Peterborough North

[rockershovel]

Obviously.

 

Maroon was phased out by 1974 and the mid/late 80s had HSTs in predominantly Executive or Swallow livery.

Having done a quick search, I would describe all three as basically "blue and grey" in varying combinations, bearing in mind that I'm not a "modern image" enthusiast and the diesel locos of the day would have been all blue.

 

The "maroon coaches" probably come from regularly seeing the NVR, which certainly has them, and the NYMR which also has them. That said, a quick look at Google produces several sources stating that the last Mk 1 stock was PAINTED maroon in 1974, which implies that maroon coaches did not disappear overnight in that year. My recollection of the time was that long-distance services were rapidly converted to HST but the Peterborough to KX commuter and stopping trains were flogged into the ground until the electrics finally appeared, years late and amid much controversy

[Market65]

Are the discs not indicating an empty coaching stock working timed at express passenger train speed? I may be wrong....

 

With best regards,

 

Rob.

[manna]

G'day Gents

 

Very few 'Maroon' coaches seen at KX after 1970/71, quite a few 'green' locos about though.

 

manna

[35A]

What a fascinating thread. I've spent ages reading through just a fraction of it tonight.

 

Your layout brings back very happy memories of the station that I spent many, many hours spotting at, as a schoolboy, between 1969 and 1978. It's a very impressive representation of what was (mainly) still there up until the reorganisation of 1972. It brought back memories of the cold, foggy winters of 1970 and 1971 and of huddling up in front of the coal fire that raged in the waiting room between platforms 3 and 6 - until the sound of something approaching drew us out into the cold again to view the passing train.

 

I shall look forward to taking some more time, another day, to catch up with it further!

[rockershovel]

Interesting last post. I first arrived in Peterborough in about 1979 and commuted to London intermittently between approximately 1984 to 1986, and regularly from 1986 to 1992 and I have no recollection of the overall roof, or a coal fire anywhere.

[Clive Mortimore]

Having done a quick search, I would describe all three as basically "blue and grey" in varying combinations, bearing in mind that I'm not a "modern image" enthusiast and the diesel locos of the day would have been all blue.

 

The "maroon coaches" probably come from regularly seeing the NVR, which certainly has them, and the NYMR which also has them. That said, a quick look at Google produces several sources stating that the last Mk 1 stock was PAINTED maroon in 1974, which implies that maroon coaches did not disappear overnight in that year. My recollection of the time was that long-distance services were rapidly converted to HST but the Peterborough to KX commuter and stopping trains were flogged into the ground until the electrics finally appeared, years late and amid much controversy

BR stopped painting hauled stock maroon during 1965 and 1966 as each works converted to the new livery, when all repaints were painted in the corporate identity of BR Blue and Grey. The last maroon stock was withdrawn or repainted by 1974. Derby carriage works managed to keep a set of maroon coaches up to that date but most had gone by 1971-72.

[great northern]

Are the discs not indicating an empty coaching stock working timed at express passenger train speed? I may be wrong....

 

With best regards,

 

Rob.

I hope you are right, Rob, it would let me off the hook, but presumably there would have been a need for signalmen to know the difference between in service and empty stock?

[great northern]

What a fascinating thread. I've spent ages reading through just a fraction of it tonight.

 

Your layout brings back very happy memories of the station that I spent many, many hours spotting at, as a schoolboy, between 1969 and 1978. It's a very impressive representation of what was (mainly) still there up until the reorganisation of 1972. It brought back memories of the cold, foggy winters of 1970 and 1971 and of huddling up in front of the coal fire that raged in the waiting room between platforms 3 and 6 - until the sound of something approaching drew us out into the cold again to view the passing train.

 

I shall look forward to taking some more time, another day, to catch up with it further!

 A warm welcome. It is always particularly pleasing to know that people who actually used the old station are looking at this. It is not obligatory to read all of the thread though!

[great northern]

Lots of oficial golfing duties are taking up my time at the moment, but before I go forth yet again, here is the remainder of Grafarman's request. It was difficult though to get the A4, the EE type 4 and the stock of both trains in one shot, so this was the best I could do.

and here is the back end of D209's train, with Andrew K just coming into view.

