Wright writes.....

[Tony Wright]

The Trice/Hornby Gresley BG is now complete (well, almost). It still needs central battery boxes on one side and a central footstep for the guard below the solebar. 

 

 

Luckily, several of these Dia. 113 BGs were turned out unlined in BR days. The type was built between 1929 and 1934, later ones having the angle trussing. Since the Hornby Sleeper was the donor, this one has turnbuckle trussing - which makes an interesting comparison with the others.

 

 

 

In service in a parcels train, the Hornby BG in front for comparative purposes. The difference in body profile is clearly evident, as are the still-too-wide solebars. I believe they should also have 8' rather than 8' 6" bogies. Oh Well - after all, these are 'layout coaches'. 

 

So far working with Gilbert Barnatt, two conversions have been completed and two more have been painted. A further two more await hacking and bodging next week. When all are finished, a full account will appear in BRM. 

Edited June 18, 2014 by Tony Wright

[LNER4479]

I seem to recall Jidenko did the Paddlebox to. Certainly the ones that came in for painting were brass, not whitemetal. There is film of one of these interesting machines on all-day service around 1949 on an IA video covering the 1940's.

 

Hi Coachman 

 

Yes I once had an etched Jendeco version of the T14 kit to build but decided the etchings were not that great and also the etched holes on the chassis side frames were so large they were greater in size than the outside diameter of the bearings! It ended up on ebay.

 

Firstly, Jidenco kits. In my building of over 400 locos for myself and customers, the only two that ever defeated me were a pair of Jidenco 'Claughtons'

You mean one of these?

 

I built this about 15 years ago, my one and only experience of a Jidenco kit. It was certainly 'fun' (in the sense of a challenge) to make but I was quite pleased with it when finished. Even more so, now I hear of others horror stories with these kits.

 

(apologies Tony, as this goes back a few days on your thread. It's taken me that time to dig out the prints I took at the time and scan them in)

[Tony Wright]

You mean one of these?

IMG_0001.jpg

IMG_0002.jpg

 

I built this about 15 years ago, my one and only experience of a Jidenco kit. It was certainly 'fun' (in the sense of a challenge) to make but I was quite pleased with it when finished. Even more so, now I hear of others horror stories with these kits.

 

(apologies Tony, as this goes back a few days on your thread. It's taken me that time to dig out the prints I took at the time and scan them in)

Never apologise for posting images of personal model-making, especially examples of such a high standard.

 

Did you paint the loco? If so, my compliments because it looks exceptional. If you didn't paint it, my compliments to who did. 

 

My compliments as well for having built a Jidenco loco. Either you're brilliant at building or it's one of the firm's kits that fits well together, or a combination of both.

 

Speaking of kits which go together well, here's the progress so far on the Jamieson V2. Except it's not ALL Jamieson. As mentioned before, the cab sides are Crownline (not exactly right because the window apertures are a bit small - Jamieson's are a bit big). The tender is from PDK (Jamieson's are a bit too basic) and she should be finished soon.

 

Edited June 19, 2014 by Tony Wright

[davidw]

The Trice/Hornby Gresley BG is now complete (well, almost). It still needs central battery boxes on one side and a central footstep for the guard below the solebar. 

 

DSC_7762.JPG

 

Luckily, several of these Dia. 113 BGs were turned out unlined in BR days. The type was built between 1929 and 1934, later ones having the angle trussing. Since the Hornby Sleeper was the donor, this one has turnbuckle trussing - which makes an interesting comparison with the others.

 

DSC_7765.JPG

 

DSC_7767.JPG

 

In service in a parcels train, the Hornby BG in front for comparative purposes. The difference in body profile is clearly evident, as are the still-too-wide solebars. I believe they should also have 8' rather than 8' 6" bogies. Oh Well - after all, these are 'layout coaches'. 

 

So far working with Gilbert Barnatt, two conversions have been completed and two more have been painted. A further two more await hacking and bodging next week. When all are finished, a full account will appear in BRM. 

 

You've  just given me ideas on what to do with a couple of sleepers Tony

[Mallard60022]

I have had the great pleasure of seeing both the BFG (apologies, couldn't resist that one) and the V" in the 'buff' so to speak. The BFG is really, really good and I thought the Hornby version was good........ but it now looks like it has been on a diet.

The brass sides applied to a rather excellent Hornby Sleeper chassis (nice turnbuckle representation) make a very smart coach and it is maroon.....nice.

