However, it went up to Middle Polling in 2019 but slipped back to the top end of Low in 2022 (the next Poll to run). It was only four votes behind the Class 411 recently announced by Bachmann (which was Middle Polling).

 

Brian (on behalf of The 00 Poll Team)

[Ravenser]

I don't model either the West Midlands or the North West, and I've given up modelling things under the wires because I never get the wires up, but....

 

I hope this is a commercial success, even though the area of operations is a little restricted  -compared to say Classes 317, 319, and 321 (other options could be a lot more restricted though). It may well be they have spread their wings a little with the expansion of electrification in the North West

 

At 3 cars it is going to be cheaper and easier to fit on a layout than the 4 car units used in the South East

 

I've a feeling this is Dapol's first multi-vehicle multiple unit in modern times. The 155, 150, and even their Pendolino were a long time ago

 

I really hope this doesn't face duplication . That would spell commercial disaster for both parties. The degree to which new announcements  in OO, even of niche subjects, are being duplicated now is very worrying. 

Edited November 25, 2023 by Ravenser
class number typo

[Covkid]

2 hours ago, Benjamin Brady said:

I have to agree though I really did not see this coming from Dapol. They are skimping on the liveries also

I guess you mean "aren't" ?

AFAIK Dapol have listed every livery they carried apart from a couple of one-off advertising specials in the West Mids. 

 

I wonder if the "mood lighting" fitted to one of them possibly 323204 ? was ever extended to the rest of the prototype fleet.  

[Fair Oak Junction]

4 minutes ago, Covkid said:

I guess you mean "aren't" ?

AFAIK Dapol have listed every livery they carried apart from a couple of one-off advertising specials in the West Mids. 

 

I wonder if the "mood lighting" fitted to one of them possibly 323204 ? was ever extended to the rest of the prototype fleet.  

 

The only regular liveries I can see that they haven't done is Centro without the Regional Railways branding, both with and without half yellow doors.

Other than though it's a fantastic selection of liveries!

Edited November 25, 2023 by Fair Oak Junction

[Ruairidh T]

2 hours ago, Covkid said:

I guess you mean "aren't" ?

AFAIK Dapol have listed every livery they carried apart from a couple of one-off advertising specials in the West Mids. 

 

I wonder if the "mood lighting" fitted to one of them possibly 323204 ? was ever extended to the rest of the prototype fleet.  

 

Northern Rail blue and purple (Serco-Abellio era) is missing, I'd have rather have had that than former FNW! 

Edited November 25, 2023 by Ruairidh T

[No Decorum]

I wonder why Dapol chose these. There have been lots of requests for Electrostars and Dieselstars (Turbostars sounds rather better, doesn’t it?) Perhaps Dapol didn’t want to risk duplication.

 

I’m going to risk mentioning price. It is often suggested that not many MU classes appear because the cost of tooling leads to a final high price. Against that, it has also been suggested that when you compare an MU to a loco hauled train, you are in effect getting a whole train and costs are comparable. Munch on this, though. Here we have a three-car MU for a little less than a Clark Railworks WD 2-10-0.

 

I think this is super. Well done, Dapol!

[wombatofludham]

59 minutes ago, Ravenser said:

I hope this is a commercial success, even though the area of operations is a little restricted  -compared to say Classes 317, 319, and 321 (other options could be a lot more restricted though). It may well be they have spread their wings a little with the expansion of electrification in the North West

 

I'm not sure they are as restricted as might first seem - the Centro units regularly covered Northampton, the West Midlands, Crewe and Liverpool, the GM units worked as far south as Birmingham, as well as all over the then electrified network in Greater Manchester including the Glossop branch.   The 320/321/322 family would be a good one for livery and geographical spread, as would the 319 but perhaps Dapol assume Bachmann are working on upscaling the Farish 319.

I suspect the 323 has been selected as the two outer cars are virtually identical and even the centre pantograph car shares similar bodyside panels, plus they have seen a range of interesting colour schemes and will be around for some time to come,  Given they have worked in three of the most populous parts of the country outside London, including single track branch lines, and make a fantastic noise, perhaps they will be more popular than first thought.  Let's face it the Class 22 diesel hydraulic was probably far more niche than the 323.

That said, I would have put money on a 313-508 "PEP" unit being announced before the 323, but I'm not about to moan about that.

[Legend]

54 minutes ago, No Decorum said:

I wonder why Dapol chose these. There have been lots of requests for Electrostars and Dieselstars (Turbostars sounds rather better, doesn’t it?) Perhaps Dapol didn’t want to risk duplication.

 

I’m going to risk mentioning price. It is often suggested that not many MU classes appear because the cost of tooling leads to a final high price. Against that, it has also been suggested that when you compare an MU to a loco hauled train, you are in effect getting a whole train and costs are comparable. Munch on this, though. Here we have a three-car MU for a little less than a Clark Railworks WD 2-10-0.

 

I think this is super. Well done, Dapol!

yes I think an odd choice of unit , unless you model the West Midlands and Manchester I suppose !  The 3x3 bit is right but I’d have happily gone for a 313 or 303!   Good price though . 

[big jim]

I’m definitely going to go for the retro centro one, I’ve got no OHLE or indeed a Midlands based layout but I do have a spot spot for them as they have always just ‘been there’ in whatever region I’ve worked or lived in 

 

I remember before I started in the railway i be had to do a delivery to somewhere in Leeds and Remember driving down Jack lane to see what was left of the Hunslet factory (my dad had Alice at the time) and I drove past the building where the 323s were being built and one was poking out of the shed, first one I ever saw and quite unexpected 

[TomScrut]

3 minutes ago, Legend said:

yes I think an odd choice of unit , unless you model the West Midlands and Manchester I suppose !  The 3x3 bit is right but I’d have happily gone for a 313 or 303!   Good price though . 