[BrushVeteran]

 

 

The Heljan 02 has proved to be a problem. I've already detailed the difficulty I had when it first arrived, and that Grahame Wareham on behalf of Heljan dealt with that extremely quickly and well. Unfortunately though I can't get the loco to run with a decoder fitted for any length of time. With the original Lenz silver it would run a few feet, then stop, so I took it to Jeremy at Digitrains, who says he has had previous problems of that nature with Heljan locos. On his advice we fitted a basic ESU decoder which he had found to be the best option. I brought it back, and ran the loco in properly for an hour, no problem, but a couple of days later when I called it up, nothing, and when put on the programming track I got the dreaded "cannot read CV" Tim says he can sort it by replacing the Heljan wiring, so it is waiting for that. I know one should not have to do this, but I want a working loco.

I'll come and pay you a visit next month. I will bring the circuit board and chip out of the demo loco that we used on your layout when we took photos last year. That worked OK and has performed on many layouts with none of the problems you are currently encountering. I'm determined to get to the root of the problem because I haven't been able to replicate it anywhere else..............................but I am using a Bachmann decoder.

[Fat Controller]

I hope you are right, Rob, it would let me off the hook, but presumably there would have been a need for signalmen to know the difference between in service and empty stock?

I believe that, these days, there are different headcodes for empty stock that's booked to form a particular working, and that which is simply a transfer, to enable the bobby to prioritise the former; did such a difference exist in earlier times? 

[Richard E]

As far as the history of the real PN goes the track layout and platforms were remodelled in 1972 when the station was reduced to 4 platforms and the through speeds were lifted following a realignment of the main lines to permit high speed running. This involved the demolition of platforms 3 to 6 and their buildings (the original location of platform 6 would lie under the main up and down lines now) and the provision of a new island platform 4 and 5 to the west on the alignment of the old Midland lines.

 

The main station buildings survived a little longer but were demolished in 1976 as life expired and replaced with a couple of portacabins whilst the current buiding was erected by a local builder, Bernard Stokeley Ltd, who were based in Eastfield I believe. They opened in 1978 so anyone in the city prior to 1976 should remember the old, and I suspect, by 1976, very decrepit buildings the splendour of which, in better days, are depicted by Gilbert.

 

Electrification between Kings Cross and Hitchin took place between 1976 and 1978 with Hitchin to Edinburgh following. The electrification work reached Peterborough in 1987 and York in 1989.

 

As a further aside Peterborough East closed in 1966 having seen much reduced services from early 1964.

 

As a final aside I arrived in Peterborough in 1994 but knowing a Peterborian who still lives in the house she was born in has, on occasion, advantages. Her late brother, sadly killed in a road accident, was the real rail enthusiast being a founder member of the Nene Valley Railway and a volunteer when 73050 was based at British Sugar on Oundle Road.

Edited May 29, 2016 by Richard E

[great northern]

A last look at the stock behind the A4 for Grafarman.

[Grafarman]

Lots of oficial golfing duties are taking up my time at the moment, but before I go forth yet again, here is the remainder of Grafarman's request. It was difficult though to get the A4, the EE type 4 and the stock of both trains in one shot, so this was the best I could do.

D209 and A4.jpg

and here is the back end of D209's train, with Andrew K just coming into view.

end of ECS.jpg

 

Awesome; sheer quality....

 

Many thanks for all the pictures; that's a few more for my desktop/screensaver collection (with your permission, of course)

 

 

David

Edited May 29, 2016 by Grafarman

[great northern]

Awesome; sheer quality....

 

Many thanks for all the pictures; that's a few more for my desktop/screensaver collection (with your permission, of course)

 

 

David

Feel free David.

[great northern]

And so to another antipodean request. Jukebox(Scott), asked if this could be given a run.

And so Grantham shed borrowed her from Boston and put her at the head of the late evening Grantham - Peterborough stopper.

