Peterborough North

[chrisf]

From Bradshaw for September - November 1957:

 

Peterborough North 7.25 am, Yaxley & Farcet 7.31 - 7.34 am, Holme 7.43 am, Abbots Ripton 7.54 am, Huntingdon North 8.4 am, Offord and Buckden 8.10 am, St Neots 8.19 am, Sandy 8.33 am, Biggleswade 8.41 am, Arlesey and Henlow 8.49 am, Three Counties 8.53 am, Hitchin arr 9.0 am.  An arrival time of 10.4 am at Kings Cross is shown but this was achieved by changing at Hitchin to a train from Cambridge.  A train left Hitchin at 9.28 am and arrived at Kings Cross at 10.34 am having called at Stevenage, Knebworth, Welwyn North, Welwyn Garden City, Hatfield, Potters Bar and Finsbury Park.  I'm guessing that it was formed by the stock of the 7.25 am Peterborough.

 

I moved to Huntingdon in 1962 and attended Huntingdon Grammar School from then until 1966.  The school adjoined the ECML so I was able to observe the passing scene without comprehending much of it!

 

Chris 

[Peter Kazmierczak]

Moving forward 16 years from the Summer 1962 up morning trains to KX I mentioned earlier, the picture for 1978 shows there were more options, though nothing arrived before quarter past eight with a civilised departure from P'boro:

 

Through trains arriving at KX between 07.00 and 10.00 -

 

P'boro d. 06.38 (starts at P'boro)

KX       a. 08.13

 

P'boro d. 07.08 (starts at P'boro)

KX       a. 08.28

 

P'boro d. 07.30 (starts at P'boro)

KX       a. 08.45

 

P'boro d. 07.54 (05.45 ex-Leeds)

KX       a. 09.07

 

P'boro d. 07.58 (starts at P'boro)

KX       a. 09.25

 

P'boro d. 08.36 (08.10 ex Grantham)

KX       a. 09.47

[rockershovel]

Moving forward 16 years from the Summer 1962 up morning trains to KX I mentioned earlier, the picture for 1978 shows there were more options, though nothing arrived before quarter past eight with a civilised departure from P'boro:

 

Through trains arriving at KX between 07.00 and 10.00 -

 

P'boro d. 06.38 (starts at P'boro)

KX a. 08.13

 

P'boro d. 07.08 (starts at P'boro)

KX a. 08.28

 

P'boro d. 07.30 (starts at P'boro)

KX a. 08.45

 

P'boro d. 07.54 (05.45 ex-Leeds)

KX a. 09.07

 

P'boro d. 07.58 (starts at P'boro)

KX a. 09.25

 

P'boro d. 08.36 (08.10 ex Grantham)

KX a. 09.47

There's nothing "civilised" about long-distance commuting. From experience of commuting on ECML from early 80s to early 90s, the 0536 stopping train from Peterborough would be busy, then the fast services at 0600 and 0640 (which were my usual services) busy, but you would still probably get a seat. After 0640, by mid-80s you would be lucky to get a seat and the 0700, little chance of a seat (no seat reservations in those days). 0730 onwards, lucky to get on at all.

 

It was a thoroughly miserable experience,and the decrepit loco-hauled coaching stock of the early 80s, often with carriage lighting not working, broken seat cushions in many compartments and sometimes no heating, absolutely horrible. I remember a huge sheepskin Scandinavian parka which was my faithful companion on these bleak wanderings... Add in the early walk across the unsurfaced, unlit car park, with its freezing puddles and miscellaneous protruding rails, and you had an utterly depressing start to the day. The VERY crowded electric trains first introduced, with their cramped high-density seating and virtually no luggage accommodation, stopping everywhere, were just bloody awful.

 

I went back on the rigs and pipelines at the first opportunity and was glad to get away from it.

 

But it was do-able. You met people on the trains with jobs in department stores, or working as motorcycle couriers, or a whole range of jobs you wouldn't think viable. I reckon that commuting cost me about half what it now costs, in terms of proportion of earnings.

 

Peterborough expanded greatly at a time when its local employers were in rapid decline, and never solved the puzzle of how to employ its new population. That's the trouble with New Towns; no underlying reason for their existence. The big offices opened by Pearl and Barclays foundered partly because they thought they could get local staff at "local" (ie, very low) wages and that didn't happen, because so many people had bought properties at "London commuter" prices and couldn't afford the wages on offer. In the end they were all outsourced to the Far East anyway.

 

My wife's sister looked at moving to Peterborough as part of an acrimonious divorce in the early 80s and was offered the choice of several PDC properties, there were whole streets empty - the policy of filling them with unwanted, unemployed and unemployable tenants from the Outer London area, rejected by older New Towns, was a "counsel of desperation" as the PDC sought to wind itself up to a predetermined schedule. She didn't come, because the then-current "Right to Buy" meant she got her council house in Cambridge for around 1/3 of its value - another kick in the teeth for the PDC!