 

In fairness for anyone wanting to model recent/present day Manchester area they are in quite good hands.

 

150 Northern - Bachmann

156 Northern - Realtrack

158 Northern - Bachmann

323 Northern - Dapol

802 TPE - Hornby

68/mk5 TPE - Dapol/Accurascale

390 Avanti - Hornby (2 Liveries)

175 TfW - Revolution

67/mk4 TfW - Hornby

158 TfW - Bachmann

 

Main gaps IMO are TPE 185 (please somebody) and the new CAF units (195 & 331 Northern and 197 TfW)

[Zunnan]

Aaah, the units which ignited my loathing of modern day rail travel. I'll break out the bubbly when they're finally fobbed off up North! There has been plenty of occasion where I've preferred to walk from New Street or Sutton Coldfield back to Chester Road rather than suffer these in the 30 years we've had them (my gangly legs don't fit in the seats so I either have to stand or contort myself awkwardly into a seat, I swear these things were designed to fit hobbits!).

 

I hope with the Centro livery examples, that the green is a tad darker than the heritage unit. For some weird reason the heritage centro unit is close to being dayglow.

 

Great to see a 25kV EMU, even with my loathing of the real things I really do hope this sells well and finally opens the door to more OHLE units after Bachmann stalled following the 350.

[piranha240]

I hope they do the North Western Trains gold star livery eventually with the branding.

[Ravel]

Fantastic news!! Pre-ordered a couple already, hoping the good people at Rainbow Railways work their magic on some as well, all over blue Northern Star livery would be good :D 

[Flying Pig]

3 hours ago, wombatofludham said:

Absolutely fantastic news!  I was working at Centro when these were in development and accompanied a party of management to the mock-up at Tickfords, and along with most of the office evacuated to Aston station on their first day in service to try them out.  As an ex Cross City regular I have always liked these units, so I think Wednesford 1992 will now be Wednesford 1994, especially as the GMPTE units were also regularly seen in the West Midlands on semi fasts from Manchester.

Surprised though it's coming from the Marches and not the Fox County, but who cares - a 323!!!

 

Were the 323s the first AC-motored EMUs in British service or did another class beat them to it?

Edited November 25, 2023 by Flying Pig

[NXEA!]

Did not see this coming, particularly from Dapol but suspect this will be quite popular. 

[wombatofludham]

28 minutes ago, Flying Pig said:

 

Were the 323s the first AC-motored EMUs in British service or did another class beat them to it?

They were the first which is why they were so long getting into service.  BR at the time was worried that the electrics might cause wrong side failures on signalling and so insisted on monitoring software which, if it detected any odd electrical outputs, would cut the power.  Unfortunately in one example frosty weather caused arcing and sparking from the pantographs and generated enough interference to shut the units down.  The software had to be tweaked several times as I understand it.  There were other issues but the nature of the electronic traction package and the potential for signalling interference was the main delay.

The irony is the much older 4-REP units were well known for causing signals to momentarily flicker on approach and the problem persisted when the traction kit was transplanted into the Plastic Pigs yet that was relatively simple, albeit high power, straight DC kit but it never seemed to get the same amount of publicity or attention as the 323s.

[Oldddudders]

Weren't the 465s in service before them?

[cs233]

Hopefully not a working BSI coupler! Should read Tightlock coupler?!

[montyburns56]

I pity whoever is going to create the sound files for this!

[Peter749]

5 hours ago, Legend said:

yes I think an odd choice of unit , unless you model the West Midlands and Manchester I suppose !  

The Northern 323s are based at Allerton depot and work along Chat Moss to Manchester and to Alderley Edge, Crewe, Hadfield, Macclesfield, Manchester Airport and Stoke-on-Trent.

They used to work Liverpool to Warrington Bank Quay until the service finished with Covid and never restarted.

 

People in the industry expect the 323s to start working Liverpool to Wigan, Preston/Blackpool and Manchester Airport/Victoria to Bolton, Preston/Blackpool when more 323s come from the West Midlands.

 

So not just the Manchester area :)

 

 

[unknown]

6 hours ago, wombatofludham said:

I'm not sure they are as restricted as might first seem - the Centro units regularly covered Northampton, the West Midlands, Crewe and Liverpool, the GM units worked as far south as Birmingham, as well as all over the then electrified network in Greater Manchester including the Glossop branch.   The 320/321/322 family would be a good one for livery and geographical spread, as would the 319 but perhaps Dapol assume Bachmann are working on upscaling the Farish 319.

I suspect the 323 has been selected as the two outer cars are virtually identical and even the centre pantograph car shares similar bodyside panels, plus they have seen a range of interesting colour schemes and will be around for some time to come,  Given they have worked in three of the most populous parts of the country outside London, including single track branch lines, and make a fantastic noise, perhaps they will be more popular than first thought.  Let's face it the Class 22 diesel hydraulic was probably far more niche than the 323.

That said, I would have put money on a 313-508 "PEP" unit being announced before the 323, but I'm not about to moan about that.

I'm glad you mentioned Northampton, definitely frequent visitors. Even ventured as far south to Bletchley TMD; obviously not in passenger service! 

[Roadrails]

WYPTE had a handful on a cancelled order for Ilkley- we ended up with Vesuvius, Krakatoa and friends! 

Will get a Northern one, they may yet go to their rightful Leeds home, but tempted to do one in Red and cream too!

Edit and with AC motors sounding like the Enterprise, yet further ££$$£s for sounds

Edited November 25, 2023 by Roadrails