The V2 is beautiful to the touch (all that smooth brass and 'sanded' solder) and runs well on the ECML. TW has made a fine amalgum with parts from all sorts of sources.

We agreed it is a very basic kit but TW assures it is very buildable. I'm looking forward to see how T gets all those rivets and bits in place. Lovely work as usual.

PR. HMI.

Edited June 20, 2014 by Mallard60022

[Mallard60022]

As there are workpersons here today and I have had to hang around,  I watched TW's DVD about Improving RTR stuff; it includes converting a Gresley and a Thompson. Only watched the Gresley bit so far but what a vis aid it is and very funny too.

Spent the rest of the afternoon listening to the afternoon drama on R4 & compiling the 1961 'chronological' Summer Saturdays 00.00 to 23.59 up and down activity on the SR main line through Seaton Junction; uuummmm, I need to count my stock.

So what's this got to do with anything?

Well, it is describing just a part of the pleasure of this great hobby and I haven't spent any money today (yet); well if you don't include that EBay invoice I've just settled

Will have to sell some of my spare DJH Kits now to pay for that......

Phil

Edited June 21, 2014 by Mallard60022

[lee74clarke]

Sorry Tony, only just seen this one. Presuming Graeme means my W1, I can drop it off sometime for you to take some decent photo's, but they would show the yellowing of the varnish up even more I guess.

Probably won't make it on Sunday i'm afraid, but thanks for the invitation. Would like to see some photo's of your friends A2/1 & B16 though, and if it wasn't for present financial circumstances, I may have been interested in buying one of them.

The said circumtances have been caused by timing belt expiring on car, killing the engine, and subsequently being stiffed by Nissan on warranty.

Thanks for the MK1 coach by the way, gives me a great template for your coupling design if ever I get around to converting some of my stock.

Lastly, and I know i'm setting myself up for a fall here, what are the main failings of my Millhomle A2/2's and A2/3's? Yes, I know you like to use the chassis as weights once melted down, but if the things run and I squint a bit, they don't look too bad.

Will give them a blast next time I can run some loco's on Bythsam maybe?

 

Regards,

Lee

[t-b-g]

The mention of the Jidenco Claughton sent a shiver up my spine.

 

If there was an award going for the worst kit ever, it would be right up there.

 

No holes in the footplate for the wheels to go through or for a motor. Just a solid sheet of brass. Optional short/long firebox/boiler but if you fit the long boiler and the long firebox it is still about 3mm short. None of the rod centres match the axlehole centres.

 

It took three of us 20 years and much part replacement to complete one, which was nearer scratchbuilt than kitbuilt. The boiler and firebox were replaced, along with the footplate. It still struggles round bends as the clearances round the bogie and in the brakes are non existent.

 

Virtually nothing fitted and the parts were so poorly etched on thin brass that any attempt to alter them to fit usually meant that they broke or buckled.

 

20 years later and I had just about put it behind me but that mention has brought it all flooding back...........

 

I thought we had the only one in captivity but I have since heard of another masochist who completed one. Any more out there? Tony W did include it in one of his lovely photos of "Narrow Road" for BRM so evidence exists.

 

For a professional kitbuilder, the fee for attempting such a beast, on a sensible hourly rate, would be very silly indeed!

 

Tony

Edited June 21, 2014 by t-b-g

[Tony Wright]

Sorry Tony, only just seen this one. Presuming Graeme means my W1, I can drop it off sometime for you to take some decent photo's, but they would show the yellowing of the varnish up even more I guess.

Probably won't make it on Sunday i'm afraid, but thanks for the invitation. Would like to see some photo's of your friends A2/1 & B16 though, and if it wasn't for present financial circumstances, I may have been interested in buying one of them.

The said circumtances have been caused by timing belt expiring on car, killing the engine, and subsequently being stiffed by Nissan on warranty.

Thanks for the MK1 coach by the way, gives me a great template for your coupling design if ever I get around to converting some of my stock.

Lastly, and I know i'm setting myself up for a fall here, what are the main failings of my Millhomle A2/2's and A2/3's? Yes, I know you like to use the chassis as weights once melted down, but if the things run and I squint a bit, they don't look too bad.

Will give them a blast next time I can run some loco's on Bythsam maybe?

 

Regards,

Lee

Main failings of the Milholme A2/2 and A2/3? How long can a post be?

