Bachmann 64xx Panniers

[Dunsignalling]

6412 went to Exmouth Junction in the summer of 1963 and IIRC saw service on the Seaton Branch. 

 

Later in the year (November?) she was transferred to Yeovil Town for use on the local service linking the town's three stations and was withdrawn in 1964 upon dieselisation of that duty.

 

John

[Miss Prism]

Update: Bachmann's production versions are now showing on its website. The footplate-mounted lubricator has now disappeard, which is fine for 6412 and 6417, but not 6406. Bachmann's tank front steps are for 6410 onward, so are not right for 6406.

 

Both the green versions have green tank fronts (yuk!) and the chimney tops are in brass (also yuk). The footplate handrail above the front step is still missing.

 

Possibly Andy will return after the weekend with some of his nice pics.

[toboldlygo]

 

Update: Bachmann's production versions are now showing on its website. The footplate-mounted lubricator has now disappeard, which is fine for 6412 and 6417, but not 6406. Bachmann's tank front steps are for 6410 onward, so are not right for 6406.

 

Both the green versions have green tank fronts (yuk!) and the chimney tops are in brass (also yuk). The footplate handrail above the front step is still missing.

 

Possibly Andy will return after the weekend with some of his nice pics.

 

The green looks yuck full-stop

[Ozexpatriate]

The green looks yuck full-stop

They look really washed out (very yellow-green) and not at all consistent with previous models. It could be a photography issue - perhaps the images are overexposed to show more detail in the black areas.

 

 

The Maunsell olive looks washed out too.

 

The "GWR green" looks closer to what Hornby has been using lately based on visual, not photographic observation.

Edited July 18, 2014 by Ozexpatriate

[The Stationmaster]

The BR green looks very odd - almost like Swindon undercoat (maybe it is?).  Presumably at this stage the models are livery samples for agreement (or not) before production gets underway?

[gwrrob]

The BR green looks very odd - almost like Swindon undercoat (maybe it is?).  Presumably at this stage the models are livery samples for agreement (or not) before production gets underway?

 

Lets hope so as I couldn't take another c**k up on a Great Western engine.

[Ian Hargrave]

Gents,please,these are just pre production painted samples...that...and only that. Please don't rush to judgement.A great deal of hard work and skill has gone into its development.

Please bear with it....it WILL be right..but right now,scathing comment helps no one...OK ?

[Ozexpatriate]

Gents,please,these are just pre production painted samples...that...and only that. Please don't rush to judgement.A great deal of hard work and skill has gone into its development.

Ian,

 

I understand the point you are making and don't disagree, there is a difference between a pre=production sample and the delivered product. Scathing comments should be out of bounds.

 

Please bear with it....it WILL be right.

Nevertheless in a market that is marching toward 100% pre-ordering, this is about trust. We have had multiple issues recently with models not meeting expectations based on prior models from the same manufacturer. Why should we assume it "WILL be right"?

 

Why is raising a question unreasonable?

Edited July 18, 2014 by Ozexpatriate

[spackz]

To me the blacks, greens and umber (E4), on all the latest photos look washed out, so is probably more of a photo/camera issue its too much of a coincidence to be anything but.

[Ian Hargrave]

Ian,I understand the point you are making and don't disagree, there is a difference between a pre=production sample and the delivered product. Scathing comments should be out of bounds. Nevertheless in a market that is marching toward 100% pre-ordering, this is about trust. We have had multiple issues recently with models not meeting expectations based on prior models from the same manufacturer. Why should we assume it "WILL be right"?Why is raising a question unreasonable?

Sorry,at this stage ,a rush to judgement is unhelpful and I cannot agree with your present stance.

All I can tell you is to repeat what I have already posted.I have had contact with such samples and have been impressed....but they are what they are...samples and just that...one step along the road to eventual production. By implication,you expect a product which is to a subscription standard rather than something marketed within budget limitations.If that is what you expect,then you must find another route to your goal.

If you have invested your own capital into the development of a model,then you have every right to question its progress on the basis of mutual trust..otherwise you,like the rest of us,can only make our ultimate judgement in a purchase....or not.

 

For myself, it's a must...a pannier and auto train my route to school and a way down the valley to Abercynon and the heady delights of Cardiff. I am going to enjoy this one.

[toboldlygo]

Since when is saying the green looks yuck, a scathing comment? Must be a down to the fact it comes in Blue box and not in a Red one.....

[Ozexpatriate]

Sorry,at this stage ,a rush to judgement is unhelpful and I cannot agree with your present stance.

I still think you are reading way too much into my comments, but I am delighted to hear that you are impressed with the models.

 

If you have invested your own capital into the development of a model,then you have every right to question its progress on the basis of mutual trust..

When you pre-order products, essentially by necessity, it's nice to have confidence that it is going to meet expectations of consistent quality with comparable products, unless it is your position that we should have low expectations.

 

If enthusiasts have a shared concern, surely the time to raise that concern is long before the product is sitting on shelves at a local shop?

Edited July 18, 2014 by Ozexpatriate

[Ian Hargrave]

I still think you are reading way too much into my comments, but I am delighted to hear that you are impressed with the models.

 

When you pre-order products, essentially by necessity, it's nice to have confidence that it is going to meet expectations of consistent quality with comparable products, unless it is your position that we should have low expectations.

 

If enthusiasts have a shared concern, surely the time to raise that concern is long before the product is sitting on shelves at a local shop?

Fair enough.....in any case,after reading this thread,I am sure  the Bachmann team will be "on message" .

 

Since when is saying the green looks yuck, a scathing comment? Must be a down to the fact it comes in Blue box and not in a Red one.....

Seeing red after a fit of the blues?

[Neal Ball]

So much speculation.... Because in reality that is what it is until we can see one on our layouts.

