Dock Green

[chaz]

Hi Chaz,

 

Thank you for posting this build in a step by step fashion.  It's always really helpful to see the way others tackle these kits, watching the techniques used to make the build successful.

 

I shall keep a closer eye on your thread now.

 

Cheers

Lee

 

Thanks Lee. I will post details of each step as I continue. It may appear to be a rather slow build but I am doing three, and it's more efficient to do the same step to all three - although my timings are for one kit. So the nineteen minutes spent on four W irons was actually about an hour on twelve.

 

There's a little more fettling to do and then I will assemble the vans. The white-metal parts are pretty good with little flash to remove, and I don't anticipate any other preparation tasks will take as long as the buffers.

 

Chaz

[Strathwood]

For a while I have been meaning to add some poster-boards to Dock Green. There wouldn't be any facing into the yard as there would be no public access but the road bridges might well have them. Trackside Signs had a stand at the St Albans show - as soon as I saw their poster for "The Ladykillers" I couldn't resist it - so right for Dock Green, the film action taking place in the area in which my layout is supposedly situated. I was also much taken with the "Guiness is good for you" - money changed hands.

 

 

The posters add a splash of bright, cheerful colours to the sooty grime of the scene.

 

 

Nothing shouts London better than an RT bus and the posters are the perfect backdrop.

 

 

For the show the boards were temporarily attached to the bridge with Blutack (crude but effective) so they are not all perfectly upright. In due course I will make some braced timber supports and fix them properly. I think the fixings must allow them to be removed to be transported (probably drop-in sockets).

 

 

The black background results from the room's matte black walls and low-level lighting. It gave the layout lighting the chance to work really well but it does have an odd effect on the snaps. I will Photoshop a grey sky in on one or two of them when I have time.

 

If you are interested in the posters have a look at www.tracksidesigns.co.uk

 

Chaz

Do like the very nice RT Chaz, who makes it please? Oh and please no comments from all of you others such as AEC! Also is there a similar model of an AEC RF available in 7mm in red or green as a finished model or as a kit from anywhere please?

 

Thanks,

 

Kevin

[daifly]

I bought my bus via eBay from a German supplier for €50 including delivery. See here for one currently on sale from a French source.

 

Dave

[chaz]

Do like the very nice RT Chaz, who makes it please? Oh and please no comments from all of you others such as AEC! Also is there a similar model of an AEC RF available in 7mm in red or green as a finished model or as a kit from anywhere please?

 

Thanks,

 

Kevin

 

I'm sorry Kevin, I'm ashamed to say I don't know the make. I do know that the maker (probably in reality China) is a continental concern - I got mine from the Radley stand but it looks like you can save a considerable amount of money by buying direct from Germany via Ebay. I don't think there are any other buses to 1:43.5 as RTR - whether there are any kits I don't know, but I suspect not. That's why I was so pleased to find the RT.

 

Chaz

[Osgood]

It is made by IXO (part of a 'classic coaches and buses of the world' series with Hachette), but best to search EB and others with just '1/43 RT bus'.  Expect to pay anything from £35 del. upwards.

 

The other British example from the series is a nice 1950 AEC Regal 3 coach - from £30 del. :

 

Edited January 20, 2016 by Osgood

[chaz]

The JLTRT van kits have spring stops moulded to the underside of the solebars. These are very neatly done but they are blind. They can be opened out with a little care.

 

 

I used a 0.8mm drill in a pin-chuck to drill two holes through the unwanted fill.

 

 

It is possible to drill two holes providing the drill bit is held firmly against each end of the slot. I didn't use a Dremel for this job; I consider that a pin-chuck allows more "feel" and hence a greater precision. The piece of resin that remains between the two holes can be removed with a scalpel blade.