 

[trw1089]

Hi Gilbert

 

The train that Andrew K was hauling, were the coaches mixed in as part of the passenger accomodation for railway staff only?  I noticed in reading through some of the Carraige Workings books that some (most?) parcels had passenger accomodation attached though only a few mention for railway staff only.  I'm keen to represent a few of these in the "oop norf" area as I start to build my sequence, though I am going to need a heap more BGs!  I do love parcel trains though, sort of the ghost train that we all knew must have run at night, but rare to find many photos of.

 

Cheers

Tony

[jukebox]

And so to another antipodean request. Jukebox(Scott), asked if this could be given a run.

 

 

And so Grantham shed borrowed her from Boston and put her at the head of the late evening Grantham - Peterborough stopper.

 

 

And seeing these at 5am my time, it's a very nice way to start the working week, too!

 

Thank you, Gilbert. Such wonderful proportions on those locos...

 

I've three of the beasties in the pile to (one day) build for Stockrington.

Edited May 30, 2016 by jukebox

[great northern]

Hi Gilbert

 

The train that Andrew K was hauling, were the coaches mixed in as part of the passenger accomodation for railway staff only?  I noticed in reading through some of the Carraige Workings books that some (most?) parcels had passenger accomodation attached though only a few mention for railway staff only.  I'm keen to represent a few of these in the "oop norf" area as I start to build my sequence, though I am going to need a heap more BGs!  I do love parcel trains though, sort of the ghost train that we all knew must have run at night, but rare to find many photos of.

 

Cheers

Tony

I just put together an "eclectic mix" of stock as requested, Tony, as there wasn't an appropriate train due on the sequence. There will be others who can say far more than I can on the subject, but I believe that compartments reserved for railway staff had a notice saying so. My WTTs seem to differentiate between pure parcels workings and services which provided some passenger accomodation. Those appear to have run mainly overnight, and the small amount of passenger stock would presumably just have been there to avoid having to run a separate and probably very sparsely occupied Class B service. That Colchester - Glasgow is the obvious example in my sequence, but the early morning Parliamentaries seem to have worked in the same way, as will be seen shortly when I take some more photos.

[great northern]

And so we now reach the final regular service train in my sequence, the 7.20pm from KX, which drags its weary way to terminate at PN nearly three hours later. It is hard to envisage any passenger enduring the whole journey, so this must have been intended merely to get people from one rural village to another.

It would have been a very suitable duty for a run down V2 working up mileage before shopping, 60853 being one of only twenty or so still in black livery by this time.

I've done a stock shot in view of the recent discussion with Tony, this one being still mainly a passenger service, formed BG BCK TSO TSO BCK.

and even left it unshopped and uncropped, thus giving a rare sighting of the bootiful bookcases, and a nice single slip.

[great northern]

One more shot of 60853, an attempt at a slightly different angle,a bit difficult to do now with those broken columns to negotiate. I need an even smaller camera.

[great northern]

A very nice relaxing day has seen everything put in place for the new day, and number 15 on the sequence reached. If this carries on, it will only be another 25 sessions before the end is reached again.

 

Anyway, we had an almost empty station at 7.10am, so I took a couple of landscape shots while the buildings were unobscured.

It seems to be a nice sunny morning for a change, but on close examination I find a train disappearing under Crescent Bridge. I have no idea what it is, or was.

Platform 6 is deserted, but will not remain so for long.

[great northern]

One more for today, as the N5 pilot brings in the stock for the 7.35am Parliamentary to Doncaster.

[jrg1]

Just to regress slightly, I was travelling through KX during mid-1974 and saw Mark 2 coaches painted maroon-it stuck in my memory, as they looked so much better than in blue

[trw1089]

A belated thanks for the eclectic stock answer Gilbert, makes much more sense now!

 

I'm thinking that when the new V2s are released, because they are only doing a late crest with double chimney and outside pipes, I might be an LNER liveried one and paint it in goods loco black if there were any in such livery, or were they all lined black until a few got greened up so to speak? 

 

I just wish they would hurry up and release them, my locoholism is making my wallet nervous again...