 

So much talk of the third rivet being in the wrong place, so much talk about colour, just a shade out......

 

Until we can finally get our hands on one, it's just speculation..... Why not have a conversation about how useful another Pannier tank will be on my new layout... Etc. etc. plus of course we could speculate on which variant Bachmann will produce next, or maybe they will also do a DCC sound 64xx

 

Just a thought

[David Bigcheeseplant]

I notice the photo of 64xx has a copper cap chimney something none of the class had plus green tank fronts they should be black, although if this is how they come then it would be out with the paint brush.

[The Stationmaster]

There are some good points from both sides of the debate in the preceding posts and I think we need to look at things from both sides.  Firstly these are obviously pics of what amount to the latest samples - presumably having arrived in Barwell for comment as a stage in development.  Thus it is perhaps understandable that things might not be absolutely correct and we must rely on Bachmann's folk to get them corrected.

 

But equally having put the models in the public arena there will inevitably be comments about them if people looking at the pictures see what they consider are errors - it is how we present our views to offer the best information to Bachmann which really matters.  I for one am sure that Bachmann will be keen to get things as right as possible but that will most likely mean 'right in accordance with the information they can readily obtain' - and if they look at, say, a picture of a preserved engine it isn't going to show original condition, and so on.  If they dodge between as built and as withdrawn condition they will never be right for one or the other - they have to settle on something and therein lies a problem on the detail of fittings.  Colour is another matter of course.

 

So where do we go - Miss Prism as a delegate to Barwell?  Or a summary of ours views submitted via Ian, or someone at Barwell plough this thread?  I know from talking to Bachmann people in the past that they are keen to get things right (hence a chance conversation with me at a show resulted in the BR Shunters Trucks coming in the correct colour of black - so they do take notice).

[brushman47544]

I understand both sides of the colour argument, but there is one aspect that does make me cautious about what might finally appear. That is that Bachmann has been producing models in a range of liveries for some time. Surely the factory should by now have a database of these colours and so when Bachmann asks the factory to produce a model in say BR lined green, then the factory should be able to replicate that exactly from the previous specification. Only things like lining and what areas are which colour should need to be specified.

 

So unless Bachmann has decided to change some of it's liveries, why should the factory produce a model in a different colour to before?

[Miss Prism]

The shade of green seems disappointingly similar to Hornby's recent (42/52/72xx) insipid pastel, but that is why it would be good to have a second opinion from Andy Y's weekend lens before offering a more considered view.

 

On the application areas of the colours themselves, in black should be:

 

- tank supports

- tank fronts

- chimney top

- the portion of the main handrail going across the front of the loco

 

I do not know whether Bachmann is currently aware of some or any of the above, nor whether it chose not to have them applied to the painted sample (although that begs the question as to what its purpose was). I do not know if anyone is advising Bachmann on livery matters. Ian Hargrave implores us to be not to rush to judgement on the grounds that it will be "alright on the night", but at the moment it is entirely unclear what might be alright on the night and what might not be alright on the night. Given this vagueness, I will send the above comment to Dennis Lovett.

 

P.S. The Swindon 1947 painting spec is somewhat ambiguous in respect of the colour of the rear of the cab, green being cited for "cabsides front and back (inside and outside)" but black for "bunker coal space". My interpretation of 'bunker coal space' is for locos without rear cab sheets, so I'm inclined to think green is appropriate for enclosed cab locos.

 

 

[bigherb]

Gents,please,these are just pre production painted samples...that...and only that. Please don't rush to judgement.A great deal of hard work and skill has gone into its development.

Please bear with it....it WILL be right..but right now,scathing comment helps no one...OK ?

They had a lot of comments on the Class 101 and they still went on to produce a pup, so there is no guarantee it will be right.

[Andy Y]

 

The shade of green seems disappointingly similar to Hornby's recent (42/52/72xx) insipid pastel, but that is why it would be good to have a second opinion from Andy Y's weekend lens before offering a more considered view.

 

 

 

Sadly I didn't take any detailed snaps yesterday as the set-up wasn't appropriate to get anything meaningful with the models being in the glass-fronted cabinets and too many people around to get products out. The sample was a hand-painted sample and the green certainly wasn't as shown in the photo above, it was similar to previous releases. The catalogue and website images can be variable in rendition of tones and saturation and may not reflect the actual finish.

 

If I do get a chance to get some better snaps for you I will do.

[Ian Hargrave]

They had a lot of comments on the Class 101 and they still went on to produce a pup, so there is no guarantee it will be right.

And in the end,it will all  be a matter of subjective judgement.....what you think might be,as you call it,a pup,others will be well pleased with.I think they will make a decent job..but nothing in life is ever perfect,is it?

[Captain Kernow]

There's always the trusty airbrush (or can of Halfords Matt Black    - comes out semi-matt, btw) if you don't like the colour that Bachmann paints 'em.

 

If any of the details aren't quite right for the number that Bachmann put on the loco, then either re-number it or 'do a bit of modelling'... (adding the horizontal handrails for the front footsteps on the Bachmann 57XX has become a bit of a habit and it's not that difficult).

 

But.... it's a R-T-R 64XX! Aren't we lucky! Who would have thought it, just a few years ago?

 

And, High Level are doing a chassis kit that will cover all the 54XX, 64XX and 74XX variants.

 

Brilliant!

 

 

 

Edit - typo

Edited July 22, 2014 by Captain Kernow

[Miss Prism]

Livery comments now with Bachmann's graphic design department.

[Brinkly]

I must admit I can't wait to get my hands on one and as CK said the High Level Chassis is an added bonus!

 

6400 trundling up to Horrabridge, autocoach number 51 in crimson in tow....

 

Regards,

 

Nick.

[GreatWesternFan220]

The expected release date for the 64xx is Mar/April 2015.