 

 

I only cut upwards towards the solebar as I'm not sure how strong the bottom of the stop is once the hole is opened out. You can also use the drill bit to clean up the hole - moving it sideways whilst twirling it round will have a cutting action like a milling cutter -  unorthodox but effective. You do need to have a light touch, only gentle sideways pressure, a 0.8mm drill is easy to break. It took me 8 minutes to do all four stops. It can be argued that once the van is on the track the improvement can scarcely been seen, as always it's up to you.

 

Now what about the horse hook visible in that last picture at the LH end of the solebar? Try to open out the hole? Or file it off and replace it with a wire hook? Or leave it alone? I haven't decided yet 

 

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The next job I did was to separate the remaining lost-wax brass castings and clean them up.

 

 

It's easy enough to cut them from the sprues but filing them is tricky - they are tiny and difficult to hold. I am reluctant to put them im a toolmaker's clamp which is likely to damage the part if tightened enough to grip properly. I use a #4 cut (smooth) flat needle file - it's less likely to snag than the more common #2 cut. The four door catches need to be reasonably smooth on the back as they will be glued to the side of a metal stanchion. One way to do this is to put them flat on a smooth cut file and propel them back and forth with a finger.

 

The lamp brackets need careful handling. They  are attached to the sprue on the flat front which you must file flat and smooth if they are to look right. however you hold it there is a risk that you will bend the bracket out of shape when you file it. If this happens don't straighten it until you have finished filing. Cast brass is hard and will work harden even more if it is bent and bent back. Doing this twice might well snap the part as it hardens beyond the point where it remains malleable.

 

The work on the castings took 16 minutes, most of which was spent filing.

 

Chaz

[chaz]

I use a jeweller's clamp. It is made of beech or similar and has a leather lining to the jaws. It has a wedge for the other end to apply pressure. There was a photo of one in MRJ about a year ago. I commented on it then and was advised that Shesto sell them. Either look back at your MRJs or the MRJ topics on here. It is ideal for holding delicate castings.

 

Thanks for that Paul. Would a jeweller's clamp hold anything as small as the door catches? if you think it would I will buy one.

 

Chaz

[chaz]

Interesting question Chaz. I've not done a lot a modelling since I bought it...... :-( It was only about £8 though. If I recall the article in MRJ showed it be used on small lost wax brass castings. I have used it to hold small brass etchings for cleaning off the tabs and it certainly made it easier to hold them. It is double ended: one end is about 20mm wide and flat, other is semicircular. The wedge fits either end. So I think the answer to your question is (probably) yes. I'll look in my box of spare castings and find a small casting, put it in the clamp, photo it and report back in the next day or so.

 

That would be extremely helpful. I stopped taking MRJ some time ago so I can't just look it up but a quick Google ought to throw up some information or a look at the Shesto website... For only £8 it's got to be worth a punt.

 

Chaz

 

edit - is this the one?

Soft Grip Wedge-type Work Holder Edited January 21, 2016 by chaz

[Barnaby]

Here you go Chaz http://www.ebay.co.uk/bhp/jewellery-clamp

I've got one like the one with all the holes in it, but some of the wooden ones look easier to use.

[chaz]

I had a session fettling the remaining white-metal castings. These are generally pretty clean with most of the flash easily removed either with a scalpel, a needle file or even, in some cases, running a finger nail along the edge.

 

These parts needed the holes drilling 1mm for the brake cross shaft to clear any flash and to take the hole right through. I prefer the shaft to go right through all the parts - it makes for stronger joins.

 

 

The brake castings come with what look like fixing pegs, which are actually casting runners from the mould and must be cut off. The brake safety loops should fit into slots in the underframe.

 

 

I found them a bit too thick to slide in. it's obviously much easier to thin the loops than to enlarge the slots. I slip the loop onto a piece of card packing with two marks showing how long a section needs to be filed. Filing the part is safe while it is held firmly on the packing.

 

 

I use a needle file from an old set - not my Grobet Vallorbe Swiss files. White-metal does pick up on files and clog the teeth and although it can be removed I would rather not let it get anywhere near my best files. Cleaning up a set of castings for one van, getting them ready for assembly took me 40 minutes.