Edited June 7, 2016 by rockershovel

[great northern]

From Bradshaw for September - November 1957:

 

Peterborough North 7.25 am, Yaxley & Farcet 7.31 - 7.34 am, Holme 7.43 am, Abbots Ripton 7.54 am, Huntingdon North 8.4 am, Offord and Buckden 8.10 am, St Neots 8.19 am, Sandy 8.33 am, Biggleswade 8.41 am, Arlesey and Henlow 8.49 am, Three Counties 8.53 am, Hitchin arr 9.0 am.  An arrival time of 10.4 am at Kings Cross is shown but this was achieved by changing at Hitchin to a train from Cambridge.  A train left Hitchin at 9.28 am and arrived at Kings Cross at 10.34 am having called at Stevenage, Knebworth, Welwyn North, Welwyn Garden City, Hatfield, Potters Bar and Finsbury Park.  I'm guessing that it was formed by the stock of the 7.25 am Peterborough.

 

I moved to Huntingdon in 1962 and attended Huntingdon Grammar School from then until 1966.  The school adjoined the ECML so I was able to observe the passing scene without comprehending much of it!

 

Chris 

The 1958 Summer WTT shows it as a through train, albeit with that 28 minute wait at Hitchin.

[great northern]

Hi,

I've been following this thread in the background for ages, and I have to say, the quality of your modelling and the layout, not to mention the realism in the photographs is totally superb!   As somebody born in the late 1970s, I started travelling extensively once I got to college, around 1996, so have always been use to 1 hour Peterborough- London journey's on the Intercity service. But can anyone enlighten me as to how this 07.25 local took over three hours!  I can imagine WDs on long coal trains passing it!  I'm assuming it must have run via March and Cambridge to take that length of time?  Even every stop 'up' the ECML from Peterborough to London surely couldn't have added more than an hour to the journey at most?

 

Love the layout tho - superb.

 

Rich

Thanks for those kind comments Rich. Those Peterborough - London stopping trains really were that slow, and they were routed along the ECML all the way. The next one was the 1033, which didn't get to KX until 1320.  There were 17 station stops on the way, a trip along the Slow and Goods lines between Arlesey and Cadwell, where the WTT shows " stops or shunts for other trains to pass". Then it was slow line as far as Knebworth, where again the WTT shows a stop or shunt.  These were purely local services, which I suppose it was convenient to run through to London, or Peterborough going Down. I can't see anyone in their right mind doing the whole journey, unless it was a railway enthusiast. The WDs on coal trains took even longer, four to five hours in the WTT, and in practice they sometimes didn't get to their destination within an eight hour working shift. A lot of time was spent in refuges watching expresses go by. The whole railway was very much slower back then. For example the 1000 Leeds -KX, which was pretty much a crack train, took three and three quarter hours.

[great northern]

I'm sure you are wondering what came next after that WD. Here is the answer.

Another one. You just get to see what the WTT dictates. Anyway, perhaps we have had our fill of Austerities for now. No sooner has that one wheezed its way under Crescent Bridge and on to the Up slow, signals come off again, and a light engine scurries by to do some shunting in South Yard.

And that's the lot for today folks.

[Richard E]

Peterborough expanded greatly at a time when its local employers were in rapid decline, and never solved the puzzle of how to employ its new population. That's the trouble with New Towns; no underlying reason for their existence. The big offices opened by Pearl and Barclays foundered partly because they thought they could get local staff at "local" (ie, very low) wages and that didn't happen, because so many people had bought properties at "London commuter" prices and couldn't afford the wages on offer. In the end they were all outsourced to the Far East anyway.

Barclays thought they could attract London quality staff at Peterborough plus 10% salaries - not a hope. They recruited one or two good staff in the end - from Glasgow! They also turned a quality bespoke service with many very good staff into no more than a call centre. The call centre went to Glasgow in the end and the back office went to Chennai and Brentwood. My ex was, apparently, offered part time work in Chennai despite living in Peterborough.

 

They stated they moved to Peterborough because of low office rents (they could have had better offices cheaper in Nottingham) and the quality of life Peterborough offered their staff. The staff never had quality of life (12 to 14 hour working days were normal) and The Orton Centre was instantly christened Beirut by some senior staff.

 

Apologies for the hijack but it gives some insight into the growth of the area and, to some extent, why the heritage of the city has mostly been swept away and replaced with 70's and 80's concrete and steel.

Edited June 8, 2016 by Richard E

[rockershovel]

Barclays thought they could attract London quality staff at Peterborough plus 10% salaries - not a hope. They recruited one or two good staff in the end - from Glasgow! They also turned a quality bespoke service with many very good staff into no more than a call centre. The call centre went to Glasgow in the end and the back office went to Chennai and Brentwood. My ex was, apparently, offered part time work in Chennai despite living in Peterborough.