 

Firstly, it's not the chassis which I melted down - they were in thick etched-brass - it was all the body components, which are super-heavy, thick white metal.

 

The loco is a scale foot or so short, mainly in the boiler/firebox. I found this out when I scratch-built a chassis for the firm's A2/3 (the etched chassis wouldn't work for some reason) and the frames were about 5mm too long, though they were right. As it is, the boiler (which is oval) only suits 60500 and 511 (for a short period) and the A2/2s as first rebuilt, though the raised bit of the footplate over the drivers is then too long for the original A2/2s. The 'V'-fronted cab is a mess. A banjo dome is supplied - it should be round or streamlined. The motion and valve gear is awful. The coupling rods are too fine and the crosshead/slidebars are lost-wax spaghetti. The cylinders are 'blind' and protrude beyond the loading gauge. The cabsides only suit the A2/3, unless you take off the rivets, and even then the windows are the wrong shape. 501 and 502 cannot be represented because the ends don't turn-in. 

The tender is corridor tender width, has both beading and rivets and the sides turn-in at the front (making the abomination only 'correct' for 501 and 502, but only if you take off the rivets and reduce the width). The rear panel is divided into nine riveted sections - it should be 15. It looks like a combination of Roche and Skinley drawings were used.

 

There are many other faults but my memory struggles. The kit boxes are excellent and the photo of (I think) 60505 is useful. Other than that, avoid at all costs, unless you're given a kit - then, melt the castings down as ballast!  

[jrg1]

Main failings of the Milholme A2/2 and A2/3? How long can a post be?

 

Firstly, it's not the chassis which I melted down - they were in thick etched-brass - it was all the body components, which are super-heavy, thick white metal.

 

The loco is a scale foot or so short, mainly in the boiler/firebox. I found this out when I scratch-built a chassis for the firm's A2/3 (the etched chassis wouldn't work for some reason) and the frames were about 5mm too long, though they were right. As it is, the boiler (which is oval) only suits 60500 and 511 (for a short period) and the A2/2s as first rebuilt, though the raised bit of the footplate over the drivers is then too long for the original A2/2s. The 'V'-fronted cab is a mess. A banjo dome is supplied - it should be round or streamlined. The motion and valve gear is awful. The coupling rods are too fine and the crosshead/slidebars are lost-wax spaghetti. The cylinders are 'blind' and protrude beyond the loading gauge. The cabsides only suit the A2/3, unless you take off the rivets, and even then the windows are the wrong shape. 501 and 502 cannot be represented because the ends don't turn-in. 

The tender is corridor tender width, has both beading and rivets and the sides turn-in at the front (making the abomination only 'correct' for 501 and 502, but only if you take off the rivets and reduce the width). The rear panel is divided into nine riveted sections - it should be 15. It looks like a combination of Roche and Skinley drawings were used.

 

There are many other faults but my memory struggles. The kit boxes are excellent and the photo of (I think) 60505 is useful. Other than that, avoid at all costs, unless you're given a kit - then, melt the castings down as ballast!  

Still not as entertaining as Q Kits

[Oldddudders]

Anent Jidenco buildability, this was built for me by a late skoolfriend, Mike Francis in the '90s. Sadly it is unpowered, and there is something not quite right on the smokebox door. Nevertheless, it passes for a Brighton H2, having been designed by Douglas Earle Marsh, who had of course worked with H.A Ivatt on the GN Atlantics.

 

 

 

[ianwales]

Hi Tony(or anyone else who may know the answer)

 

On the subject of Ex LNER Coaches, how long into the BR era did the Triplet restaurant sets last please?

 

Ian

[Mallard60022]

I'm going to stick my neck out a bit and say I know at least 1958 (Peterborough North) and probably 1960/61. However the 'masters' will be back shortly!!!!!!!!

Arrrrrrrrrr

[Clive Mortimore]

Yesterday evening I was privileged to operate Little Bytham. I really enjoyed the short time driving trains and the conversation with Tony about model railways. Thank you Tony.

 

This was the icing on the cake for what had been a wonderful day on the GCR and a good meal at the Willoughby Arms. While in the pub garden a Buzzard, a Red Kite and a Spitfire flew over.

 

I will not mention the crash, not involving me this time. Or that Tony was surprised I was older than he thought I would be.

Edited June 22, 2014 by Clive Mortimore

[Horsetan]

The mention of the Jidenco Claughton sent a shiver up my spine.