 

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

There may be a bit more preparation of parts to do, which will become evident during assembly but here are the timings so far...

 

• fettling the parts for the buffers - 50 minutes
• assembling buffers - 10 minutes
• getting the axleboxes to slide on the W irons - 19 minutes
• modifying the spring stops (optional) - 8 minutes
• preparing lost-wax brass details - 16 minutes
•  fettling the white-metal parts - 40 minutes

total time I have spent* on preparing parts (so far) - 2 hours 23 minutes    Hmmmmm........

 

Now, it will be interesting to see how long the assembly takes.

 

*I'm not the fastest worker but I would be interested to know how long others might take to do this stuff.

 

Chaz

[chaz]

Dock Green's next outing will be to the show held on Saturday 6 and Sunday 7 February at Eggars School in Alton.

 

Have a look at...

 

http://www.altonmrg.co.uk/category/febex/

 

Chaz

[keefr2]

Aaaaargggghhhh! I don't believe it (typed in my best Victor Meldrew voice!) Daughter & family live in Four Marks. Where will they be that weekend? Visiting the wrinklies at home in Swansea!!! Aaaaargggghhhh! 

 

Keith

[chaz]

Aaaaargggghhhh! I don't believe it (typed in my best Victor Meldrew voice!) Daughter & family live in Four Marks. Where will they be that weekend? Visiting the wrinklies at home in Swansea!!! Aaaaargggghhhh! 

 

Keith

 

How do you manage it? Such bad timing. I suppose eventually a date  and venue will hit the spot for you...

[chaz]

Hang on, it might be a light bulb moment...

 

Lacking a jeweller's clamp and eager to get on with cleaning up those tiny lost-wax cast details.  I looked around for something that would serve, maybe this?

 

 

It has wooden "jaws" so won't mark the brass.

 

Here are a couple of the door catches, one filed up and the other still with a bit of sprue attached.

 

 

Placing the part into the clothes peg was actually the trickiest bit. Once I had it in it was surprising just how tight a grip one can apply.

 

 

A #2 flat needle file did the job, but a tight grip is essential - any relaxation invites the part to ping out and across the room where the carpet monster awaits.

 

 

Here are the four door catches cleaned up.

 

 

That's a 12BA nut just to show the size of these small parts.

 

These are the lamp brackets - a before and after shot...

 

 

...and this is how I hold them to file that front face.

 

 

I'm not going to claim that the clothes peg is as good as a jeweller's clamp - that wouldn't be fair as I haven't tried one - but it certainly works (and I had one in the cupboard) .

 

Chaz

Edited January 23, 2016 by chaz

[daifly]

It is made by IXO (part of a 'classic coaches and buses of the world' series with Hachette), but best to search EB and others with just '1/43 RT bus'.  Expect to pay anything from £35 del. upwards.

 

The other British example from the series is a nice 1950 AEC Regal 3 coach - from £30 del. :

 

IXO AEC Regal.jpg

Thanks for the tip! Ordered one of these from Germany on Wednesday evening. Delivered this morning. Looks bigger and better 'in the flesh'!

Cheers

Dave

[chaz]

Having retained the casting in the clothes peg, you could then mount it in you vice. No need to apply pressure with you hand and less risk of a 'ping' moment.

 

 

That would certainly work and I have fastened a toolmaker's clamp in a vice to do some work. I did consider it but I like being able to "feel" the amount of grip and the facility of being able to easily turn the work to a different angle. I didn't suffer a "ping moment" doing the 12 small castings for two vans - not that difficult providing you take care.

[Robin Gristwood]

I really enjoyed seeing Dock Green at St. Albans, its even more impressive in the "flesh". Unfortunately I didn't get to talk to you about the layout as both times you had gone for a break, but your knowledgeable operating team were able to answer my questions.