 

They stated they moved to Peterborough because of low office rents (they could have had better offices cheaper in Nottingham) and the quality of life Peterborough offered their staff. The staff never had quality of life (12 to 14 hour working days were normal) and The Orton Centre was instantly christened Beirut by some senior staff.

 

Apologies for the hijack but it gives some insight into the growth of the area and, to some extent, why the heritage of the city has mostly been swept away and replaced with 70's and 80's concrete and steel.

The Orton Centre was known as Beirut long before Barclays arrived! We used to shop there in the late 70s and early 80s (it was one of Peterborough's first supermarkets) but I haven't set foot there for years, and don't see any reason to do so now.

[great northern]

This morning's featured train is the 0550 KX - Grantham. Two and a half hours to get this far, a ten minute rest, and then another 55 minutes to get to Grantham, even calling at Great Ponton, where almost nothing stopped. Diagrammed for a Doncaster engine, and the HMRS Journal survey shows haulage by A3s and V2s during the period it was observed.

Today 60149 Amadis is in charge.

Seen again during its 10 minute rest, hardly needed for a Class 8 engine and a formation of BSK CK SK BG.

Seen from on high, a PMV has been added at the rear today.

 

During the week of the survey, the load varied from the basic four vehicles to as many as 11 on Thursday 11th July, when it included two buffet cars destined for Cleethorpes, presumably locked and travelling ECS. Cattle wagons and horse boxes also featured for all or part of the journey, so it seems just about anything was hooked on as needed.

[great northern]

Pictures of Lily.

 

Lily oh Lily.

I hope they make you feel all right.

 

Apologies to non Who fans, who may be scratching their heads, and wondering if I have finally lost it completely. This view caught my eye this morning, the lyric came into my head, and I couldn't resist it.

[gwrrob]

Your Hostas nice too Gilbert.

[great northern]

Your Hostas nice too Gilbert.

I don't know any songs about Hostas though.

[great northern]

Enough of the horticultural stuff. Time for a train, more coal empties, but behind a 9F for a change.

Creeping along the slow now.

And then I thought I would crop the first one even more.

[jukebox]

I don't know any songs about Hostas though.

 

No, but with a little creativity, you could slip 5:15 into the photo captions somewhere...

[St Enodoc]

Pictures of Lily.

lily 1.jpg

 

Lily oh Lily.

lily 2.jpg

I hope they make you feel all right.

 

Apologies to non Who fans, who may be scratching their heads, and wondering if I have finally lost it completely. This view caught my eye this morning, the lyric came into my head, and I couldn't resist it.

"I say, I say, I say - my dustbin's full of lilies."

[rockershovel]

I do like the cladding on the bridge. Crescent Bridge has always had a slightly scruffy, neglected appearance - I don't really regard its present livery, apparently painted sky blue using a yard broom, as much of an improvement - and this really comes through on the model

[Mallard60022]

I can see for miles and miles and miles and miles......

 

Don't know who took this picture with a duck in water tower tank but I think he had a drone.

P

[great northern]

Short of time this morning, so here are a couple of hastily prepared images. It shows, I'm afraid.

The 9F still creeping up the slow line.

and now held at signals to allow the A1 to leave with the Grantham stopper. The light really does do some strange things to those signals.

[great northern]

I've spent a bit more time shopping some more stuff, so here is one more to be going on with.

B17 pulling in to Platform 6 with the 8.06 from March. Are these against the light shots working a bit better now?

[Fat Controller]

I don't know any songs about Hostas though.

Hosta song at twilight?

[great northern]

It is fortunate that March shed didn't have any B1s in 1958, so it is B17s or D16s on these GE section locals. What a choice to have to make. The shuffle of rosters that takes place at the end of each sequence allocated this duty to 61635. I do wish I hadn't superglued quite a few Class A lamps in place though, as it does restrict the possibilities, and I don't like knowing that a certain loco will always be on a specific train. Easily bored, you see. More shots of Milton follow.

I zoomed in on this in order to photoshop the small bridge sections, and a nice effect caught my eye, so here is a very close encounter with a B17.

Says something for the standard of modern RTR doesn't it, when it can stand up to this kind of close inspection?

[trw1089]

B17 up close, just beautiful!

[Market65]

One of the best models Hornby has produced, and I have four of them at the last count! How good Milton looks as it makes it's way into Peterborough North.

 

With warmest regards,

 

Rob.

[great northern]

No, but with a little creativity, you could slip 5:15 into the photo captions somewhere...

Out of my brain on the train?

[Fenman]

It is fortunate that March shed didn't have any B1s in 1958, so it is B17s or D16s on these GE section locals. What a choice to have to make. ...

 

You have no idea how strongly I agree with you! Beautiful portrait of a B17, too.

 

Were any B12s still making it to PN by 1958...?

 

Paul