 

If there was an award going for the worst kit ever, it would be right up there......

 

...For a professional kitbuilder, the fee for attempting such a beast, on a sensible hourly rate, would be very silly indeed!

It wouldn't be a fee anymore; it would be danger money. Edited June 22, 2014 by Horsetan

[Tony Wright]

Yesterday evening I was privileged to operate Little Bytham. I really enjoyed the short time driving trains and the conversation with Tony about model railways. Thank you Tony.

 

This was the icing on the cake for what had been a wonderful day on the GCR and a good meal at the Willoughby Arms. While in the pub garden a Buzzard, a Red Kite and a Spitfire flew over.

 

I will not mention the crash, not involving me this time. Or that Tony was surprised I was older than he thought I would be.

Thank you Clive,

                          You should mention the crash - quite dramatic, where I ran an express almost full pelt into the rear of a goods train. Operator incompetence completely - not setting the right road, not concentrating, too busy wind-bagging (me, I mean) and generally showing a level of idiocy rarely matched. 

 

Anyway, I'm glad you enjoyed the time.

 

I've just concluded another splendid running day with three good friends (a fuller report of which will appear tomorrow) where there were fewer crashes and only one derailment. Many visiting locos ran, including the following pair. These belong to Tom Foster and should shortly be coming up for re-homing after he's switched periods. Both were professionally-built by John Houlden from PDK kits and (now) run beautifully. I say 'now' because the B16/3 was DCC-d, and to run it I properly I had to take out the decoder. The installation was truly dreadful - the chip was taped directly to the top of the motor (is this good practice - I thought chips should be kept away from potential heat sources?) and one could have run a cooker off the wiring. The soldering was poor, using solder of far too high a melting point. I'm told this was 'professionally' installed. I'm glad I avoid DCC!

 

 

 

And my almost-complete Jamieson V2 performed faultlessly (I'm glad). In view of the comments about Jidenco, it's a salutary thought that this 40+ year old kit (not the excellent DMR tender, of course) went together far better than etched brass kits at least half its age. 

 

 

More pictures tomorrow..................

 

And the last triplet sets in the ECML crack trains lasted until 1961.

Edited June 22, 2014 by Tony Wright

[S.A.C Martin]

I had a very enjoyable - probably the most enjoyable day with model trains I've ever had - in Little Bytham today and I was very privileged to meet and speak with Tony on a variety of topics. Thanks once again Tony, and your good lady, for your hospitality, and for allowing me the pleasure of seeing a few of my models in action on your superb layout.

 

 

I dare say my garish blue (ha ha) A4 Pacific turned a few spotter's heads at Little Bytham today, for a variety of reasons, not withstanding that her pulling ability was put to shame by a Hornby Railroad Flying Scotsman, no less, which romped away with a much heavier train (once Humorist had a few running repairs up in Tony's modelling den).

 

 

Overall a lovely day out and was good to meet Mr Roberts and see Mr Foster again too. Does make one wonder on the actual benefits of DCC when you see a layout like Little Bytham in action.

[Tony Wright]

I had a very enjoyable - probably the most enjoyable day with model trains I've ever had - in Little Bytham today and I was very privileged to meet and speak with Tony on a variety of topics. Thanks once again Tony, and your good lady, for your hospitality, and for allowing me the pleasure of seeing a few of my models in action on your superb layout.

 

CIMG8805_1.jpg

 

I dare say my garish blue (ha ha) A4 Pacific turned a few spotter's heads at Little Bytham today, for a variety of reasons, not withstanding that her pulling ability was put to shame by a Hornby Railroad Flying Scotsman, no less, which romped away with a much heavier train (once Humorist had a few running repairs up in Tony's modelling den).

 

CIMG8800_1.jpg

 

Overall a lovely day out and was good to meet Mr Roberts and see Mr Foster again too. Does make one wonder on the actual benefits of DCC when you see a layout like Little Bytham in action.

It was a delight to meet you (again) Simon, and I enjoyed a very good day, too. Thank you for posting your pictures.