 

I was pleased to see how well Dinghams couplings work on your layout as I am planning on using them for mine as well.

 

I did take a few photos of the layout whilst I was there.

 

 

 

 

One thing I forgot to ask about though was what is the height of the layout, as I am currently trying to work out an optimum height for mine.

[chaz]

I really enjoyed seeing Dock Green at St. Albans, its even more impressive in the "flesh". Unfortunately I didn't get to talk to you about the layout as both times you had gone for a break, but your knowledgeable operating team were able to answer my questions.

 

I was pleased to see how well Dinghams couplings work on your layout as I am planning on using them for mine as well.

 

I did take a few photos of the layout whilst I was there.

 

One thing I forgot to ask about though was what is the height of the layout, as I am currently trying to work out an optimum height for mine.

 

Thanks for the kind comments, Robin. I'm sorry we missed the chance to meet and chat.

 

The Dinghams aren't perfect but I certainly wouldn't change them. The only other couplings I would consider using (3 links would be impossible to work with on Dock Green) would be Kaydees - but these do look wrong on BR goods stock.

 

Thanks for posting your photographs. I particularly like the shot of "Susan" with the tank wagons.

 

The baseboard top surfaces are 4 feet above the floor. This is a compromise - children and wheelchair users can find it difficult to view the layout but it does give a good view across and is accessible to the operators. I would prefer something nearer eye height - but that's impractical for an exhibition layout.

 

Chaz

[2ManySpams]

I've started fitting Dingham couplings to the stock I'm building after watching Chaz's layout and having a play with some samples myself.

 

I'm currently building coaches and have started to wonder if I've made the right coupling choice. Will they work under the coach corridor connections or will the lifting loop be prevented from lifting? Can't seem to find anyone that's used them on coaching stock...

[chaz]

I've started fitting Dingham couplings to the stock I'm building after watching Chaz's layout and having a play with some samples myself.

 

I'm currently building coaches and have started to wonder if I've made the right coupling choice. Will they work under the coach corridor connections or will the lifting loop be prevented from lifting? Can't seem to find anyone that's used them on coaching stock...

 

Yes, there is a problem with Dinghams under coach corridor connections. I have very few coaches and, of course, those that I do have never run on Dock Green. A few possible solutions...

• cut the corridor connections so there is no floor - hardly noticeable from the side. The loop will lift in the gap between the sides. This is what I did on the few corridor coaches I have.
• only use Dinghams on the ends of a rake - corridor connections on the end to be modelled folded - use screw couplings within the rake.
• use Kaydees on coaches and dedicated passenger locos so fitted
• only run non-corridor stock
• take up stamp collecting instead

[2ManySpams]

Stamps you say...

[BG John]

I'm planning a fairly straight run with coaches without corridor connections, and running mixed trains means I can't have different couplings either. The instructions do seem to rather avoid passenger stock, with just a note added about how one customer did it.

[Phill Dyson (onslaught832)]

I use Kadee's for my coaching stock, they are great to couple un-couple under corridor connections & have a prototypical buckeye look to them too ........hope this helps?

[chaz]

I'm planning a fairly straight run with coaches without corridor connections, and running mixed trains means I can't have different couplings either. The instructions do seem to rather avoid passenger stock, with just a note added about how one customer did it.

 

If you don't have corridor connections to worry about there should be no problem getting Dinghams to work. You could mount them in the slot in the buffer beam as you would a screw coupling. You could also mount them on the bogies but if you did this you would need a mounting that brought them to the correct height. My Thompson non-corridor coaches had Dinghams in the buffer beam slots and these worked fine through Peco points. There is enough sideways leeway in the couplings to cope with the reverse curve through a Peco crossover.

 

Chaz

Edited January 27, 2016 by chaz

[BG John]

The layout I'm just starting won't have any points, just plain track and a hidden sector plate, but the one I've got planned for the future will use copper clad points that almost match Peco, so that's reassuring.