 

Little Bytham went retro again yesterday, with a selection of pre-war and immediate post-war locos and trains provided by Tom Foster and Simon Martin. Both of these are talented young modellers, intent on doing things for themselves, making and modifying things with their own hands. They represent a new generation in the hobby - the sort essential to encourage otherwise the long-term future of the hobby will be less exciting. The current main-stream trend (of which I'm part) is to model what one remembers, when the senses were much more impressionable and indelible memories created. Those memories from the '50s/early-'60s, which the RTR boys provide so much material for us to enjoy. The problem is that those who well remember those heady trainspotting days are well into their own sixties, and not the early ones either! Neither Tom nor Simon can possibly remember the period they model (I was pre-school age when the locos Simon models were in that guise), but their diligent research and painstaking attention to detail does them credit, as does their modelling. What I like is their respective 'no fear' approach. If they want a model, they make/modify it, sometimes showing huge ingenuity - an ingenuity I wouldn't even contemplate, nor ever would have. Tom's had models professionally built, but now (with a little help) he has little further need for that. As for his weathering techniques, he's taken them to a standard I've rarely seen before and never bettered.

 

So, what can they teach 'modellers' of 'my' generation? Plenty I'd say. For one thing stop moaning about what the trade does or does not have to offer, how much detail should be provided and how much things cost. If it isn't available or it's too expensive, go without (how politically incorrect is that?) or have a go at making it yourself, like this pair of 'children'. And, it's the making and finishing of things that the likes of these chaps produce that, to me, is the most encouraging.

 

Perhaps, when they see these, Tom and Simon might care to provide some captions. Well done!

 

 

  

 

 

I'm not sure of the colour on this A4

 

 

 

 

 

 

As usual, extra pictures (already seen) were inexplicably imported into this post (computers!!!!!!!!!!), and I should apologise for the non-removal of my BR K5 seen in the distance in one of the pre-war pictures.

Edited June 23, 2014 by Tony Wright

[Guest 2750]

Thanks again to yourself and Mo for your lovely hospitality once more! Great to see Simon Martin again after a good few years, and not forgetting Simon Roberts who seemed to be chief fettler of my Gresley coaches. SR solved the issue of a derailing Gresley Coach....out of gauge!

 

Captions? I'd say for my K3 and A4, we have a York based K3 heading northbound with a Class B goods. The A4 can only be on the 'Flying Scotsman' as 4486 'Merlin' is a Haymarket loco, so could only be on the Coronation or Flying Scotsman that far south?

[micklner]

Lovely locos, other than a certain A4 which just doesnt look right to me (sorry Simon).

 

Is the Duke of Rothesay a Nucast or PDK ?

 

 

As to DCC and Sound NO thanks . What would be nice is for a decent smoke system to be invented !!

[jwealleans]

Go back a couple of posts, Mick, to where it first appears.  It's a PDK..

 

I've seen some of those wagons before.  Those DUHA loads do look very good indeed.

[Guest 2750]

Go back a couple of posts, Mick, to where it first appears.  It's a PDK..

 

I've seen some of those wagons before.  Those DUHA loads do look very good indeed.

 

That is a different B16 Jonathan (B16/3) but is currently mine (and was a PDK build by John Houlden). The other B16 is also PDK but built by Paul Hill (and now belongs to Tony).

 

I think you know those wagons as well as the previous owner!

Edited June 23, 2014 by 2750

[jwealleans]

Mick was asking about that horrible looking Thompson pacific, I think?

[Guest 2750]

Mick was asking about that horrible looking Thompson pacific, I think?

 

Ah right, also mine which I took down yesterday.

[Tony Wright]

Lovely locos, other than a certain A4 which just doesnt look right to me (sorry Simon).

 

Is the Duke of Rothesay a Nucast or PDK ?

 

 

As to DCC and Sound NO thanks . What would be nice is for a decent smoke system to be invented !!

Mick,

         DUKE OF ROTHESAY is built from a PDK kit, also by John Houlden. 

 

Returning to DCC, the more I see of it the less I like. As mentioned, the DCC-installation in the B16/3 was abominable (not an inherent fault in DCC, admittedly), and if this represents the standard of 'professionally-fitted' DCC systems in kit-built locos, then leave me out of it (I should point out that it was not fitted by the builder). Little Bytham would benefit not a jot from DCC. I don't need to park locos all over the place on the scenic side, don't need DCC to 'improve' my running, don't need to waste valuable ballast space in sheet metal-built locos to fit a chip, and save myself pounds and pounds by not needing to fit the horrid things. 

 

The worst-running layouts I've seen (in one case, no running at all) have been DCC, and the best analogue. That's not to say all DCC layouts run like rubbish, nor all analogue ones run well. 

Edited June 23, 2014 by Tony Wright